I was sitting in Starbucks

[Powdered Toast Man]

I thought it was a relatively safe place. I go there often to work and have never had any issues with anyone.

Then they sat down; three young ladies, probably a few years younger than myself. They were speaking about the bible. One of them was a minister of sorts and the other two were studying.

Normally I have my earbuds in, but today I forgot them.

They began talking about this and that in the bible. I was pretty much ignoring them.

After a few minutes the discussion turned to Homosexuality and how the bible looked at it.

My ears perked up.

I was expecting to hear them say how the bible was wrong. Instead, the three of them began talking about how the bible was right about that, but wrong about African Americans and Women because... well... that was where they lost me. They were trying to find a rationalization to explain how the bible could be right in being bigoted against gays, but it was totally unacceptable for women and African Americans.

I sat there getting more and more furious.

They moved onto another topic. I didn't care. Normally, I would have gone off on them. Normally, I would have interrupted and listed off at least 10 different examples of bull shit arguments in the bible and how they were truly ignorant for believing that it is anything more than a bunch of stories. It is not to be taken literal.

Ordinarily I would have done just that.

But for some reason... today... I just didn't have it in me.

Today, more than anything, more than it angered me, today it just hurt too much.

[gateley]

1. ...

:hug:

[Skittles]

2. OK

they're studying the Bible in a STARBUCKS? That's enough right there to destroy any credibility they think they have. Don't give homophobic sanctimonious pieces of SHIT like that the power to change your mood.

[murray hill farm]

7. Well said!

Do not give them that power!!!!!

[Powdered Toast Man]

16. What I wanted to do...

Was grab my partner and plant a big one on him and say, hey hun, let's go to church. But... I don't think he would have appreciated that too much; not big on PDAs.

[saracat]

21. I understand.And with those sort, it would not have helped.

I would have been tempted to talk loudly about freedom FROM religion and being forced to be subjected to the bigotry of others.

[sui generis]

27. yee haw!

skittles and I agree on something . . . :P

[CaliforniaPeggy]

3. I am so sorry...

:hug:

[MindandSoul]

4. I understand, and I'm so sorry! It is stupid and unfair . . .and NOT Godly!

[DesertFlower]

5. i'm really sorry you had to hear that bullshit. nt

[jtuck004]

6. There are those of us that appreciate you. Keep your head up.

[Still Blue in PDX]

8. As my very wise father told me time and again, "People are stupid."

As someone who used to think that truth could be found in interpreting a Bible literally, I apologize.

:hug:

[FreeState]

9. I found it odd that they are in a business on the Sabbath talking about others sins

"Six days shah thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God; in it thou shalt not do any work..." (Exodus 20:10).

"...thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates. "


Guess it doesn't matter to them that the people in Starbucks are breaking one of the 10 commandments because of they are making someone else work.

[Divine Discontent]

14. good catch.

thank you for pointing that one out. If they wanna get all Torah on folks, they better look at the plank in their own eyes before they go and confuse texts and make excuses about the ones for females and blacks.

I wrote a post below about David & Jonathan - who clearly were in love based on more than one text.

[MissMarple]

18. Bingo....cherrypicking the bible. And they criticize others for that.

And the Sabbath starts Friday at sundown, and wearing mixed fiber clothing, eating shrimp.... sorry ladies. If you want to criticize others for not following a commandment....we have stones for you, if any of you think you are a pure and blameless saint. I double dare you.

These people mock and dishonor their own faith.

[Huskerchub]

35. Well, that depends...

If this happened on Sunday, they were not breaking the Sabbath. As you quote "the seventh day is the Sabbath". Sunday is the FIRST day of the week. Look at any calendar and you can see that...ask any Jewish person they will tell you that...ask any Seventh Day Adventist they will tell you that...ask a Christian minister that and he or she will tell you that. The Sabbath starts at sundown on Friday and lasts till sundown Saturday. So, no it would not matter to them about breaking Sabbath...Most Christians do not observe Sabbath (with the exception of the SDA's and a couple other very small groups). If you want to bash someone based on their religious views you should at least know then basic tenets of their religion.

[The Doctor.]

10. I've been there too. Thank you for sharing.

I have been in plenty of places where and when I should and could have drawn the zombies into their own foolishness.

Sure, I've gone ahead and done it a few times. But damn it... you can't do it every time. Usually, I just bring up the parts of Leviticus that involve letting the entire village gang-rape one's daughter, or stone their son to death if either disobey their parents.

I did do that once.

They left the coffee shop.

I've been in a state where I just couldn't summon it up... and hated myself for not having the wherewithall. You're not at all alone.


Never give up. Always point out hypocrisy. Make the world around you a better place.


It's not easy, but we of good conscience must never relent.


Thank you for being you.

[Powdered Toast Man]

15. I am just thankful...

That the people in my life who I care about are not that way. Not one family member. Not one friend. They have all be the epitome of supportive.

[HillbillyBob]

11. Funny how the Christofascist always bring up the old testament

When JC said I am the New Covenant and he did not say squat about clothes of multiple fabrics, shellfish . . .

[metapunditedgy]

12. On the bright side, you didn't bang your head on a brick wall.

(I.e., their thick skulls.) Only time and experience will change them, if anything will.

FWIW, lots of young evangelicals drop out pretty quickly and move on with their lives. Many of them have a very hard time with that "don't have sex" stuff....

[Divine Discontent]

13. I love Christ. I am Gay. These people that follow the Jewish rabbi customs of Leviticus when it

concerns Gay people (even though I dispute what those verses mean that they use on GLBTers, also known as the 'clobber passages'), but then make excuses as to what God must have meant in regards to the OTHER verses, while still judging GLBT people show IGNORANCE. Plain and simple. I don't blame God for their judgment on others. They're just dumb. I commend you for not losing your cool. The most I would have done is walk by and say, "well don't sit there and make excuse for the Jewish customs for some people, and condemn the Gays, for shame! WHOSOEVER means just that - whosoever - Christ came to set the captives free - you me, everyone".

And again, I commend you for not saying nothing too, it's a personal thing day to day, there are some days I wouldn't say anything either. Just wanted you to know, I care.......

God loves us all. Everyone doesn't have to believe in Him, but I believe who loves us, and that is something I have believed since I was a little child, and I don't let others judgment tell me where I'm going after death.


"After David had finished talking with Saul, Jonathan became one in spirit with David and he loved him as himself." "The soul of Jonathan was knit with the soul of David, and Jonathan loved him as his own soul." 1 Samuel 18:1
After Jonathan, who would have been king, had he not given up his rights to be so, to David, against his father Saul's wishes, died in battle - King David sang out to God about his love for Jonathan, and said, "My love for you, Jonathan, surpasses even my love for women."

[Powdered Toast Man]

17. What I find so maddening..

Is the bible says over and over that "we" are not supposed to judge others. It's "his" job.

They conveniently miss that.

[MissMarple]

19. They are shallow and ignorant. Hopefully they are teachable. God must love them.

So, I guess we have to be civil.

[Skittles]

24. they convenienetly "miss" that because they are not real Christians

they are simply right-wing assholes

[closeupready]

37. Violent, angry people who need a rationalization in order to vent their hatred and

pervert the Bible to make it fit their world view and personal wishes.

[aquart]

25. That's New Testament.

Old is very judgmental. Go read Judges. In my book, God takes VENGEANCE as his own, but doesn't mind if we are nasty to all sorts of people. Adulterers, for instance. UGH!

But the Old Testament wasn't inspired by the infallible hand of God. It was written by a bunch of pissy and highly politicized Jews during some very dramatic times. Some of the Bible reads like Page Six. GOSSIP. And history. And court case settlements. It's our record. We argue about it all the time.

THE OLD TESTAMENT IS NOT FOR CHRISTIANS. Stop reading it.

[saracat]

20. Boy do I get that.And about so many things.I can relate.Sometimes

the hurt supercedes the fight. I feel like I am warching society go backwards and I feel powerless to stop it.

[rsmith6621]

22. Why Bother....If They Were not Imposing on You Personally...

..... I mean if they didnt come over to you with the idea of sharing their convictions with you just LEAVE THEM ALONE.... you aint going to change their minds or hearts and it is still a country were we can have free conversation.....

Your wasting your time and not doing any good for the viewpoint you have.

[Smarmie Doofus]

26. At the risk of wasting my time.....

>>>>Your wasting your time and not doing any good for the viewpoint you have.>>>>


.....you might reconsider your pov here. No one would ever change their mind about *anything* if we all followed this advice to its logical conclusion.

[joeybee12]

32. Hmm...offended by hate is now a "viewpoint"

Amazing.

[keepCAblue]

36. Oh, but they WERE imposing on the OP personally...

...by creating a hostile environment for the OP. If the OP was black and a group of KKK-like racists came in, sat nearby, near enough to be within earshot and began *discussing* the inequality, inferiority of blacks (just their "point of view", as you call it), don't you think the OP would rightfully feel "imposed on" due to the hostility, animus and intimidation being spewed by the racists?

[aquart]

23. Christians blundering thru the Old Testament again.

I wish they would just stop. It's not their book. They don't know how to read it. They just make a mess.

[sui generis]

28. There is a point where you go past the absurdity of the moment

. . . you don't even have to internalize that anger before you respond. Just ask them if they are aware how offensive they are to the people sitting around them, and ask them to leave and go a church or bible study where it would be more appropriate to muse on their fantasies than a commercial coffee shop where some of the people they're talking about are sitting right next to them.

Then I'd let my head twist around on my neck, levitate and vomit green yak all over them.

[mitchtv]

29. I can understand the lack of will

It is entirely normal, you can't be on fight or flight indefinitely. Tho, I would be tempted to tell them if they were not living Kosher to STFU about the OT. welcome to the once great LGBT forum

[troubledamerican]

30. Boycott Starbucks. They use quotes on their cups from Diane Medved, wife of Neocon Hate Radio Host

Michael Medved.

[joeybee12]

31. Ask them why they are influenced by what semi-literate shepherds

wrote 2000+ years ago.

[closeupready]

33. Why I NEVER leave home without my mp3 player. And just because

I have the earbuds in my ears, doesn't mean it's on - it could be that it will remain off unless I pass by someone saying ugly, disgusting things like those three did. Then, the volume goes up, and you're forgotten, as far as I'm concerned.

But yeah, that would have made me furious, too. :mad:

[closeupready]

34. And also, let me add my own Christian homophobia anecdote:

On the Christianity.com boards (or whatever the URL is for that board), I joined several years ago to get a sense of whether my dislike for evangelicals was still warranted.

I made a post, and a Christian female started PMing me, and everything was fine, until I mentioned a gay friend of mine. She pm'ed me that you have to cast them out of your circle of friends, or else they will lead you astray.

I forget how I responded, but it was something like "how dare you, what a disappointing response from one of Christ's followers, goodbye".

And you know, when I think about all the Christian young people who've struggled with their sexuality and these people, I just get so angry.

[Christa]

38. People like them scare me

the more godly they pretend to be, the more scarier they are and the less I trust them.

I speak from experience.

[ZombieHorde]

39. ...

:hug: