Can Catholics abide a saint who had an abortion?

[rug]

Dorothy Day, who died in 1980, was an anarchist, a pacifist, and the co-founder of the Catholic Worker, a movement devoted to helping the poor and the homeless. Described by historian David O’Brien as “the most influential, interesting, and significant figure” in U.S. Catholic history, Day is currently being considered for canonization in the Catholic Church.

Before her conversion to Catholicism in 1927, however, Day lived what the late Cardinal O’Connor of the Archdiocese of New York has referred to as "a life akin to that of the pre-converted Augustine of Hippo." That bohemian life included common-law marriage and an abortion.

Some may feel that Day’s promiscuity precludes her cause for sainthood. But in his February 2000 letter to the Vatican in support of Day’s canonization, O’Connor contended “that her abortion should not preclude her cause, but intensifies it.” She is a model, he continued, “for women who have had or are considering abortions” because she “regretted” that action “every day of her life.”

http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2011/07/07/my-take-catholics-will-accept-a-saint-who-had-an-abortion/

[Cleita]

1. If all the sins were committed before there was a

conversion, the Church will allow it. Remember St. Augustine, a libertine with mistresses and illegitimate children before he found God.

[skepticscott]

10. I don't think they have too much trouble

if the sins were committed after a conversion, frankly. They can always find a justification to sanctify who they want.

[Maccagirl]

2. A fascinating article that will give conservative Catholics

hives-much like Ms. Day did in her lifetime I will guess.

[TheDebbieDee]

3. I know this is a cheap shot, but...........

if Catholics can abide a culture that has protected several hundred child predators down through the centuries, what won't they abide?

[laconicsax]

13. Hell, they can abide a former Nazi as Pope. n/t

[okasha]

23. There's enough wrong with and about Ratzinger without the hyperbole

All German boys were forced to join the Hitler Jugend when they were fourteen. Several of my professors of German at a major American university had the same experience. They weren't "Nazis," either. Quite the contrary.

[laconicsax]

24. The Hitler Youth was a part of the Nazi Party and members wore kiddie-brownshirt uniforms.

Your professors were former Nazis, as was the Pope. Their enthusiasm doesn't change facts.

[rug]

25. And repetition doesn't make it true or relvant to the OP.

[laconicsax]

26. You may have noticed that I wasn't replying to the OP. n/t

[Tesha]

20. Empowered, confident women. They won't abide them. (NT)

[ZombieHorde]

4. Interesting. Recommended. nt

[Curmudgeoness]

5. My understanding of Catholicism is limited, but

I seem to recall that if a person confessed a sin to a priest, and does the required pentence, that sin is wiped from the slate.

IMO, this is a perfect example of when Jesus forgave a prostitute her sins. But then again, we are talking about the Catholic church and their mores.

[avaistheone1]

6. Jesus forgave prostitutes, thieves, murderers among others

Jesus Christ even forgave a murderer. Who was it? It was Saul of Tarsus - who became the Apostle Paul, the greatest Christian who ever lived! At one time Saul hated Christians, and was responsible for sending many of them to their death: "I persecuted the followers of this Way to their death" (Acts 22:4).

http://www.christianpost.com/news/can-god-forgive-a-murderer-46239/



Jesus also forgave a murderer who was crucified next to him who asked for Jesus' forgiveness.

[provis99]

8. Jesus won't forgive heretics or apostates though.

No matter how decent they are.

[avaistheone1]

9. Jesus does...

Christian scholars are divided on what words Jesus said, and did not say. There is much misinterpretation. However one of the few things where there is scholar consensus is that the Beatitudes are Jesus' words. According to the Beatitudes a heretic or an apostate could be saved by their actions.



THE EIGHT BEATITUDES OF JESUS


"Blessed are the poor in spirit,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

Blessed are they who mourn,
for they shall be comforted.

Blessed are the meek,
for they shall inherit the earth.

Blessed are they who hunger and thirst for righteousness,
for they shall be satisfied.

Blessed are the merciful,
for they shall obtain mercy.

Blessed are the pure of heart,
for they shall see God.

Blessed are the peacemakers,
for they shall be called children of God.

Blessed are they who are persecuted for the sake of righteousness,
for theirs is the kingdom of heaven."


Gospel of St. Matthew 5:3-10

[eridani]

11. Interesting how many fundie whackjobs refuse to believe that this is actually--

--in the New Testament. Supply Side Jesus would never ever say anything like that, or denigrate rich people.

[xchrom]

7. Recommend

[Odin2005]

12. The current bunch of assholes that run the RCC will never allow it.

She was a leftist and the current church hierarchy is rabidly right-wing.

I love a couple blocks from a Dorothy Day center and occasionally get food from their food shelves. Wonderful folks there.

[murielm99]

14. I've always admired Dorothy Day. n/t

[rug]

15. "Don't call me a saint. I don't want to be dismissed so easily."

A very remarkable woman.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:j6y3vh7xmy0J:www.sojo.net/index.cfm%3Faction%3Dmagazine.article%26issue%3Dsoj0007%26article%3D000741e+Don't+call+me+a+saint.+I+don't+want+to+be+dismissed+so+easily.&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&source=www.google.com

"First of all, let it be remembered that I speak as an ex-Communist and one who has not testified before Congressional Committees, nor written works on the Communist conspiracy."

[dimbear]

16. Constantine had his wife boiled alive in a bath.

Or so the history books say. I believe a large portion of liberal DUers would call that questionable behavior, at least for a saint.

[rug]

17. Non Sequitur is a Latin phrase.

[dimbear]

18. Good point. I'll make a note of that. Meanwhile, let's just agree

that almost no misbehavior excludes you from sainthood except questioning Catholic dogma.

[rug]

19. Well, there's always Saint Lucifer of Cagliari.

Admittedly, the dogma was in flux at that time.

[dimbear]

21. Catholic Encyclopedia has the details.....

Wow. Now that guy dealt out some tough love! :)

[dmallind]

22. If they do, they HAVE to sync up "St. Dorothy's Day" with the annual Wizard of Oz screening

Although I suppose it would be St. Dorothy Day's Day...

Wonder who will come forward to claim the "miracle of the timely donation" or some such?

[Manifestor_of_Light]

27. So does Dorothy Day get brownie points with the RCC?

If she had NOT regretted her abortion, would that make her less qualified to be nominated for sainthood? According to the anti-abortion crowd, every woman who has an abortion goes into a tailspin of depression, regrets it every single moment of the rest of her life, and feels guilty. Not to mention that she has a higher chance of getting breast cancer (not true--a complete lie) as well as be guilt-ridden her whole life (not true either).

even if she had to have an abortion to save her life and had a deformed/non-viable fetus.

:banghead:

[Manifestor_of_Light]

28. Would somebody answer my question??? Please?

[Manifestor_of_Light]

29. kick

Would somebody answer my question at the bottom please??