Brett Favre is teh Greatest QB of ALL TIME. Discuss.

[MrPerson]

[madinmaryland]

1. Great, but not the greatest. nt

[MrPerson]

2. Better than the Great Gary Hogeboom.

[madinmaryland]

3. no s***, sherlock!

[MrPerson]

4. Well than who do you say is greater?

[Upton]

5. Joe Montana for one

[MrPerson]

6. System QB. Nothing more.

[Upton]

8. The numbers speak for themselves

Super Bowl wins

Montana-4

Favre-1

Career QB Rating

Montana-92.3

Favre-85.4


Favre does lead in one category...the most career interceptions in the history of pro football.

[MrPerson]

11. West Coast Offense. Great Coach.

[PVnRT]

39. So, was Holmgren an idiot, then?

Guess who Holmgren learned his offense from?

All great quarterbacks had great coaches. Stupid argument, but this is to be expected from you when it comes to your hero-worship of Favre.

[MrPerson]

42. Holmgren was no Walsh.

The Steelers proved that.

[CreekDog]

57. system qb with 3 100+ rating seasons

with 2.6% career interception rate (better than Elway and Favre)

Favre's best year he had a 99.5 rating
Elway's best year he had a 93 rating

Montana was far better than both of them. Fewer mistakes.

[MrPerson]

60. Dink Passing = Not Real Passing

[nomorenomore08]

73. Career average per completion: Montana = 11.9, Favre = 11.4

So by your definition, Favre was more of a "dink" passer than Montana. Just saying... :shrug:

[Forkboy]

77. The dink pass pretty much came to prominence in the West Coast offense Montana led.

And laugh all you want, those "dink" passes keep drives alive and win more games than long bombs do. To say it's not "real" passing (whatever that is) is silly. Tell it to the stats books under "passing yards".

[ProfessorGAC]

66. No Such Thing

Not in the NFL. This isn't high school football. Calling anyone in the NFL a product of the system is just silly.
GAC

[MrPerson]

68. The first 25 plays are scripted. Its a system.

[ProfessorGAC]

69. Duh!

GAC

[MrPerson]

70. For a perfesser you sure are brief.

[ProfessorGAC]

71. You're Obviously Not Interested In Discussion

So, why should i bother?

Anybody who says Montana is merely the product of a system hasn't even bothered to watch what goes on in an NFL game.
GAC

[MrPerson]

72. It has been said about him now for decades.

[madinmaryland]

7. Well, I would say there are a few:

Joe Montana
Troy Aikman
John Elway
Dan Marino
Terry Bradshaw

Aikman and Montana, though had great teams around them.

[MrPerson]

9. My answer to that

Elway had talent but only won a SB when he had Terrell Davis.
Dan Marino couldn't win the big one.
Terry Bradshaw was mediocre. Only won a SB because of D
Aikman had Emmitt Smith.

Who did Favre have? He did it mostly on his own.

[MrPerson]

10. Go ahead. Unitas me.

[madinmaryland]

12. During their run in the mid-90's, they had a great defense, which made

it much easier for Favre. A great defense can shorten the field for the offense, making it look better.

[MrPerson]

14. Didn't even bring up teh pics.

[Upton]

15. When Favre had the chance he often didn't perform

only one SB win in 2 tries and 2 NFC Championship wins in 4 tries. His interception in OT in the 2007 NFC Championship game will live in infamy....a QB worthy of the designation "the greatest of all time" doesn't make mistakes like that

[MrPerson]

18. He made his teammates better. Only Unitas did that before.

[fishwax]

64. only Unitas made his teammates better?

:shrug:

[PVnRT]

33. Starr, Bradshaw, Graham, Montana, Baugh, Unitas

[MrPerson]

13. Montana is behind Elway, Marino and Unitas.

[Upton]

17. Marino has no Super Bowl wins

and only 1 appearance.....he cannot be considered anything other that a stats QB.

[MrPerson]

19. He had that quick release. That was pure gold.

[MrPerson]

20. Near Greats....

Tarkenton, Stabler, Fouts, Staubach, Starr, Graham, Van Brocklin, Layne, Luckman, Baugh.

[Upton]

21. So?

I want to see some big time wins...not a quick release

[MrPerson]

22. He never had the supporting cast. Just the talent.

[MrPerson]

23. Montana did not have a particularly good arm either.

[PVnRT]

34. Dan Marino = Dan Fouts

System quarterbacks in pass-happy systems who couldn't win the big game.

[Captain Hilts]

38. ESPN's "Sportsreporters" ALL agreed Jurgensen would eat Montana for lunch.

And not even belch afterwords.

[MrPerson]

41. No way. Jurgensen drank his lunch.

[Captain Hilts]

46. Okay, so he did. Your point?

Note the Schlitz cap. He was fined for this one:

[MrPerson]

50. Teams would jump offside when he belched.

[MrPerson]

16. And passer rating was made obsolete by the WCO.

Dink passing doesn't make you great.

[Forkboy]

24. I actually think Marino is the best ever.

I like Favre (or I should say, I like the way he plays). He's an old school type guy who could play at any time, and in that regard I'd place him ahead of Montana, who I think would have been creamed if he had played anytime before 1980.

I always thought Elway and Marino were the best I saw, and had Marino won a single Super Bowl he'd have to be seriously considered (he should be anyways). But, that's the breaks, and you're measured by winning the big game, regardless of surrounding talent. Not always fair, but there ya go. :)

One criticism of Favre that isn't as bad as people think is Favre's interception rate. Compare the touchdown to interception ratio of many Hall of Famers and Favre's is as good, if not better than many of the greats.

Favre - 448 - 291
Marino - 420 -252
Montana - 272 - 139
Young - 232 - 107
Starr - 152 - 132
Staubach - 153 - 109
Bradshaw 212 -210
Kelly - 237 - 175
Namath - 173 - 220
Unitas - 290 - 253
Elway - 300 - 226

[Dinger]

25. I'm A Favre Lover, But I Agree With You

Marino is the best ever.

[cboy4]

75. He's not better than this guy

:eyes:

[PVnRT]

43. Comparing volume stats from different eras is difficult

The guys in the 60's and 70's had to contend with the equivalent of anarchy when it came to pass defenses. The first four names on your list are post-1978; this is not a coincidence.

[Captain Hilts]

48. They're just not at all relevant. The rules are so different now, to gin up offense and TV ratings.

[MrPerson]

55. And then there's the dink passing.

[MrPerson]

56. Third and ten. Throw to a guy behind the sticks.

[Forkboy]

78. It is, but we do it all the time in every sport.

That's half the fun of the debate. :)

I have to admit, I still judge players based on the players I loved from the 60's and 70's. If we're talking defense I measure them against Butkus. If it's QB's I measure them against Joe Kapp. Ok, I kid, it's not Kapp (but he does have one of the funniest segments on NFL Films). QB's like Unitas, Staubach, Bradshaw. Running backs I compare to Sayers and Payton (can you tell I watched a lot of Bears games?). That was a pretty rough and tumble era. :)

[BOSSHOG]

26. Give me Sammy Baugh

[Captain Hilts]

28. He completely changed the game, didn't he? nt

[MrPerson]

30. Best punter ever.

[Captain Hilts]

31. Smart ass! Go wash your mouth out with soap, right NOW! And your hands. nt

[BOSSHOG]

35. Imagine

baugh's passing talents with today's receivers.

[Captain Hilts]

37. And today's no-bump rules? Hell, Roman Gabriel would drool at the new rules and receivers!

[BOSSHOG]

40. Gabriel looked good in Eagle Green

[Captain Hilts]

27. Not even close. I'll go with Lombardi's choice...

[MrPerson]

29. He could barely get the ball past his waistline.

[Captain Hilts]

32. You don't throw with your waistline. nt

[PVnRT]

36. He's not even the best Packer quarterback

Put Bart Starr on any team today, in his physical prime, and he would make Manning look like a scout team player.

[MrPerson]

44. No. 2 was Sid Luckman.

[Captain Hilts]

45. HEY, Sid was the last good quarterback Chicago has had. nt

[MrPerson]

47. Jim McMahon?

[Captain Hilts]

49. Two good years. Luckman, several. nt

[MrPerson]

51. Luckman owned the 40's

[Captain Hilts]

52. Who was quarterback of Chicago's 73-0 pasting of the 'Skins? nt

[MrPerson]

54. Luckman

[MrPerson]

53. Luckman turned down 25K to jump leagues

[ProfessorGAC]

58. Nope. Discussion Over

Sorry, but i don't think he's even in the top 5. Superb, yes. A winner, yes. Not in my top 5.

Montana
Unitas
Bradshaw
Kelly
Elway

That's what i think, anyway.
GAC

[MrPerson]

62. Montana and Bradshaw don't belong on that list.

Bradshaw - Beneficiary of Steel Curtain D

Montana - Beneficiary of D's not solving the WCO.

[ProfessorGAC]

65. Wrong and Wrong

So there.
GAC

[MrPerson]

67. link, pleeze?

[PVnRT]

79. You first

[Captain Hilts]

102. Agree. Great for their eras. But didn't call their own plays. nt

[hughee99]

59. You have quickly learned how to stir the pot here...

And without even bringing up Bonds. Nice work. :)

[MrPerson]

61. I listen to ESPN radio 24/7

Whe I'm not watching ESPN News.

[PVnRT]

80. That explains a lot

[MrPerson]

85. I refuse to listen to Fox Sports.

[PVnRT]

92. I was referring more to your complete ignorance of football

[MrPerson]

93. I know more than you do.

You just came on and made blanket statements.

None of which make any sense.

Favre had the most TD's yards, wins...

Get some manners, son.

[PVnRT]

101. Yes, you're very good at parroting numbers

That doesn't mean you know anything.

Go ahead and alert on my posts. I'll be happy to alert on the trollbaiting you do around here.

[MrPerson]

95. This goes for you too. Lose the insults.

You know nothing about who I am.

Stick to the issue and stop the personal attacks or I'll alert on your posts.

[cboy4]

97. Oh Christ Almighty

[cboy4]

98. Yup it sure does.

:eyes:

[MrPerson]

99. Nice Ad Hominem attack. Attack the argument, please.

[cboy4]

100. No, I prefer to attack the fact that people who listen to

ESPN radio 24/7 are usually know it alls.

That was the point of the OP, and I stand by my comment.

It's an Ad Hominem attack in your head because you don't like being criticized.

[MrPerson]

63. BTW - I'm a Steeler Fan.

So if I was regionally biased I'd like Marino, Montana Unitas, Kelly and Bradshaw.

[MrSlayer]

74. Christ. No way.

Not even close. Favre might be in the top 15-20 but no way is he the best ever. This is just flat out insane.

[MrPerson]

84. way.

[MrSlayer]

91. It's a ridiculous premise.

Utterly ridiculous. Favre might be the most overrated player ever.

[MrPerson]

94. Most TDpasses, Most wins, Most Yards.

Hardly ridiculous.

U need links if you want me to continue to tolerate this abuse.

Otherwise I'll have to ignore you.

[MrSlayer]

96. Yeah because he played 1,000 years.

How about his interceptions, particularly in the playoffs, his run of the mill QB rating 85.4, the fact that he won a single championship mostly due to his defense and special teams and was owned in his second SB by one of the QBs that is far ahead of him on the all-time list? He flat out sucked for a number of his years, making boneheaded play after boneheaded play. Favre was/is (you never know with him) a gamer with great heart and a golden horseshoe up his ass but he is not the best QB ever. It's just ridiculous to suggest this.


And yes, I'm just playing along.

[Jack Rabbit]

103. I didn't know Christ was a quarterback.

Who did he play for?

[cboy4]

76. I can't believe this is even an argument

[MrPerson]

86. This is getting hit on the head lessons.

[Jack Rabbit]

81. Montana was the greatest quarterback

Dink passes? If we exclude those, we are left with Doug Williams.

System quarterback? No one could make something as of as many busted plays as Montana did if all he was was a system quarterback.

Supporting cast? Would Mr. Person think of taking away points from Johnny Unitas because he had Lenny Moore or Raymond Berry at the other end of a pass?

[sniffa]

82. Oasis is better

[MrPerson]

83. Oasis never played QB, you silly person

Brett Favre - now there's a QB.

[madinmaryland]

87. Was Favre the one who

peed off the deck??

[MrPerson]

88. He peed on my rug. It tied the room together. The rug not teh pee.

[madinmaryland]

89. You're bald? That's just digusting!

:puke:

Did you kick his ass for doing that to you?

[MrPerson]

90. Lebowski reference, dood.

You need to get around more.