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MathEducation Donating Member (60 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 08:19 PM
Original message
The Character of Jesus...
a great read regarding the four biographies of a certain remarkable character, called Jesus Christ.

http://www.jewsforshalom.org/TheCharacterOfJesus.html

It is the grand peculiarity of the sacred writings, that they deal in supernatural events and transactions, and show the fact of a celestial institution finally erected on earth, which is fitly called the kingdom of God; because it shows Him reigning, as a Regenerator and Restorer of the broken order of the world. Christianity is, in this view, no mere scheme of doctrine, or of ethical practice, but is instead a kind of miracle, a power out of nature and above, descending into it; a historically supernatural movement on the world, that is visibly entered into it, and organized to be an institution in the
person of Jesus Christ. He, therefore, is the central figure and power, and with him the entire fabric either stands or falls.

To this central figure, then, we now turn ourselves; and, as no proof beside the light is necessary to show that the sun shines, so we shall find that Jesus proves himself by his own self-evidence. The simple inspection of his life and character will suffice to show that he cannot be classified with mankind (man though he be), any more than what we call his miracles can be classified with mere natural events. The simple demonstrations of his life and spirit are the sufficient attestation of his own profession, when he says--"I am from above"--"I came down from heaven."

...

But before we drop a theme like this, let us note more distinctly the immense significance to our religious feeling of this glorious advent of Jesus, and have our congratulations in it. This one perfect character has come into our world, and lived in it; filling all the molds of action, all the terms of duty and love, with his own divine manners, works and charities. All the conditions of our life are raised thus, by the meaning he has shown to be in them, and the grace he has put upon them. The world itself is changed, and is no more the same that it was; it has never been the same since Jesus left it. The air is charged with heavenly odors, and a kind of celestial consciousness, a sense of other worlds, is wafted on us in its breath. Let the dark ages come, let society roll backward and churches perish in whole regions of the earth, let infidelity deny, and, what is worse, let spurious piety dishonor the truth; still there is a something here that was not, and a something that has immortality in it. Still our confidence remains unshaken, that Christ and his all-quickening life are in the world, as fixed elements, and will be to the end of time; for Christianity is not so much the advent of a better doctrine, as of a perfect character; and how can a perfect character, once entered into life and history, be separated and finally expelled? It were easier to untwist all the beams of light in the sky, separating and expunging one of the colors, than to get the character of Jesus, which is the real gospel, out of the world. Look ye hither, meantime, all ye blinded and fallen of mankind, a better nature is among you, a pure heart, out of some pure world, is come into your prison and walks it with you. Do you require of us to show who he is, and definitely to expound his person? We may not be able. Enough to know that he is not of us--some strange being out of nature and above it, whose name is Wonderful. Enough that sin has never touched his hallowed nature, and that he is a friend. In him dawns a hope--purity has not come into the world, except to purify. Behold the Lamb of God, that taketh away the sins of the world! Light breaks in, peace settles on the air, lo! the prison walls are giving way--rise, let us go.


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msongs Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 09:02 PM
Response to Original message
1. certainly not biographies nt
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MathEducation Donating Member (60 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 10:07 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. (i.e. the four canonical gospels)...
Edited on Mon Dec-25-06 10:11 PM by MathEducation
...

We come back, then, to the self-evidencing superhuman character of Jesus, and there we rest. He is the sun that holds all the minor orbs of revelation to their places, and pours a sovereign, self-evidencing light into all religious knowledge. We have been debating much, and ranging over a wide field, in chase of the many phantoms of doubt and false argument, still we have not far to go for light, if only we could cease debating and sit down to see. It is no ingenious fetches of argument that we want; no external testimony, gathered here and there from the records of past ages, suffices to end our doubts; but it is the new sense opened in us by Jesus himself--a sense deeper than words and more immediate than inference--of the miraculous grandeur of his life; a glorious agreement felt between his works and his person, such that his miracles themselves are proved to us in our feeling, believed in by that inward testimony. On this inward testimony we are willing to stake everything, even the life that now is, and that which is to come. If the miracles, if revelation itself, can not stand upon the superhuman character of Jesus, then let it fall. If that character does not contain all truth and centralize all truth in itself, then let there be no truth. If there is anything worthy of belief not found in this, we may well consent to live and die without it. Before this sovereign light, streaming out from God, the deep questions, and dark surmises, and doubts unresolved, which make a night so gloomy and terrible about us, hurry away to their native abyss. God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. This it is that has conquered the assaults of doubt and false learning in all past ages, and will in all ages to come. No argument against the sun will drive it from the sky. No mole-eyed skepticism, dazzled by its brightness, can turn away the shining it refuses to look upon. And they who long after God, will be ever turning their eyes thitherward, and either with reason or without reason, or, if need be, against manifold impediments of reason, will see and believe.

...

http://www.jewsforshalom.org/TheCharacterOfJesus.html
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Harmonicaman Donating Member (103 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
2. Jesus Christ
A character in a work of fiction.

Like Oliver in Oliver Twist

or

Like Beethoven In Bill and Teds Excellent Adventure


the Choice Is Yours


Happy Holidays
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MathEducation Donating Member (60 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 09:35 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. absolutely...
the choice is mine...to believe...

Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted. Blessed
are the meek, for they shall inherit the earth. Blessed are those
who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be filled.
Blessed are the merciful, for they shall obtain mercy. Blessed are
the pure in heart, for they shall see God. Blessed are the peace-
makers, for they shall be called sons of God. Blessed are those who
are persecuted for righteousness sake, for theirs is the kingdom of
heaven. Blessed are you when men revile you and persecute you and
utter all kinds of evil against you falsely on my account.

...The grace of our Lord Jesus Chirst be with you all. Amen.

http://www.jewsforshalom.org/
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raccoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-27-06 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #2
16. I'd say he's more analagous to Robin Hood. nt
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MathEducation Donating Member (60 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 10:38 PM
Response to Original message
5. ps: happy birthday, Jesus...
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Evoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 10:40 PM
Response to Original message
6. I know its cool to like Jesus and all, but I don't really.
When I read the bible I was like...man, this guy is full of himself. I mean, he spends half the time bragging...oh I'm the son of god, love me, leave your family for me.blah blah blahdedy dah.

That love stuff is nice enough, but what an arrogant guy. Even when he was cleaning that guys feet it felt more like he was showing off than that he really cared.

I don't like Jesus.
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MathEducation Donating Member (60 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. A Father's Love Letter (to you)...
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Evoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 11:03 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Um yeah....that sappy video did nothing for me.
Except make my ears bleed.

Got anything else? Maybe some sort of animation of Jesus hugging babies or something.
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MathEducation Donating Member (60 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. "...Neither do I condemn thee..."
John 8
Jesus went unto the mount of Olives.

And early in the morning he came again into the temple, and all the people came unto him; and he sat down, and taught them.

And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst,

They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.

Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?

This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.

So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.

And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.

When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?

She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

...

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roguevalley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-25-06 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. its too bad that Jesus has become entrwined with excremental
people. I love him. I admire him.
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Evoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-26-06 01:52 AM
Response to Reply #9
11. Thanks for that quote...thats exactly what I'm talking about.
He does the good stuff but then, all of a sudden,

"I am the light of the world, followeth me..darkness, have light of life"

I mean...seriously. Ego or what. Everytime I do something good, I don't tell people I'm the light of life. When I was in grade school, I stopped what was going to be a bad bullying situation, to much risk to myself. But I didn't go to the person being bullied and claim I was the light of the world. Arrogance!

For every good thing he says, he starts freaking bragging.

Although, maybe if you quote some more bible passages (which I've read in its entirety, mind you), maybe all of a sudden I'll start loving jesus and convert to christianity. You just need to find the perfect quote thats all! Keep it coming, hehe.
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jgraz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-26-06 02:05 AM
Response to Reply #6
12. The more I learn about Jesus, the more disappointing he is as a moral teacher
Killing fig trees because they don't give him fruit (http://www.godhatesfigs.com), refusing to heal a woman because she's from the wrong tribe ("don't toss your bread before dogs") and continually advocating that people follow the complete, barbaric law of the old testament. He also seems to have no problem with keeping slaves, since he seems to use them in every other parable.

Seriously, why do we really expect some 2000-year-old rabbi to have any relevant advice for modern society? Moral thinking has come quite a long way since the gospels were written. Is there any reason we still need to rely on these ancient teachings to tell us how to live our lives?



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Realityhack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-26-06 05:18 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. No.
Of course there isn't (and there realy never was).
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TRYPHO Donating Member (299 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-26-06 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. There are lots of 2000 yr old Rabbi's that are very interesting to us...
But they aren't the ONE that everyone seems to go on and on about. The Rabbis that count are the one's that debated the Jewish laws of the time, and their contents are in the Talmud for Jews to debate and learn from to this day.

Jesus missed the debate apparently.

All the moral decisions were made by those within the yeshivot, not outside; and Jesus, if he had been around, doesn't seem to have made the grade.

Perhaps he couldn't get the sponsorship?

Either way, plenty of Rabbi's did manage to get their voice heard, which has lasted unchanged for 2000 years and many for much longer.

But Jesus, sorry, not up to scratch. Failed the test. Wasn't a Rabbi in the true sense of the word AT THAT TIME. If he'd passed the test he'd be known by the Jews too.

TRYPHO
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TRYPHO Donating Member (299 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-26-06 06:19 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Rabbi's from 2000 years ago, of course
There are very few Rabbi's that are 2000 years old.

I should also like to point out the following:

Before 135 CE, only Jewish sages in Palestine had semicha, and thus were called rebbi (or "rabbi"). The sages of the Babylonian Jewish community had a similar religious education, but without the semicha ceremony they were called rav. As such, these early Babylonian Jewish sages deferred to the Palestinian Jewish sages.

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semicha

This would suggest that if Jesus was a Rabbi he would have been from the Palestinian college, namely at Tiberias or Ceasarea

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Talmud

Just thought you might find that snippet interesting, as it sort of places him in one of two colleges. I don't suppose they had attendance sheets? Wonder who we can ask to see the register?!

TRYPHO

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Book Lover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-27-06 02:49 PM
Response to Original message
17. Is this website a
repackaged Jews for Jesus group?
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