Are we in the last few days of the Obama debate?

[Tyo]

Obama has a good chance of getting the nomination wrapped up tomorrow and if not then, probably soon. If/when Clinton throws it in will criticism of the Anointed One here at DU have to cease? Or to put it another way, will the gag order come down on those of us who see Obama for what he is rather than as what he represents himself as being?

Would criticism of the A One be construed as working to defeat him? Or would you actually have to come out in support of Grampy "Never-Mind-What-I-Said-Last-Week" McCain before you'd be seen as crossing the line? I've read the rules but I'm not sure how they would be interpreted in this case.

[Skoods]

1. For me, yes.

Because he will be our parties nominee and I will do whatever I can to get him elected.

[pnwmom]

13. Welcome to DU, Skoods! n/t

[Tyo]

15. Ooops, sorry Skoods

My bad manners were showing. Welcome to DU! :hi:

[SteppingRazor]

2. You should probably e-mail the admins about this.

That said, I believe that, once there's a presumptive Democratic nominee, flames against that nominee are not tolerated. But, like I said in the title of this post, don't take my word as gospel.

[Tyo]

3. I think you're probably right

But rather than email I thought I'd post because I'm hoping that a mod will respond and i think that this is a better way to get the official position out to everyone.

[MuseRider]

4. When honest criticism

is seen by the "fans" as flaming I would say if you want to stay here you probably should just stay out of it. That is what I intend to do. I can post my disgust elsewhere and still stay on good terms here. Loyalty oaths will be the thing. Blechh.

[Tyler Durden]

6. Don't forget to let me know where you're posting....

My disgust won't be going anywhere, and without a safety valve I'll get TS'd in notime flat.

[MuseRider]

9. LOL

I understand. We could do without a saintly coronation, at least I know I can. I would so much rather be happy but beware and be able to hold anyones feet to the fire who is in the highest office. I doubt we have ever had a good POTUS who did not get taken apart every now and again to show him who is being affected by what he is doing. Oh well, rock on with the rock star.

[Staph]

8. If I understand the rules correctly,

honest criticism is always allowed. We know we're not perfect; we're just better than the alternative. But this is Democratic Underground. If you intend to support a candidate from another party, then you need to find another home.

[MuseRider]

10. Really?

Honest criticism is always allowed? It is supposed to be but the hoards see to it that it all becomes a flame. This is what happens when substance takes a backseat to adoration.

Thanks for the rules update and the title of the forum.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

5. i think when/if he is our nominee we should stand behind him

just because mcclurkin will be the least of our problems if mccain is crowned king

[Tyler Durden]

7. So very difficult.

Like choosing between being up to your neck in shit or up to your neck in piss.

Pri I don't think that man has the slightest idea what Equal Treatment Under The Law really means.

[Tyo]

11. Or worse...

He understands exactly what equal treatment under the law means but he feels that his religion and/or political expediency trumps that concept

[MuseRider]

12. BOOM!

There it is. I think you hit it right on the nose. It is going to be very hard for me to stay engaged when the new POTUS makes me feel almost as creeped out as the last. The political expediency makes me think of a coward but the religious stuff makes me want to curl up and die. I have nothing against religion but I do have a huge problem with it being spouted off all the time where it does not belong, in our policies and by our political officers mixing it all together. Damn, this is going to be hard.

The fact that equal treatment under the law does not seem to be something that will be dealt with properly makes me more angry than a silver spooned elitist making war but not being good at hiding what he is doing. This guy is smarter and better at the podium. I hope HOPE that I am wrong, I will be the happiest person on the planet and I will be ever so happy to admit my failure to see how good he is. Now, if I can just get past the initial shivers......

[NMMNG]

18. The thing that gets me most

Is how he simply will not tolerate racism, but "reaches out to" and insists on "hearing the voices of" homophobes. The double standard just makes me want to :banghead:. Why does he not get how wrong that is?

[Tyo]

19. He knows exactly what he's doing Buffy...

And he's comfortable with it. Of course he'd like to have our votes, but not at the price of alienating certain other constituencies he feels are more important and with which he has more affinity and not at the price of putting the Constitution above his own personal religious beliefs.

[qb]

14. "The President is merely the most important among a large number of public servants.

He should be supported or opposed exactly to the degree which is warranted by his good conduct or bad conduct, his efficiency or inefficiency in rendering loyal, able, and disinterested service to the Nation as a whole. Therefore it is absolutely necessary that there should be full liberty to tell the truth about his acts, and this means that it is exactly necessary to blame him when he does wrong as to praise him when he does right. Any other attitude in an American citizen is both base and servile. To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public. Nothing but the truth should be spoken about him or any one else. But it is even more important to tell the truth, pleasant or unpleasant, about him than about any one else."

Theodore Roosevelt in the Kansas City Star
May 7, 1918

[Tyo]

16. That is the best quote ever

TR was kind of a mixed bag when it came to politics, but when he got stuff right he got it really right. Thanks.

[Ayesha]

17. I think criticism/questioning is important

Although I support Obama, I'm also still upset about the McClurkin thing. I believe that it's essential that there are people continuing to needle him on that issue, because that is exactly how to keep it from happening again. Even though Obama has not apologized to many people's satisfaction, I strongly believe he will think twice before having anything more to do with McClurkin and his ilk.

We are not going to get a President who (openly, anyway) supports gay marriage this time around. However, we have a shot at hate crimes legislation, ENDA, ending Don't Ask Don't Tell, and maybe even getting civil unions. Marriage rights are EXTREMELY important to me, but those other rights are, too. By holding Obama accountable for McClurkin, we show that we're a voice that will not be silenced and cannot be ignored - and we increase our likelihood of winning those victories.

I would be very upset if people were banned for criticizing our nominee's stance on gay rights or any other issue. Candidates' positions evolve over time, and your words can have an impact. It wouldn't surprise me if Obama's staff reads DU. They may take your advice to heart.

[Amimnoch]

20. Voting Hillary Tomorrow, Caucusing tomorrow night!

Well, it's finially my turn to have my voice here in Texas. Casting my Hillary vote tomorrow morning, going back tomorrow evening to caucus/pricinct convention for her! Wish us luck!

[xchrom]

21. if you want to see the adoring throngs lose their minds when the annointed one

ascends to the presidency and signs some pro-gay legislation.

it'll be as though the history of struggle by gay folk the nation over was nothing.