Q&A w/ Wayne Madsen on Vote Rigging here on DU!

[jamboi]

I and some of the other DUers (most notably Vote4Kerry & roguevalley) have been corresponding w/ Wayne Madsen and he has offered to interact w/ us here on DU regarding his ongoing investigation into vote rigging of the 2003 California and 2004 US election.

Please understand that he can not reveal info that would compromise or endanger his sources and that he has to be careful about unsubstatiated charges. Also this is an opportunity for us to help out with the research to flesh out these enigmatic allegations.

He's just now signing on and he e-mailed that his login will be Casolaro

JamBoi

[althecat]

1. Cool

Hi Wayne :)

[MelissaB]

2. Thanks for the

heads up, JamBoi!

[ailsagirl]

3. Terrific!

[NVMojo]

6. cool, but we need to be careful cuz there are already about 8 journalists

sitting in jail because they won't reveal their sources ...

We must not put this man in a precarious position. He must be able to get his entire story out...at the right time...

[Eloriel]

33. He's a big boy and ought to know what he's doing --

not as if he hasn't dealt with controversial stuff in the past or anything.

[lowmanknows]

56. Here's my theory and it accounts for the exit polls.......

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/politics/news-article.aspx?storyid=26823

This is odd. Say you wanted to rig an election. How would one do it? What would be the easiest way to do it, without involving too many people? A good old fashioned "crisis." Scare people away from the crime scene so the dirty business can be done. Everyone knows that if Kerry was going to win he would need OHIO or FLORIDA or both. Those are the only two that would need to be messed with to assure victory for either side. In Ohio there was the famous "Warren County Lockdown" because of "terror" threats. What about the less infamous "Bomb Threat" at the State Elections Office in Tallahassee the day before the election. I guess my point is this....... The only two places that needed to "fixed" (Ohio& Florida) both had a scare tactic applied to a government building the day of, or the day before the election. If they both had the same "crisis" on the same day it would look odd even to people who are not avid news watchers.
The State Elections Office in Tallahassee holds what? The main tabulating computers. It would actually be easier to hack in the main tabulating computers before the actual election because you can place "kernels" in place and never have to mess with it again, and you would still get what looks like "actual" results. The Warren County Courthouse holds what? The optical scan equipment that can be hacked into and votes can be messed with from as low as the local level and as far as the state and national level. By doing it this way you would actually have control before and after the election and you run a smaller chance in getting caught because your using to different modes at two different times.
To get this done all you would need is 2 or 3 people in Ohio and Florida to get this done. Not an army of computer hackers. Does anyone else besides me notice that there were means, opprotunity, and motive here? This even explains the exit polls......

Thank you,
Stacy Lowman

[ClintCooper2003]

84. Hey Stacy

Hey there, Stacy. Just out of curiosity, where are you from? I used to know a Stacy Lowman.

Take care,
Clint

[Twist_U_Up]

4. wow hope is on the way

[lowmanknows]

62. please listen to my theory.............

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/politics/news-article.aspx?storyid=26823

This is odd. Say you wanted to rig an election. How would one do it? What would be the easiest way to do it, without involving too many people? A good old fashioned "crisis." Scare people away from the crime scene so the dirty business can be done. Everyone knows that if Kerry was going to win he would need OHIO or FLORIDA or both. Those are the only two that would need to be messed with to assure victory for either side. In Ohio there was the famous "Warren County Lockdown" because of "terror" threats. What about the less infamous "Bomb Threat" at the State Elections Office in Tallahassee the day before the election. I guess my point is this....... The only two places that needed to "fixed" (Ohio& Florida) both had a scare tactic applied to a government building the day of, or the day before the election. If they both had the same "crisis" on the same day it would look odd even to people who are not avid news watchers.
The State Elections Office in Tallahassee holds what? The main tabulating computers. It would actually be easier to hack in the main tabulating computers before the actual election because you can place "kernels" in place and never have to mess with it again, and you would still get what looks like "actual" results. The Warren County Courthouse holds what? The optical scan equipment that can be hacked into and votes can be messed with from as low as the local level and as far as the state and national level. By doing it this way you would actually have control before and after the election and you run a smaller chance in getting caught because your using to different modes at two different times.
To get this done all you would need is 2 or 3 people in Ohio and Florida to get this done. Not an army of computer hackers. Does anyone else besides me notice that there were means, opprotunity, and motive here? This even explains the exit polls......

Thank you,
Stacy Lowman

[Dogmudgeon]

5. Didn't you get the memo?

Wayne Madsen has been debunked.

We aren't supposed to listen to him. It will make us look bad.

They told us so. They wouldn't lie to us, would They?

--p!
Screw that. I'll listen anyway.

[NVMojo]

8. i think most of the anti madsen freepers have bailed out, haven't they?

[Ducks In A Row]

31. I think their debunking arm got wore out!

:)

[Vote4Kerry]

7. Great for you to come Wayne!!

Glad you are here!! We are here to help you!

[Helga Scow Stern]

9. Exciting time to be alive.

[Shalom]

10. Give Him A Hero's Welcome

If we had 1,000 Wayne Madsen's on the front line, digging up facts, we'd be home free by now. It's time to stop relying on armies of one: Bev Harris, Wayne Madsen, Jesse Jackson. But this is America - WE NEED THE MEDIA ! WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON ?

[Karenca]

11. Jamboi

Thanks!

[nadinbrzezinski]

12. Hey there Wayne \ Casolaro

Will not ask any deep questions, I know how far and hard this goes

Just hope that I can share the info with friends

I know, we are now the media and we need to spread it

And trust me, I have LOTS of questions, but at this stage I know I have to let the story develop

[life_long_dem]

13. Thanks jamboi,

DU Rocks.
America Rocks.
Wayne Madsen Rocks.

p.s. so do you Jesse Jackson............

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

14. Casolaro.

A scary but very apropos nick. The provenance is striking.

[mirandapriestly]

42. Yes, great nickname , but scary

I am looking forward to this

[NVMojo]

323. good catch on the nickname....may the force be with this Casolaro...

[MarcelP]

15. NC clean? Hispanic vote in FL, CA, TX.

Wayne,
Thanks for all the info. FL, CA, TX, and Ohio I get, but what about NC--ignatzmous makes NC look very fishy, both by the difference in counts by different machines (with same demographics for the populations) and by difference between early/absentee vote and poll vote in Kerry race vs. other races. Do you think NC is clean?
(By the way, problems with figuring out the Hispanic vote in FL, TX, CA have been giving experts fits--see Carolab's thread, "44 Percent of Hispanics Voted for Bush, Highly Improbable." Posted Nov. 24)

[freedom for all]

21. Thank you Wayne

for all your help...

[KoKo]

57. And, NC County had a Diebold technician in the precinct supposedly

working on the machine before, during and after the election. I can find the link if he doesn't know about it already.

Here's a snip from the article from "Charlotte Observer" posted on "Daily Kos."


Gaston, NC -Diebold Technician, missing votes, investigation
by oldnorthstate
Mon Nov 22nd, 2004 at 07:27:29 PST

An investigation will begin according to Monday's News & Observer

QUESTIONABLE PRACTICES

State elections officials will begin an investigation today of complaints in Gaston County involving a computer-company technician working on the elections without adequate supervision, a mismatch between ballots cast and the number of voters in some precincts, and the late reporting of early-voting ballots. About 12,000 early votes from Gaston were not reported for a week after the election.


http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/22/102729/93

[Casolaro]

66. NC

There is a possibility that the vote was fixed in NC also and Gaston County is suspicious -- but the scam I'm looking at that involved paying techs to rig the vote was said to definitely involve FL, TX, OH and CA. There may have been other states involved. But the info I received definitely mentioned these Big 4 states.

[Straight Shooter]

98. Let me take a big guess at why Texas was rigged

1. Padding the vote easier to hide
2. More loyal operatives in Texas
3. Keeping the myth alive that bush is "loved" in Texas

Thanks for being here, WM.

edit: oops, I see that WM has answered this further down; yep, pad those votes.

Anybody looking for a Cassandra?

[txindy]

109. Don't forget the added bonus of manipulation in Texas

DeLay's 're-election' and his control of the House.

[Patsy Stone]

157. In English we say

Gerrymandering. :)

[yardwork]

100. Don't forget Beaufort, NC where a machine "ate" early votes

More than 3,000 votes were lost when the machine's memory filled up.

[flyarm]

107. i was a fla poll watcher in pinellas county

dear mr madsen, i am great friends with the people who ran the poll watching here in pinellas county florida..and i am dear friends with the current dec chair.and sec chair....we filled out forms and details of what problems and counts were while poll watching..would you like me to contact the people and ask anything specific of them?? the man who ran the program here will be running for the dec chair here on dec 2nd..he is on top of this program...if i can help you please let me know!!
pinellas county is clearwater fla and st petersburg fla ..on the coast near tampa...we were the heal of the i-4 corridor, very important for election and kerry lost here by approx 155 votes...i was a kerry delegate...anything i can do please feel free to ask!!
i will never believe kerry lost here!!
[e-mail]

[NVMojo]

327. wherever there were new Sequoias in Nevada during the election

sequoia "techs" were on hand for the tabulation.

[Acryliccalico]

353. Thanks

Makes my heart feel better:yourock:

[Woo]

16. Ok Enough --

With the shakin hands -- let's go -- where is he? Let's get some questions flyin' -- let's get this show on the road...

(I was an audio engineer in the commercial/ad world in a previous career, time is money :)

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

19. Excellent.

I need a smidge at 1.5 and a little at 250. Make it so, Number One.

Oh, and more cowbell please. ;-)

[Woo]

34. Yikes...

I hope Mr. Madsen is not a Kansas fan:)

If I may -- possibly an overview of the findings he has released to date(someone else can do this, aha, maybe jamboi, sorry I just twist knobs), so folks who haven't given this much of a look can be up to date without reading through 1000 post --

My question is probably one that can't be answered ... but everyone wants to know -- what's the timeline? -- is there a glimmer of hope to get this out before the inauguration?

[Casolaro]

72. Timeline

We are trying to get this story out and have a criminal investigation started to block the Ohio recert on Friday and the meeting of the Electoral College

[Tace]

76. Good

[Twist_U_Up]

77. i like

[bj2110]

79. Wayne, you have an army of individuals willing to help here at DU...

While it may not be the most secure medium, whatever we can do to help with the crunched schedule, please let us know!

[Donailin]

87. Thanks, Wayne

Good to see you here. You have the total support of the commoners, but do you have the financial or moral support of the candidate we are fighting for? It would be nice to know. . .

[Casolaro]

94. Support

I have been meeting with Kerry campaign and Democratic Party people here this weekend. As for me, I've taken on the Bushes and Karl Rove for years. I appeared on Greg Palast's "Bush Family Fortunes" and explained how the Bush Family uses their office to enrich themselves and their buddies. I'm not afraid of them at all. But I do have protection by my two pals: "Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson." Unlike the person whose name I'm using as a screen name, Danny Casolaro, I trust no one except my friends, and I take another look at them from time to time.

[radio4progressives]

115. What is the Kerry campaign's reaction to recent reports?

It would be extremely helpful, i believe, if Kerry broke with his cryptic messages and held a press conference in the next 24 hours, with a straight forward announcement.

What are your thoughts? Any chance, we should expect to hear from him in the next day or two?

[radio4progressives]

304. Please respond: What's Kerry's reaction to reports? n/t

[mzmolly]

117. Glad your being cautious. How do you know your sources are credible?

And, have you considered contacting Dan Rather? He's leaving CBS shortly and may be a receptive voice.

Thanks again.

[Casolaro]

273. sources

sources are risking their loves by talking

[DemocracyWhere]

142. What investigations are the Dems and Kerry conducting and where?

Is Kerry and/or the Dems funding the Greens and Libertarian verfication effort in Ohio?

If they are but doing it through cutouts, why?
Why wouldn't it be a good idea for Kerry and the Dems to fund the 'independent' efforts out in the open?

To what degree comparatively to other efforts (BBV, Cobb, Badnarik, Nader, etc.) is Kerry and/or the Dems funding and organizing verification investigations in all of the states?

DemocracyWhere (DW)

[MandateThis]

352. Kerry and the DEMS

Yes, Kerry and the Dems are working on this. Let's remember that this is bigger than Kerry or bu$h. It's about America and it's about DEMOCRACY. Many state DEM pages have posted notices on their website that they are working on this too. Sometimes you have to scratch below the surface to see what's going on. We know the network media won't tell us.

[jtb33]

347. You carry a GUN?!

!!!!!!!!!!

[TexasChick]

144. Really? OMG, that's great! n/t

FYI:

n/t = "No text"
eom = "End of Message"

[thebeckerman]

194. New Jersey Federal Case

Would this information to the New Jersey Federal Case enforcing consent decree against RNC?

[Joe Chi Minh]

369. Sorry if

if any pusillanimity on my part in the direction of caution was excessive, ill-advised and counter-productive, Mr Madsen. No need to respond. I just want to get it off my chest.

[99Pancakes]

402. This DUer has a fever

and the only cure is more cowbell.

[Twist_U_Up]

17. book deal

hate to bring it up but repugs are gonna drag this out first and will beat it like a drum

[Wiley50]

18. Greetings Casolaro!

Been reading your stuff on globalresearch.ca and copvcia.com for years. Thanks for fighting the BFEE Cabal for us!

[KaryninMiami]

20. What can we do to support your efforts?

Obviously you are as keenly aware as we are, of the time issue. One of the things that many of us are frustrated about, is not being able to do enough. Or, we feel that our efforts are going nowhere because of the mainstream media lock-down or what appears to be a lack of interest. Any suggestions on what we should be doing (saw your post in BBV and here regarding Foreign poll workers)?

[Casolaro]

80. Response

I share your frustration. The Kerry campaign is not the brightest light in the chandelier on being prepared for this fraud. You need to do something like the MeetUps. Organize. Petitions to the media & member of congress, news conferences with losing local Democratic candidates who may have been caught up in the fraud. Force the lazy corporate controlled media to pay attention but don't get arrested and clobbered around in the process. For Fox News: "If it bleeds, it leads."

[merh]

147. Have you spoken to Kerry directly?

It would seem to me that his investigation into the BCCI would give him ensight into this scam. He would be able to understand the fraud and the connections better than others.

[wattsupamerica]

186. when will your unpaid sources come out

You have the transaction... I am wondering when you will make that into a PDF or a JPG, so people can view it, and more importantly when will you give the names or a quote of a source, lots of reporters I have talked to challenge you on that?

[genius]

226. Thanks for reporting casalaro. I've been handing out your article

I must say that it came as no surprise to me but I was impressed that someone uncovered the truth.

Given that The Republicans have three branches of the federal government, it occurred to me that maybe we could use the Canadian press to make a big deal out of it. This is a wild idea but would it be possible to get Canadian officials to go along with a mock trial? It clearly would not be binding but the information would be on the record and, if Bush were convicted (even in a mock trial) of election rigging, it might carry some weight in terms of getting us some publicity. It would have to be some place close like Canada.

[Ducks In A Row]

237. he answered that

not now, because the freepers will take it, screw with it and present it as a forgery, a la rather

who btw Rather didn't report a lie, the story was 100% true, but rove made sure it was REPORTED as a lie

[merh]

242. Go read the posts he answers your question regarding the check

and why he won't post it. Regarding naming sources, that is also answered and do you know who Deep Throat is? Didn't think so, neither do the reporters you talked to.

[Rumba]

22. Welcome!

User profile shows he's on!

[Solitaire]

23. Hi, Casolaro and thanks for all the work you've done :)

:hi:

[Ducks In A Row]

24. I for one am grateful that he is doing this story

and I hope it will be told in it's entirely soon.

I hope he, and the whistleblowers, take care.


My question is a point that I've read others use to try to debunk the story. Mainly $29.6 million dollars being transferred by check, and not be wire transfer.

Any reasons he knows of at this point as to why a paper check?

I know some people who have been tellers and they hadn't personally heard of that amount of money being transfered by check (but they never handled the HUGE money dealing). And they couldn't think of a reason other than maybe a wire transfer rings bells these days that a paper check might not.





(let us know if questions are going be in another thread, and not this one).

[Ducks In A Row]

29. btw, I don't think the check thing debunks anything

but I'm hoping for a little background about that issue.

[mzmolly]

25. Will he post here? Thanks in advance Mr. Madsen!

:toast:

By "here" I mean in this forum?

[ZRB]

26. G'day Casolaro

I admire your bravery.

My question is: how confident are you that your sources are genuine, and are telling you the truth?

Thank you, and be careful.

[Casolaro]

60. Sources

My sources are very brave for coming forth but they also know what the risks are if they are exposed. My major job other than reporting this story is protecting them.

[mzmolly]

78. But how are you protecting YOU? I think you really need to work with

people in the Kerry camp so that you have back up.

Are you forwarding the information you get to anyone in the Dem party?

I think you should be working with Kerry - John Conyers etc...

[wattsupamerica]

251. could 1 come out in say europe

I am fully in support of your efforts just that I have a bunch of people yelling at me when I bring up your story that not one name just the details on the money and banks.

[lizzieforkerry]

27. Wayne, I live in Warren County, Ohio

Thanks for all you have done!

[Loki]

28. Casolaro is a strange id.

Is there a significance related to its history? Take care Mr. Madsen and welcome to DU.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

35. Google Danny Casolaro.

I think that Danny might have been the first person working on this story, many years ago.

[Casolaro]

54. I'm here

Sorry for the delay... on the check --it is a bank check or cashier's check. Any EFT larger than $10K would be reported to FINCEN here in Tyson's Corner, VA. One for $29.6 would get automatically reported to CIA, NSA, FBI, IRS, DHS and others. They kept this to as paperless trail as possible.

[Ducks In A Row]

64. thank you! very much!

and do keep safe.

[Liberty Belle]

65. Are you confident check is genuine?

Welcome to DU!

Is there any chance that this was a stolen or forged check? Have you actually seen this check, and do you have a photo as evidence?
What evidence do you have linking the company that wrote the check (the one Canada suspects of being involved in the Nigeria Internet scam) to the GOP or the Bush campaign? Is it possible that the Nigeria scam was actually set up to raise money for rigging the election?

[Casolaro]

111. Check

I have a color digital copy of the check. It is real, right down to anti-forgery features. I have refrained from posting it right now because at this stage the Rove types would doctor it and point to the fake version as proof of a forgery. I'm very aware what the right wing bloggers did to 60 Minutes. They may have merely cleaned up the documents for TV (I've seen that done at other networks). But the right jumped all over the docs and discredited Bill Burkett (who is solid) and Dan Rather.

[starroute]

200. On the 60 Minutes memos

There is no sign they were cleaned up. They display many irregularities and imperfections which could only have been produced by a 30 year old typewriter and could not be duplicated by computer. If you or anyone you know is interested in reviving this issue, there were numerous threads on the question here, some with links to the findings of experts in old typewriter fonts, and I would be glad to dig them out.

[lateo]

381. Could you dig those out for me?

I am currently in a debate with someone aboot this very thing.

[Ducks In A Row]

86. and would I be correct in thinking that one big check...

would be more "paperless as possible" than a flurry of checks written to various parties? So just one huge check that they hope fly under the radar.

thanks again

[Casolaro]

96. Check

That's right -- this check likely generated bundles of cash used for the pay outs. The Bushes like to deal in suitcases of cash as do their friends the Saudis.

[mzmolly]

106. The account these funds were deposited into would have smaller

payouts to X that could be traced.

Is anyone working on that? Are Government officials (the legit ones) investigating this?

Bush is losing friends at the CIA I would imagine we'd have some allies right now? Additionally the House Judiciary committee Dems would be interested in any info you have.

[Casolaro]

118. Intel agencies

Some with those agencies have already offered their help to trace the money. I knew I could count on my old "buddies."

[mzmolly]

125. Good to know. What do we do now to take back our democracy?

Do we have a reason to actually vote anymore? Will these people remain in charge of our faux democracy for years to come? What do they want? Money/power all of the above?

[mzmolly]

89. May I ask why your sources chose you to investigate?

Curious as to how you became a contact.

[Casolaro]

104. Investigation

This came to me because of my ongoing work investigating 911 -- this info came as a result of a probe into Saudi money in Texas. It was fitting that my first source and I met at Ground Zero. This effort is as much for those who died that day as for those of us who have been left to deal with the perpetrators of that crime.

[mzmolly]

112. Thanks for the response.

:hi:

[Ducks In A Row]

123. it will be poetic justice if 911 is the catalyst to bring down bush

and company.

[rdmccur]

132. Greg Unger

Is Unger, author of 'House of Bush,House of Saud' aware of any of this?

[Wiley50]

141. Ruppert says"Get over it" You don't see it that way?

Mike Ruppert says There ain't no fighting it except hitting them economically with boycotts and looking out for #1

[TexasChick]

152. Let me take a gander at who that might be....let me see...how about

Smirking Chimp and Satan Cheney? Man, I hate this effin' administration!!

[Wiley50]

180. Absolutely not!

I didn't say I thought we should get over it. I wouldn't be here if I did.
He works with Mike Ruppert of Copvcia on the same octopus.
I'm wanting to know why He's doing this and ruppert is giving up.
Get a grip!
No Freeper here

[TexasChick]

232. Who the eff are you talking to, pal? I was replying to Casolaro 's post

about the 9/11 investigation! I wasn't referring to you at all, ditz! I didn't call anybody a Freeptard! You get a grip and learn how to read before you spew idiotic crap!

[Eloriel]

38. As in Danny?

It's certainly not a name I'd have chosen. :-( Really bad symolism, and all that.

40. re Casolaro as ID... from http://www.american-buddha.com/mystery.death.htm

Joseph Daniel Casolaro was one of many freelance investigative
reporters stirring the witches brew of scandal simmering in the nation's
capitol. He was also an aspiring novelist, newsletter publisher, and
freelance writer for publications running the gamut from the now defunct
Washington Star to the National Enquirer. From a well-to-do family
(his father, a doctor, had invested well in Northern Virginia real estate),
he was 44 years old, divorced, and living comfortably on a five-acre estate
in Fairfax County, Virginia -- home to the CIA.

Casolaro was working on a book aimed at exposing what he called "The Octopus," a group of less than a dozen shadowy figures whose machinations figured heavily, he claimed, in the Inslaw case, Iran-Contra, BCCI, and the October Surprise.

DEATH SCENE, WITH INSTANT EMBALMING

In the first week of August, Casolaro told friends and acquaintances
that he was going to West Virginia too meet a source who would provide a key piece of evidence he needed to complete his investigation. He drove to Martinsburg, West Virginia, on Thursday, August 8, and checked into room 517 of the Sheraton Hotel. Two days later, at 12:51 p.m., hotel employees found his naked body in a bathtub full of bloody water. Time of death has been estimated at about 9:00 a.m. <1>

[ailsagirl]

82. YES-- I remember reading about this on the web

And it gave me the creeps.

http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/6583/bases078.html

http://www.lycaeum.org/books/books/last_circle/1.htm


Bush I's name featured prominently...

[in_cog_ni_to]

364. Just one of many who have died investigating the BFEE.

Be careful Casolaro. These people don't play around. :(

[KaliTracy]

44. Google Casolaro's Octopus

[NY lib NY]

30. From 1 to 100...

One being the least and 100 being the most how sure are you that your evidence will come to the light of day and overturn the election?

thank you for giving me hope again!!!

[Casolaro]

114. Chances

The chances that a third rate burglary at the Watergate would bring down an administration were about a 4 out of 100 in 1972. These numbers should change but we had a much different kind of news media in 72 and 73. So this is going to be a rough ride.

[Liberty Belle]

137. Strategy to gain media coverage

The mainstream media corporations are all publicly owned. Kerry or a prominent liberal organization (Dean's or Moveon) could mobilize Dems to speak out at shareholder meetings and in the meantime, contact the chief financial officer or shareholder liaison at each of these companies. Protesting the lack of serious coverage, coupled with an organized effort to get Dems to dump stock in GE, Viacom, Disney, Fox, and Time-Warner could get their attention. It worked with Sinclair Broadcasting. These companies also have products we could boycott. Send GE's CEO a crushed up lightbulb. Tell Disney we won't buy any Disney toys or videos this holiday season--let alone visit Disney World. Fox owns a movie studio. Time-Warner publishes books and other materials. If half the voters in this country stopped buying this stuff, the corporate media would have to listen.
I'm a business writer. I have access to paid information services and could easily get the names of all officers in these corporations, plus contact info and shareholder materials. Just imagine if we held a demonstration in front of their next stockholder meetings and passed out info on voting fraud (and media suppression of the story) to every shareholder entering the meeting!

[ooglymoogly]

231. here is a link

i post this every chance i get and so should everyone else as well as what strategy to gain media advocates. http://www.followyourmoney.org everyone needs get the list of bad and good companies and make hundreds of copies and give them to everyone remotely interested in our cause.

[chicchick]

294. Footnote from a member of MSM

Please understand that plenty of journalists inside Big Media are interested but are forbidden to report it. In my newsroom, we must whisper and look over our shoulders to even speak ill of Bush or mention vote fraud. It's our livelihood. We haven't sold out but need your help to speak out without losing our jobs.

I would LOVE to see organized mass demonstrations outside my newspaper office. It would have a huge impact on coverage, I guarantee. The one thing corporate management cares more about than kissing the administration's butt is local, direct criticism.

Don't be shy. Organize. Now, this week, IS THE TIME to take MSM to task. Trust me on this.

Take Wayne's story to the publisher -- en mass -- and insist your newspaper or radio or TV start covering the news its audience wants to know.

[Liberty Belle]

322. Thanks. Demonstration planned in San Diego.

A friend is organizing it in front of the Union-Tribune offices here. I hope others will follow suit. I've been a newspaper journalist myself, and know that you are right.

FYI, I've formed an e-mail group of activists across the nation. We've begun a strategy of e-mail independent newspapers that switched endorsements from Bush in 2000 to Kerry in 2004. So far two have published strong editorials on voter fraud after receiving the materials we sent, so there is a glimmer of hope. If enough readers see this in second-tier papers and start questioning why larger newspapers and TV stations aren't carrying these stories, it will become more difficult for the mainstream media to ignore.

Times have surely changed since Watergate, when even our conservative local paper covered the unfolding story in vivid detail.

I still think going over the heads of publishers to the corporations that own them--and their stockholders--may be the way to break through the ice. I've posted the idea here a couple of times but no one has responded. Maybe pickets in front of Disneyland would get some attention.

[Habibi]

351. Sorry, but

you HAVE sold out.

[nmoliver]

357. How to publicize

My approach to publicize these hot-potato items that Madsen is unfolding would be:

1. International. Contact writers such as Michael Meacher in London, people in France, and the Canadian media. Since Canadian sources are implicated, Canadian outlets could show good promise. It will be harder for our media to ignore the story if it is making headlines in Canada.

Take our case to the UN.

2. The congresspeople such as Nadler et al. who are challenging the election. Ask them to have the GAO expand its investigation to include the Madsen findings.

3. Keith Olbermann. As the evidence becomes more solid, he may start to cooperate. The fact that he has given Madsen's work a public face is a good start. His questions about it were not unreasonable - I had the same questions myself, as did many of us.

4. Keep it alive on the internet, and make sure the case is proved solid.

5. The rest of the media after that. I wouldn't bother with this approach until all of the evidence is there.

Throughout the process, we must keep in mind that everybody involved in exposing this scam is endangering their lives and the lives of their loved ones.

- Nina

[Alisa]

403. How about buying "puts" on these companies, in a coordinated attack?

While having those that hold stocks, dumping? Wouldn't that be scary!:D

[ahyums]

207. can we take that to mean that you think they're fairly low or that because

Watergate was actually exposed that they are fairly high?

Thanks again for spending all this time to answer the curious masses.

[chomskysright]

32. e-voting employeees info here for WM

here is what I just sent you.

I ain't hiding: marsha hammond, phd: licensed psychologist: GA & NC
[e-mail]...if I can be of any assistance.

I have an Election Protest meeting tomorrow with the Buncombe county (Asheville, NC) BOE:



Marsha Hammond, PhD

I understand via the democraticunderground.com that you are perhaps looking for some of this information (which you perhaps already have).

Nevertheless, here is some:


This is Gaston county NC where the NC BOE and director cannot seem to get a straight answer: 'dunno' is the song the BOE person is singing
1. Anyone living in Gaston County should be mad.
>Also, recent news article indicates that even the NCBOE thinks maybe
>the 2000 results in Gaston are questionable.
>
>We can't give these people a free pass.
>
>The county pays a technician from Diebold to operate its systems on
>Election Day. That person was in charge of transferring early votes
>from electronic storage to the counting computer. Diebold believes
>the transmission was interrupted, said spokesman David Bear. Story
>Archive
>http://www.votersunite.org/electionproblems.asp?
>sort=date&selectstate=NC&selectproblemtype=Machine+malfunction
>
>If you want to help heat up the media interest in GASTON county,
>send a copy of this "public information request" to various media
>outlets.
>
>Tell the reporter (via email or phone) that getting the answers to
>the questions in that request will make a HUGE STORY.
>
>The Charlotte Observer is covering this pretty well, but send it to
>your local papers too. I sent it to the North Carolina AP desk on
>Nov 15th.
>
>The Public Information Request that you should send is at this link:
>http://www.blackboxvoting.org/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?
>az=show_thread&om=1&forum=DCForumID1490&omm=2&viewmode=threaded
>or if that link appears broken in this message, use this one:
>http://tinyurl.com/5z8ym
>
>

2. Indiana: I assume you have this:

Look at what happened in Johnson and Marion Counties, IN. These are both
ES&S counties. One is DRE and the other optical-scan. In Johnson County,
ES&S tried to use uncertified software without detection. Their local
technician, who also worked very closely with the county elections
department, was told to cover-up and lie about the problem. He refused to
do that and was fired. The county hired him as an adviser. Then Marion
County had a problem and their technician was told to lie and cover-up
which she refused to do. She was fired and given a job by the county as an
adviser. In both cases these people took the places of election workers on
election night, working for ES&S. If they had done the dishonorable thing
and lied to the county, who is to believe that they would not have done
things with the vote count?

3. And of course GA where all the counties have to deal with Diebold employeed. For the person to talk to about this:
Roxanne
countthevote.com (I sent her telephone number to you in the e mail)

associated with Georgians for verified voting


Sincerely,

Marsha Hammond, PhD: Licensed Psychologist: NC & GA

[Avalux]

36. Casolaro - I live in Texas

and was surprised you mentioned this state as part of the "fix". Is there anything I can do from here? Just point me in the right direction and I'll do what I can. Thank you so much for all of your hard work! :hi:

[Casolaro]

85. Texas

They used Texas to pad their national margin (the 3+ million votes). They used California for the same thing. Any unusual activity/behavior noticed at any polling place in Texas should be reported. I am forwarding complaints I'm receiving now to Democratic Party and Kerry campaign people.

[Donailin]

92. "Pad their margins" -- Oh those bastards.

I knew it.

[madrigal]

95. TX weirdness

Insecure ballot boxes and weird stuff:

excerpt:

"The lack of security for ballot boxes has also been recorded. They were not in a locked and secured area, but stacked around the county clerk's office, some in the public waiting area. Only one visible box had a piece of paper taped over the slot on top.

Concerned citizens mentioned the boxes in the waiting area on Friday, after looking through the glass on one of the doors that leads into the hallway. Despite the boxes being clearly marked, county clerk office staff quickly informed them the boxes they saw were not ballot boxes at all, but storage containers. Office staff then closed the blinds on the two windows into the hallway."

source:
www.zwire.com/site/news.cfm?newsid=13377692&BRD=1574&PAG=461&dept_id=532241&rfi=6

[ailsagirl]

97. And also...

https://voteprotect.org/index.php?display=EIRMapNation&tab=ALL

contact info:
[e-mail]

They have a huge database of documented incidents from the election, sorted by type and location (interactive map of US, broken down into state/counties/precincts). You can query on any county in the country. The worst states (1000+ incidents), among others, are California (3250 incidents), Texas (2263), Florida (4569), and Ohio (3332).

[Avalux]

119. Thanks for responding -

makes sense they'd use Texas to pad the national vote. Much work to be done. :hi:

[nadinbrzezinski]

120. CA personal, they demanded IDs but in San Diego

the scanners, they used Opti Scans, were not working well. My precinct they were not working, period

[Liberty Belle]

177. Right. My son's precinct had opti-scans crash repeatedly.

He worked at a San Diego polling place. It took 20 tries to read one ballot. They called the Registrar and had technicians sent over several times to fix the problem, without much success. All the techs were white college kids, BTW.

[mhr]

330. I Worked Early Voting In Dallas County - I Personally Observed

The ES&S iVotronic touch screen machines give votes to Bush.

I observed four occurrences. Each time a straight party democratic voter would find Bush replacing Kerry on the summary page.

Fortunately, these errors were caught. But, who knows how many unsuspecting voters did not scrutinize the summary page thoroughly.

All occurrences were reported to the Martin Frost campaign for whom I volunteered.

Interestingly, I never observed an alternative example were Kerry replaced Bush!

[ahyums]

37. If he does post on here my question is fairly simple one:

First of all many many thanks to Wayne for actually taking the time to come on here and answer questions.

As someone who is obviously fairly involved in this, how optimistic are you that it will all be exposed in time? How good do you think the chances are of stopping Bush from being inaugurated?

[kk897]

39. Casolaro---

Looking more and more like the original Casolaro was on to something real.

Mr. Madsen, have you investigated the involvement of the extremist wingers such as the Sovereign Citizens movement in this election?

I think that the largest contributor to Ohio's 2004 GOP campaigns, David Brennan, and his White Hat Management (manages charter schools and homeschool programs, HQ in Akron) company, had a hand in election fraud. According to watchdog groups, Sovereign Citizens are working toward gaining a foothold in County governments (the highest level of government they acknowledge), including the strategy of getting appointments to Boards of Elections and County Commissioners' offices. They also often impersonate various kinds of enforcement agents in order to intimidate people. When you follow the money, it leads up to the likes of Hudson Institute and Amway. There's also a connection to Kenneth Blackwell.

I detail some of this in the thread I put below... I've been looking further, on my own, since DUers didn't seem particularly interested,but I do want to bring it to someone's attention. Just in case.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=203&topic_id=81142

Take care, and thank you so much for your courage and work.

[teenvote]

41. Wayne- Question on Vote Rigging- What about NY? NC? Va?

Wayne-

Thank you for taking the time to our answer our questions.

With regard to your interview today on Pacifica radio, you mentioned four states on which the investigation is focusing: OH, FL, TX and CA.

My question is whether you have any information about investigations in the following states: (1) New York, which reported a mysterious 4% decrease in voter turnout (could Kerry votes have been wiped out?); North Carolina, which had a huge pro-Bush discrepancy between the exit polls and the final numbers; and Virginia, which had enormous Democratic turnout in several areas but went to Bush by a similar margin to which he won in 2000. It seems to me if the "padding" of Bush's numbers occurred, it may have been done in these states as well.

Also, what information can you give us regarding HOW the actual manipulation went on? Without compromising any identities, have you actually spoken with any of these vote riggers? Have they explained exactly how they did what they did?

[Solitaire]

47. New York City...

I live in New York City and we use those old, (I guess reliable) lever machines here.

I saw nothing out of the ordinary where I voted, on East 60th Street.

[propagandafreegal]

74. Hold on! I live in NYC and there was purging of the voter roles ro...

I know two people that were registered and when they went to vote were not on the list and had to complete provisional ballots.

One was my cousin and another was my friend's mom who had been voting at the same polling place for twenty years.

The Republicans covered all their bases in diminishing the democratic vote. Both people I mentioned were African American.

[Casolaro]

124. NYC

I think NYC went smoothly. Tammany Hall has not died out just yet. Those old Democrats are smarter than to allow Diebold and ES&S in their domain.

[Solitaire]

153. right...

and you know us NY'ers. Not so easy to push us around; we get angry quickly.

:)

[propagandafreegal]

159. NY did not go smoothly for the two people I know whose votes weren't

counted. I know I'm new here and have no credibility, but it is true. They used different methods to drain votes away from Kerry in NY.

[Casolaro]

122. Vote fixers

I communicated with someone who was aware of the project. That person definitely knew about those 4 states. There may have been others but the contact was not in a position to know about other states. But it can't be ruled out.

[mzmolly]

43. Do you know when he's supposed to do so?

;)

Tick ... tock ... tick ... tock.

Waiting impatiently. :hi:

[bj2110]

45. He's here... Over at GD... Link here...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2760765

[IAMREALITY]

88. Casolaro, Firstly Thanks for Being Here and For Your Courage

My question is simple, as it is all I personally need to know. I know you have to protect information, I know you have to proceed carefully, and I know you are very smart and capable in how you are handling this. I also have faith in you.

So my question(s) simply are

1. Can we at DU and elsewhere have 100% confidence that this story is backed by substantially competent sources.

2. What would you place the odds at that this will make its way into the Mainstream Media and be the catalyst for widespread investigations that may start the process of pieces coming together one by one, and that this could be the smoking gun we are all waiting for.

Summed up I'm basically just asking can we have confidence this is real, and can we place some level of hope that this will lead to a breakthrough.

Thank you.

[Goldeneye]

46. He's here....he posted in the linking message from the lobby

[ahyums]

50. is someone going to point him in the direction of this thread?

[Goldeneye]

52. I posted that people were waiting in this thread

I'm sure hes responding ...lots of questions to look through...it'll take some time.

Here's the link if you want to jump to that thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=2760765#2760795

[jamboi]

55. Think he just arrived.

[Ducks In A Row]

58. he's just at one post at the moment, I guess it's only fair

to let him read our questions, think about them and take time to answer.

I mean, just because we're all tearing OUR hair out doesn't mean he's under any pressure.


anyone remember the commerical with the woman waiting for some store's door to open.

waiting waiting waiting....


:)

[Digit]

48. Casolaro, my question

In the states you mentioned, please tell us the counties, and precincts where we can find the anomalies. I realize it is a mess, and all sorts of methods were used.
Did they control these areas from within the areas or from outside somehow.
Do we need to look at any other states other than the ones you mentioned in your interview Sunday evening 11/27.
Thanks for sticking your neck out.

[Eloriel]

59. There's a lot of good info you can dig up yourself right here --

Check especially for Ohio (if that's what you're mainly interested in), but also Resources:

VOTE FRAUD LINKS - A DU Compendium - Thread #3
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=201x4927

VOTE FRAUD Links Compendium - Thread #2
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=201x3223

VOTE FRAUD Links - a DU Compendium
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=201&topic_id=1984#

[Casolaro]

133. Counties

My leads on that are that the counties and precincts were where there were unspecified "security actions" ordered by phony FBI and DHS people. This cleared the way for the techies to perform their "fixes." What I've also been told is that some non-US techies were involved.

[Straight Shooter]

143. Non US techies, meaning Canadian?

In other words, they would blend in?

Thanks.

[Casolaro]

146. techies

Not heard about Canadians, but Mexicans, Brazilians and Russians

[Straight Shooter]

161. Brazilians, of course. Thanks, Poppy, thanks ever so much.

Always taking care of his boy.

[Lil]

170. Ah! I wasn't thinking of that possibility in my post #164

[Lil]

164. Trying to get a picture of what the activity at a precinct might look like

Would the "non-US techies" be on the ground or just the phony FBI and DHS people?

I'd guess there was no need to be on site if computers were involved.

Just thinking of ways to jog memories of poll watcher who had visits from the "FBI & DHS" - who might be thinking, "But there were no 'non-US' types around my polling place."

[cloud75]

49. welcome casolaro keep up the good work...

the media is watching this story don't stop doing your research they will follow soon i used to be a small market tv reporter and every good story starts off as "word on the street" these days the internet is "the word on the street."

[ooglymoogly]

51. hi wayn

i read k olberman blog and got a little sad that he seemed to be ragging on you. what about his point that why would k. r. tell his soldiers about the large and exact amount of money. i read it early afternoon before your broadcast and am not completely sure of my facts. we are all rooting for you. thank you for answering questions

[Casolaro]

136. Olbermann

Keith probably doesn't get out of that bunker in Secaucus, NJ very often. Also, being an ESPN sportscaster may not have been the best experience to judge such a long lead investigative story.

[Alizaryn]

154. Olbermann

If he is anything Keith Olbermann is reasonable and WILL listen to reason. He has done more then consistantly bring issues concerning the election to light he has given us hope.

[Ducks In A Row]

174. not to say keith can't learn...

I think his first blush response was because this sounded to many people as coming from tinfoilhatland (not me because I knew your rep).

but as keith has been the sole mainstream media voice so far as any reporting on election fraud (without saying the word "fraud" unfortunately), think of Olbermann as being worth educating on the facts.

It could be MSNBC will let out Olbermann's leash a little bit more and he can seriously report on this story in a place another viewing audience can see.

[Patsy Stone]

184. KO = Watergate fan.

http://www.nyobserver.com/pages/frontpage4.asp

[ooglymoogly]

193. thanks Wayne

this is real treachery. you need to be careful. it's too awful. it makes me sick in the pit of my stomach. damn it be careful and we will be watching and rooting for you and doing what we can to help

[BradBlog]

385. Sloppy Reporting from Olbermann on this One

In my opinion. Here's why...See this story:

Mr. Olbermann: Pot on Line One, Says You're Black
http://www.bradblog.com/archives/00000999.htm

[Name removed]

395. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. 
[link:www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules.html|Click
here] to review the message board rules.

[lowmanknows]

53. Here's my theory and it accounts for all even the exit polls.........

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/politics/news-article.aspx?storyid=26823

This is odd. Say you wanted to rig an election. How would one do it? What would be the easiest way to do it, without involving too many people? A good old fashioned "crisis." Scare people away from the crime scene so the dirty business can be done. Everyone knows that if Kerry was going to win he would need OHIO or FLORIDA or both. Those are the only two that would need to be messed with to assure victory for either side. In Ohio there was the famous "Warren County Lockdown" because of "terror" threats. What about the less infamous "Bomb Threat" at the State Elections Office in Tallahassee the day before the election. I guess my point is this....... The only two places that needed to "fixed" (Ohio& Florida) both had a scare tactic applied to a government building the day of, or the day before the election. If they both had the same "crisis" on the same day it would look odd even to people who are not avid news watchers.
The State Elections Office in Tallahassee holds what? The main tabulating computers. It would actually be easier to hack in the main tabulating computers before the actual election because you can place "kernels" in place and never have to mess with it again, and you would still get what looks like "actual" results. The Warren County Courthouse holds what? The optical scan equipment that can be hacked into and votes can be messed with from as low as the local level and as far as the state and national level. By doing it this way you would actually have control before and after the election and you run a smaller chance in getting caught because your using to different modes at two different times.
To get this done all you would need is 2 or 3 people in Ohio and Florida to get this done. Not an army of computer hackers. Does anyone else besides me notice that there were means, opprotunity, and motive here? This even explains the exit polls......

Thank you,
Stacy Lowman

[merh]

61. Bless you Wayne

be careful and dig, dig, dig, uncover this nation from the crap of the BFEE - let us know what we can do to help. :hug: :loveya:

[Stand and Fight]

63. Awwweeessssommme

Awesome work DU troopers! Thanks for letting us know that.

[SCRUBDASHRUB]

71. CASOLARO: HAVE YOU BEEN IN CONTACT WITH (OR VICE VERSA)

KEITH OLBERMANN?

Oh, and a big and hearty welcome to DU! Hope you stay and enjoy yourself; we have a good crowd here.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

67. Speaking as an old moderator from way back...

Let's try to hold our breaths and let Wayne have a little time to answer.

A humble suggestion from a friend to friends. ;-)

[karlrschneider]

91. Yes! Give him a little air between questions and demands!

...

[autorank]

68. Jamboi, thanks! Que passa?

[Alizaryn]

69. Is there hope of a black and white ending?

Thanks for all of your efforts. I would like to know if there is anything that you can tell us that would convince us that you are Wayne Madsen. We are fighting a constant battle with those that question.

Why is Texas mentioned as being a key link?
Do you have enough information to bring to the authorities?
Why the heck would they be dumb enough to set a scenario like this in motion and then refuse to pay?


Is there any hope?

[Carolab]

70. Any connection between Five Star Investments

and FISX Group Limited?

Or between Equity Financial Trust and FISX Group Limited?

Also, any connection(s) to Caryle or Baker-Botts? Or Worldsec? Or Appleby Spurling and Kempe?

One more, in Florida, was the rigging targeted to certain counties/precincts or did it occur all over? I ask because of the Miami Herald's independent count in north Florida of 17,000 votes.

Thank you.

[Casolaro]

151. connection

Not sure about FISX Group.

Baker a very real possibility though. Votes grabbed in FL were statewide, but especially the more populated counties where the padding could go virtually unnoticed.

[lowmanknows]

331. I know I'm new here, but please listen to my theory.............

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/politics/news-article.aspx?storyid=26823

This is odd. Say you wanted to rig an election. How would one do it? What would be the easiest way to do it, without involving too many people? A good old fashioned "crisis." Scare people away from the crime scene so the dirty business can be done. Everyone knows that if Kerry was going to win he would need OHIO or FLORIDA or both. Those are the only two that would need to be messed with to assure victory for either side. In Ohio there was the famous "Warren County Lockdown" because of "terror" threats. What about the less infamous "Bomb Threat" at the State Elections Office in Tallahassee the day before the election. I guess my point is this....... The only two places that needed to "fixed" (Ohio& Florida) both had a scare tactic applied to a government building the day of, or the day before the election. If they both had the same "crisis" on the same day it would look odd even to people who are not avid news watchers.
The State Elections Office in Tallahassee holds what? The main tabulating computers. It would actually be easier to hack in the main tabulating computers before the actual election because you can place "kernels" in place and never have to mess with it again, and you would still get what looks like "actual" results. The Warren County Courthouse holds what? The optical scan equipment that can be hacked into and votes can be messed with from as low as the local level and as far as the state and national level. By doing it this way you would actually have control before and after the election and you run a smaller chance in getting caught because your using to different modes at two different times.
To get this done all you would need is 2 or 3 people in Ohio and Florida to get this done. Not an army of computer hackers. Does anyone else besides me notice that there were means, opprotunity, and motive here? This even explains the exit polls......

Thank you,
Stacy Lowman

[Stand and Fight]

73. We need a thread just for questions for Mr. Madsen...

No other commentary.

eom

[Twist_U_Up]

75. Has JJ or anyone from the DNC offered any assistance ?

a wink for a reply and I`m happy

[shraby]

93. Scroll down through the posts...he's answering

them here and there.

[Patsy Stone]

148. Actually it seems answering in order. n/t

[Casolaro]

145. assistance

I've been meeting with the Dems and Kerry folks all this weekend here in DC

[Twist_U_Up]

149. TYVM Please tell John when you talk to him

WE BELIEVE IN HIM AND ITS TIME TO REPORT TO DUTY

[rdmccur]

162. Second that!

[MandateThis]

355. Tell JK We got his back!

Write to John Kerry and tell him, "WE GOT YOUR BACK!" We should all do that!!!! :)

[mzmolly]

167. How receptive are they to what you have to say?

:shrug:

[ooglymoogly]

276. yesssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss!!!!!!!

[Eloriel]

81. My question

is twofold.

I believe one of your correspondents passed along my concern that this may be a set-up similar to the Rather and Hatfield set ups. I know you're not exactly naive, but you DO realize the Rather thing was a set-up, don't you (not necessarily targeting Rather specifically). Remember, one of the key ingredients is a lot of TRUTH, with enough falsehood to sink the story and make the lack of credibility the story. Other than your checks and other documents, how are you guarding against this and/or sure that you're not the target of another set-up?

SECOND --

The real reason that I and several others who have been working on this voting machine issue for two years now are skeptical of this whole storyline is that (1) it's so highly improbable from a logistics standpoint, based on your description and (2) it's not necessary -- those systems are riggable from inside AND via modem (or wireless) in real time. It's just not necessary. Why would they dream up a stunt like this, with all its potential for discovery, leaks, etc., when it's just NOT necessary?

[Casolaro]

140. Bush m.o.

The Bushes seldom deviate from their m.o., which is to use pass throughs, shell companies, and large amounts of money to get what they want. Yes, there is a lead on gaining access through modems. But that is where I have to be careful. The name I have connected with that is well known and he has sued journalists in the past for libel.

[jamboi]

158. Hmm... big hint there! We could figure out who that is. n/t

[Straight Shooter]

192. You'll be googling all night, jamboi

Trust me ;)

[jamboi]

224. Reporters sued for libel? Doesn't seem like that would be too hard.

Especially if someone is a political journalist and familiar with these things I'm thinking they'd probably be able to get it quickly.

[Straight Shooter]

238. I took a stab at it and had thousands of responses ... BUT

I'm not a political journalist. You're right, someone in the field would have a good head start. But, do we risk exposing that person?

BTW, thanks for getting WM on board here tonight. Some very important questions are being answered, and I hear the ring of authenticity in his answers.

:thumbsup:

[mzmolly]

The only reason I could think of E is if they brought in suitcases full of

pre filled out optiscan ballots so a paper recount would not detect anything?

That might explain the voter turnout vs. # of registered voters issue?

Though the whole scenario sounds really far fetched. I guess Watergate probably did too?

[merh]

317. Eloriel

Reading these posts made me realize that they probably vote padded in Mississippi. I know of one precinct in a predominately African American community that "ran out of ballots" and was not able to allow voters to cast their ballots for a couple of hours. The doors were closed until more ballots arrived. :shrug:

[NJ_Lib]

83. Welcome Wayne...

Please use us as your personal assistants... There are many different kinds of people here, from different walks of life and professions...

If there's anything you need, please don't hesitate to ask...

God bless you and your family for the hard work and sacrifices you've made... Thank you!

[Ducks In A Row]

191. Hell yes, use us if you can

some of us are unemployed as a result of bush's economic stupidity, and have lots of free time

of course you have to be VERY careful, I know, but if you can give assignments that will not expose you or the whistleblowers to danger, please consider it.

[Vote4Kerry]

90. Nominating this thread

Hopefully people will know where to come to chat with Wayne and get information! Nominating this thread for homepage now!

[Kellis]

101. Welcome Madsen

Im wondering is this safe for him?I mean this is pretty serious stuff we're talking about here.

I hope you are protected.

Stay safe-Please.Our Democracy is at stake!:toast:

[burn the bush]

99. is this investigation the reason why the dnc & all have been quiet?

[chiffon]

155. Hopefully they offered SOME support.

[Casolaro]

185. support

support was offered and was appreciated

[Casolaro]

211. DNC

Pretty sad outfit -- they can't even hire a decent Karl Rove type. A "Karl Rove who likes dogs and kids, brakes for animals, but hates Republicans."

[Ducks In A Row]

278. probably because their main function is to raise money

and until we get a fire-breathing liberal as head, it's about all they'll be good for.

.. ::Sigh::

[jdj]

383. I don't understand that, everyone here hates Rove, and many of

us are unemployed.

[lowmanknows]

334. I know I'm new, please listen to my theory.........

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/politics/news-article.aspx?storyid=26823

This is odd. Say you wanted to rig an election. How would one do it? What would be the easiest way to do it, without involving too many people? A good old fashioned "crisis." Scare people away from the crime scene so the dirty business can be done. Everyone knows that if Kerry was going to win he would need OHIO or FLORIDA or both. Those are the only two that would need to be messed with to assure victory for either side. In Ohio there was the famous "Warren County Lockdown" because of "terror" threats. What about the less infamous "Bomb Threat" at the State Elections Office in Tallahassee the day before the election. I guess my point is this....... The only two places that needed to "fixed" (Ohio& Florida) both had a scare tactic applied to a government building the day of, or the day before the election. If they both had the same "crisis" on the same day it would look odd even to people who are not avid news watchers.
The State Elections Office in Tallahassee holds what? The main tabulating computers. It would actually be easier to hack in the main tabulating computers before the actual election because you can place "kernels" in place and never have to mess with it again, and you would still get what looks like "actual" results. The Warren County Courthouse holds what? The optical scan equipment that can be hacked into and votes can be messed with from as low as the local level and as far as the state and national level. By doing it this way you would actually have control before and after the election and you run a smaller chance in getting caught because your using to different modes at two different times.
To get this done all you would need is 2 or 3 people in Ohio and Florida to get this done. Not an army of computer hackers. Does anyone else besides me notice that there were means, opprotunity, and motive here? This even explains the exit polls......

Thank you,
Stacy Lowman

[BlackVelvet04]

358. We saw this the first 20 times.........

Could you please refrain from littering up this thread? I'm sure your theory will be given all due consideration at some point, but this isn't the thread for it.

[IndyOp]

102. Siphoning Votes from Dems to 3rd Party Candidates in 2000, 2003 & 2004

Casolaro - I just posted a summary of evidence of "Siphoning Votes from Democrats to Third Party Candidates" in the 2000, 2003, and 2004 elections based on work by Mark Crispin Miller, Richard Phillips, Bev Harris, and Oliver Willis on DU. The link to the complete summary is at the bottom of this post. Best wishes! IndyOp

Fingerprints of Vote Fraud, Part I:
Siphoning Votes from Democrats to Third Party Candidates

One way to make the case that vote fraud occurred in the 2004 Presidential election is to demonstrate a similar pattern of unusual results in this election and previous elections in which vote fraud has been suspected. For example, unusually high vote tallies for third party candidates may result from moving votes cast for Democrats to third party candidates. The total number of votes cast remains the same, but the performance of the Democratic candidate is damaged as compared to the Republican. This paper will summarize evidence that suggests that votes were siphoned from the Democratic candidate to the third party candidate(s) in three US elections: 2000, 2003, and 2004. In two cases (California 2003 and Ohio 2004) the unusually high vote tallies for the third party candidates are apparent in the final vote counts. In two cases (Florida 2000 and Ohio 2004) votes appear to have been moved from the Democrat to third party candidate(s) to temporarily damage the Democrat’s performance as precincts were reporting during election night – in one case the votes were returned to the Democrat a few hours later, in the other the votes may have been transferred to the Republican candidate. Perhaps it is coincidence that the voting systems involved in these cases are Diebold, Global Election Systems, and ES&S – all with ties to Republicans?

<http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x87168>

[flyarm]

172. were florida sequoia machines involved??

please be careful mr madsen..these thugs like to cause car wrecks and suicides!!

i am in pinellas fla and i was wondering if this problem occured in sequoia machines or optical scan?? or both??
i worked for both kerry here in fla and betty castor...so i am very interested ..
i was a poll watcher for primaries, 2 weeks early vote and general, but we here in pinellas have sequoia machines, i am just curious if this was an across the board theft,or if it occured in specific machines..or did it occur in the tabulation gems machines only..
i was also a delegate for this area..for pinellas so i know all the candidates well and all the dem congress people well as well as janet reno...we lost every race here in pinellas..and we went gore last time with so many fewer people coming out for election..this election the volunteers and voters for kerry were overwhelming..i will never ever believe kerry did not win here nor will i ever believe betty castor did not win!!

thank you and please be careful...

from a just retired 33 yr american airlines flight attendant nyc based...2001 flight attendant of the year nyc..i know bush allowed my coworkers die!! its why i worked so hard to get him out of office so we could finally get the truth!!

from fly

[lowmanknows]

346. Please listen to my Theory........

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/politics/news-article.aspx?storyid=26823

This is odd. Say you wanted to rig an election. How would one do it? What would be the easiest way to do it, without involving too many people? A good old fashioned "crisis." Scare people away from the crime scene so the dirty business can be done. Everyone knows that if Kerry was going to win he would need OHIO or FLORIDA or both. Those are the only two that would need to be messed with to assure victory for either side. In Ohio there was the famous "Warren County Lock down" because of "terror" threats. What about the less infamous "Bomb Threat" at the State Elections Office in Tallahassee the day before the election. I guess my point is this....... The only two places that needed to "fixed" (Ohio& Florida) both had a scare tactic applied to a government building the day of, or the day before the election. If they both had the same "crisis" on the same day it would look odd even to people who are not avid news watchers.
The State Elections Office in Tallahassee holds what? The main tabulating computers. It would actually be easier to hack in the main tabulating computers before the actual election because you can place "kernels" in place and never have to mess with it again, and you would still get what looks like "actual" results. The Warren County Courthouse holds what? The optical scan equipment that can be hacked into and votes can be messed with from as low as the local level and as far as the state and national level. By doing it this way you would actually have control before and after the election and you run a smaller chance in getting caught because your using to different modes at two different times.
To get this done all you would need is 2 or 3 people in Ohio and Florida to get this done. Not an army of computer hackers. Does anyone else besides me notice that there were means, opportunity, and motive here? This even explains the exit polls......

Thank you,
Stacy Lowman

[proudtobeadem]

103. Hi Wayne! Welcome! :)

[ahyums]

105. One more quick question (I don't think it's been asked yet)

There has been a lot of conjecture on here about the Kerry Campaign and/or Senior Democrats in general working "under the radar" on this, to your knowledge, and if you can answer without disturbing someone's secrecy is this the case?

[Casolaro]

156. Radar

I just don't get the feeling that Kerry and the big shots have any master plan. But there are other Dems and Kerry people working on this angle of the story and they've been supportive.

[MRKARNO]

108. Wayne, question on why Bush was so eager to declare a "mandate"

Is the reason that Bush was so eager to declare a mandate at his 11-4-04 (I think) press conference because he knew he didnt have one and that his padding efforts were successful?

[Casolaro]

160. Mandate

Yes, Bush was real sure of himself, like a thief is when he knows he got away with a bank heist.

[merh]

275. More like a mafia don that owns the police, the judges and

the jury. :shrug:

[DoYouEverWonder]

110. Hi Wayne, I hope you've seen the stories we collected

regarding all the shut downs of election offices around the country because of so called terrorist threats?

I know you referenced this in your article and some people are saying that you didn't back up your claim. Well, here's a ton of back up. I hope you find the info useful.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=2750379


BTW: Thanks for come by and letting us bombard you with questions.

PBWY
DYEW

[buddysmellgood]

113. Either your sources will have to come forward or the source will need to

give explicit detail that shows how the vote was hacked. We need information that only the hackers would have. Otherwise, your story is going to look like one more conspiracy theory.

[Casolaro]

176. Sources

Since the Bushes destroy their opponents, I am relying on getting the technical details of the rigging. The sources have done their jobs by passing on this information in good faith. I can't expect them to identify themselves.

[mzmolly]

190. True, but this does have to lead to SOLID evidence.

Will this/can this lead to solid evidence?

[LiberalAndProud]

Have you uncovered any of the technical details?

Sample code for instance?

[Casolaro]

267. code

This is still at the level of following the money trail to the perps..not there yet.

[ZRB]

289. Are you confident that you will "get there?"

And do you have any idea when?

[Eloriel]

213. How will that work?

Even that can't be proven -- no one gets to open the machines. All traces of vote rigging are easily erased. What kinds of technical details could be useful here?

[TexasChick]

116. Hi, from Texas, Casolaro! PLEASE, PLEASE take care of yourself!

These people will stop at nothing to stay into power, even getting rid of you and anyone else who stands in their way of getting rid of their bogus mandate for the Chimp!

[Twist_U_Up]

121. Great radio this afternoon

It boosted alot of the naysayers confidence in our fight
on DU and here
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/11/28/2147/5748

check out the poll
Keep up the fight and STAY SAFE

P.S. When you bring Bush down ..I will nominate you to replace him

Madsen For President

[Casolaro]

168. Thanks

My platform in free beer for everyone but the Neo Cons. Beer is not allowed in Camp X Ray, Guantanamo Bay.

[IAMREALITY]

175. Great to See That! Balls ANDDDD a Sense of Humor! n/t

[thebeckerman]

182. How Can We Be Sure This is Verifiable?

My question is this: how can we be sure this is verifiable? I want to publicize the story, but don't know how I can be sure it's true. Can you give us some help on this?

My biggest question is why would these guys be telling you this, since if everything you say is true, these guys could be killed for speaking to you?

[Casolaro]

219. Yes

And that is why I am trying to protect their identities. These people have already done more than could be expected considering who they are up against. Now its up to the independent media to get to the bottom of this.

[Twist_U_Up]

183. enjoy your sense of humor

although I havent had a drink in a long while, if this all pans out, I could become a very happy drunk lol stay safe

[mzmolly]

221. Thanks Casolaro! Logging off for the night and wanted to thank you for

stopping by.

I hope that your on to something. And if you are, I hope it sees the light of day.

Stay safe!

:hi:

[Straight Shooter]

222. As long as it isn't Coors beer

;)

[TruthIsAll]

126. Hi Wayne. We already have the circumstantial statistical evidence.

Now we need the real thing.

[helderheid]

127. Welcome and have you contacted Randi Rhodes or anyone

at Air America Radio???

Thank you for risking all you are risking.

[LittleClarkie]

128. You said the Kerry campaign was not the brightest in being prepared

do you have a sense of what they WERE prepared for? Were they prepared more for recounts and suppression than actual fraud?

[Casolaro]

165. prepared

Those 17000 lawyers called up were mostly business lawyers, public policy types, etc. This needed criminal attorneys. I don't get a feeling that is what they planned for.

[MRKARNO]

171. Carlyle Group involvement?

Was the Carlyle Group involved in any way shape or form?

[Casolaro]

181. Carlyle

Not that I've discovered but Five Star Investments was set up when Daddy Bush was President for some very specific reasons that he knows about. He is very much involved in this affair.

[Vote4Kerry]

197. "Daddy" Bush involved?!! I knew it!!

I knew "Daddy" Bush had his grubby little hands on this election fraud!

[Straight Shooter]

212. See post #133 and ensuing posts. "The Brazilian Connection"

Of course Poppy is involved. It's always been his handiwork, with the ever helpful presence of a certain Rovian sort.

Power, baby. Power.

[leftchick]

356. Didn't he make a very recent trip...

to Brazil??

[Sydnie]

210. One Bush, Two Bush, Three Bush -- More?

Just how many birds can we catch in this "bush" when we are done? Daddy, Jr, Jeb ... who else? Would be delicious to nab "beautiful mind" Barb for sure.

If Daddy is involved it makes sense that Jeb would be as well, right?

[rainbow4321]

345. Hopefully the whole Texas regime...

Can we maybe send the whole group on a long boat ride to Gitmo? Just gather them all onto a cruise ship down near Galveston, tell them it is a cruise to celebrate chimp's "win" and the door prizes are lovely orange jumpers <Texans love the color orange, right?> ...we can all stand on the shore line and wave them off into the sunset..and then go home and watch JK get sworn in as prez....

[NJ_Lib]

360. I believe it...

Before the election, I heard Ma Bush say that Bush sr. is completely OBSSESED with his son's reelection... Screaming at the TV and throwing stuff around...

I totally believe he's in on this...

[Evening Star]

179. "This needed criminal attorneys" Oh I like the ring of that Thanks!

[Straight Shooter]

129. CIA spooks know where bodies are buried, will they tell any tales?

Just curious about this purge of the CIA. Seems to me some of those folks must be mighty P.O.'d. Also seems to me some of them would know this election is tainted and have the means to prove it.

Any chance at all that there might be an "arrangement" for some info to be discovered "accidentally"?

edit: pardon my manners. Thank you.

[YellowDoginthehouse]

169. I've been wondering the same thing, Straight. n/t

[Casolaro]

188. CIA

Yes, meetings are on schedule

[Straight Shooter]

199. Now I shall sleep better at night

Thanks, WM.

:thumbsup:

[Twist_U_Up]

203. wow !!!!! I definitely like

[TexasChick]

220. OMG! I hope what you say is so true!

Please, Heavenly Father, I pray to you tonight to ask for your divine guidance and to keep Casolaro and his confidants safe! And, to ask you for your divine wisdom in allowing the truth to prevail so we can take back our country for the good of this great nation and the good will of other nations abroad. In Jesus' name, I pray, Amen!

[Joe Chi Minh]

373. Yes, TexasChick,

after telling my wife to take care, when she goes out, I've recently taken to praying to her guardian angel (and mine) to look after her. It just makes sense. I also commend her more directly to the care of Jesus, Mary on occasions.

[TexasChick]

380. How sweet, KCabotDullesMarxIII! Thanks! It never hurts to pray for

anyone! Peace to you, my friend! :hug:

[Joe Chi Minh]

391. Thank you, TexasChick.

Peace be to you, too. And a hug.

It's good to live in a context greater than ourselves, isn't it. Where Providence has the last word, and is never derailed, whatever the appearances. No disaster, political or otherwise, can overcome us - with the Boss on our side.

[TexasChick]

392. OMG! Words of wisdom to live by from now on:

Where Providence has the last word, and is never derailed, whatever the appearances. No disaster, political or otherwise, can overcome us - with the Boss on our side.

Thanks!

[hangloose]

363. Hasn't the CIA been gutted by Goss, do you have allies in this

organization that will go against "Policy".

[ailsagirl]

130. For those of you who didn't hear Madsen on the radio...

you can download the program from this link:

http://www.kpftx.org/archives/kpftsignal/index.php

[LiberalAndProud]

173. Thanks, ailsagirl.

[yardwork]

131. Thank you for what you are doing, Mr. Madsen

It gives me hope!

[wattsupamerica]

134. Is their a connection to Sproul and Associats or Nathen Sproul AZ Rep Prty

Sproul & Associates, was a major RNC get out the vote effort, they were paid about 2.8 million in political consulting dollars and of that (possibly separate of that) some 890,000 in funds for voter registration by the RNC directly. This organization has been discovered to have actually destroyed voter registration forms (with employees saying that they were directed to do so by leadership the actual numbers have been estimated into the thousands in just one state) that were written so the person on the form may be a democrat in about a half a dozen states all of them “swing” states in the 2004 election. The act of destroying these forms is a felony both nationally and in most states. The question is did the RNC know of these actions as they paid this criminal nation wide voter fraud organization that was directed by a former head of the RNC in Arizona, if so then an entire political party with powers to run national candidates and hold office is possibly criminally liable for voter fraud on a nation wide basis.

[Casolaro]

265. Arizona

There are GOPers in Arizona who are dodgy to say the least. That's why I mentioned the Falcone bit in the article. That was gun running money that got to Bush-Cheney 2000 from Falcone interests.

[mprest]

135. Need help in Ohio?

Because I am in the Cleveland area. What do you suggest, other than going to the December 4th rally in Columbus with Greg Palast?
mprest

[k8conant]

138. Wichita County, Texas

ES&S was called into Wichita County, Texas to "fix" the punch card counter. Apparently the straight party votes hadn't been counted and there was also double counting. The ES&S supervisor was Mike Menkin but the programmer who was on site for several days is not named except as a "she":




I had to register to view this:
http://www.timesrecordnews.com/trn/local_news/article/0,1891,TRN_5784_3306862,00.html
The county remedied the problem Wednesday night with the help of a computer programmer from Elections Systems and Software, the county's software provider.

Gossom said the programmer alleviated the counting problem by re-entering all the program information and increasing the test parameters to allow for the testing of more areas.

"ESS did a wonderful job. There are no problems with the results," Martin said about the fix.

[Clark2008]

139. Are your sources talking to the feds

and if not, why not?

And, if so, will the feds at least admit they are investigating (they have to)?

As a follow up: if the sources aren't talking to the feds for fear of a Bush cover-up and/or retaliation, can they talk to an international organization, such as the wing of the UN that overseas election fraud?

[Casolaro]

195. talking

They dare not talk to the Feds -- the FBI may be involved in this (not all of them but that part that constantly serves as cover up artists for Bush). The state officials in Ohio are mostly Republicans -- a Taft, Inc. state. Florida - well that is Jeb's personal banana republic. Texas - N/A. That leaves California where the Dems still control some statewide offices.

[MRKARNO]

209. If not the feds, then who in the gov't can do anything? No one?

I'm assuming that you're implying that no one in the gov't can help us, so the only way to get this out would be if we make a stink about it and the Mainstream Media picks it up. The NY Times or other supportive major newspapers would be a good place to go with this once you've assembled all the date, no?

[Casolaro]

234. Media jealousy

I know this major media. They practice NIH -- "Not Invented Here" therefore, we don't want it.

[Paligal]

338. I thought the FBI and CIA hate Bush...?

I read that the FBI and CIA are hostile toward the Bush admin. because they have consistently tried to pin their own shortcomings on them. In fact, the FBI warned Bush of 9/11 specifically, and he did nothing, and then they were accused of not doing a good job. So I was under the impression that they have now basically turned against the White House. They seem like ideal candidates for helping.

[in_cog_ni_to]

366. There are "certain" agents within those organizations who will do ANYTHING

for the BFEE. Remember, poppy Bush use to be the head of the CIA. He has HIS people in there. Goss is purging the ones who won't play the game.

[AuntPatsy]

150. Hello and welcome, your one brave soul...I have no question but

I do know something but it might be small potatoes I don't know. I know in South Texas that many voters which would have been seen as sure Kerry ones considering their financial situations were not allowed to vote. How many I have no clue...

All I can relate is what a young girl that is friends of my daughter told me, she and others she knew were registered voters and she did in fact vote in the last election of 2000, but when she and some of her family members went to vote in the same preceint mind you as 2000, there was no record of her, or so they said and told others the same..

I am not being rude, but most of these cases that I have heard about were welfare ones so to speak. So I just wonder if perhaps they did indeed use their votes for Bush without the knowledge of the true voters since many didn't know they could vote there at that time, the workers never informed these voters that their were alternate ways to vote until they could be checked for accuracys..

Some of these people have the same address, DL matched etc...but they were pushed away..

I don't know how much this is helpful...thats all I can really relate...

[Casolaro]

228. vote purge

Yes, its their m.o. to screw those who have the least resources to challenge the disenfranchisement. Ask the African Americans in Florida and Georgia. This happened to them in 2000, 2002 and this year. Cynthia McKinney gets beaten in her mostly African American district in 2002 primary where e-voting was used and comes roarig back this year. She was being punished in 2002 for what she said about GWB and 911.

[AuntPatsy]

249. I know of one huge oil company with very close ties to them

I just cannot say it. I honestly wish I could. I do know that money played heavily with this association and this particular company has ties going back many years since he was gov of texas and they play the conservs well, it's a bit of a joke considering the occupation to many but ignored because the money is good....they also have many outlets that have progressed through the years, not very typical of most that I know..

I cannot offer up names. I am sorry..

[Casolaro]

300. I know

for the same reason I can't disclose any sources...those SOBs down there in Texas have ruined friends of mine for taking on the Bushes.

[AuntPatsy]

328. SOB's? What a nice name for them and far too kind...;-)

[Straight Shooter]

279. Get the facts summarized and send it to votersunite.org

They are compiling a nationwide listing of voter problems.

http://www.votersunite.org/electionproblems_submit.asp

[AuntPatsy]

293. Our paper had nary a peep about this that I noticed. The sad part

is that this being Texas, not many took it further believing their vote not exactly tie breaking or aiding all that much. I am not saying that people are exactly stupid. But definately clueless in many aspects....

It just made me sad, even when I told this girl to go back and complain and what she could have done, she didn't have the time or care any longer, sadly, that is what most did I am sure since it was not reported...

[kk897]

163. Question about Extreme Right Wing involvement?

I'm really sorry to do this... I already asked upthread, but it seemed like maybe my question got skipped. That's okay... just want to know if you've read it, at least. Here it is again:

Mr. Madsen, have you investigated the involvement of the extremist wingers such as the Sovereign Citizens movement in this election?

I think that the largest contributor to Ohio's 2004 GOP campaigns, David Brennan, and his White Hat Management (manages charter schools and homeschool programs, HQ in Akron) company, had a hand in election fraud. According to watchdog groups, Sovereign Citizens are working toward gaining a foothold in County governments (the highest level of government they acknowledge), including the strategy of getting appointments to Boards of Elections and County Commissioners' offices. They also often impersonate various kinds of enforcement agents in order to intimidate people. When you follow the money, it leads up to the likes of Hudson Institute and Amway. There's also a connection to Kenneth Blackwell.

I detail some of this in the thread I put below... I've been looking further, on my own, since DUers didn't seem particularly interested,but I do want to bring it to someone's attention. Just in case.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...

Take care, and thank you so much for your courage and work.

[Casolaro]

216. Amway

I have not looked into that but Amway, Unification Church, Hudson, Coors, Olin, Scaife and all those kooks are involved in this administration.

[kk897]

223. thanks for the response!

I'll keep digging on my own.

Again, thanks on behalf of... well.. the whole world.. for your work.

[Solitaire]

166. a question for Casolaro...

Have you spoken with Keith Olberman or are you planning to do so?

[kk897]

178. look up thread

He answered this above.

[Solitaire]

255. found it, thanks kk897

[Paligal]

227. I would like some vagueries cleared up, please. IMPORTANT

Hi. I have been very vocal on this site about the fact that there are vagueries in your story where there need not be, yet specifics on things that prove little.

For example, you cite "various" election sites that were on security lockdown, but do not name them. I am only aware of Warren County. If you speak of "various" ones, why don't you name them in order to validate yourself to the reader? It seems strange, because those are facts that aren't top-secret or need to be hidden. Giving details should be a basic journalistic value, right? So I am confused...

Yet, you mention a 29 million dollar check. To my mind, investment firms get huge checks all the time. The mere fact that a check exists made out to them doesn't really lead to any conclusive evidence of fraud. If then, you could show that those funds were then funneled to people you could prove to be computer hackers, THAT would be something to put into print. If not, it is still in the allegations phase and needs further investigation before actually putting it out for public consumption. Or not?

I feel frustrated, because I SO want to believe your allegations and see them proven. Yet there are so many inconsistencies in the story, that I find it irresponsible to point to it as proof of fraud, because 1. We could be being set up to look like "Dan Rather" fall guys 2. Stories we spread that have no identifiable evidence (we can't verify an "informed source", for example) will immediately be torn apart by non-believers and we will be painted as liars and crackpots for spreading them, even though what we allege (fraud) is true (I believe).

I feel conflicted by this story, because while I greatly admire the pursuit of finding out about election fraud, I do not understand a premature reporting of it that may jeopardize the whole story by allowing it to be dismissed due to its holes before evidence has even been gathered.

I don't mean to insult you, but I am left wondering about your motives or goal in reporting this story the way you have. I'm really interested in hearing your take. Comments?

[Casolaro]

297. Checks

But do trust funds that are awash in Saudi money that have been used in the past for political purposes by the Bushes that cut a check for $29.6 million on Oct 22 2004 mean the Saudis are interested in buying shopping malls in Texas? In this case, sources that are identified will be dead. I've had enough of Americans being killed by these Bush SOBs: 3000 on 911 and over 1300 in Iraq are quite enough. But I know Karl Rove would like to know who's talking.

[TexasChick]

316. I am right there with you! I knew these criminals had everything to do

with 9/11!! I just don't feel the truth will ever be known; or at least it will never be proven enough for the compliant sheeple who love the Chimp and his administration to believe he had something to do with it!

Can you divulge any information as to how close are we, as the people, on showing these asshats as the perpetrators of 9/11? My fundie aunt, who I love dearly, loves that disgusting, lying, warmongering, smirking Chimp and has met him before and has pictures of it hanging in her house! It is quite disgusting! It would give me great pleasure in finally showing America and the world who really killed those innocent citizens that day!!!

[Paligal]

335. Please. Osama Bin Laden

Osama Bin Laden has now admitted on tape that he was behind 9/11. I don't doubt that. My uncle was killed by Al Qaeda terrorists in 1995, and our family has been following Bin Laden's murderous career since then. He has/had millions of dollars and a great deal of power, with operatives all over the world, as well as the outspoken motive of killing as many Americans and Westerners as possible "to get into heaven". He said this stuff WAY before 9/11. Americans just weren't listening. While I am sure that Bush saw it as an opportunity to push his agenda on the American people, and he certainly looked the other way in preventing it, there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that Al Qaeda was behind it, not the Bush admin. No doubt. As far as Bush being behind the dubious election result, THAT I believe, though it remains to be fully proven.

[TexasChick]

339. Uhh, that's your opinion. I happen to believe that he was and I'm not

going to change it. But, thanks for your thoughts.

On edit: Take a look at Casolaro's posts #'s: 288 & 302.

[BlueDog2u]

350. These are not mutually exclusive propositions....

The two families have a long history of business association, and perhaps Bin Laden's well documented hatred of the Americans was directed and timed with inside assistance. I believe the evidence supporting this scenario, given for example in Mike Ruppert's new book, Crossing the Rubicon, is quite compelling.

[in_cog_ni_to]

367. Exactly. That's why he hasn't ever been caught. It was a joint effort.

Bin Ladin and the cabal.

[BlueDog2u]

375. Those who doubt this scenario without looking into the

evidence first should begin their journey of discovery with the Latin Prosecutor's question: cui bono? Who benefits? Think about it. Are you aware of how well documented the insider trading just before 911 was? How come our media has never investigated or released the details of just who took those thousands of "put" options on American and United Airlines on or before Sept. 10? And that's just the beginning. Look at what was happening in the stock market in the months before 911. Look at Bush's approval ratings before 911. Look at what a terrible piece of real estate the Twin Towers turned out to be for the owners. Look at the paper trail stored in tower 7 which would have led to numerous indictments against powerful individuals and probably further Enron type revelations.

Why was the stock market doing so badly? One reason is that the Taliban had cut off so much of the world's heroin supply that the drug operators were starving. And it gets worse the more you look at it with an unprejudiced eye.

Check out Mike Ruppert's book for more details. Read the reviews on Amazon: for every 9 sincere readers who said it was the most important book they've ever read, there was of course one obligatory freeper who could say nothing but call Ruppert a nut case.

And by the way, you'll notice that Wayne Madsen shows up quite a bit in Ruppert's book for his first rate investigative work on previous stories regarding BushCo.

[AgadorSparticus]

389. i remember thinking this from watching F911. bush gave OBL 2 months

to get out before special forces made their move. 2 months!!! that is too obscene to be just an oopsy.

[OneBlueSky]

343. OBL has been a US "asset" for years . . .

we created Osama bin Laden, and I have no doubt that he remains on the payroll even today . . .

[Ducks In A Row]

332. about the check again

would telling the names of the payer, signer,
and the payee on the check be giving out too much
information at this time?

if not, any chance of releasing any part of that
information at this time?



(thank again. I hope you don't over extend yourself,
but we really appriciate this)

[Ducks In A Row]

324. the bush doesn't care about the american people

the dead on 911 and the dead in iraq more than prove it.


and what part of rove will stop at nothing to kill this is so hard to understand.

You were watching when Rather's story will dragged through the mud. The story was true, but a lie about forged documents was happily spread by the media and now Rather is slowly "retiring".

If this WH can screw up a man like Rather for a story that is years old, imagine what will happen to people telling a story that might throw bush and cronies into jail.

a story that proves bush is in bed with the bin ladens.

think about it

[Joe Chi Minh]

374. IMPORTANT.

Don't shout! It's considered rude in Democrat circles.

[bobbieinok]

384. not in mine....I shout when I'm mad and TOTALLY FED UP with all

this bushco garbage we have to deal with

[jamboi]

400. .

[Liberty Belle]

187. What do you think of this strategy?

Strategy to gain media coverage

(Note, I posted this above in a reply to a reply, but thought it might get missed.)

The mainstream media corporations are all publicly owned. Kerry or a prominent liberal organization (Dean's or Moveon) could mobilize Dems to speak out at shareholder meetings and in the meantime, contact the chief financial officer or shareholder liaison at each of these companies. Protesting the lack of serious coverage, coupled with an organized effort to get Dems to dump stock in GE, Viacom, Disney, Fox, and Time-Warner could get their attention. It worked with Sinclair Broadcasting.

These companies also have products we could boycott. Send GE's CEO a crushed up lightbulb. Tell Disney we won't buy any Disney toys or videos this holiday season--let alone visit Disney World. Fox owns a movie studio. Time-Warner publishes books and other materials. If half the voters in this country stopped buying this stuff, the corporate media would have to listen.

I'm a business writer. I have access to paid information services and could easily get the names of all officers in these corporations, plus contact info and shareholder materials. Just imagine if we held a demonstration in front of their next stockholder meetings and passed out info on voting fraud (and media suppression of the story) to every shareholder entering the meeting!

Let me know if you need me to dig up contact data.

[burn the bush]

189. do u think the media will cover your story?

or give you the cold silent treatment that we've gotten about the fraud?

[Ugnmoose]

196. What do you think of allegations raised in Crossing the Rubicon?

And do you think the American people will ever see anyone held accountable?

[Casolaro]

205. Kiev

What we need is Kiev. There was an anti-vote fraud rally held a week ago Friday in Lafayette Park in front of the White House. 30 people, incl media were there. Media consisted of Al Arabiya and Pacifica.

[Twist_U_Up]

241. YOU SEE THIS DUers ???????

What we need is Kiev. What we need is Kiev. What we need is Kiev. What we need is Kiev. What we need is Kiev. What we need is Kiev. What we need is Kiev.

Hes doing his part its time to do ours Im heading to OHIO SEE YAS THERE, RIGHT ???

[New Earth]

247. what/who is Kiev?

:(

[Casolaro]

257. Kiev

The Ukrainian people got over 1/4 million people in the streets of Kiev to overturn a rigged election

[New Earth]

269. ohh ok i knew about the Ukraine election story in general

guess i never picked up on the city. thank you.

[truehawk]

287. 60,000 People in the Streets of Keiv Demostrating against Election Fraud

[ooglymoogly]

337. they did it in snow and rain with only barrels for heat

and they did it for seven days. do they have more to loose than we.

[Donailin]

272. Then we need to get Moveon, UPJ, ANSWER and whoever

else was so instrumental in coordinating the marches in DC and NY back in 2002-2003, and this year at the RNC on this.

Everyone needs to start the ball rolling by email snailmail and phone calls to these groups asap, that's my thinking.

[standingup]

295. United for Peace

and Justice was instrumental in organizing the march in NYC.

http://www.unitedforpeace.org/

[pointsoflight]

280. Yes. If/when this comes out, we must take to the streets.

We can not rely on our republican government or court system to see it through. We must take to the streets en masse and we must get world opinion behind us.

[mprest]

291. It's out to us. Print it out and give it to your friends...

[MandateThis]

354. UK NEEDS TO COMDEMN OUR ELECTION

I want to see the world and the UK winnder condemn bush/rove and say,"American exit polls were also correct. You need to step aside and let the TRUE president take over."

[mprest]

217. Hope returns. Thank you WM.

Thank you for coming to talk to us. I have hope again.
mprest

[Alizaryn]

198. Have you been in contact with the FBI

Is the copy of a check enough for you to get help from the FBI?
Will your having a copy of the check give your sources identity away?

[Carolab]

235. Speaking of the FBI what do you know about Jeff Fisher

does his story have any credibility?

[wattsupamerica]

201. When will your unpaid sources step out

I get hit so many times that you have no sources, just this transaction and nothing more but your word.

[Ducks In A Row]

225. he has sources, or don't you read

with all the answeres he's given, you KNOW it's not just his word.

[wattsupamerica]

274. Yes I do but the people in the press want to know more

I know that sucks, but that is the roadblock I run into

[Straight Shooter]

258. Hi, wattsupamerica

It doesn't look as if his sources will step out any time soon, if ever. Rest assured they exist. They will be forthcoming with technical forensic details, rather than eyewitness testimony, apparently. Remember, we are dealing with confronting people at very high levels of power and you just don't stick your neck out unless you want it chopped off, so to speak.

Nick Berg found out the hard way.

Welcome to DU :hi:

[in_cog_ni_to]

368. His sources would be killed if he named them.

No. We don't need to give the BFEE any more excuses to kill.

[Patsy Stone]

202. Hail to the Redskins!

For what it's worth, I don't believe they were wrong about their "prediction game" this year.

[buddysmellgood]

204. Do you think Bev Harris will uncover part of this plot?

[Alizaryn]

208. Good question and do you have any opinion/info about the Florida..

School (Bay Point) story that is out there?

[Vote4Kerry]

206. Wayne, can you give us instructions on what you want us to look up?

DUers are committed to helping you in your investigation. What do you need from us in terms of research at the moment to help you?

[shraby]

215. Will you be able to connect it to the white house

directly, or will they be able to weasel out of it?

[Casolaro]

239. WH

I already have this linked to the White House, actually 2 White Houses: Bush I and Bush II

[shraby]

244. No weasel room for them I hope.

Yer great!

[Twist_U_Up]

214. I can`t help but fear for your safety

a friggin Smith and Wesson isn`t enough. PLEASE get yourself to an undisclosed location with plenty of Special Forces.YOU SHOULD NOT BE IN HARMS WAY. please

[in_cog_ni_to]

370. Man, I agree! Get some of those CIA "buddies" for protection!

:scared: We've had Casolaro and Hatfield knocked off already. Not to mention everyone else they've killed. Please get some more protection!

[Evening Star]

218. Daniel Hopsicker? Have you thought about teaming up with Hopsicker?

He might be of some assistance in Florida as well.

He's been around the block a few times down here in "Terrorland"

[Casolaro]

229. Hopsicker

I know his work but have not been in contact -- we've been working on some similar stories over the years though.

[helderheid]

236. I have asked this before and I know you're swamped

But please let me know if you've been in touch with Randi Rhodes or anyone at Air America Radio?

[Casolaro]

252. Randi Rhodes

No, but I'd be happy to talk to her. I can be contacted at [e-mail]

[trudyco]

230. Fisher story tied in at all?

Are you familiar with the Fisher story? Is there anything at all to Baypoint schools and the CyberNet CEO that died recently?
Trudyco

[mzmolly]

233. Excellent question.

:hi:

[Casolaro]

245. Fisher

My latest information is that there is a possible tie-in. I've asked someone to check it out on the ground in FL and MI.

[kk897]

253. that's why I'm so interested in the Extreme Right Wing thing

I think they might be the "missing link" between the Fisher story and your story.

Dunno... I just write press releases for little local companies... never done any *real* journalism! But it just seems important.

Carolab, have you seen what I'm talking about?

[genius]

240. What would be the best way for us to spread the word?

Woodward and Bernstein at least had Congress. We don't have the press or Congress. I was also wondering about meetups regarding the stolen eleciton. How is the Canadian press? Would the Canadian government help us in exposing what's going on. I understand they are a little concerned about possibly one day being invaded over natural gas.

[helderheid]

246. International press

We could send press releases world wide. It costs about $600 for a good list of world wide press addresses (e, snail, and fax). I'm willing to pitch in a few bucks.

[Casolaro]

254. International

Hey, they picked up this story in Vanuatu!!!

[genius]

263. Now, we just need to get other news sources to pick it up.

How about if we suggest the Ukranian govenment uses the rigging of American election as a defense against the attacks by our govenment on the Ukranian election? That would bring it more into the public eye.

[genius]

281. Based upon what you know, do you think we have reason for optimism

Are your sources safe? Lots of Bush informants (Hatfield, Shoedinger, Baxter) have wound up dead. Do you believe that your sources will stick to their story and eventually tell it credibly to the world?

[shraby]

266. Vanuatu means one thing....

we can only go up!

[Patsy Stone]

271. I thought you were going to say

Survivor! :)

[ahyums]

270. Vanuatu that's great

now we just have to put all our effort into cracking Kiribati, then if we manage that Lichtenstein is next.

[Donailin]

282. You forgot POLAND!

and Macronesia!


LOL

[Straight Shooter]

292. Lichtenstein

Yes, they also had a mad king at one time

:)

[genius]

256. What about mock trial re the election on the record in a foreign country?

If it were backed by a foreign govenment, it would carry some credibility - even if it didn't have any actual effect.

[myschkin]

359. International Press

They don't want to hear it (speaking for the german speaking room). But I can give you all important mail-adresses for the german speaking press...

[buddysmellgood]

243. If you succeed in cracking this open, we'll also know who killed JFK.

I know that's a leap, but if you can prove what your saying, people will assume those freaks are capable of anything. Especially with Bush Sr. being CIA.

[Karenca]

259. I think you already

answered this yourself :))
Such a long line of irreprehensible crimes---They should be locked away forever.

[flyarm]

260. 9/11

mr madsen have you ever looked into jeb signing executive order for marshall law sept 7th 2001?? 4 days before 9/11??

from fla state web site!!

EXECUTIVE ORDER NUMBER 2001-261 This is the order he signed on 9-07

http://sun6.dms.state.fl.us/eog_new/eog/orders/2001/september/eo2001-261-09-07-01.html

[genius]

248. I noticed the money connection also to Osama.

I've had a theory that Bush and Osama were still in league. The planes did not bring down the WTC. Also I don't believe Osama is running through the caves connected to a dialysis machine. Do you have any insights on this?

[Casolaro]

288. Bin Laden

The Bin Ladens and Bushes go together like Sears & Roebuck, Captain & Tennile and for the really old timers Horn & Hardart

[Ducks In A Row]

299. you forgot Sonny and Cher!!!!!

[Casolaro]

302. Unlike Bush & Bin Laden

Sonny and Cher broke up

[Ducks In A Row]

361. totally!

:)

[in_cog_ni_to]

371. And Gladys Knight and the Pips!

;)

[Karenca]

250. Mr. Madsen...What is your educated guess

that we will be able to overthrow the dictator? On a scale of 1-10, maybe.
I want to thank you for all you are doing for your fellow Americans Karen

[trayfoot]

261. Thank you, Mr. Madsen

for all you are doing and for coming here to discuss this with us. And, for Heaven's sake, please stay safe! If there is anything you think we should do, please don't hesitate to tell us. We just want to make sure that democracy does survive the Bush dynasty.

[seemslikeadream]

262. Jack Shaw - Dov Zakheim

Winds of Change: Troubled Waters Ahead For the Neo Cons

I know this article by heart, I've posted it so many times!

Anything you can post about Dov Zakheim

or what the deal was with Shaw and that story about the Russians moving those weapons.

Thanks

[Paligal]

284. Will there be any SOLID evidence eventually?

As another poster said earlier, we are all wondering, if NONE of the sources want to come forward, and this just remains allegations, how can we take any action? Someone will have to come forward and provide solid evidence, or else, what's the point of this whole investigation? Without a public whistleblower, this will be dismissed as hearsay and a crackpot conspiracy theory.

Comments?

[standingup]

264. Mr. Madsen

There have been prior instances of software being replaced with non-certified versions or versions with known issues. Is there any chance this happened again in this election cycle?

Thanks

[Casolaro]

286. Code

What I can tell you is that coders in Brazil were used to modify certain software. If anyone can check with the experts if any of these e voting firms were using outsourced programmers, that would be useful info

[bj2110]

298. Been in touch with Avi Rubin at Johns Hopkins?

He apparently got his hands on some Diebold source code and found an unusual line item. Not sure how or when he got a hold of this. Something was encoded with a majorly out-of-date encryption key. So easy to break and, that it looked to hime that it was deliberately placed. And, it was in the source code, which meant all machines could be hacked with the same set of rogue code.

[Straight Shooter]

311. We need Poppy's itinerary one year prior to and up to election

Did he go to Brazil, and with whom did he meet? He definitely travels to South America now and then.

Poppy gets careless in his arrogance. Perhaps someone has access to the manifest of whatever planes he's flown on. The people he buys can be bought by someone else. That's the thread that is always left untied by the ruthless.

[WhoWantsToBeOccupied]

344. Diebold's Brazilian subsidiary

"In 2000, Diebold's wholly-owned Procomp subsidiary manufactured and installed more than 360,000 direct recording electronic voting terminals throughout Brazil. Over 109 million voters in 5,500 counties accurately and securely cast their votes using a Diebold election system solution. Countrywide results were known just four hours after the polls closed. The successful implementation of the world's largest election system is just an example of the scope of projects Diebold is capable of completing within the election system marketplace."

Source: Diebold website

[wiggs]

268. Sibel Edmons

Greetings and thanks.

Sibel Edmons apparently got a peek into conversations about money trails, drugs, other governments, and 9/11.

Any crossovers to the election money trail you've uncovered?

[LittleClarkie]

277. Do you feel that this time will be different

It seems as if this administration is damned adept at weaseling out of allegations without much damage.

Do you have any sense that they could indeed be nailed by these charges, Watergate style? Or is that a longshot?

[Carolab]

283. Is Accenture involved at all?

You mentioned internationals. Could they have deployed technical personnel to pose as FBI/DHS?

[Shalom]

285. WHAT CAN WE EXPECT TO LEARN WHEN BANKS OPEN TOMORROW ?

You have provided specific info on a $29 M bank transaction.
Will we find out from the parties involved what the "cover story" is ?

[Woo]

290. WRAPPING UP...

Alright folks --Mr. Madsen has given a lot of time and effort to answering questions -- if he's still here let's wrap it up -- a thanks to him.

I propose we create another thread where what he has said can be discussed -- so this thread doesn't grow to be an unmanagable length --

Someone create the new thread -- I don't do 'creating threads'

[Straight Shooter]

301. Someone else do the honors, I'm calling it a night

Going to go to sleep and dream of spooks rattling skeletons in the House of Bush.

Thanks a million to Mr. Madsen for his time and information.

:thumbsup:

[Ducks In A Row]

306. better to have a mod do it, so as to lock this one

so mr. madsen doesn't have to figure out which thread to post in.

[Casolaro]

307. sorry I could not get to everyone

Its late here in DC -- so I'm checking out. Good night all.

[New Earth]

309. thank you for coming!

i hope you stay safe and hope to hear more soon :)

[bj2110]

312. Thanks! Come back from time to time & let us know how we can help.

[Karenca]

313. Good night Mr. Madsen

May you stay safe....You are doing wonderful things for us 'blue" Americans.

[jamboi]

314. Thanks so much Mr. Madsen. We totally appreciate it and will support

the research effort.

ttys,

JamBoi

P.S. Just started the "Talk About Madsen Q&A" Topic. Might alter the title slightly, so heads up.

[truehawk]

319. Go Safe

[jamboi]

308. Hmm... good idea. I'll start one. Maybe "Talk about Madsen Q & A" n/t

[jamboi]

318. DONE. See new topic. n/t

[Ducks In A Row]

296. so how many posts can a thread have before we start a new one?

[BlueStateBlue]

303. Mainstream Media Coverage

Do you think attention from the mainstream media would help, or hinder the situation as it stands today?

Thanks in advance.

[wattsupamerica]

305. I am willing to hit the streets on this but I need to know 1 thing

If thousands even millions hit the streets are your sources going to come out, sproul alone would send me to the streets, but I would hate to hit the streets and find this came from no one creible.

[Paligal]

321. Exactly. And he won't answer that.

This is my whole point (along with some other DUers). And he has not answered that question. I understand about protecting sources. But eventually, there must be a credible source willing to come forward, or this whole story is pointless and will be shot down.

[shraby]

341. Credible or not, there is enough circumstantial

evidence that this election was hijacked for Bush. That in itself is enough to take to the streets.

[genius]

310. Please take care of yourself and make sure your sources stay safe

Your article was a great Thanksgiving present to a great many of us and we are looking forward to seeing you expose Bush for what he really is.

[truehawk]

315. So You were looking into 9/11/01 The 19 billion from Short Sales?

[Karenca]

320. CAN YOU ALL BELIEVE HOW LONG THE

BUSHES HAVE BEEN RAPING OUR COUNTRY!!?
WE DO NOT NEED TO BE GOVERNED BY THIS MASS MURDERER---HE IS NOT OUR PRESIDENT!

[jamboi]

325. Please Nominate this for front page!!!!

[Karenca]

326. DONE!

[Garbo 2004]

329. Re: vote counting location lockdowns reported in the media

From the first article you state: "There have been media reports from around the country concerning the locking down of precincts while votes were being tallied. In one unprecedented action in Warren County, Ohio, election officials locked down the facility where votes were being counted."

What media reports of vote counting site lockdowns were you referring to other than those about the Warren County lockdown? So far as far as I can tell the hunt for such media reports on that specific subject has come up with about 3 or 4 such press reported events. Which doesn't appear to support the impression one might gather from the article that there were media reports of numerous and widespread incidents of vote counting lockdowns.

In this thread http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2750379 a poster says your emailed response referred to what appear to be physical security measures like locking up the machines and recording their movements or machines that locked up and wouldn't divulge their results which are quite different matters than Warren County type lockdowns that preclude media or others from witnessing the tabulating process:

IndyOp (128 posts) Fri Nov-26-04 09:05 AM
Response to Original message

53. A reply from Wayne Madsen -

I e-mailed Madsen last night to ask him to share his 'reports from around the country' about lockdowns and he sent the following (but I am not sure that it was what you were looking for because his references sound more like appropriate security measures and/or glitches).

System weighs 14 pounds and will be transported to polling place by inspector at which time it will be zeroed out and the polls will be opened. At 8 p.m., the polls will be closed and the touch screens will be transported to Merced and placed in an individual lock down facility which is password protected and records when each device is moved. Opening and closing of each unit is done by internal and external serial number. Software security will be accomplished by logic and accuracy testing of each unit and is open to the public for review.
http://web.co.merced.ca.us/elections/touchvote.html

For seven days, a paperless voting machine sat mute. It refused to tell Collin County elections officials and observers what votes it had recorded at Rose Mary Haggar Elementary School on Campbell Road. from a report in the Dallas Morning News <http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/city/c... >

The touch-screen machine locked up during voting Nov. 2 and was taken out of service. Election night, despite coaxing from technicians, the machine would not divulge results from 63 voters.
http://vote2004.eriposte.com/redstates/texas.htm#TEXAS

Ms. Iachetta is inviting any members of the media interested in the eSlate’s security procedures to attend the “lockdown” and machine certification process on Friday, February 6th at 2 p.m. in the Basement Conference Room of City Hall. At this time the Electoral Board along with the Registrar will perform the Logics and Accuracy test and lock down all the machines before they are sent to the precincts for Tuesday’s election.
http://www.charlottesville.org/content/files/3182DFBE-5...

It's a fair question in determining the precision of the reporting in the article if the assertion is that there were press reports of Warren County type lockdowns of vote counting around the country. And that such lockdowns were not just rare isolated incidents and presented occasions for vote tampering.

It's understandable that people would try to confirm basic public info which should be readily available regarding locations where vote tampering is alleged to have occured. Again, the specific statement in the article was about media reports of lockdowns while votes were counted such as Warren County. Not of polling places or schools or other items which are not comparable events to the Warren County incident.

As you well know, the substance of the Rather TNG report was solid, even the contents of the disputed memos were supported by the secretary. But the questionable provenance of the memos themselves succeeded in discrediting the report as a whole in the minds of many, including the rest of the (not terribly brave or thinking) mainstream press.

So no offense intended, but you understand how these little things can bite one in the ass and potentially harm the larger story when people review the article and try to assess its credibility.

[s-cubed]

349. BACKUP YOUR DATA, WAYNE

Please, Wayne, Danny died, and all his knowledge died with him. I hope you have passed on your knowledge and evidence to others. If the fascists know that you have, you will be safer.

Thanks you,

[jamboi]

333. PLEASE GO NOMINATE THIS THREAD FOR FRONT PAGE! n/t

[KoKo]

342. Why would you want this on the DU Front page? He's working on an

undercover story and you want this out there for everyone to see? Why?

Most folks can find his articles and they should be on the front page...not a discussion. What are you thinking? :eyes:

[jamboi]

362. The info he talked about here are no longer undercover R they?

If he thought it was okay to say it here in public...

[lthuedk]

336. We may not have mainstream media, but we have Springsteen.

There are other ways to get broad coverage. Set up a bait and switch with a major artist at a significant time and let it rip.

[Carl Brennan]

340. Are you familiar with Riggs Bank, terrorist money, Saudi Princess

and Dubya's uncle Jonathan?

I don't want to dig up a bunch of stuff you already have.

I am the guy who e-mailed you the stuff on "Madame butterfly" Lepore and the Saudi link.

[jamboi]

348. NEW JUST FOR DISCUSSING MADSEN'S SESSION TONIGHT

Talk About Wayne Madsen Q&A On Vote Rigging
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=87649&mesg_id=87649

[hangloose]

365. I'm sorry but I didn't learn a whole lot from "Casolaro" on this

thread. I appreciate that he took the time to participate but other than a supporting appearance where DUers could offer comment and ask questions what did we learn, what insights were given to help advance our understanding of his effort?

[in_cog_ni_to]

372. I learned that he has connected this to Bush I and Bush II.

That's more than I knew yesterday. :hi:

[nostalgicaboutmyfutr]

376. Yeah.....and who is this guy really?

I mean, it is not difficult to just build a BS background and then come out and spout on the internet what you want people to know...

I want to see some hard proof that this is the guy....

[jamboi]

378. We all want more hard proof, but there is no doubt Madsen has been around

quite a while now and has built some positive reputation for himself as an investigative journalist. Check it for yourself. I did.

[Sandy_0]

377. I know that we all would like this to be true

but there is a real danger here. Our being even remotely involved in this could cost us all of our credibility.

Do you realize that "Castelero" could be setting you up to look like a bunch of "crazies" -- He has given no direct answers, no evidence and his tale grows more and more like a bad novel. He's made you feel that you are "in" on a big plot to save Democracy and you are finding it satisfying and exciting.

I'm not debunking his story. I'm not convinced either. Just be careful that none of you cost us our credibility. How do you know for certain that Castelero is Madsen? Be careful. My usual blog considers me the conspiracy theorist of the blog and I'm not buying this story. You guys don't know me because I've only started posting here a short time ago. Just be careful. Don't let yourselves be too gullible. Be careful.

If we lose our credibility it will undermine Bev Harris and all the others working on exposing the voter fraud. Guilt by association. Be a bit more skeptical and be careful. He's sure getting a lot of information here.

[jamboi]

379. Every allegation should be checked out, yes.That's just reasonable

But we should not be in the position where we are so afraid to speak our minds that we can not even talk openly about allegations of whatever kind. Freedom of speech. That we have ended up so paranoid shows you just how shellacked we've been by the righties. Stand up for freedom and be ready to investigate stories. If they turn out wrong, reject them. If right embrace them. But don't be afraid to look at them.

[gumby]

387. Who's "we" ?

As a poster, I claim NO "credibility." I am, nor is DU a network news production, nor a major media publication. They are the ones who have to worry about "credibility."

"We" do not loose the "credibility" "we" never had by listening to and responding to a credible investigative reporter.

The "other side" already considers anything other than their own reflection as "crazies."

Yeah, "be careful" and don't look at the man behind the curtain. Ug.

[mmiixx]

382. beware of ROVE

this all looks good
so far but it would be just like Rove & Co to set up something like this and pull in as many bloggers ,M/I etc. then shot the whole thing down with pre-arranged un-contestable proof that its all crap . Rove is an expert at this type of thing , its got him were he is today - head of the free (yea right) world .
Bushes Brain .........

[Cowboy Joe2k]

386. It's just Meaningless Crap. The people in control are those

With the central tabulators.

Give us back our Right To Vote.

[jamboi]

388. Compilation of Madsen Q&A

Check this Compilation of Madsen Q&A by IAMREALITY
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=88322&mesg_id=88322

[GetTheRightVote]

390. Thank you for the information, thanks Wayne

[jamboi]

393. Compilation posted on DUer's web site! Link

http://www.legjoints.com/WayneMadsen

Thanks to Roger_Otip!!!

[jamboi]

394. Oops, link mistake, corrected here:

http://www.legjoints.com/WayneMadsen/

[snot]

396. To Casolaro & Co.: precautions

Every one of Casolaro & his contacts should (if you haven't already done so) write down and tape everything you know and put that together with any other evidence you've got in a safe deposit box, and should leave instructions with your spouse, lawyer or other reliable person for the originals to be remain secured and copies to be delivered to several key persons in the event of your death. Not sure who the key persons shd be but I'd include several key media people, DNC, gov'l people, maybe Common Cause and BBV.

That said, I continue to feel that this and the Jeff Fisher stories look distinctly Rove-to-Rather-like, and that this story should not be pushed unless and until we get something beyond one guy saying so. Casolaro may have the best intentions in the world, and still be duped.

[jamboi]

397. Anyone who's serious about organizing research on this plz join me here

New, Improved Madsen Research Project Strategy Thread
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=post&forum=201

[jamboi]

398. Corrected Link for Madsen Research

Corrected Link for Madsen Research
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=201x6212

[gl2]

399. background info on possible vote rig

Read Daniel Hopsicker's new book, Welcome to Terror Land, the definitive book on CIA corruption, lies, and narco $ wrapped up in the Venice FL school where Atta and cohorts studied. Hopsicker points to narco trafficking and is corroborated by FBI translator Sibel Edmonds.

Secondly, the intel implications of Wayne's latest article (in a Mexican $11 billion counterfeit scam, General Robert L. Ferrera sent sent $ to Five Star Investments, Ltd. Another man indicted in a $3 million fraud in Washington state, Grady Hand, was defended by Dennis Hayle, head of DEA's CENTAC narco unit). In the Washington case, Hand and Hayle said the $3 million was sent General Robert L. Ferrera as part an off-the books CIA operation---to hide it from Congress. Given the info. about General Robert L. Ferrera, plus the DEA and narco connection, we should be looking for narco $ links. Once you see the CIA and narco $ links in this, it begins to look WORSE THAN Watergate! We should all go out and do research, then post it here.

The Five Star stash of Marcos secret criminal cash hoard (seen on http://bellaciao.org/en/article.php3?id_article=4566 ) and the Cook Island routing of Iran Contra $ also look suspicious. Ollie North is reported to have been a crook. Ret. Lt. Commander Al Martin, who actually participated in Iran Contra, then later exposed his knowledge, writes:

"Ollie (North) was complaining that Armitage and Clair George had ramped up cocaine imports in the United States at the prices, which had been cut in half from 1985 to `86, from $30,000/ kilogram in `85 to $15,000/kilogram in `86.

"Ollie’s idea was that he used to call it “Reaganomics of Cocaine.” In other words, you keep moving the price down and eventually what you’re doing is building more revenue in the future by driving down the price now because you’re going to have more demand at a lower price level.

"What Ollie said was absolutely true. He said, “Our cost equation is such that net delivered, that we are trading for every one kilogram of refined 90-proof--he used to call it proof. I like the way he used to say it. He used to call it proof. Ollie would say, for every one-kilogram of 90-proof coke, we are trading one factory-fresh M16 rifle with a full field kit and a thousand rounds of ammunition that cost us $650. And he said, even when delivering costs are put in, our net deliverable cost to put that kilogram of cocaine in a port city in the United States is still only a thousand dollars a kilogram. So $15,000 was still a lot of money. And he figured what it was doing was Reaganomics. He used to use the term all the time, as the Reaganomics of the cocaine business. You drag down the prices and you create ever more demand by dragging down the prices. Of course, what Ollie didn’t figure on is that prices would continue to plummet as much as they did. In the spring of 1986, cocaine was $15,000/ kilo on the street that was at primary-dealer level. By the beginning of 1987, cocaine had fallen to $7500/ kilogram, after Iran-Contra was over, because the CIA had absolutely flooded the market with this stuff.

[gl2]

401. other Republican election schemes

Looking back, please remember: Before the election of '64, JFK was hit--according to Col. Fletcher Prouty, by Gen. Ed Lansdale (the Du Pont-Dulles protege--see Prouty's website for photos and story).The hit threw the election to pro-war LBJ as a sympathy vote, BUT in '68 M.L. King was hit in another of the same Army 111th, Army 113th schemes (see the famous court win re the case). This caused rioting, which made Democratic sectors look bad and helped move the South into a Republican posture (ironic, given the origins of the R party). Nixon won. Then in '72 it was Watergate---"the Bay of Pigs thing... As Nixon said, the Warren Report "was the greatest hoax ever perpetrated." (Nixon's own words, uncovered in '03). Then in '80 it was the October Surprise, then in 88, Gennifer Flowers, which led to Monica Lewinsky, a carefully orchestrated partisan dig. Republicans won in '00. Then 9-11 occurs, albeit not yet proven a direct Republican scheme, yet the narco $ and CIA fingerprints, plus FBI silencing of witnesses to Mohammed Atta/Marwan al Shehhi doings in Venice FL (see Hopsicker's book, sic), which redounds to Bush gains. Now, it's an e-vote scam unfolding. Mob $, assassinations, coups and stolen elections---it's all consistent with the animal logic of corporate greed, the power and control of the Republican party (an awkward gaggle of noveau riche and old industry $ (Du Pont, Rockefeller, Smith), lightly sprinkled with new $ washouts like Bill Gates and Warren Buffet. Maybe they're not literally evil, but they enjoy power and control, especially when it comes through manipulative prestige doings among their $$ peers. Add a little foreign danger and, voila! they feel like they're fortifying the nation.

Too bad it's killing the planet and making soft enemies of all who challenge US$ coups and domination... When the thinking behind it all is modeled on the animal logic of Darwinian elitism, we're all in deep trouble. Animal logic? The same channels that route CIA narco $ into US accounts also feed a growingly secret and exotic black budget establishment, the new medieval fiefdom of domination here in the US and all across the world.