Wow, Rick Reilly really rips into MJ. About time that jerk got what he deserves.

[LisaM]

I didn't watch watch the HOF just because of him, but it sounds like I missed it all!

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=reilly_rick&id=4477759

[madinmaryland]

1. Rick Reilly is a dick. I'll have to see Jordan's speech for myself. Anything

out or Reilly's mouth is suspect. Sounds like he has a vendetta against Jordan, kind of like you do (as a Piston's fan).

Hmmm.

[LisaM]

2. I do dislike him because of some of the way he handled himself vs. the Pistons

I freely admit it.

However, not having seen this speech, since I detest Jordan, I did a little searching around and there are plenty of other articles laying into him for this.

[madinmaryland]

3. Have any links?

:shrug:

BTW, wasn't your negativity towards Jordon debunked a couple of months ago?

[TZ]

4. Nope. And living in this area

You should know how big a Jerk Jordan is. It was apparant after his debacle with the Wizards. Abe Pollin may be the nicest, classiest owner in sports and he loathes Jordan. Jordan is an ass. And an idiot. Kwame Brown?

[madinmaryland]

7. Uhmm. The Wizards/Bullets are and have been a debacle. Anything

Jordan did or didn't do probably wouldn't have mattered. The franchise is nearly as bad as the San Francisco Warriors and the San Diego Clippers.

[TZ]

8. Say what you want but Pollin is a class act

And he can't stand Jordan. For good reason. Kwame Brown is lousy and he was Jordan's prize pick. In case you didn't notice the Wizards got much better after Jordan left.. Jordan's a great player but a incompetent jerk as an executive. Notice how no other team but the expansion Bobcats wanted him. I don't think you are thinking objectively about him

[madinmaryland]

14. Where did I say anything about whether or not Pollin isn't a class act.

I have no idea, nor do I care. I do know that by his running of the club, he has had as much success as the Warriors and Clippers have had.

As for Jordon, I can understand why LisaM's judgement is clouded as the Bulls annually kicked the shit out of her dirty boys in Detroit. It's ironic that she has the gull to talk about Jordan being a jerk, when her dirty boys defined the art of the cheapshot and complete dirty play. Yes, he was a great player (possibly the greatest - I am not nor have I ever been a Bull's fan), and I will agree that as an executive he is quite pedestrian.

[TZ]

16. So someone's not a jerk if they win alot?

No wonder you like the Cowboys. If a nice guy like Pollin ( who is a dem I believe and does much good for the city of DC) refuses to be on the same room as Jordan says alot. From what I read/heard Jordan is one of the most unpleasant people around celeb or not. You need to quit being a fan boy about Jordan.

[madinmaryland]

17. What are you talking about, Snyder. You are twisting what I have said (like cboy)

and then try and tie it to the Cowboys. :wtf:

mim shakes his head.

[Captain Hilts]

19. Pollin is a gem of a man. And the Wizards don't deserve him.

And I disagree with the firing of Eddie Jordan.

[madinmaryland]

20. That's fine that he is a fine man. But his acumen in running an NBA

team has been less than stellar. I'm looking at how the franchise has performed over the last 30 years, and well, that speaks for itself. Wasn't it when Wes Unseld was with them in the late 70's that the last won a championship or was in a championship game?

[Captain Hilts]

21. Who said he's been a great owner?

[madinmaryland]

22. Thank you. Point made.

[TZ]

26. Jordan made a bad franchise worse

And even though the wizards have never been a great franchise that does not mean Jordans not an boob. If you weren't a koolaid drinking fool you'd understand that.

[madinmaryland]

27. I would say that his poor decisions as a Wizards exec, were just a continuation

of more than 20 years of bad decisions by the Wizards organization. I can at least understand LynzM irrational hatred for Michael Jordan, but yours seems even more irrational. You fools should have considered having Jordan for even a couple of years a coup, and actually marketed it better. I'll leave the koolaid drinking to the wizard fans.

:D

[madinmaryland]

23. BTW. After living in the DC area for five years, I have never heard anyone

speak negatively of Jordan, if they even talk about him at all. Funny, but my boss who has season tickets to the Wizards/Bullets even thinks they are a fucking joke.\

Separate your feelings from the debacle called the Wizards and a someone they hired that lasted two years in DC. Sad, just very sad, cboy.

[TZ]

25. Well I have relatives IN dc

Who are pretty smart and they have told me some pretty nasty stories about Jordan. Once again I have to ask you if you didn't notice that the Wizards got better after Jordan left. And kwame brown is a failure wherever he went. All you have to do to find out about how bad a person Jordan is is pay attention to what Abe Pollin, numerous sportswriters, Jordan's ex wife and long time DC insiders say. You are starting to sound like a jock sniffer who think that image is everything. Honestly, you need to pay attention. Jordan is one of the most fake, hatefully arrogant incomptent jerks out there. It is a fact that Jordan made a bad franchise worse. And sorry, I think I will take the opinion of a. thirty year resident of DC on DC affairs over a a five year resident. It's people like you who think he can do no wrong and believe his carefully crafted image that he feathers his pockets with. He has never gotten a dime from me and never will. He reminds me of OJ- everyone thought he was a good guy while he was abusing his wife.

[LisaM]

10. My negativitiy towards Jordan was not debunked

unless you mean some people didn't agree. No one disputed the facts that he kept Pistons off the Olympics team, and that he refused to participate in the ceremonies associated with it.

[madinmaryland]

15. I find it highly ironic that you think Jordan is a jerk, for a possibly keeping

certain Pistons. Given the dirty boy reputation of the Pistons of that era, I was happy the jerks from Detroit would have been left off the team.

:shrug:

[LisaM]

18. Ha ha ha, and Michael Jordan's not dirty?

He had the refs in his pocket and was one of the most unsporting players of all time. But even if you didn't want to see any Pistons on the Olympics team (did you complain that their coach was allowed to coach it, and are you including Dumars?) what do you have to say about Jordan's refusal to participate in the ceremonies?

You can be one of the adoring masses; I don't care. But I think his behavior at the HOF induction points out perfectly what I've thought for years.

[wilt the stilt]

28. you cheered for lambeer

I played basketball until I was 46. I played with many fine players including one of the original starting guards in the first women's professional league. Jordan may be a jerk but Lambeer did things that would have started a fist fight in the street. He would submarine people and then go hide behind the refs. what a chump.

[LisaM]

29. First of all, this is not about Laimbeer. Of course everyone hated him.

Except for Pistons' fans. He fouled out of plenty of games, though, which Jordan never did, so to say that Laimbeer hid behind the refs when Jordan didn't is just silliness. The refs adjusted how they called the game - they changed the game - to accommodate Jordan. That would bother any true basketball fan. The effects are still with us - superstars don't get the same treatment as others, I've heard announcers in all seriousness support the concept that veterans and rookies "get" or "don't get" the calls, they won't call travelling - the list goes on and on. And why won't anyone address the substance of the article I posted? Jordan has been a jerk all through his career and he was a jerk at the HOF.

If you want to start a thread about Laimbeer, be my guest. I have tried to bring up Jordan here before and all I get back is boo hoo, Pistons were dirty, Laimbeer Laimbeer Laimbeer (don't hear about Dumars, Johnson, Salley, Chuck Daly, or many of the other players). I'm talking about Jordan, don't get fixated on Laimbeer!

[wilt the stilt]

30. I thought Dumars was great.

however you are still defending in my opinion the dirtiest basketball player I have ever seen and he did hide behind the refs. When he submarined a player and they got up steaming he ran behind the refs. I saw him do it. I just wish he played against Willis Reed. It would have been a bloodbath.
dirty is dirty and trying to hurt players is beyond it all. Jordan never tried to hurt players on purpose.

I started watching the NBA in '64 and I saw almost everyone. No one was ever like lambeer

[LisaM]

32. I'm not asking anyone to like Laimbeer. Where did you get that?

I'm not even sticking up for him! I know lots of people detested him. I'd be surprised if they didn't. But don't you think Dumars, or at least one Piston, should have been on the Dream Team?

On the other hand, no one was ever protected by the refs more than Michael Jordan. And I think any idolatry of him is misplaced.

[wilt the stilt]

45. Dumars deserved to be on the dream team

But Thomas even more so. both were terrific players as was Dantley(who was on the'76 olympic team). The rest no way. Jordan however was and is the finest basketball player of all time bar none and that includes Bill Russell who I watched many times and used his techniques to rebound my whole life(he used to have a a tutorial on how to play during halftime in the 1960's).

I copied my style of play after john Havlicek.

That being said your diatribe sounds like sour grapes. I watched Jordan just like reilly and my take was nothing like his. I thought he spoke on what drove him to his heights as a player and he was the most competitive player I have ever seen play.

I remember a play where he had the ball stolen from him and i swear I literally saw smoke come out of his nostrils. He chased down the player and stuffed him. He was unrelenting in his pursuit of winning.

One more thought on another Piston. Remember the move that Rodman did when he came from out of bounds to get position under the boards. I turned to my friend and said that he stole my move.

By the way, calling lambeer a chump was the ultimate putdown when I played Bball

[madinmaryland]

46. Definitely sour grapes. Someone needs to get over it and move on.

It's not healthy to hold on to petty grievances like this one.

[madinmaryland]

31. Lisa. YOU ARE THE POT CALLING THE KETTLE BLACK!

Un-fucking-believable!

end of message.

[Jetboy]

43. I remember Isiah conspiring to keep the ball away from MJ

in one of his first all star games. I remember the deservedly named Bad Boys fouling my Bulls harder than I've seen anybody fouled before or since. I just don't know what you are talking about except that you are petty and jealous.

[madinmaryland]

44. +1

[a kennedy]

5. Here's the video of the speech.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMMBWJJPjSE&feature=topvideos

[jakefrep]

6. Rick Reilly = worthless tool

First the stupid hitpiece on Tiger Woods, and now this.

[TZ]

9. Doesn't mean Jordan's not a jerk

Cause he is. He's despised by people in the know in DC because of his antics...he's the Matt Millen of basketball.

[LisaM]

13. Millen was utterly inept in his job

but by all accounts, a likeable guy - which was why he hung on to his job for so long.

[LisaM]

11. Why is Reilly a jerk? Because he doesn't buy into the superstar meme?

I don't subscribe to SI any more (I used to, for years), but I've always liked his columns and whether or not you agree with him, he is a good writer.

[jakefrep]

12. He's a cheap-shot artist.

Like far too many in the sports-columnist biz.

[madinmaryland]

24. I would have to say that he is a pretentious asshat who is jealous of those

that are successful in sports. Read any "life of reilly" article that he has written.

Pretentious asshole.

[madinmaryland]

33. Lisa. I have attached a list of the 1992 Dream Team.

Charles Barkley
Larry Bird
Clyde Drexler
Patrick Ewing
Magic Johnson
Michael Jordan
Christian Laettner
Karl Malone
Chris Mullin
Scottie Pippen
David Robinson
John Stockton

-----

Do you seriously think that any of the Pistons from their 91-92 squad actually belonged on the Dream Team? Other than Christian Laettner, I see no other player that does not deserve to be on the team.

If so, can I have some of the shit you are smoking?

91-92 Detroit Piston roster (48-34)
Mark Aguirre
William Bedford
Lance Blanks
Joe Dumars
Gerald Henderson
Bill Laimbeer
Bob McCann
Dennis Rodman
John Salley
Brad Sellers
Charles Thomas
Isiah Thomas
Darrell Walker
Orlando Woolridge

[LisaM]

34. Well for one thing, Magic had already announced he was HIV positive

Rodman was at the start of his seven-year streak of having the most rebounds, and you can easily make a case for Isiah. If you don't like Rodman and Isiah, you still need to make a nod to the Pistons and their back-to-back championships. And I don't think - especially in the Olympics, which, ha ha, is supposed to represent a high level of sportsmanship, one of the players gets to say who plays and who doesn't.

Be that as it may, this is still not a defense of Laimbeer. I understand why people don't like him. I GET IT!!!!! LOL.

But you don't seem to have an inkling of why I detest Michael Jordan.

I don't personally dislike Magic, though I have a friend (Bulls fan, natch) who can't stand him and gets really, really upset whenever he is honored for anything. She thinks he was promiscuous and a bad role model.


Here's some non-Rick Reilly reaction to Michael's tirade:



http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/halloffame09/columns/story?columnist=adande_ja&page=JordanSpeech-090914
"He got the high school coach who cut him and the guy who beat him out for the final spot on the team. He got his beloved North Carolina coach, Dean Smith, for keeping him off the Sports Illustrated cover that went to the upperclassmen instead. He got Pat Riley and Riley's "little" protege, Jeff Van Gundy, for all of their gamesmanship during the Bulls-Knicks rivalry in the '90s. He got his old Chicago general manager/foil Jerry Krause, delivering the final refutation on Krause's ill-advised "organizations win championships" remark. He got every media member who doubted Jordan's ability to win an NBA championship. And he went on an extended riff on Bryon Russell, the man forever frozen in the highlight of Jordan's final shot in a Bulls uniform".

http://www.dwightjaynes.com/michael-jordan-not-exactly-a-hall-of-fame-level-speech
"There’s a very good column about it here <http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-jordanhall091209&prov=yhoo&type=lgns> that sums it all up, but it’s pretty incredible how many people accepted it — because he’s Jordan, of course — and didn’t call him on it. It’s always been incredible to me how little sticks to Jordan. The gambling, the strange retirement from the game to go off and suck at baseball, the abuse of his teammates, his ill-fated comeback, his front-office failures — he’s Jordan, so nobody criticizes him".


http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=aw-jordanhall091209&prov=yhoo&type=lgns
"This wasn’t a Hall of Fame induction speech, but a bully tripping nerds with lunch trays in the school cafeteria. He had a responsibility to his standing in history, to players past and present, and he let everyone down. This was a night to leave behind the petty grievances and past slights – real and imagined. This was a night to be gracious, to be generous with praise and credit".


http://www.sacbee.com/846/story/2177677.html
"And No. 23 apparently had a lot of things prodding him during his 14-year career. Not demons. Memories. Slights. As we found out Friday night, the list of people who either knowingly or unknowingly motivated Jordan <http://topics.sacbee.com/Jordan/> was phone-book long".

[madinmaryland]

36. I'll skip your phobic comment about Magic Johnson..

Dennis Rodman began as you said in 92 and then carried them through the Jordan years in Chicago. In 92, Rodman, in my book, wouldn't have been on the team. Thomas (with all of his quirks.. if you'd like, i'll dredge some of his crap up), might have qualified for the team. He probably would have been a better pick than Chris Mullen, who was way overrated. I'd take John Stockton any day over Thomas.

Where did I say I disliked Laimbeer?? I said he was a dirty player, as others here have. And he was totally unqualified for the dream team.

Yeah, I've read what you have said about why you hate Jordan, and they are appear to be petty grievances, because the Bull's spent the better part of ten years kicking the Piston's asses and humiliating them like they did to most of the teams in the NBA. That's all I'm pointing out....

That and ..



:D

[LisaM]

37. Magic barely played in the Olympics. My point was that he wasn't the most fit player

though I can see why you construed it differently. That's not what I meant, though.

I just think that now everyone can see what some people have known about Jordan all along. He's really not a nice guy. I remember when he was on one of his many retirement tours and my sister was talking to Scott Simon, distusting Jordan drooler, about how he was not going to be welcome in Detroit. Scott Simon was surprised to hear it. He probably went and cried all over the Jordan poster he (seriously) kept in his office!!!!!

Spirited debate, MiM. We're never going to agree on this, but it is very fun!

[LisaM]

35. PS - I think the Dream Team was stupid anyway

As an American, I was really embarrassed by it.

[madinmaryland]

38. We all know why, but the dream team was a PR bonanza! Unfortunately,

bringing the "dirty boys" into the mix could have ruined the images of some of the other players. I have yet to hear you complain about Larry Bird being on the team.

You complain about Magic and Jordan, but not about Bird, Stockton, and Mullen??

:shrug:

[LisaM]

39. I have no love lost for Larry Bird

However, none of the people you mentioned got up and reamed everyone they'd ever been associated with at the HOF induction. And for someone like Jordan, who anyone must admit was pretty catered to by the league and the refs, to get up and do that is pretty bad.

[madinmaryland]

40. ...

I won't mention that it is a disgrace that the Detroit Lions get to host a game on Thanksgiving Day!

:popcorn:

Channeling the douche-twins!

[LisaM]

41. They all laughed when Michigan took the field against Notre Dame, too

You just wait.

[madinmaryland]

42. Uhh.. They beat the Amish.

That's a real accomplishment!

:D

[ProfessorGAC]

47. Reilly Is An Idiot

Jordan's speech was funny. Anybody who says it was mean spirited wasn't really paying attention.
GAC