Is There Really a Gay Generation Gap?

[ccharles000]

I found this interesting.

I was at the club a couple of months back, when a drunken younger guy bumped into me. He looked back in his stupor, kindly tapped my shoulder and said, "Excuse me sir." I almost screamed. Not because he ruined my fresh white sneakers, but because at age 29 I was considered a "sir." At what age do we become "older" gays. As time passes, it seems as if the young-old age threshold continues to decrease. To my dismay, what I consider "older" is a few decades beyond what the younger generations today consider mature. Could this be the reason why so many gay men chase the fountain of youth? Are the older gay generations out of touch with the younger generations? And will the generation gap ever be closed?

A late 2005 study by the Institute for Gay and Lesbian Strategic Studies confirms what many gay adults and young adults already feel-- the younger generations don't understand older gays and older gays don't understand the younger ones. Ironically, the number of years that divide "younger" from "older" gays can be as little as five years. Dr. Glenda Russell, co-author of the widely reported study, makes these major points:
LGBT adults tend to project their own experiences onto today's young people, when in fact the lives of today's young people are often quite different.
Adults tend to focus on the suffering and isolation of LGBT youth, even though many LGBT teens are actually doing well.
Young LGBT people sometimes complain that no one is doing anything about discrimination, apparently unaware of decades of prior activism by LGBT adults.
Young people often provide a fresh perspective on issues that is both less constrained by past strategies for problem solving and less reliant on older-and perhaps incorrect-assumptions about the degree of homophobia.
Adults have greater experience and resources and are more familiar with the historical roots of the LGBT movement.

http://www.iglss.org/media/files/Angles_81.pdf

http://gaylife.about.com/b/2006/08/02/is-there-really-a-gay-generation-gap.htm

I have found that older gays are more uncomfortable with words like queer and fag.

[mitchtv]

1. you got that right Charlie000

while fag is used to insult people with my peers, Queer is almost never used unless it is to mock the strates. We older men realize that we are invisible to the younger crowd, and manage to survive somehow.

[Smarmie Doofus]

2. Not a lot of coherence here:

>>>>>Adults tend to focus on the suffering and isolation of LGBT youth, even though many LGBT teens are actually doing well.
Young LGBT people sometimes complain that no one is doing anything about discrimination, apparently unaware of decades of prior activism by LGBT adults.>>>>>>>>


If so many LGBT teens are "doing well".... why would young LGBTs complain that "no one is doing anything about discrimination."?

[hooraydems06]

21. I think what they're getting at...

... is that it's a different group of LGBT youth that's complaining about discrimination than the ones doing well. And they're often different political parties as well...

[Moloch]

3. I'm 28...

and have been absolutely shocked by the fear and distrust of non-gay people some have expressed in this forum. I've been out since I was 15 and have never faced overt homophobia other than the occasional joke. Of course, I've read extensively about gay history and the way we were treated for most of the 20th century. Its certainly understandable for older gay people to hold a great deal of resentment but there's every reason to be optimistic. Once we have a Democratic president and expand our majorities in the senate and house, we can have legislative victories. Societal changes are also happening rapidly. My mom used to worry quite a bit about how I would be treated being an out gay person and, honestly, I don't think its been difficult to be out at all. If you look at poll after poll of people under 30, you'll find that they overwhelmingly support gay marriage and are against job discrimination. Things are really starting to look up, and we should acknowledge that.

[Zuiderelle]

5. "the fear and distrust of non-gay people some have expressed in this forum"

Fear and distrust of non-gay people by us here in this forum? Where exactly?

It isn't fear and distrust of non-gay people that some gay people have. It's distrust of homophobic people, or straight people who don't care that we are second-class citizens, or that we don't deserve equal rights.

If you personally never experienced homophobia, it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

[Moloch]

8. I never said homophobia didn't exist.

Here's a few examples of posts which seem to demonstrate a fear and distrust of non-gay people:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=221&topic_id=70665&mesg_id=70720

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=221x77192

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=105x2635946

Most of the posts containing the words "breeder" and "straighty" have been deleted.

[Zuiderelle]

14. It's odd that nothing you posted showed anything demonstrating fear or distrust of non-gay people.

And even IF you saw posts about "breeder" or "straighty" before they were deleted, how the hell does that show fear or distrust?

I'm still not convinced that you really care about gay issues at all.

[terrya]

6. No one here has expressed fear and mistrust towards all hetero people in this forum.

On the contrary, there are some wonderful hetero friends of the GLBT community that have come in here to be supportive, or have asked how they can help us in our fight for equality. And I, for one, dearly love those nice people. :-)

We have, however, experienced homophobia in this forum. And you know it's been expressed in here.

I'm glad your experiences being gay have been free of homophobia. Some of us haven't been so lucky.

[Creideiki]

7. "I've been out since I was 15 and have never faced overt transphobia"...

other than a particular poster saying things like, "it's really the same as transvestitism", and sex-change operations are vanity projects.

Hmmmm...mote...beam...

[Moloch]

9. Its quite off-topic for this thread...

for you to try to revive a months-old flame war. Lets be adults.

[Creideiki]

17. Nah, not really off-topic

It's just showing that someone who has not been the paragon of virtue may not want to come and open their trap.

[Moloch]

19. If my presence bothers you that much..

I assume you know how to use the ignore feature.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

11. on which planet do you live? i want to move where there is no overt homophobia

in nyc lisa and i get harassed frequently.

so please let me know where you live that you can be out and gay and not get harassed.

ps: i like to hold my girls hand in public.

[closeupready]

15. Do you think you'd also get harrassed if

you were living in, say, San Francisco? Curious about that.

[JackBeck]

4. Apathy is trans-generational and isn't unique to anyone's personal political passion.

Your quip at the bottom of your post is frame of reference and not reflective of a collective experience, since it is only what you "have found".

So please stop generalizing unless you have explicit proof.

[closeupready]

10. I'm definitely on the older side.

Hope this doesn't sound defensive, but is "chasing" younger gays what younger gays do, too? Young people are just naturally beautiful. Why is it "chasing" when older gays admire younger gays, and "normal" when younger gays do the same thing? Is that, in fact, prejudicial against older gays?

Personally, in my experience, physical attraction is important. But a romantic partner needs to have a sense of humor, intelligence and good breeding, because there is so much more to a successful relationship than just sex, though that is a big element.

I do find it hard to maintain relationships with younger people, not older people so much, because younger people generally haven't developed the social skills needed to maintain long-term relationships, and conversations often end up revolving entirely around them and what is going on with them, and so I just end up getting bored.

[dsc]

12. so do you check their papers?

sorry couldn't resist with the good breeding line. I know what you mean but it sounds a little pompus.

[closeupready]

13. lol - "breeding" 'for lack of a better, all-encompassing word'.

Wow, talk about syntax nazis. :D Cheers, and Happy Pride, dsc! :hi:

[baby_mouse]

16. Older here, 38. Had to struggle with resentment.

All the work done, see and no understanding of what it cost some of us.

I have an ex who was heavily involved in Act Up and have an inkling of what it was like for him. I get the feeling a lot of younger gay folk haven't even that inkling. I can't set myself up as some kind of hard-bitten activist, but the attitude of some younger gay folk seems terribly callous to me, carefree, bitchy, dismissive, lacking any concern for what has gone before.

But maybe that's good. It doesn't look good to me, I have to say.

[meegbear]

18. I'm 42 and notice it too ...

when they address me as "Sir", it's not in the 'Leave It To Beaver' politeness. Being called "Daddy" makes me feel old, but I take it in stride.

[galledgoblin]

20. well, you're talking about two things there

that first discussion, of when someone becomes a "Sir" or "Madam", I would say that it happens when you're an adult. it doesn't mean you're old, just that you command a certain amount of respect. I'm sure you're still smoking hot.

as for whether there's a difference in the experiences of LGBT who matured after about 1995 and LGBT who matured prior, I emphatically say yes!

it's different for LGBT who matured between 1985 and 1995, 1975 and 1985, 1965 and 1975, etc. each generation is building on the previous work.

the world I grew up in was much less intolerant than the world of previous generations, and it most certainly had an impact on my degree of radicalness on LGBT issues.

[foxeyes2]

22. My take

Well I am 42 and because I was raised and continue to live in the South (Tennessee to be exact) I use Sir as a term of respect. It doesn't matter to me at least how old you are as I have used for people much younger than me and of course much older than me as well as those in my age range. the young man who bumped into you was probably raised the same way and was doing his best to be polite which to me is very important. Civility, showing respect, being polite helps smooth out the rough edges of the world we live in. It's not about being fake or insincere but a true desire to show deference or honor to those around you. So don't feel old for being called Sir.

Secondly there is a gap between younger and old gays because things have improved, rights have been gained, there is more acceptance, more visibility and so on. Yet there is still a lot of work to be done, homophobia/transphobia are very real and occur on a daily basis and we must continue to confront prejudice whenever we see it or experience it. It is easy to criticize younger gay folks when we don't see them doing the things we think they should but it is important to remember that they are still young just like we were once and if truthful we sometimes were a bit self centered or at least most of us were. So we need to cut them a break, befriend them, share our stories, listen and learn from their stories and work together for a better and brighter future for all of us and for those who come after us.

[MonkeyFunk]

23. Yes, I think there is

and that's fine.

The experiences of gay kids today is pretty different from my experiences. I don't begrudge the differences, as long as they don't diss ABBA.

[lightningandsnow]

26. I love ABBA.

Love.

Just thought I should say that.

[NewYorker83]

24. I'm 25....

my best friend is 53... The looks and comments we get are shameful.. I'm glad to have a mature man at my side who educated me on the struggles, the epidemic and the overall history of the GLBT rights movement. Since then I have become very distrustful of the younger gays in the community... I know I'm young but I already feel out of touch with my younger peers. My personal interactions with the younger ones has always been problematic and usually ends with some thing about I'm 25 freaking years old, I don't want to deal with that crap. I'm also sure younger persons feel I'm boring and stiff. There is def. ageism within our community and sadly the age is getting younger and younger within terms of a "generation gap." I also completely agree that a lot of peers seem relatively uninterested in the history about where we've come from and how far we've come as a community. I applaud the mature men and women out there who have fought the good fight and hopefully my generation will take the torch soon and keep the ball rolling.

[Smarmie Doofus]

25. This is true of young people generally ; not just gays:

>>>>I also completely agree that a lot of peers seem relatively uninterested in the history about where we've come from and how far we've come as a community. >>>>

Now that I think of it , it's true of Americans in general ( i.e. that we're historically illiterate). Seems the system... such as it is... would prefer to keep this going ( I wonder why!).

In the 70's there was no GLBT history to reference ( i.e. there *was*, but it was verboten and... as a book title later put it, "Hidden from History".) so we drew mostly on the history of the American left , esp. antiwar, civil rights, feminism, all of which movements were themselves cresting around that time.

I was always a history nerd but what you say above could have been said about most young GLBT's in the 70's. Therefore... the OP premise that there is some kind of NEW generation gap in the GLBT community is a myth, imo. Far as historical perspective is concerned, anyway.

People are , on average, ignorant of history; young people are more ignorant than most 'cause they haven't been around long enough to recognize it's relevance.

Welcome to DU.