God or nothing ~ Pat Condell does it again !!

[UndertheOcean]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ovg0eYjM64w&feature=sub

Bravo

[DURHAM D]

1. more details before I waste a click...

[UndertheOcean]

2. This is a funny video about Australian Kangaroos seeking asylum in Peru.

[DeSwiss]

3. You can never waste a click on Pat Condell....

...it's just not possible. ;)

"The truth is, nobody knows why we're here. Nobody. Not you, not me, not the priest, not the imam, not the scientist -- nobody. And anyone who expresses an opinion upon the subject is guessing. And your guess is as good as mine or the Pope's or Stephen Hawkings or anybody else's. And I think that if anybody says that their guesswork is the truth and the only truth, is a liar or a fool or both -- and should be treated as such. Not humored and indulged as they presently are and made to feel that their is virtue in their arrogance. But openly mocked and ridiculed, and if it hurts their feelings so much the better. Not because I believe in gratuitous insult, I don't. But I do believe in responding to it in-kind. And there is a difference.

As for you, if the fear of believing in nothing, the terror of keeping an open mind is keeping you enthralled to this monstrous, crude, imaginary god foisted upon you by a class of parasitical, fear-mongering clergy -- this vengeful punisher who'll be waiting for you at the moment of death (looking forward to that?), then I would suggest for your mental health, you're far better off believing in nothing. Even if you do go crazy. You'll still be ahead of the game. Peace."

~ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ovg0eYjM64w&feature=player_embedded">Pat Condell, "God or nothing"

[charlie]

4. It's remarkable his rants are unscripted

They're worked out in advance, of course, but he doesn't write them down.

[DeSwiss]

5. Exactly.

If I were religious, I'd call him a prophet! :) Here's one his that's a favorite of mine:

Although I'm an atheist and a secularist, and just about as anti-religion as it is possible be. I have no problem with anyone believing in god, if that's how they want to live their lives. In fact, I think for some people believing in a false god, (and this one is false, because they all are), can be quite therapeutic in much the same way that artificial daylight can help with the winter blues.

But personal faith and public religion are two completely different things.

When religion goes public it stops being spiritual and it becomes political. Usually running on the "Moral-hypocrisy Ticket." And because it claims divine authority, demanding unconditional submission and obedience from outside the bounds of reason, it despises democracy as much as it despises women and homosexuals. So quite a lot then.

And therefore it is always working toward theocracy. Toward strengthening the power and status of clergy. Public religion exists for the sole benefit of the clergy. And clergy exists for the sole benefit of clergy. And this is a pivotal point to understand.

Personal faith, spirituality, whatever you want to call it, doesn’t need to be administered and policed by a privileged class of clerical fascists. Whereas public religion not only depends upon clergy, they depend upon it. Neither can exist without the other. And neither is "actually" necessary.

And they know this of course. Which is why their proxy-religion is all about guilt and submission and obedience. Not enlightenment. Are you kidding? That's the last thing they want. Because "enlightened people" don't need clergy.

Why do you think the Pope tells Catholics obedience to the doctrine of The Church is the foundation of your faith? Not the "Sermon On The Mount," not "loving your neighbor," obedience is your foundation.

Of course it is. It has to be. Because the alternative is for you to look into your own heart, and that's the last place these parasites want you looking. Because that's where the bullshit detector is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STlYN5KCiWg">Pat Condell - From ''The arrogance of clergy''

[LAGC]

6. Pat's politics are a little iffy though.

Did you see his rant against the "Ground Zero" "mosque"?

He's also supposedly a member of the British Independence Party, a xenophobic party that wants to withdraw from the European Union and stop immigration.

I like some of his rants, but I'd be hesitant to put him up on a pedestal as any sort of "New Atheist" prophet...

[laconicsax]

7. "New Atheist?"

:rofl:

[LAGC]

8. Richard Dawkins does post his clips on his web-site. (n/t)

[Goblinmonger]

9. What exactly, according to you, are "New Atheists"?

Are they young? Are they ones that just speak their mind? Was there a schism in dogma of atheism? :rofl:

[DeSwiss]

11. Pat's politics are anything but "iffy."

At least as far as I have seen. And yes, I saw both of his rants http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjS0Novt3X4&feature=related">"No mosque at Ground Zero " and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJQ4bwGPRuk&feature=related">"Bad faith at Ground Zero". Provocative stuff. But the truth can very often be painful to hear. Yet hear it we must -- one way or the other.

Personally, I'd prefer if NO religious edifices were being built - anywhere - ever. Temples, mosques, churches -- they are all simply monuments to our ancient, infantile and ignorant past. They are little more than sanctuaries for people so that they can continue to live in denial of the truth about reality -- and havens for the con men who prey on them. And I also think it is helpful to remember that Mr. Condell's statements are coming from someone who lives in a country http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article4749183.ece">where Sharia law is already taken a foothold. So his condemnation of Islam's negative influence within society is based in reality, not the politically correct wishywashyness that we've become accustomed to on this side of the pond.

And while I expect to see incorrect statements being made here in R/T because, well because it's all about religion -- and there being so few facts within religion -- one just becomes used to it. And the facts that are often stated "about religion" based upon study, scholarship, and science are given short shrift. Because oddly, when it comes to religion few want to hear the facts.

However, you said that Pat Condell is "supposedly a member of the British Independence Party?" Actually that's not correct. The party you're trying to refer to is called the British National Party, or the BNP. They're the racists. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G4FpTvp0tgs">And no, he doesn't belong to that one either.

Finally, as for the idea of these "New Atheists" that you speak of, I think Sam Harris put it best:

"Atheism is not a philosophy; it is not even a view of the world; it is simply an admission of the obvious. In fact, "atheism" is a term that should not even exist. No one ever needs to identify himself as a "non-astrologer" or a "non-alchemist." We do not have words for people who doubt that Elvis is still alive or that aliens have traversed the galaxy only to molest ranchers and their cattle." ~ Sam Harris

[LAGC]

12. Okay, you made me do it.

A quick Google search shows the UK Independence Party (UKIP) is a separate political party.

And it didn't take long to find Pat's endorsement:

http://www.ukip.org/content/video-zone/1572-vote-small-think-big-says-pat-condell

Besides wanting to withdraw from the European Union, the UK Independence Party's immigration platform:

UKIP will:

- End mass uncontrolled and unlimited immigration
- Regain control of our borders
- End abuse of UK asylum system
- Introduce work permits visas for limited periods
- End support for multiculturalism and promote one, common British culture

http://www.ukip.org/media/policies/PPimmigration.pdf

Just sounds a little xenophobic to me.

Look, I agree with many of Pat's rants, I just think we should keep things in perspective here before we elevate him on some sort of pedestal.

As for the "ground zero mosque" debate and Muslim immigration in general, I think the more diversity the better. I'm not that concerned about religious minorities, I'm more concerned with the very powerful and entrenched religious MAJORITIES that already impose their religious views on the rest of us. Try living in a heavily Mormon area out West where they've outlawed gambling and casinos and where many places can't even have liquor stores open on Sundays. I'm not as worried about a few dozen (moderate) Muslims moving in and opening a new Islamic center like they just did here in my town a couple months ago.

I just think that the more religious diversity we have, the less powerful any one religion is, the stronger the secular state is, as the various rival religious groups keep each other in check. It also tends to open people's eyes up and make them realize: there really is more than one "true way" -- I don't doubt that more non-believers arise from such diversity as well.

[DeSwiss]

13. I stand corrected.

However, I recall during their national elections watching http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LTKzg1K7Es">his videos which advanced the idea that people should vote for independents -- any independents as long as they weren't with Labor, Tories or the BNP (as he states in the video you posted also). As you may have seen from the other video link I posted, there was an attempt to connect him to the BNP because of their racist rhetoric against Muslims. However Pat's rants have nothing to do with race, but with religion. All religion.

As for the issue of "multi-culturalism," I too have concerns about supporting it when it is apparent that it is simply a guise for the imposition of religiously-sanctioned laws and cultural mores into the mainstream and secular realm of society. Like the mandatory wearing of burkas by Muslim women. I agree that diversity is not only welcomed, but it should be seen as a necessary aspect of human existence. However, I do not hold this view with respect to religions. When there is religious diversity we can only end up with division, hatred and conflict as the outcome because since it isn't based upon reality it doesn't believe that it must conform to human conventions of tolerance and acceptance of all human beings for their own sake. All one need do is to look at religion's history. Look at its present for that matter.

Pat Condell believes that the institution of religion is a fraud. One that is perpetrated against those who are confused distressed and/or frightened by daily life in this dizzying modern world of ours. It developed and sustains the simultaneous idea of its adherents as victims and as sinful perpetrators. One designed to engender a belief in its false and comforting words of hope for tomorrow, while the other is designed to perpetuate a sense of guilt and responsibility to a god they have somehow short-changed even before they were born. And religion also simultaneously glorifies its creator for having miraculously created the universe, while at the same time castigating that same universe as something to be deplored and only endured until death releases them into an existence of the automaton's continual obeisance and praise.

Pat Condell says the things that must be said. And he does so in an unvarnished way. He doesn't require a pedestal, but he is worthy of praise for saying what he does and exposing himself to the danger and hatred of demented religious detractors. And he realizes (as do I) that we've come to this point of affirmative atheism out of necessity, because of all those prior years of trying to be inclusive and respectful of the bizarre ideas from these death cults, which by their very nature are anathema to life and human flourishing. As I pointed above, he says that religion should no longer be: "humored and indulged as they presently are and made to feel that their is virtue in their arrogance."

So the tenor of Pat Condell's comments (as with many others today), have become necessary because we've wasted all those years living in denial about the fact that religion is an out-of-date and out-of-control problem threatening our very lives. And thus by so placating the religious institutions of the world, we've lead them to believe that their fantastical ideas should be honored and respected for no apparent reason other than that they say we should. Even though there is not a shred of evidence, or rationality as to why we should do so. We require rationality in all other aspects of our daily lives. But not with respect to religion. I doesn't have to make sense. Yet I dare say that few if any religious believers would ever try to fully live their lives within the realm of these irrational religious beliefs. Not as it is advanced and stated within their holy tomes. But nonetheless believers cling to religion like it were a talisman. Like it's a worn and tattered blankey -- one that has been with them since childhood -- and they're hard pressed to let it go.

- Fine, but the placating ends now. That's why I like Pat. He understands this, and says so.....

[humblebum]

10. The man is good entertainment and a blathering bigot. nt

[cleanhippie]

15. You are the expert on such matters....

militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:militant atheists :rofl:

[laconicsax]

19. You forgot something....

STALIN!!!!

[humblebum]

20. Oh that's a keeper! Now you are actually cheerleading for Stalin.

Classic.

[laconicsax]

21. Whatever floats your boat. n/t

[onager]

16. Sorry. Here, have some non-bigoted quotes...

"What you have to spew and spread is extremely dangerous...it's dangerous for our children to even know that your philosophy exists! This is the Land of Lincoln where people believe in God! Get out of that seat...You have no right to be here! We believe in something. You believe in destroying! You believe in destroying what this state was built upon."-- Monique Davis (D), Illinois State Representative, to Rob Sherman during his testimony before the House State Government Administration Committee.

"Under no circumstances would I ever vote for an atheist {for President) because they are terrible (and have) no moral code." -- Star Jones, on the TV show The View, 2002.

"No, I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered as patriots. This is one nation under God." -- George H.W. Bush, to American Atheists' reporter Rob Sherman in 1987, while serving as vice-president.

"Civilized people -- Muslims, Christians and Jews -- all understand that the source of freedom and human dignity is the Creator." -- Atty. Gen, John Ashcroft, speaking to a group of Christian broadcasters, February 18, 2002.

"They put the Negroes in the schools, and now they've driven God out." -- Rep. George Andrews of Alabama, responding to Engle v. Vitale, 1962

"Rights come from God and only from God." -- Alan Keyes

"Why not admit that the words "separation" and "church" do not even appear in the U.S. Constitution? Instead, they do appear in Article 52 of the Constitution of the Soviet Union." -- Rev. Tim LaHaye

"I believe this notion of the separation of church and state was the figment of some infidel's imagination." -- Rev W. A. Criswell, interview, CBS Evening News, August 23, 1984. In July 1960 Rev. Criswell predicted: "The election of John F. Kennedy will lead to the death of a free church and a free state."

"Evolution is the root of atheism, of communism, nazism, behaviorism, racism, economic imperialism, militarism, libertinism, anarchism, and all manner of anti-Christian systems of belief and practice." -- Henry Morris, The Remarkable Birth of Planet Earth (1972)

"The wall of separation said to have been erected by the First Amendment exists only in the mind or rather in the imagination of legal students smoking the opium of secularism." -- The Catholic World, editorial, April 1955

"Today we are engaged in a final, all-out battle between communistic atheism and Christianity." -- Sen. Joseph McCarthy, in his infamous address to the Ohio County Women's Republican Club on February 9, 1950 - the address which launched the "McCarthy Era."

"The greatest book since the Bible!" -- Ann Coulter, review of "Blacklisted by History: The Untold Story of Senator Joe McCarthy and His Fight Against America's Enemies" by M. Stanton Evans. Glenn Beck adds: "America, please read this book!"

All quotes from Positive Atheism.org's nifty alphabetized database. (Except the Coulter/Beck reviews, available at almost any site hawking Evans' book.)

[humblebum]

17. And these have a bearing on Pat Condell how? nt

[onager]

18. I'll let you figure that out.

See you in a week or two.

[AlecBGreen]

22. wow

"Evolution is the root of atheism, of communism, nazism, behaviorism, racism, economic imperialism, militarism, libertinism, anarchism, and all manner of anti-Christian systems of belief and practice."

Quick! Everybody stop having sex RIGHT NOW!!!1! Your making too many liberal communist nazi racists! If only I could find some "stop natural selection" bumper stickers to hand out.

p.s. Im full of snark right now, in case thats not obvious :P

[UndertheOcean]

14. only one rec ???