About those Dates...

[Senator]

Note: I posted this comment in response to the thread containing the email from the Cobb campaign that included a timeline of events for the coming recount of Ohio.

I'm posting as a new thread bacause I think it is a core issue that effects all our efforts.

About those Dates...

...all of them (Dec. 7, Dec. 12, Jan. 6, and any others)

Try not to think of those dates as "deadlines," because they are not.

Pretending that there is a clock that can be run out is just more neofashist propaganda. It is designed to foster defeatism on our side.

Not even the Jan. 6 counting date is a real deadline, as Congress can take whatever action they deem fit to appoint an acting president until a valid winner can be determined (yes, really). And you can bet the farm that is exactly what they'll do should public opinion be leaning against them come January and they need more time.

But this propaganda line is big reason we...

... MUST change the FRAME

.

[jsascj]

1. Are you really a senator?

[New Earth]

2. lol

i asked him/her that the other day and they didn't answer :(

[jsascj]

3. Maybe if they answer

They'll have to shoot us!

[New Earth]

4. let's pretend it's John Kerry

sneaking us insider info :P :crazy:

[jsascj]

12. Wouldn't that be the GREATEST!

Or maybe Johns Edwards.

[Senator]

5. Sorry...

...thought you were just kidding.

No, of course not. I hold no public office of any kind.

[New Earth]

6. dammit

:-( :D

[IAMREALITY]

15. That's Ok

In a few months, neither will John Edwards....

hehehe ok, maybe that was a bad joke :)

[BlueCaliDem]

7. True. Congress can take whatever action they deem fit...

...but then one must look at just WHO controls Congress? More specifically, what party holds the majority seats in Congress, and what party has had their Messiah Reagan tell them: "Speak no evil of fellow party members", right?

We cannot allow this to be flipped over to Congress where it will die a silent, but thorough death.

Remember too, that it was the Republican dominated Congress that killed the bill that would have forced e-voting machines to produce papertrails, and what has paved the way for yet another presidential election to be stolen.

[Senator]

9. Well, a couple of points.

First, I would caution folks against this type of thinking. One big part of both election thefts is the "inevitability" propaganda. Like the "deadlines" it is meant to foster defeatism.

Second, futile or not, I see no other moral/patriotic option than to "go to the mat" with this thing. If we don't draw a line at the only moral principle on which the nation was founded, and still ostensibly exist; that gov't power can only be derived from the consent of the governed, then we are already adrift. We become complicit in the treason itself.

But on a more practical/political note, it's one thing for a politician to hold his tongue or sit on his hands (as the Dem Senators did on 01/06/01). It's quite another to be confronted on the issue of whether or not you will tolerate, and thereby aide and abet, racism, election theft, and treason.

Confronted with their sworn duty to defend and uphold the (currently in breach) Constitution, and a large and growing body of public outrage at the undeniable reality in Ohio, Florida, and elsewhere; it would not be too shocking if even some republicans decide that they need to look at themselves in the mirror every morning.

Particularly since Fahrenheit 9/11 recently depicted their dereliction of duty to millions.

But all that said, I think we need this "charge of the light brigade" simply to maintain our own self respect and esteem. I think that may be the bottom line.

[BlueCaliDem]

10. You Are Absolutely Right...It Is Our Responsibility To Hold Our...

...Congressmen, and women accountable, and confront them with their sworn duty to defend and uphold the Constitution, but you speak of what's legal, and right.

I speak of what happens in reality.

No matter how many lawsuits, if Congress so chooses, nothing will happen, as we've seen. They find the tiniest of loopholes to crawl through in order to protect their worthless hide (present Senator exempted. :) ), and all their "sins" are white-washed by an obedient, complicit media.

How many chickenhawks have paid, or lost their positions paid for by American taxpayers, for lying about WMDs in Iraq, and launching an illegal war that killed over 1200 of our troops? How many have paid for killing the bill that would have helped protect the basic right of voting with the option of legal auditing?

SCotUS has usurped the power of Florida's Supreme Court in order to hand Bush the presidency in 2000 w/o any reprecussions of any kind, using the tiniest of loopholes in the Constitution, and running out the clock they themselves had set as time limit; Scalia has shown bias when going duck-hunting with Cheney whose case was before the Supreme Court, and telling us that there's no conflict of interest, and NO ONE takes them to task on that???

I'm no legal mind in any which way, but I'm a realist, and from what I've learned, and read as I watched America go downhill, is that John Edwards was so right, when he said there are two Americas.

However, I feel Kerry knows this too, and behind the scenes, is working to ensure, that not a minute is wasted as mounting evidence of a coordinated effort to steal power fails this time around.

[Senator]

13. Well, I'm no idealist.

I'm well aware of "what happens."

But I'm also aware of the detrimental effect of acting/speaking as if it "always happens" that way. That's simply untrue. Nixon did resign in disgrace, Ollie North et. al. have criminal records, Poppy did lose, the impeachment farce did fail (and in that instance it was Senate Repubs that smothered that tar baby, when faced with 70% disapproval from the public - and yes, I think that number is realistically achievable, even in a short time frame.)

But, also realistically, I don't share your confidence in Kerry. He has spent many, many years in the bubble of the DC/Media Analstocracy. His Pavlovian response to the Mighty Wurlitzer, which is deafening in his circles, seems quite in character to me.

I'm glad others are getting better mileage from him.

I hope he does finally turn the boat into the enemy.

[knowbody0]

8. absolutely

not only are these the facts, and we need patience which is so difficult, but while we play this waiting game, our attention is being diverted from the war, the patriot act and our democracy.george is moving in fast forward, unobstructed, towards the end of all things american

[Chimpanzee]

11. WHEW!

For a second I thought maybe * was claiming multiple man dates!

[senseandsensibility]

14. LOL

Give him time; I'm sure it's coming!

[bleever]

16. Kick, especially for the NGU comments below.

[dewaldd]

17. Absolutely. If the recount goes to Kerry, people will finally wake up.

I think it would be really, really hard for the press not to report a recount going to Kerry. And if the Dems realize that they have another stolen election on their hands, they will finally wake up.

And then they would realize that the smearing of us all as tin foil hat conspiracy nuts has Rove's turds all over it.

[YellowDoginthehouse]

18. I think John Kerry probably knows how to spell "fascist"