Why I can't follow Organized Religion's Moral Authority

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

At this very moment, it's easy not to be swayed by Organized Religion's Moral Authority. They have none.

When an Organization bases it's entire campaign on LIES and BEARING FALSE WITNESS, breaking two of the very 10 Commandments they would like to exhibit everywhere, I just can't bring myself to take them seriously. However, it's much more than 'at this moment'.

I was raised as a Southern Baptist in the Deep South. I turned 9 in mid-1965. I was baptized and born-again. One would think I was doomed to be a fundamentalist racist that were so prevalent and loud at the Sarah Palin rallys. The very type that the Republican Party calls part of it's base and continues to court. The very type that the Old Republican Guard will smile at and give a pat on the back as long as I vote for their candidate. Outside the rally, they would have nothing to do with.

Instead of clinging to religion, I clung to education, reading, exploring, questioning, discussing, thinking, empathizing and common decency and common sense.

And that brings me to where I am today, unable to follow Organized Religion's Moral Authority.

IT'S THE 21ST CENTURY! YOUR DOGMA IS OLD! PUT IT TO SLEEP!

Am I truly anti-Christian or anti-religion? I don't believe so. I do follow Christian Philosophy which can be seen as the basic philosophy in all the worlds religion. Do unto others, do so to the least of these, turn the other cheek, judge not, brother's keeper, log in own eye, etc are my paradyms. I do NOT follow the Pharasean Philosophy that religion belongs in government and should be controlled by a group of Religious Leaders who are fallable and lost themselves.

Organized Religion has lost all of it's battles over the years when it's been counter to their strong dogmatic principles.

We can even go back to the very first Organizers of Religion/Mythology/Mysticsm.

Human Sacrifice to appease the gods/God? Gone.
Burning witches at the stake? Gone.
Forcing science to recant truths? Gone.
Promoting slavery as acceptable? Gone.
Not allowing women to serve as leaders? Gone.
Standing by while Jews were murdered? Gone.
Using influence to promote segregation? Gone.

These do not include the Crusades, Inquisitions, and all the horrible things done in God's name. Those were horrors but good people have done good deeds as well. The point of this post it not to say bad people do bad things, but instead to show how over time, culturally Organized Religion has been, well, just plain wrong.

When anyone is basing their morals on the understanding of what they are being taught by their chosen Religious Leaders, they should look both before today and after tomorrow. Are their truths they hold dear actual truths or just a culture in transition? Is it acceptable to 'apologize' decades or centuries after the fact of the suffering of hundreds, thousands, millions?

If there is a God and I'm standing in front of Him/Her one day... I'd rather be judged on giving an enemy a glass of water than being damned for denying an innocent person a moment of peace. But then again, that's just me.

So if I can't follow Organized Religion's Moral Authority, where do I get mine?

It's really very simple, based on our understanding of nature, life, human development, growth and personal experience, I weigh what science shows me, what philosophers tell me, and where I can best fit in the world for the short time I'm here. It's not my understanding that I am here to make anyone's life miserable but instead to offer a helping hand when I can and am able.

I am constantly disappointed that there are not more who espouse the same understandings. Especially when those people are my Religious and Political Leaders.

It's bothersome that gays marrying has become the battle cry for the Pharasean power-mongers.
Perhaps in the next 30 yeras, this 'battle' will be as 'quaint' as the Salem Witch Trials and Good Christians only doing God's work.

I can hope.

[xchrom]

1. all institutions -- become --

a reflection of all the flaws that humanity possesses.

because at their root they are human.

that includes organized religion -- it is their reluctance for self inventory and embracing fact that irks so
with organized religion.

it just so unnecessary.

[Zenlitened]

2. What the religionists don't want you to know:

Morality stems from our deep evolutionary heritage.

Altruism, empathy, social awareness, conscience -- all the ingredients of what we call morality have evolved incrementally over time.

They are part and parcel of what we are as human beings. And thus subject to all the extremes of greatness and failure that we ourselves are prone to.

Religion and its various gods have nothing to do with morality, beyond attempting to co-opt it for purposes benign or malevolent.

Religion and its god(s) are not a source of morality. They are simply its kidnappers and lately, more often than not, its killers.

[bluedawg12]

3. I'm thinking morality is adaptive

co-operative societies do better than societies that compete intensly with in the group.

If that is true, than the current big 3, and thier variations are non-productive and dysfunctional as they pit us against each other for no benefit.

What? Homophobia will increase our chances for finding food, shelter, mates? Hardly.

It has become nothing more than a political tool of oppression.

Just found this and it is on topic and timely. The article itself goes into how religious leaders are picking and chosing the best populist message to stay in power. Gays? Immigration? Environment? Take your pick, they are!

........

http://www.newsweek.com/id/168182/page/1
Christian right regroups after Obama victory
Down but not demoralized over Obama victory, Christian right faces another crossroads

By ERIC GORSKI AP Religion Writer | AP
Nov 9, 2008
Several Christian right leaders, however, dwelled not on the presidential result but on the success in California, Arizona and Florida of constitutional amendments that, in effect, banned gay marriage. In Florida, however, gay marriage wasn't enough to tilt the pivotal battleground state to McCain.

"Conservative politicians lost. Traditional values succeeded," said Tom Minnery, a vice president of Dobson's Focus on the Family. "It ought to tell them to get a clue about the importance of marriage. We were frustrated that Sen. McCain would not speak out about marriage strongly and repeatedly."

Still others pointed to how Hispanics and African-Americans — who overwhelmingly backed Obama — sided with white evangelicals in rejecting gay marriage.

"There is a common thread among these different ethnic groups, and it's church. It's faith," said Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council. "If Republicans want to reach into those ethnic groups, really the only bridge they can cross over are the social issues. But they have to be true to them."

Richard Land, president of the Southern Baptist Convention's Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission, said immigration is another issue that holds promise.

Joel Hunter, an Orlando, Fla., megachurch pastor, fits that definition. Hunter, 60, is anti-abortion but also signed a statement on climate change and has denounced "hateful immigration rhetoric." He also delivered the closing prayer at this summer's Democratic National Convention and prayed with Obama by phone Tuesday before the president-elect took the stage in Chicago's Grant Park.

On gay rights, Hunter said evangelicals can find a home in coalitions that support restricting the institution of marriage to one man and one woman but advocate that gays be able to form legal relationships short of marriage — and that no one face job discrimination.
.........

[Mesteryo]

4. claiming that morality is part of human evolution..

Doesn't prove that morality doesn't come from God in fact it does the opposite. You're basically arguing that moral awareness is ingrained in human nature. That means if God is behind nature than this moral awareness comes from God.

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

9. So Human Evolution is a given...

... and God is a supposition.

And if Moral Awareness is TRULY from GOD, then there are much bigger problems.

Then why were people burned at the stake for being witches when there were NO such things?
The 'good christians' were being moral in their beliefs.. but wrong in their humanity.

It can't be both.

Either God knows and He doesn't Care.


Don't give me the God lets us chose, that isn't a good support position who lost their lives and loved ones.
The story of Job isn't a Happy Ending by the way.

[Mesteryo]

12. Why do people ignore murder laws?

Because they can.

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

15. Kill one person, you're a murder.. Kill all people, you're God.

... so let's pick another contrivance.

[bluedawg12]

11. Ingrained by who?

Morality is ingrained? Huh? I said adaptive. Big difference.

[Zenlitened]

19. Which "God"? There've been so many, I find it hard to keep track.

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

25. I'm thinking the One whose ...

serpents that were created from staffs that ate up the other serpents created from staffs from the Other Gods.
The One who commanded to have NO other gods before Him and He is the One True God....

But then again, my god, who knows? Evidently God even knows.. there are many!

[Mesteryo]

5. you do know that slave abolitionists..

Used Biblical morality and the idea that God created all people in His image to attack slavery.

Also let's not forget MLK was a Christian minister.

The problem isn't Christianity, it's people who forget that Christian morality must center on loving others and not condemning them.

Bad things are done in the name of economic justice and social equality yet as a progressive I hope we don't advocate their demise.

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

8. And some Christians use 'do so to the least of these'

as being supportive of gay rights.

Again, I wasn't discussing religion... Organized Religion that foists itself upon individual people to sway them into a political way of thinking has no Moral Authority.

Christ taught to be more concerned with YOUR own soul before worrying about your neighbor.
Today, we 'cast stones' via Organizations without self-judgement.

[bluedawg12]

13. When organized religion is destructive

one can argue it no longer serves a function.

[Mesteryo]

17. does the same apply to all secular institutions?

So should we eliminate all scientific research? How many people were killed by atomic weapons developed by scientists?

[bluedawg12]

18. You do realize

you make no logical sense, right?

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

14. and BTW, slavery wasn't abolished by Popular Vote

... let's not forget that.

[Zenlitened]

20. Funny coincidence:

Supporters of slavery used Biblical "morality" and the idea that their god created separate races to DEFEND slavery.

[Mesteryo]

24. people use anything to excuse evil..

Supporters of slavery also used the Constitution to defend their "right" to own slaves. Do you want to eliminate that?

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

27. Evidently all we have to do is VOTE ON IT!

and win 50.01% and voila, Slavery would be legal again.

Who in Alabama and Mississip knew in 1960 that it would have been THAT easy?

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

26. And BOOKS by 'experts' even into the 1950s showed the superiority

.. of one certain race.

[DarkTirade]

6. There will always be fearful people who oppose progress.

Even when the most basic of thought processes will show that it's the right thing to do.

[Jamastiene]

7. What I find THE MOST disgusting OF ALL is that the perpetrators of hate

spend so much time using the Bible as a weapon to bash people and so little time actually reading it. They take what hateful men claim Jesus said, as fact, as gospel, instead of the actual gospel that is in those Bibles they use as weapons. There is something incredibly wrong with that picture.

Those people really need to sit down and ask themselves which master they are really serving by perpetrating hate based on what someone TOLD THEM Jesus said as opposed to what Jesus actually said. Jesus clearly said "love one another." The Bible also says "Judge not, lest ye be judged."

When the real Christians get into power, they will be our Calvary. I fully believe that even though I'm not religious myself. I have met kind Christians who are not hate mongers. I know they exist. The problem is that they are outnumbered and surrounded by the same blood thirsty monsters that outnumber and surround us.

I truly believe our salvation lies in a coalition with those people who are just as disgusted as we are. By "salvation," I do not mean living in the closet or "hate the sin, love the sinner." By "salvation," I mean full equal rights, a chance to join in doing good works for our communities as ourselves, and our status as full human beings fully restored.

Until then, that bunch of haters who have usurped religion as a tool to perpetrate their own blood lust will continue to make asses of themselves and destroy lives. It is a damn shame, really.

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

10. Do you serve God, or James Dobson? Is that the question we should ask?

[bluedawg12]

16. Well said. Nothing in Scripture

shows that Jesus said anything about homosexulaity, for example.

Most of it seemed to come from Paul, who brought Abrahamaic rules for living into the sect of Judaism known as the early xtians.

Someone pointed out in another thread that Levitcus was talking about slave owners not lying with men, and not free men.

Also, going back to the cult from salt, this is an example of religion from the mouth of man and not God.
.......

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brigham_Young
Brigham Young was responsible for revoking the priesthood and temple blessings from black members of the LDS faith, who had been treated equally in this respect under Joseph Smith's presidency.

Young later (in 1863) reiterated,

Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so. (Journal of Discourses, vol. 10, p. 110)<1>

.......

[Eryemil]

22. Funny, some of those here defending Christianity were just bashing Mormons..

...in another thread.

I wonder how all the religious queers deal with the cognitive dissonance of supporting institutions that actively seek to undermine their very humanity.

[JustFiveMoreMinutes]

28. The thing about religious queers...

.. is that it's NOT 'man' that they really have to worry about....... well, in the short term they do... but in the LOOONG term in their religious beliefs, they only answer to One.

[Clintonista2]

21. I agree with Gloria Steinem's view

I was watching an interview with her once and she was asked whether she would consider herself a religous person. She said that she considers herself a "spiritual" person, the difference being that religion is far too political for her. That's exactly how I feel on this matter.

[bluedawg12]

23. Yup.

It is organized religion, that is more political than spiritual. Unless codified laws are considered spiritual??