Hot stuff on Air America Radio just now.

[Carl Brennan]

I cut in the middle of the interview and listened to someone from Common Cause I think it was. He said that there was a gross undersupply of vote machines in democratic counties. One area only had 2 machines when more like 12 were needed and that anything less than six would have been considered total failure of supply. Out of the 2 machines one broke down. While the red counties had extra machines they refused to supply them to the dem counties when they were requested. There were no lines in the Repug counties. This was just a small snip, but what is emerging is a picture of purposive voter disenfranchisement. Then with all the other shit: voter suppression, machine "glitches" that only favor Bush. I don't see how they can do anything but invalidate the election in Ohio.

[Action Jackson]

1. We really do need to follow up with the not enough machines problems

It is totally unacceptable Blackwell purposely did not have enough voting machines in certain Dem areas. It borders on criminal. Bring me his head on a plate please.

[liam97]

3. I think it was Bob Fitrakis

They are doing exemplary work in Ohio - www.freepress.org

[kerry2win]

4. it is criminal

I don't know how anything in Ohio could be legally certified with that crap going on, but then again they have the republican Ohio Supreme court. It would be nice if they had the b#lls to stand up for the law they swore to uphold......would you like a side dish of schrub with that?

[Eric J in MN]

2. That was Bob Fitrakis, who write for the Free Press about Ohio.

http://www.freepress.org/columns/display/3/2004/995

How the Ohio election was rigged for Bush
November 22, 2004

Following four community public hearings in Ohio about election irregularities and voter suppression – two in the capitol, Columbus, and one each in Cincinnati and Cleveland – a clear pattern and practice of voter disenfranchisement is emerging.

In order to understand the extent of the voter suppression in the inner city of Columbus and Franklin County, overwhelmingly Democratic wards, start with the phrase: “Machines Placed By Close Of Polls” on the last page of the county’s 17-page voting machine allocation report.

This phrase at the end of the spreadsheet may be the key in unraveling a deliberate and unprecedented plan to repress African American and poor central city voters. In statistics, when you see a bizarre definition or measurement, it sends up red flags. Why doesn’t the Franklin County Board of Elections have a number for “Machines Placed By Opening Of Polls”?

It now appears that the Franklin County BOE placed scores of machines too late in the day to alleviate the long lines of voters who gathered to vote before work and at lunchtime.

[jean]

5. he's Bob Fitrakis,author, reporter, legal advisor for 8 polling locations

according to MajReport blog - http://www.majorityreportradio.com/weblog/

I heard his commentary - it's amazing that repub communities had ample machines and no lines while the heavily dem areas did not and had horrendous lines and long waits.

He said according to the state's own standards, there should be one machine per every one hundred voters. At the college he mentioned, there were 1300 some registered voters and only two machines - this is where the kids waited for hours and voting went on until 2 in the morning.

Also, I only caught the end of him saying they're investigating the trucking firm assigned to transport voting machines to various areas. The firm ended up having about 100 machines that were never delivered, sitting in their warehouse on Election Day. But, again, from their investigation, the repub areas were well-serviced. No problems except in dem precincts.

[Eloriel]

6. It's my understanding that

Alliance for Democracy's suit they filed last week covers this and other testimony from the citizen-organized "hearings" that were held in several places in Ohio (3 or 4 days total).

Help America Recount, co-founded by DU's own hedda-Foil (also co-founder of the National Ballot Integrity Project) is helping fund the recounts, and actively involved in all that's going on behind the scenes, including looking at other states.

IOW, I think we've got it covered.

If anyone wants to help either of these two efforts, you can contribute to HAR here: www.helpamericarecount.org

Or to the Cobb campaign for the Ohio Recount (sorry, don't have a link -- and be sure to mark it for the RECOUNT).

Volunteers are still needed in OH, and if you can help with that, check out this thread and links: Ohio Recount Effort: Green Party Seeks Money, Volunteers
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x71002

To support the lawsuit by Alliance for Democracy, go here:
http://www.thealliancefordemocracy.org/html/eng/2138-AA.shtml


If you want to keep up with the vote fraud/suppression/recount news, check out these threads (updated at least daily):

VOTE FRAUD LINKS - A DU Compendium - Thread #3
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=201x4927

VOTE FRAUD Links Compendium - Thread #2
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=201x3223

VOTE FRAUD Links - a DU Compendium
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=201&topic_id=1984#

[Straight Shooter]

7. The link to the Cobb recount donation fund

http://www.votecobb.org

Their fund barometer is at 85K of 100K needed, as of 9 a.m. on Monday, Nov. 22.

[SaveAmerica]

8. video of lack of machines

Do you know if anyone got video of the differences in the amount of voting machines between the dem and rep. precincts (footage of long lines in high dem princincts with 2 machines and high rep precincts with 5 and 6 machines)?

[kk897]

12. At the first Columbus hearing,

in the church's basement away from the testimony, they showed about a 20 minute video that demonstrated that very well. I think you can find it here:

http://www.goxray.com/index.php?id=651&cat=17

They mainly have stuff from the hearings, but I think like part 5 or something has footage from election day.

[Carl Brennan]

10. I've been in communication with hedda on some other stuff

regarding Blackwell and his finances. She and the citizen action people in Ohio are some seriously hard working people.

I have this warm feeling that the Repugs are going to get TKO'ed with one huge punch.

It's just good hearing somebody who knows what he is talking about describing what is happening.

[AnIndependentTexan]

9. I keep forgetting to listen because Mike is on vacation

He's one of the main reasons I listen to Air America.

[goldengreek]

11. I think Ohio will get thrown out.

But that'll still give Bush more than enough electoral votes to win. But since we know this is just the stuff we caught, this will cast the same pall of illegitimacy over his second term that Florida did for his first.

Speaking of which... Bev Harris just gave us more info on Jeb's state. Several counties are about to get busted for rigging the vote.

[mrdmk]

13. Just a question here!

If by chance both Florida and Ohio elections are thrown out due to fraud (actually, fraud in an election is treason), Mr. Bush Jr. and Mr. Kerry both will have 252 electoral votes each, meaning that the vote will go the the House of Representatives, that will not help the cause of getting Mr. Kerry into the White House?

If we can get the correct vote count in these two states, do you really think that this would be more constructive?

Personally, I would like to Mr. Bush Jr. and his cronies put on trail for treason, but would that be helpful to the cause of the American Public?

[ZRB]

14. If Florida and Ohio were thrown out

Then Kerry would lead 252-239.

I'm not sure that the House would decide it then. Could someone find the part of the Constitution that explains the Electoral College. I believe it says that "if the vote is a majority of the total votes cast." Now, if 49 votes were simply thrown out, they might not necessarily apply to "total votes cast." It could be a majority out of the 489 votes cast, rather than 538. I bet there would be a big legal battle...

[mrdmk]

16. Sorry, here are the numbers

At this time

Bush = 286 electoral college votes
Kerry = 252 electoral college votes

Florida = 27 electoral college votes
Ohio = 20 electoral college votes

My question was rhetorical on whether or not this confrontation would be good for the country or may divide the country even more, thus make the country impossible to govern. I would like to kick-ass on the Bush Jr. Administration, but will it work for the good?


edit: corrected Ohio electoral college votes, thank you!

My post above should show the electoral votes as follows:

Bush = 239
Kerry =252

Never the less the vote would still go to the House of Reps. because of the 270 electoral vote minimum.

As a side note, is this how they count the votes?

[New Earth]

17. uh

i thought ohio was 20 electoral votes?

[mary195149]

18. Ohio has 20 electoral college votes

[ebayfool]

22. Where do you get the 270 electoral vote minimum?

I thought that was just number needed if ALL the states EV's were counted (without throwing out Florida & Ohio).


(first time posting with my pretty new gold star - ain't it nice?!)

[mrdmk]

26. Here is your answer

<snip>
• U.S. presidents are elected to four-year terms by 538 Electoral College voters, one per senator and representative from each state, plus three from the District of Columbia. In 38 states, the voters are required by law to vote for the candidate who won the popular voter in their state, although all electors usually cast a ballot for the popular vote winner. A candidate must receive a majority of 270 votes to win the election.
<snip>

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/president/

down at the bottom

[ctsteve]

15. First Hand Reports from Ohio Volunteers

Voter disenfranchisement in Ohio

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/21/221351/52

[talk hard]

19. Does anybody even give a crap?

It seems life has moved on and the Republicans are ignoring the fact that all the votes aren't in yet. Which probably explains why they keep "finding" votes tucked here or there. I have a feeling the fraud was rampant and could take any state they needed to.

It sounds like there are wads of inappropriate irregularities. Too few machines, nonoperable machines and no paper ballot available, etc. Not to mention perusal of all the provisional ballots. And, hell, have the absentee ballots even been counted?

My head is going to explode.

[zann725]

20. Yeah, I do!!!

They want us to believe Life has moved on. They're like shoplifters who feel if they just keep moving, and talking to distract us, we won't notice the bulge of what they've stolen. That's why they're keeping the news so busy with war...and cabinet appointments.

That's exactly why we have to keep a clear head, and NOT give up.

I think the only blessing that's come out of the last 3 weeks of Repug hell...is that it's a foreshadowing of how quickly they plan to move in their second term at moving the country FARRRR Right. So that even moderate Repug's...even perhaps those who voted for Bush...or even helped him steal the election...might be having second thoughts.

I keep focusing on the positive...when I'm not utterly depressed!

[MominTN]

21. Bush needs to go

Don't get soft. He is taking his "mandate" and screwing more things up as fast as he can go. He and Fox have agreed for us to take in more Mexicans which means more lost jobs for us, and problems in education and healthcare. And another mom in this forum talked about her son in the service who has heard he's going to Iran in May-June. We don't need another war!!! So we need to insist that Bush is out and Kerry is in, if we can find the votes. If they insist on another 4 years with a fraud we need to refuse to pay taxes or something even more serious.

[breadandwine]

23. FLASH BULLETIN! Blogger calls march on Fox NOW!!

Combined protest against Fox and the rigged election —

The objective is specifically to challenge the wall of silence on the rigged election by news outlets like Fox and make a breakthrough —

Please spread this around, check it out and kick it —

A blogger has posted an extremely detailed, specific call to protest the rigged election AND the suppression of the truth ABOUT the rigged election by Fox News — a combined event mass march protest to be held in New York City — AT — Fox headquarters on 6th Avenue —

Main protest chant —

“Rupert Murdoch, tell the truth! Fascists rigged the voting booth!”

Nobody thinks of marching against a news organization in the streets. This is going to be a shot heard round the world.

Very comprehensive protest plan with very helpful travel details, the works —

See blog on this,

“A Call To March On Fox —

For refusing to tell the truth about the rigged election!” —

http://acalltomarchonfox.blogspot.com/

Discussion thread in General Discussion Forum — please help keep this kicked —

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=2688242

“A Call To March Against The Rigged Election”

Please spread these links around to help us organize this.

Please join that discussion there and help keep it kicked. Marching on Fox starts at post 117. But read the whole discussion. And read the blog. Discussion also discusses an earlier blog on marching against the rigged election and media. Second blog being discussed is on a specific, detailed call to march on Fox specifically as a key initial part of this protest against the rigged election. Fox is a key ENABLER of the rigged election. They’d never get away with election rigging on such a vast scale if it weren’t for news suppressers/distorters like Fox. Read both blogs.

Tremendously detailed comprehensive blog —

It gives the exact location in New York City of all of Rupert Murdoch’s empire, New York Post, Fox News, News Corporation (Murdoch’s big parent company — it owns almost everything else he’s got) — all of that — it’s all in a single building on 6th Avenue between 47th Street and 48th Street in mid-Manhattan. Murdoch’s own office is in the building too. We can be chanting against him right outside his window. All their offices are not on very high floors either — as low as the second floor — they’ll see and hear us and have to pass us on the way in. All those blow-hard Fox talking heads lying about the election — we’ll be in direct shouting matches with them as they come and go. And Fox itself is on the SECOND Floor. How good is their studio soundproofing in there????? Everybody at Fox is going to be bitching that they can’t get any work done. There’s no way they can hush this up.

Since it’s a vicious circle — news organizations like Fox suppress our protests, making them seem futile, therefore the proposal is to combine objectives and protest Fox AND the rigged election TOGETHER right outside Murdoch’s building and tie the two evils together — “Murdoch suppresses the truth about the rigged election!” — and invite other New York news organizations, many of whom DETEST Murdoch, to cover it. (You didn’t know New York news people and news executives hate Murdoch? Blog goes into that a lot.)

Blog has many links to anti-Murdoch resources and video of Bill O’Reilly telling everybody to shut up, shut up, shut up, over and over. What a sewer rat! Right on camera! He looks really mean and drunk in one of the film clips. Jack Daniels? And he’s on camera hotly lecturing us, “It is our duty as all loyal Americans to shut up.” The video nails him good — and Fox. Blog gives other video links too.

Tired of being told to shut your trap? Open it. March against Fox and the rigged election in New York City.

But the idea is to put it all together, to protest and denounce Fox outside their offices for leading the COVER-UP of the election heist. It’s a shot across the bow to the rest of the media that they better start telling the truth about the election, or they’ll get protests like the one at Fox. All the national news media are based in Manhattan. They can’t say this protest was too out of the way to get to.

Blog also has links to downloadable anti-Fox flyers, petitions and other resources against Fox that could be distributed at the protest march.

Blog goes into tremendous detail about the strategy, the advantages of starting protests in New York as opposed to other cities (huge liberal population would augment people coming from out of town), and it’s the news media capital of the world. Very friendly terrain. New York Democratic congressmen are demanding investigation of the stolen election. No rednecks in the population or the government, no paranoid security apparatus like you have in D.C.

Blog includes complete “mother lode” total orientation guide to using New York subways with downloadable maps you can enlarge, how to use mass transit to get from Amtrak’s Penn Station to the march, how to use mass transit to get from the airports to the march.

Let’s make it happen!

Keep kicking that thread so everyone will hear of this!

[terip64]

24. kick!

[bones_7672]

25. Reality Check: no way the Ohio election will be thrown out

Face it, no judge or US Senator is going to contest the election to the point of "throwing out" the vote of a whole state.

Hasn't happened, isn't happening, will never happen.

The most you can hope for is that there will be prosecutions, but the election itself will NEVER be invalidated.

[New Earth]

27. like i said before

the only thing that will change the ouctome of the election is RECOUNTS. It is THE ONLY way. Evidence of fraud will add to the case (and be a case in itself) but it willl only end up as a long list of lawsuits, prosecutions, more investigations, and the relief of knowing that yes, the election was 'rigged'. No judge is going to throw out the entire state's vote - that would be disenfranchising the entire state.