W Post: Kennedy Targets Job Bias Against Gays , lesbians and bisexuals _ but not transsexuals

[Omaha Steve]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/02/AR2008040200359.html?tid=informbox

By ANDREW MIGA
The Associated Press
Wednesday, April 2, 2008; 6:52 AM

WASHINGTON -- Sen. Edward M. Kennedy is jumping into the middle of an uproar within the gay community whose causes he has long championed.

The Massachusetts Democrat is leading a push in the Senate for a federal ban on job bias against gays, lesbians and bisexuals _ but not transsexuals, cross-dressers and others whose outward appearance doesn't match their gender at birth.


Sen. Ted Kennedy, D-Mass, speaks at the National Hispanic Cultural Center in Albuquerque, N.M., in this Thursday, Jan. 31, 2008 file photo. Kennedy is jumping into the middle of an uproar within the gay community whose causes he has long championed. The Massachusetts Democrat is leading a push in the Senate for a federal ban on job bias against gays, lesbians and bisexuals _ but not transsexuals, cross-dressers and others whose outward appearance doesn't match their gender at birth. (AP Photo/Toby Jorrin) (Toby Jorrin - AP)


"We will strongly oppose it," said Roberta Sklar of the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force. "Leaving transgender people out makes that a flawed movement."

The House in November approved the bill, written by openly gay Rep. Barney Frank, D-Mass., despite strong protests from many gay rights advocates that it didn't cover transgender workers.

"It was made very clear in the fall that most LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender) organizations, the vast majority of LGBT organizations, do not want Congress to shove a civil rights bill down our throat that we don't want," said Mara Keisling, executive director of the National Center for Transgender Equality.

Some gay rights groups, including the Human Rights Campaign, supported Frank's bill and the decision not to risk its rejection by Congress by insisting on immediate transgender protections as well.

FULL story at link.

[terrya]

1. ENDA is going to be vetoed this year anyway.

Do the right thing, Senator. Support a fully inclusive ENDA that protects transgendered Americans as well. Do the right, decent, honorable thing.

[Moloch]

2. I don't support job discrimination against anyone...

but transvestites should start their own movement. On other threads, transvestites have argued that they feel they were born the wrong gender and that they wish to live as such. That's fine, but then they are not gay if they are, for example a man who feels they are a woman and is attracted to other men. Instead of trying to attach themselves to the gay movement (or the feminist movement, as they have tried in the past) they need to start their own organizations and push for their own legislation if they think they're being discriminated against.

[hulklogan]

3. Transgendered people have always been part of the "gay movement"

hence the "T" in GLBT.

I realize it's hard to stand up for people even more downtrodden than us, but I'm not going to kick my trans friends out the door just so I can have a minor legislative victory that will get vetoed anyway.

[Moloch]

6. West Virginia coalminers are "downtrodden," too..

but that doesn't mean they should be included in the gay rights movement (unless, of course.. they're gay, lesbian or bisexual) We certainly haven't achieved even half of what can be considered equality yet but the movement has become mainstream. Most GLBs are out of the closet and happy. This is not 1969 or 1978.. years when gay rights were not even subjects of discussions for Democrats. The Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence may be fun and interesting to watch but we simply can't afford to make them the centerpiece of the movement.

[hulklogan]

7. What you say is foolish, selfish, anti-Democratic and downright mean.

I have no time for that crap. You should take your anti-trans bullshit somewhere else.

[mitchtv]

4. how fucking treacherous is that?

you take the cake
GLB"T" capiche?

[Solon]

9. Why the fuck are you on this board?

And that includes both DU and the GLBT forum. If you can't get over your transphobia then why not go back to whatever hole in the ground that you oozed out of?

[Moloch]

11. Well, I'm a Democrat.

Democrats don't always share the same opinions on every single issue. I'm also gay. I have as much right to be here as you do. Surely, you can disagree without resorting to childish insults.. Or can you?

Here's the second paragraph from "about DU:"

We welcome Democrats of all stripes, along with other progressives who will work with us to achieve our shared goals. While the vast majority of our visitors are Democrats, this web site is not affiliated with the Democratic Party, nor do we claim to speak for the party as a whole.

Soooooooooooo...

[readmoreoften]

12. My partner is a butch lesbian--that means she's gay and transgendered.

Learn your fucking history. Stonewall. The Compton Cafeteria Riots. How do you think we got where we are today? DEMOCRATS????!!!! No, honey, we got here from rowdy queens and trannies. Take your bullshit elsewhere.

[Moloch]

15. Wow.

Violence may have been justified during Stonewall. The police were clearly harassing those people... but that was 39 years ago. Things just aren't the same anymore. We've won significant legislative victories all over and the time for violence is most certainly over. Again, I'm a gay Democrat. You don't own this discussion board, so quit acting like you do.

When Obama is president and Democrats control the Senate and House of Representatives, we'll get civil unions everywhere and ENDA will finally pass. It often seems like people here (not just in this forum, but across all sorts of left-wing sites) would rather complain than actually get people elected who are willing to make things better. Your butch girlfriend will not be discriminated against if ENDA were passed. The transvestite movement keeps repeating it over and over again to scare the rest of us. Its time to divorce the transvestites from the GLB movement and move forward.

Violence will NOT further that cause in 2008.

[mitchtv]

18. absolutely disugsting

Karma is a funny thing, it always comes around, just when you leas expected. and bites you on the ass;What a mean spirited attitude . Good luck trying to be better than someone else in straitey's world. Or, as Ben Franklin said "We all hang together, or we'll all hang seperately"

[Moloch]

19. lol

There was nothing mean spirited in my post (or any of the others.) I didn't say anything bad about transvestites, just that I don't believe they should be a part of the gay movement. I also never claimed I was better than any of them. Aren't you overreacting a bit? Straitey? Well, I guess if my post offended you so much, its been a pretty good day and you didn't have to waste your self-righteous indignation on anything important. :hi:

[mitchtv]

20. Simply put

They were a part of the movement Long before you

[UncleSepp]

24. Transvestite movement? n/t

[Solon]

22. You are also a bigot...

So take your bigoted opinions out of here.

[terrya]

10. You might want to learn the difference between transvestites and transgendered people.

Pretty simple to look up.

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[AGirl]

13. There is a difference between transvestities (crossdresser) and TRANSSEXUALS. Get it.

[LostinVA]

16. I can't believe you're still posting your TRANSPHOBIC SHIT in here

:puke:

You don't post a single thing for equal rights, you're just here to bash the TG folks. Fucking disgusting.

[DarkTirade]

21. ... WTF?

:wtf:

Seriously... WTF.

Are you really that self-absorbed and short-sighted that you can't see that GLBT rights are all about keeping people outside the 'normal' gender binary from being marginalized and discriminated against?

Or are you just trying to troll for angry responses here?

Either way... you're either a narrow-minded bigot, or an internet troll. Neither of which are particularly welcome here.

And last I checked, the feminist movement was also about evening out the power structure within the gender binary, which gives it a lot in common with GLBT.

[UncleSepp]

23. Marriage rights and parental rights

Gay and lesbian rights cross over with the rights of transsexuals on the issue of marriage and parental rights. If a straight transman wishes to marry a woman in a state that does not recognize a change of gender, he can't, because his marriage would be considered a same-sex marriage. If a lesbian transwoman wishes to marry her girlfriend, she can only do that before her legal transition. A trans person of any birth gender may find it impossible to bring a spouse from outside the country to America without having had lower surgery, because the state department requires lower surgery for a change of gender on a passport. So far, no marriage that began as a straight relationship and became a same-sex relationship due to the transition of one of the spouses has been invalidated solely on those grounds.

If a straight transman and his wife have a child who is the biological child of the wife, and the couple divorces, the husband's trans status can be grounds for a loss of custody or a termination of parental rights. If a lesbian transwoman with children divorces before transition, her trans status can also be grounds for a loss of custody or visitation rights to her own biological children. A straight couple, one of whom is transgendered, may not have the practical right to adopt a child for the same reasons that make it difficult for a same sex couple to adopt a child.

The equal right to marriage and the equal right to be a parent regardless of the genders of the spouses or the genders of the parents is a right for all of us, gay, bi, lesbian, trans, and even straight. It is a fundamental human right, not a special right for a special group.

[ccharles000]

5. ...

Freedom is never voluntarily given by the oppressor; it must be demanded by the oppressed.-MLK

I will oppose this bill until everyone in our community is included.

[readmoreoften]

8. Why do they always say 'cross-dressers' and not transgendered people?

What LGBT person identifies as a cross-dresser. A cross-dresser is generally a straight man who wears panties and stockings under his suit as a sexual fetish. A transsexual person is a person who physically alters his/her body, a transgendered person is a person who doesn't fit into traditional gender paradigms. I'm sorry for anyone who IDs as a cross-dresser, but the only men I've ever met who called themselves by that name are heterosexual clients of mine when I was a dominatrix.

An article like this is equivalent to an article describing Equal Opportunity Employment as: "No one should be discriminated against due to race, color, or whether or not their a gangsta rapper." Talk about building a straw man into a bill.

[AGirl]

14. it probably makes for a more sensational article... RIghts for crossdressers! :roll my eyes: