Conscientious Objection

[H2O Man]

In the months leading up to the election, DU carried a number of threads that dealt with various aspects of a military draft. There is good reason to believe that the policies of the Bush administration will lead to more violence around the globe, particularly in the Middle East. The war in Iraq and Afghanistan alone will likely create a need for a military draft within the next 12 to 18 months.

There are numerous DUers who are either of draft age; have children at or about draft age; have extended family or friends who are at or about draft age; or are simply interested in this important issue for other reasons.

DU continues to serve as a discussion forum, where some general ideas on subjects like the draft can be explored and debated. I am hoping that on this part of the forum, we might be able to discuss how the concepts of religion & spirituality can be used to help young adults prepare to declare "consciencious objector" when the time comes.

I am an old CO Counselor. I have the books and resources to help people examine this subject in depth. I also have a "blog," on which I will soon be addressing C.O. & the draft in terms that encourages people to begin to take steps now, to document their belief system for the future.

Interested parties can view my site at:

http://h2oman.blogspot.com

[youngred]

1. Thank you

though I likely would be 4-f and undraftable I am very interested in this and wil pass it along to my friends. Thanks

[H2O Man]

2. Thank you.

You illustrate the first step in documenting CO status: the habit of thinking of the welfare of other people, even in a situation that may not directly involve you. I appreciate your interest!

[OneBlueSky]

3. another good resource . . .

Central Committee for Conscientious Objectors (CCCO) has been around for a long time . . .

http://www.objector.org/

[H2O Man]

4. It's a great resource!

I've saved material from it since back in the old days of NISBCO!

[H2O Man]

12. The Center on Conscience and War

can be reached in the following ways:

Address:
1830 Connecticut Avenue, NW
Washington, DC 20009-5706

Telephone
202-483-2220

Fax
202-483-1246

e-mail
[e-mail]

URL
http://www.nisbco.org

I would urge DUers to consider making a donation to this organization. It will be one of the single most important resources in the struggle for social justice when Bush & Cheney want to have American youth drafted to secure Texas oil's access to the Middle East.

I will be posting more information about this group on my blog today.

[wildflower]

5. A somewhat related LBN thread...

at http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=1121693 :

Brethren Agree To Revive 'Alternative Service' Military Draft Programs

http://www.beliefnet.com/story/158/story_15893_1.html

Leaders of the Church of the Brethren say they will follow through on a request from the Selective Service to have "alternative service" programs in place for conscientious objectors if a draft is reinstated.

As one of the historic "peace churches" that shun military service, Brethren officials were "cautious" after an unannounced visit by a draft official to a church center in Maryland last October. Officials were worried that the visit signaled that a draft may be at hand. snip

In follow-up meetings, draft officials urged the church to dust off long-standing "alternative service" programs that allow conscientious objectors to serve in two-year domestic service projects in lieu of military service.

thread at

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=1121693

[sybylla]

6. Since you are an old CO counselor

how would you advise an atheist to prepare?

Atheism is not supposed to be a block to filing for CO status but all the orgs out there that focus on helping young adults prepare focus on things you can do from a religious aspect. My sons (16 and 18) are atheists and are not about to join any kind of religious order just so they can follow their conscience later on.

[H2O Man]

8. That's an important question .....

...and certainly no one should ever feel any pressure to "join" any religious group or claim any spiritual foundation that they do not have. The good thing is that a person is equally capable of having consciencious objections to war.

By the old definition, which I am convinced will be the general definition that the new draft will use, there are two important types of COs.

{1} Those who by reason of deeply held moral, ethical, and/or religious beliefs, are conscienciously opposed to participating in war in any form are the typical C.O.s.

{2} The second type are persons who by reason of deeply held moral, ethical, and/or religious belief, are conscienciously opposed to participatin directly in war in any form, but who are not opposed to performing noncombatant duties -- such as serving as a medic -- in the armed forces.

There are also sub-groups that the federal law has refused to recognize. They include {1} selective objectors, who do not believe in participating in "unjust wars"; {2} nuclear pacifists, who are opposed to wars that hold the potential to escalate into nuclear wars (which was a more distinct group in the 1970s, when WMD were not as common in non-"super power" nations); and {3} noncooperators, who refuse to register, etc.

I'm confident that you, as a parent, discuss issues including violence and war with your children. I would suggest (and you may well have) that you talk with them about organizing their ideas in the upcoming months. I will be posting the three major questions that they may need to be able to answer soon. In general, they are: {1} describe your belief system as a CO, including if they allow service in a noncombatant capacity; {2} describe how you acquired these beliefs; and {3} how does this belief system affect you life style, both in the day-to-day and long-term (career options) choices you make?

The more back-ground material a person has, including -- if it becomes necessary -- letters of support from relatives, neighbors, teachers, friends, etc, are very valuable. I recommend that young people and their parents consider getting together in groups, or with others over the internet, to brain-storm on activities to take now.

I hope that this helps, and I will certainly be available here to discuss any ideas or questions people may have.

Again, thank you for an important question.

[sybylla]

9. Thank you H2O Man

Okay, now that sounds like something out of a comic strip.


I'll be bookmarking this thread and watching for future posts. I appreciate your expertise and any assistance you can give.

[H2O Man]

11. You are certainly welcome.

I have sons ages 21 and 17. I know your sons are exactly as important to you, as mine are to me. And so if I have information to help you protect your sons' interests, I am surely going to do everything I possibly can.

A good start is to have your sons think even in terms of what books they have read, or people they have learned about, that affect the way they think.

Most "local" draft boards were filled a year or more ago, quietly. And they are generally made up of people with pro-military backgrounds and attitudes. We need to have young people prepared to sit down with a group of them, and to be able to articulate their belief systems to a degree that shows beyond a reasonable doubt they are opposed to war and violence.

[PATRICK]

7. Keep updated

I am thinking that things are in the works to change the draft situation or at least the appearances while the old handbooks of people like yourself merely serve as references to attract.

They are closing loopholes and moving at the same time to institutionalize a perverted form of "alternate service", mainly stateside non-com roles as safe havens for the privileged to 'serve with honor" which will be denied to the poorly educated or unskilled. I would be flexible in dealing with the new hoops that will be offered, especially the argument that non-com status defeats the pacifist determination not to contribute in any way to the war effort. Besides the new twists, the old difficulties should be remembered as there were far fewer CO's than voluntary exiles.

Mainly, if you haven't thought about pacifism and the unacceptability of violence or any war, do so now before the draft surfaces. The commitment must be real in your own mind and not sown with doubts and other agendas.
Other honest ways to deny the draft will be more painful than ever. The spiritual price if genuine, is even costlier, no matter the social pressures.

We are one very predictable LIHOP from a sweeping national wave of a totally reincarnated fascism. The ongoing Bushco agenda is also likely to go the same way with few obstacles. Better to choose now.

[H2O Man]

10. Interesting points.

In October, one of the better informed "anti-draft" DUers posted much of the "talking points" from DoD meetings on the potential draft. And you are 100% correct that they are looking to close any and all "loopholes." This is especially true in regard to the two recognized types of CO, which I cover in post #8. The goal is to force "noncombatant" as the only option.

In my opinion, people need to take an immediate interest in this. It can't be put on the back burner. The "bump on a log" attitude will get you or your children in a uniform. We need to take a "let's do it right now" attitude. We need to begin with an "it's already too late to think that anyone in Washington, DC is going to look out for our welfare" stance.

[indigobusiness]

13. Here are some relevant links

-I saw these elsewhere and thought they might benefit this thread:

http://www.beliefnet.com/story/158/story_15893_1.html

Brethren Agree to Revive 'Alternative Service' Draft Programs Leaders of the Church of the Brethren say they will follow through on a request from the Selective Service to have "alternative service" programs in place for conscientious objectors if a draft is reinstated

http://www.thememoryhole.org/mil/draft-boards.htm

DOD Notice: Serve Your Community and the Nation - Become a Selective Service System Local Board Member The Selective Service System wants to hear from men and women in the community who might be willing to serve as members of a local draft board.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/147483_draft08.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3242923.stm

http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,12271,1077906,00.html


http://dailydraftdispatch.org