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As the Preakness gets ready to roll, a note of respect for Sham and Alydar

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Faygo Kid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 04:59 PM
Original message
As the Preakness gets ready to roll, a note of respect for Sham and Alydar
I am old enough to remember their races well. Great horses who would have won the Triple Crown had it not been for Secretariat and Affirmed. I know that Sham finished last in the Belmont (of just 5 horses) because he tried to keep up with Secretariat. Even Affirmed couldn't have done that. Anyway, enjoy the Preakness. I know I will, yet again.

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elleng Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
1. Not so old! (Me, too!)
Maryland my Maryland!

Off we go!
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KamaAina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 05:37 PM
Response to Original message
2. Alydar could have kicked the asses of any of the glue-factory nags that have come since
this is getting ridiculous. As in pre-'04 Red Sox ridiculous. :(
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TZ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 05:43 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Not necessarily
There have been some very good horses in the TC series. Who just couldn't do it for various reasons, Barbaro, Real Quiet, Afleet Alex, Easy Goer/Sunday Silence, Smarty Jones, Curlin, etc....
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KamaAina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 07:53 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. You forgot Risen Star
Louisiana's own, who got jobbed in the Derby and then fruitlessly won the other two. :eyes:
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Awsi Dooger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. The lack of a freak horse is genuinely ridiculous
Triple Crown winners are revealed as 2 year olds. It's surreal no one has surfaced along those lines in so long. In the '70s it was a regular occurrence, more of a surprise if it didn't happen. Besides the three Triple Crown winners there were early superstars like Hoist the Flag, Honest Pleasure and, of course, Spectacular Bid.
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TZ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. I think that inbreeding is taking a toll on thoroughbreds
Many take longer to mature. Many are much more physically fragile and can't keep up the physical stress of an early campaign.
I've read that historically it wasn't unusual for thoroughbreds to race several races in a couple of days even. Now, horses won't race more than 2 times a month max..except for the triple crown. I think because of the way horses are now bred and trained, the short turn around between races make it difficult for any horse to win all three. Thats my take on it. Also notice how those horses that do well in the races tend to tail off or become injured later in the year. Curlin is one of the few horses I can remember that got better after the TC series.
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LWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 03:15 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. Inbreeding might have something to do with it;
more likely, it's breeding for single traits (speed) and allowing weaknesses to develop (lighter bone, for example.) The ubiquitous use of lasix, bute, and other medications may also play a part, allowing weaker horses that might not have done well without to achieve and be added to the gene pool.

That, and the simple fact that it costs money to care for horses. In the case of the racing industry, time = money, and therefore horses are started years before they should be, and conditioned too quickly to develop bone strength; all a matter of $$$.

All horses, regardless of breed, mature skeletally at the same rate; they are fully mature, with all cartilage fused into bone, at about 6 years old. It's no wonder so many break down, raced as youngsters. The breed would be stronger, and sounder, and more able to go the distance, if the athletes were allowed to fully mature before racing. Spending a couple of years racing as a youngster, not fully developed, and being sent to the breeding barn does not result in the strongest and best being saved for breeding; just the most precocious or luckiest.

Speaking of lucky, Lookin' At Lucky isn't even three yet. He is technically 3, since all TBs age on January 1st. His real bday, though, isn't until May 27th. He's run all of his races as a 2yo.

There were 3 triple crown winners in the 70s, after a 3-decade drought. Then another long drought. It's probable that breeding for increased speed has added muscle mass and and speed that equine skeletons are simply not designed to handle. There may never be another triple crown winner; if there is, it will be because of the x-factor, an unusually sturdy horse, legal drugs, and a larger than fair share of luck.
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Kingofalldems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 05:45 PM
Response to Original message
4. Alydar a great sire also
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Awsi Dooger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-15-10 11:10 PM
Response to Original message
6. I'll give you Alydar, but not Sham
Alydar was a terrific horse who won countless Grade 1 races and nearly a million dollars. Sham won a single Grade 1 race, only 5 of 13 starts, and barely $200,000.

Sham's level is absurdly overstated based on two losing races. You never want to apply too much credit for losing. It's conveniently forgotten that Sham lost the Wood Memorial to Angle Light without excuse. Secretariat ran dull that day, not at his best. Sham lacked a reason. Actually his excuse was very simple; he wasn't a great horse and horses who win less than half the time are birthrighted to fail when too much is expected of them.

Horses of Sham's caliber blow the Belmont all the time, when they happen to receive favorable conditions during the first two legs. 1973 would have been no different. The field would have been substantially larger, for one thing.

Secretariat's greatness does not depend on Sham. The theme is repeated constantly on the internet and in sports discussions in general, Secretariat's biggest boosters overrating Sham. I was glad to find many specialized racing forums like Thoroughbred Champions.com where the sharpest posters designate Sham in the overrated category, not underrated.

Everyone gobbles up the time of that 1973 Derby as if it verifies Sham's greatness. Meanwhile, track promoters have known for decades that you set up world record attempts by staging a rabbit, or multiple rabbits, on an already rapid surface. They've done it most notably in the 800 and 1500 (or mile). In horse racing it often happens accidentally, or by the sheer makeup of the race. Shecky Greene set torrid fractions for 7 furlongs in 1973 on an extremely fast track. That enabled Sham to pick up the pieces entering the stretch before Secretariat gradually passed him. Under different conditions, like the race Angle Light stole in the Wood, there would have been no Derby record and Sham's reputation properly would be lower.

Let's put it this way, Sham wasn't even considered the best horse in California prior to the Derby. Linda' Chief thumped him once and was a 1-2 favorite in the Santa Anita Derby, the one Grade 1 victory on Sham's resume. Every Triple Crown winner in the 1970s was a legend as a 2 year old. The late bloomers who show up in March inevitably flop when they're touted for the Triple Crown.

Alydar was excellent as a 2 year old, defeating Affirmed in 2 of 6 meetings. I have confidence Alydar would have won the Triple Crown if Affirmed had been sidelined, but it wasn't a cinch. Late runners like Alydar are up against it. He barely got second in the Derby with a late rush.
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Faygo Kid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. Well stated.
Wow, you know your stuff. Thanks.
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two gun sid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 10:51 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. Well said, Awsi....
look, I liked Sham and thought he was gonna catch Secretariat in one of those TC races but, I never thought he would have been a TC winner without Secretariat in his foal crop. Sham was good and tried like hell but he was all used up in the Preakness. His best shot would have been he Derby. I still think that he would have won the Wood if Pancho hadn't told Pincay to wait for Secretariat and let Angle Light go.

Sham peaked at the right time, Pancho liked to talk his horse up and the media made him into more than he was. He was a very nice horse who tried hard and he did well against Secretariat in a couple of races. Yep, overrated. But, then again, so was Secretariat.
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Earth Bound Misfit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-16-10 01:12 PM
Response to Original message
11. Sham wasn't even the best horse (other than Secretariat) in that 3 yr old crop...
People often overlook the fact that the great Forego ran 4th in Secretariat's Derby.

http://www.thoroughbredchampions.com/biographies/forego.htm
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