Ky Derby Trail: Is Pyro Really Too Slow?

[two gun sid]

From The Bloodhorse:
Despite being ranked No. 1 or 2 on just about every Derby poll, Pyro, for some reason, has been branded by many a slow horse and simply the best of a bad lot. Yes, the pace in his two starts this year has been slow, and his final times have not exactly set the Fair Grounds teletimer aflame, but is this horse really as slow as many of the experts say he is?

His Beyer numbers have been called “modest.” His speed figures have been termed “slow.” One line in a column referred to “Pyro’s two slow victories at Fair Grounds.” One pollster, who had him ranked No. 1 all year, dropped him to No. 2 in a week in which he didn’t even run, nor did the horse who replaced him atop the list. The pollster, upon second thought, had felt that perhaps the colt’s accomplishments were an “illusion,” and pointed out that he was a faster horse last year.

The odd part is that Pyro was 1-for-4 last year, losing three times to War Pass, and is 2-for-2 this year, winning both his starts by daylight.

On the Beyers, Pyro ran a 105 in the Bessemer Trust Breeders’ Cup Juvenile (gr. I), a number that is only a few points below many Derby-winning figures. This year, he is slowly heading back to that number, running a 90 and a 95. Many people feel that 95 is still too low for a top Derby contender, and while that may be true on Derby Day, Pyro has shown he can run much faster, and no other 3-year-old has run higher than a 99 in two-turn stakes competition this year. So if Pyro’s Beyers are slow, whose are fast? Sierra Sunset (99), who is off the Derby trail, Cool Coal Man (98), Visionaire (98), Elysium Fields (97), Denis of Cork (96), and Nikki’sgoldensteed (96) are not exactly tearing up the track, and none of these have a triple-digit Beyer to fall back on, as Pyro does. Who wants their horse to tear up the track in February and March anyway?

http://tcm.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=44221

[aaronbees]

1. Off topic: Rags to Riches retired

This news sure bites. I'll never forget that Belmont Stakes.

Link: http://news.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=44213

Rags to Riches Retired

Date Posted: March 24, 2008
Last Updated: March 24, 2008

(Edited press release)

It was announced March 24 that 2007 Belmont Stakes (gr. I) winner and 2007 champion 3-year-old filly Rags to Riches has been retired from racing and will head to Ashford Stud where she will be bred to champion sire Giant's Causeway.

In 2007, Rags to Riches made history when she became only the third filly to win the Belmont Stakes, and the first to do so in 102 years. Rags to Riches outdueled eventual 2007 Horse of the Year Curlin in a breathtaking stretch run to capture the third leg of the Triple Crown. She had five wins from six starts in 2007 and amassed career earnings of $1,340,028. In January, she was honored with the Eclipse Award for outstanding 3-year-old filly of 2007.

Rags to Riches was sidelined last September after suffering a hairline fracture to her right front pastern during the running of the Gazelle Stakes (gr. I) at Belmont Park. She returned to Eclipse Award-winning trainer Todd Pletcher's barn at Palm Beach Downs earlier this year where she resumed training.

"She has re-injured her right front pastern, and because of the timing, the decision was made to retire her as opposed to trying to bring her back in the fall," said Pletcher from Palm Beach Downs. "It's a sad day for racing and all of her fans. She will go down in the history books as one of the best fillies ever to run. With the tremendous family that she comes from, she should make a terrific broodmare. We are excited for her and the prospects that lie ahead."

(rest of the story at the link above)

[aaronbees]

2. On topic: Pyro's got the talent

I'd forgotten he ran a 105 speed figure in the BC Juvie last year. Pretty good analysis from Haskin, especially looking for patterns and the comparison to Street Sense's prep under Nafzger. Though I think the slow figures are perhaps a concern, Pyro has always looked well within himself at the end of thes two Fair Grounds races. And isn't the Fair Grounds a bit deeper and slower than some other tracks? I could be wrong on that. The Blue Grass Stakes won't tell us much about his speed since it's run on synthetic. The Denis of Cork changes in midstream seem mystifying to me; he doesn't have the foundation to be messing around with a light schedule like that. I hope I'm mistaken, though. Barbaro rewrote the books a couple years ago, and Cork could do the same.

I really like Numaany ... a lot.

[jakefrep]

3. Like the CIA guy said in "Charlie Wilson's War" - We'll See

Pyro will likely improve, and the jury's out on War Pass at the moment. But I think we were spoiled a bit by last year's stellar crop of 3-year-olds. It's going to be hard for any of this year's horses to stand out in comparison.

[Justpat]

4. I don't know if he is too slow,

or if everyone else is going backward or treading water from where they were
as two year olds.

Pyro seems to be going forward.

And I agree that the FG track is not lightening fast. I think Asmussen is bringing this
horse to form this spring in an intelligent fashion.

[aaronbees]

5. Florida Derby on Saturday

Intriguing race with lots of mystery and possibility with these unproven colts. My tri in order: Tomcito, Elysium Fields, Big Brown.

http://tcm.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=44251

$1,000,000 Florida Derby (gr. I, Race 10, 5:45 p.m.), 3-year-olds, 1 1/8 Miles
PP. Horse, Weight, Jockey
1. Fierce Wind, 122, Cornelio H. Velasquez
2. Smooth Air, 122, Manoel R. Cruz
3. Da' Tara, 122, Joe Bravo
4. Tomcito, 122, Jorge F. Chavez
5. Cool Gator 122, Eddie Castro
6. Nistle's Crunch, 122, Julien R. Leparoux
7. B B Frank, 122, Javier Castellano
8. Elysium Fields, 122, Eibar Coa
9. Hey Byrn, 122, Jose Lezcano
10. Majestic Warrior, 122, Rene R. Douglas
11. Face the Cat, 122, John R. Velazquez
12. Big Brown, 122, Kent J. Desormeaux

Anyone else going to be watching the Dubai races in the morning?

[Justpat]

6. Curlin won the 6 million Grade I World Cup.

He won by a few lengths. Asiatic Boy second.

Curlin was magnificent.

[aaronbees]

13. He looked like a true world beater

He's really a beautiful horse and has grown so much since I saw him in the Rebel.



That said, I'm hoping Grasshopper gets a chance to beat him this year. :P

[Justpat]

7. Big Brown!!

In a romp and in good time too. 1:48.1 for mile and an eighth.


Wow. Don't know what else to say.

[two gun sid]

8. Holy Smokes!!!

That is the guy that is gonna win the Derby. Jesus, he is so much better than anyone else out there and he is just a kid. He doesn't even know how to race yet. He's just gonna get better.

He's my Derby horse now.

[Justpat]

9. The rest of the field looked like drunken sailors in the stretch.

Wow, that was so impressive.

[aaronbees]

10. Incredible race

Pretty speechless after that. Broke from the 12 and got the lead pretty effortlessly.

I liked how Tomcito ran too! (Up for third ... new country, long layoff ... encouraging.) I hope he has enough winnings to get to the Derby.

[Justpat]

11. We had Tomcito's half sister in the barn last year.

She couldn't outrun me.

[two gun sid]

14. LOL!!! I 've got a couple of horses that can't outrun me too!!!

OB, Big Brown is exciting. I'm really impressed by him.

[Justpat]

18. Me too.

Usually when they go out there a half in 45 and six furlongs in ten and change, they
don't go on and finish like that. He just kept running.

I wish I could have seen a shot of how he galloped out.

[two gun sid]

20. I just checked the chart...

every horse that tried to go with BB early ended up way back at the finish. He destroyed the Florida Derby field.

[aaronbees]

15. LOL, really?

Tomcito was so insanely far back I thought it was a lost race for him. I like his pluck to get up for third.

[Justpat]

19. Yes, she was a slab sided dummy

and not much desire to be a racehorse.

Her owner took her and sent her to Turfway where she was claimed
for about 15,000. She is now a half sister to a Grade I
stakes placed horse and her value is way more what she was a racehorse.

[two gun sid]

12. Tomcito finished well...

he deserves a spot in the Derby but I don't know if he's gonna have enough money on his card.

[aaronbees]

16. I fear you're right....

but I hope he gets a chance. Maybe the Belmont Stakes? I think he'd like 1 1/2 miles.

Big Brown ... wow! Good Derby horse to have, man! Looks now like War Pass has some company up front on the lead now, and what company it is. As impressed as I am by BB, I can see these two burning each other up. Big Brown's coming out party today sure adds more intrigue to the mix.

[GOPisEvil]

17. One word: WOW.

That might be the easiest 1:48.1 I've seen in a long time. Kent Desormeaux didn't even think it was that fast. However, in a Derby field with a lot of speed, he may not be able to keep that pace. So, don't count Pyro out yet.

[bread_and_roses]

21. I'll add my wow!

I hadn't been paying much attention this year yet. I have to see the horses run - at least on the TV - to really get into it, and this was the first race televised for us. Anyway, that was spectacular! Handsome fellow, too, he looked to be - I like big horses.

Good to see everyone here!

[Justpat]

22. Hey Kenzee13,

good to see you back!


I wasn't too interested in the Derby goings on until just recently.
I thought BB was awesome and Pyro is looking better and better with
every start.

[Awsi Dooger]

23. Outstanding horse, pathetic name

Big Brown? Are you kidding? Reminds me of the ridiculous commercials that somehow make it past every level of scrutiny without anyone summoning a dash of necessary clarity, pulling the plug and starting over.

Last night I was marveling at his 3 races on YouTube and wondering how in hell Big Brown got stuck with a user name like that. More than two decades ago I remember the great Jim Murray in the LA Times writing that great horses inevitably have terrific names, that "Tulip Lips never wins the Derby." I hope someone from the Times retrieves that column and reprints it. Otherwise, Jim Murray may be pounding his confines in posthumous disgust.

I memorized every Derby winner's name in high school and have added to the list each year, reciting the names in chronological order as soon as the new hero is revealed. As much as I admire awesome ability like Big Brown has displayed, and his emergence makes the Derby exponentially more interesting, I concede the blase name alone may cause me to root against him.

This morning I was pleasantly surprised when Miami Herald racing writer Gary Long adopted the same angle in his recap of the Florida Derby:

http://www.miamiherald.com/624/story/475822.html

"A colt bearing a numbingly unimaginative name left nothing at all to the imagination Saturday in a breathtaking romp to victory in Gulfstream Park's 58th Florida Derby.

Big Brown?

Doesn't evoke lyrical sound waves like Barbaro and Monarchos and Thunder Gulch and Unbridled and Spectacular Bid, does it."

[Justpat]

24. It sounds like a roast beef entree at an early bird special. n/t

[Awsi Dooger]

26. He's probably got some fans at UPS

Potential ad campaign if he becomes a star, with the, "What can Brown do for you?"

BTW, lots of racing insiders here. Do you guys have any influence on picking names? Is it solely the owners or do trainers and other handlers ever submit names, ones they like or that have personal significance? I've always wondered if much thought goes into it, or just something to get out of the way.

The example I always remember is Meyerhoff was a bridge player and submitted names with a bridge connection. Supposedly the first choice was Three No Trump but that was rejected, for whatever reason, and hence Spectacular Bid.

[Justpat]

28. It is strictly the owners who name the foals. n/t

[two gun sid]

29. Breeders name them in the Standardbred business...

and a lot goes into naming the foals. I have taken suggestions from trainers, friends, family, etc.

I try (and don't always succeed) to make the name have some personal significance. I named a colt after my business partner's dad because Lloyd was just a gigantic fan of harness racing. Sadly, Lloyd passed away 2 weeks ago and never got to see his namesake make a start. I also have a mare whose sire was a great racehorse but never made it as a stud. I always give her foals a name that has 'Nite' or 'Lite' in it in honor of her daddy just to keep his name in the pedigree. I really respected that old guy.

Mostly I suck at naming horses but I do put a lot of effort into it.

[Awsi Dooger]

30. Thanks for the input

It's interesting there's difference between thoroughbred and standardbred norms.

I like one word titles, with emphatic meaning. Something like Affirmed. I'm amazed there are so many ridiculous multi pronged names instead of scouring the dictionary, or simply borrowing from real life, and summoning somewhat obscure but very impressive words.

Actually, I think I would suck at naming horses also. I distinctly remember my freshman year in college, which was in the Seattle Slew era after he retired and was at stud. In one boring class I started scribbling potential names for Slew offspring, to the amusement of the brunette coed next to me. I even remember the one she laughed out loud about, briefly disrupting the class. It was my Flintstones-based submission, "Yabba Dabba Slew." :rofl:

[jakefrep]

31. There was a harness breeder noted for his creativity in naming horses

whose preferred method for selecting names involved a pitcher of martinis and a thesaurus.

[two gun sid]

32. He had it about right, jake....

how do you guys name yours?

[jakefrep]

33. Our "foundation mare" was named Credit Card Katie...

...all we have to do is look in the mailbox for inspiration. Katie's Gold Card, I'm Maxxed Out, Platinum Plus, Discover Gold, Theonlycardyouneed, etc.

There was quite a story behind Credit Card Katie. The breeder was quite a swinger in his bachelor days. He was out one night at the local bar, where he met up with a lady. They had a few drinks, danced, and got to feeling quite amorous and decided to get a hotel room. Our friend the breeder was sweating bullets at this point because he didn't have enough cash on him. The lady, named Katie, flipped out her credit card and paid for the whole thing.

While we were racing Credit Card Katie, our trainer had her at Maywood Park. Our trainer's mom was named Katie. Someone asked out trainer if the horse was named for his mom. Trainer said "If you knew the story, you'd know it wasn't my mom."

[aaronbees]

34. Such a great story .... eom

[Awsi Dooger]

40. Yes, great story! n/t

[aaronbees]

35. Latest Haskin report: "Hot Brown on Derby Menu"

http://tcm.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=44339

[chelsea0011]

27. Big favorite now. Looked like the real deal.

[aaronbees]

25. Georgie Boy Off Derby Trail

Santa Anita | Posted 3/31/2008, 8:16 pm
Georgie Boy off Derby trail with pulled muscle
By BRAD FREE

ARCADIA, Calif. – Georgie Boy is out of the Santa Anita Derby and off the Kentucky Derby trail with a pulled muscle in his back.

Trainer Kathy Walsh announced Monday afternoon that Georgie Boy would be sidelined indefinitely. Walsh and owner George Schwary were scheduled to meet Tuesday at Hollywood Park to discuss Georgie Boy’s recovery process.

Walsh told the Santa Anita publicity department that Georgie Boy came out of a six-furlong workout Saturday at Hollywood Park with a pulled muscle.

“It’s high on his back end and we don’t know how long it will take, but we’re not going to take a chance,” Walsh said. She said Georgie Boy would not require surgery.

“I don’t know how long he’ll be out, but Mr. Schwary is very patient, and we’ll give the horse all the time he needs and let him tell us when to come back. Maybe we’ll see him in the Pacific Classic,” Walsh said.

http://www.drf.com/news/article/93352.html

[two gun sid]

36. Lasix also one of the drugs that has no place in the game

From ESPN.com:
While horse racing is making very slow but somewhat steady progress in its fight to rid itself of scourges like steroids and a number of illegal drugs, it shouldn't continue to ignore another drug that has no place in the game. It's time for Lasix to go.

Anyone who still thinks Lasix is necessary would have a hard time explaining the results of the Dubai World Cup Day races. Fifteen U.S.-based horses competed and, of course, all 15 used Lasix when running in North America. The United Arab Emirates, like every other country in the world not named the United States, does not allow horses to compete on that or any other drug. But our drug dependent thoroughbreds did just fine without their fixes.

Including Curlin, who was brilliant when winning the Dubai World Cup, three American horses won on the six-race card. Plus, Idiot Proof was second in the Golden Shaheen and Well Armed was third in the Dubai World Cup. It doesn't seem that any of our horses were put at a disadvantage because they didn't have their supposed anti-bleeding drug. Apparently, neither were any of the 68 non-American horses who ran that day at Nad al Sheba Racecourse.

Not that this was a surprise. Since the inception of the Dubai World Cup in 1996, dozens of U.S. horses have gone to Dubai, run drug free and done just fine.

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/horse/columns/story?columnist=finley_bill&id=3324301

[two gun sid]

37. Who are the 20?

From DRF:
Who'll make the Derby cut?

By JAY PRIVMAN

When someone tells you it's not about the money, rest assured, it's about the money. Cash is king, especially when it comes to the Kentucky Derby, because if you've got cash, you're a smash.

Despite the overpowering victory by Big Brown in the Florida Derby on Saturday, and the continued excellence of Pyro this spring, it appears inevitable that more than 20 horses will be entered in the May 3 Kentucky Derby at Churchill Downs. With the Derby just a month away, the list of prospective runners in the Derby still numbers more than 40.

If more than 20 horses enter the Derby, the field is determined by earnings in graded stakes races. And with precious few opportunities remaining to earn graded money before the Derby, there are several prominent horses sitting in precarious positions.

Going into last weekend, Big Brown was the most notable in that shaky spot. He had not earned a dollar in graded stakes money in his first two starts, so the Florida Derby was a make-or-break race for him. He broke the bank. The $600,000 he earned for his dazzling victory - in which Big Brown got a Beyer Speed Figure of 106 - is more than enough to be in the field.

[Justpat]

38. I wish to add a few thoughts on my remarks further up thread

concerning the half sister to Tomcito.

They were the unkind, thoughtless type of remarks that have driven me from every race
horse racing board I ever visited.

Because we were not able to get the best out of the filly does not mean that she
was a dummy. IT means that we did not do our job.

The man who bred and raised Tomcito is the man who also raised Street Sense. He is
solely responsible for me being in the horse business and I am saddened beyond
words that I made hurtful comments toward him and his horse.

In the small world of the internet, my remarks were sent to him, I guess by someone
who noticed them here. It is a painful reminder to me to strive to think about
my words before I let them fly.

Sorry to post a personal note here but I felt I needed to do it.
Thanks. OB

[aaronbees]

39. That's big of you, OB

Takes some guts to personally apologize on a message board like that. But truthfully I'm not sure what was so untoward or thoughtless about your remarks; I understand, though, that there's a personal connection there that's important to you and you cherish it. I took your comment to simply be a colorful way to say she ran slow, and I didn't sense any designation of blame or nastiness from you. At least that's the way I see it. I'm surprised other folks in the horse racing world would find this little barn of horse chatter and debate here.

I didn't know that about the Tomcito/Street Sense connection ... makes me want to root for him even more (probably in the Belmont).

:hug:

[Justpat]

41. I have never been know for being a tactful person.

I was saddened that I hurt my friend.

The man who owns Chesapeake farm has foaled and raised Street Sense and bred and raised
Tomcito. So if Tomcito wins the Derby, that is two years in a row that products of his
way of doing things have grabbed the gold ring.


Thanks for your thoughts.

:pals: