Has anybody read Bill H.R.3200, the Health Care proposal?

[stuball111]

Here it is... seems there is a "public option" in there, but it seems pretty lame to me. And even if it does pass, it won't give much relief for a few years.



http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.3200:

[mzmolly]

1. What about it seems lame to you?

:shrug:

I've not read all 1000 pages, personally. As for relief coming in a few years, that's better than no relief in a few years.

[stuball111]

2. I just skimmed over it in certain parts,

But I don't like penalties for not having a plan. That seems like an auto insurance type thing. Also, the "public plan" seems to be something they are setting up to allow the present providers to administer it. In other words, taking a chunk of money and saying,
" Here you go, run our plan." Also, it seems like it will take a long time for it to actually get rolling. It will reduce costs somewhat, but I also don't like this "Exchange" idea,or a co-op if you will. It may reduce costs, but it seems that there is no Universality in it. Sure, everybody MAY be covered, but there will still be disparity in quality, and costs for premiums. Also, it is EXTREMELY complicated. I think it would also create a lot more waste than a single payer, universal, government administered plan, which would, if implemented correctly and swiftly,yanks the private insurance industry into streamlining their business or else be toast. They could run private insurance WAY more efficiently by adopting a style used by a single payer system, but they are to stubborn to use profits to do that, and to caught up in doing their own thing. For instance, nobody has come up with the idea for private insurance to conglomerate their billing and administration of their individual systems into a combined billing and management center, like other companies do. I dunno, it just seems kinda half-assed in it's approach to appease the present system, and try to make everybody happy, left, right, rich, poor, insurers, doctors an infinatum

[mzmolly]

3. I definitely support a single payer

plan, but I don't think that will happen immediately. I agree with some of your points, but I don't know that any plan would be without its issues.

[stuball111]

4. True..

Universal Health Care didn't happen over night in Canada either, and the private industry is far too strong, as well as the blue dog problem. But a foot in the door is, I suppose, better than the present mess.*sigh*

[YewNork]

5. The exchange won't be the only place to buy insurance, though.

Keep in mind that the insurance exchange will not be the only place where insurance can be purchased. People will be able to buy insurance directly from private insurers also.
The public option will only be available on the exchange, but private insurers will be able to sell insurance both on the exchange and externally.

On the exchange, there will be 4 types of policies offered:

Basic,
Enhanced,
Premium, and
Premium-Plus

The benefits and coverage for each of those 4 types of plans will be standardized so that the basic plan sold by one carrier will be exactly the same as the basic plan sold by another
carrier. It will allow people to compare apples to apples, and to decide to go with one company because, for instance, they offer better quality of service or they have more
in-network doctors where that person lives.

Plus, if a person wants to buy a plan that offers more than one of the pre-defined plans, one that is customized to their needs, they can buy outside the exchange.

[stuball111]

6. Yeah, I read that..i't an improvement..

Still isn't "universal"though whereas true universality costs everyone the same, and is all premium plus, and everything is "in plan". It looks like the cost will go down. I see signs that it will create competition with the plans outside the exchange, and lower their prices. Call me a dreamer, but I do come from Canada originally, and UHC can't be beaten. Another thing that is weird is that it said something like qualification based on %400 of the poverty level(?) which Is good for the poor, but it seems like sliding scale based on wealth? Also, the co-pay and deductable issue is still there. There's none of that in a Universal system.I know that it will take time to slam on the brakes on the health care train, maybe this is a start, but I still think the Dems ought to just set up a Canadian style system and let the chips fall where they may.

[YewNork]

9. I lived in Canada for 12 years until recently and I agree that it is better but

there is no way that the insurance industry is just going to let themselves be voted out business.

[stuball111]

13. Yep...

They'll have to go kicking and screaming...over a period of time of course...

[Shagbark Hickory]

7. Raise your hand if you thought the subject of healthcare reform wasn't going to come up til 3rd year

I'm raising my hand.

[stuball111]

8. me

:hi: unless we start a teabagging movement... call it... the I.V. baggers

[dflprincess]

11. 2019 - the CBO say there will be some relief by 2019

meanwhile many of us will still be looking at thousands of dollars in out of pocket copays + premiums that get paid to private insurance companies. This bill is just a way to keep United Health Care posting record profits.

Meanwhile, we have Medicare, a system that was set up and running 11 months after the bill passed and that could be expanded to all of us.

[mzmolly]

12. 2019?

That's not going to help get anyone re-elected if true.

[dflprincess]

18. 1) The high out of pocket expenses are really lame

and will discourage people from seeking treatment.

2) The requirement that most of us will be forced to continue to shovel money to the for profits or face a penalty

3) The CBO's estimate that only 10 million people will be eligible for the public option by 2019.

4) Calling this "reform" is really lame.

[John Q. Citizen]

10. According to the CBO the public pool will have at most about 10 million enrolles by 2019. What we

have in HR3200 is essentially Romney Care, the system in place in Massachusetts. Mandatory insurance purchase from private insurance companies, and tax subsidies for lower income people. It's a bonanza for the insurance industry and as costs raise benefits will be cut. The CBO says no savings at all from the public option.

Health insurance stocks are doing about as well as all stocks, so you know investors realize that HR3200 will never lead to single payer. If anything, it will give the insurance industry more money and power than they have now.

That strikes me as ironic really, because if Americans had wanted Romney Care why didn't they just elect Romney?

Which is what they will probably do in 2012 if this is as good as it gets.

[grahamhgreen]

14. It sucks, but the state single payer amendment by Kucinich makes it barely palatable. 11 months is

the time it took for medicaid to be implemented after it passed, BTW.

[vind1xth3avenger]

15. This is not about health-care, it is about the POWER OF THE STATE.

This is not about health-care, it is about the POWER OF THE STATE.




Since the “journalists” haven’t read the 1,000 plus page long Health Care bill you may not know about the following atrocities in the Bill:

“Pg 22 of the Health Care Bill MANDATES the Govt will audit books of ALL EMPLOYERS that self-insure!!

Pg 30 Sec 123- THERE WILL BE A GOVT COMMITTEE that decides what treatments/benefits you get.

Pg 29 lines 4-16 - YOUR HEALTHCARE IS RATIONED!!!

Pg 42 - The “Health Choices Commissioner” will choose your HC Benefits for you. You have no choice!

PG 50 Section 152- HC will be provided to ALL non-US citizens, illegal or otherwise.

Pg 53- Severability (KEY GEM)

“If any provision of the Act, or any application of such provision to any person or circumstance, is held to be unconstitutional, the remainder of the provisions of this Act and the application of the provision to any other person or circumstance shall not be affected.”

Pg 58 - Govt will have real-time access to individual’s finances & a National ID Healthcard will be issued!

Pg 59 lines 21-24- Govt will have direct access to your bank accounts for electronic funds transfer

PG 65 Sec 164 is a payoff subsidized plan for retirees and their families in Unions & community organizations (ACORN).

Pg 72 Lines 8-14 Govt is creating an HC Exchange to bring private HC plans under Govt control.

PG 84 Sec 203 - Govt mandates ALL benefit packages for private HC plans in the Exchange

PG 85 Line 7 - Specs for Benefit Levels for Plans = The Govt will ration your Healthcare!

PG 91 Lines 4-7- Govt mandates linguistic appropriate services. Example: Translation for illegal aliens

Pg 95 Lines 8-18 The Govt will use groups i.e., ACORN & Americorps to sign up individuals. for Govt HC plan.

PG 85 Line 7 - Specs of Benefit Levels For Plans. #AARP members- Your Health care WILL be rationed

PG 102 Lines 12-18- Medicaid-Eligible Individual will be automatically enrolled in Medicaid. No choice.

pg 124 lines 24-25 No company can sue GOVT on price fixing. No “judicial review” against Govt Monopoly.

pg 127 Lines 1-16- RE: Doctors- The Govt will tell YOU what you can make.

Pg 145 Line 15-17 An Employer MUST auto-enroll employees into public option plan. NO CHOICE

Pg 126 Lines 22-25 Employers MUST pay for HC for part time employees AND their families.

Pg 149 Lines 16-24 ANY Employer w/ payroll $400k & above who doesn’t provide public option pays 8% tax on all payroll.

PG 150 Lines 9-13- Biz w payroll between 251k & 400k who doesn’t provide pub. opt pays 2-6% tax on all payroll

Pg 167 Lines 18-23 ANY individual who doesn’t have acceptable HC according to Govt will be taxed 2.5% of income.

Pg 170 Lines 1-3 Any NONRESIDENT Alien is EXEMPT from individual taxes. (Americans will pay)

Pg 195 -Officers & employees of HC Admin (GOVT) will have access to ALL Americans financial/personal records

PG 203 Line 14-15- “The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax.” Yes, it actualy says that.

Pg 239 Line 14-24-Govt will reduce physician services for Medicaid. Seniors, low income, poor will be affected. Expendable.

Pg 241 Line 6-8- Doctors, doesn’t matter what specialty you have, you’ll all be paid the same.

PG 253 Line 10-18 Govt sets value of Dr’s time, professional judgment, etc. Literally sets the value of humans.

PG 265 Sec 1131-Govt mandates & controls productivity for private HC industries

PG 268 Sec 1141- Fed Govt regulates rental & purchase of power driven wheelchairs.

PG 272 SEC. 1145- TREATMENT OF CERTAIN CANCER HOSPITALS - Cancer patients - welcome to rationing!

Page 280 Sec 1151- The Govt will penalize hospitals for what Govt deems “preventable re-admissions.”

Pg 298 Lines 9-11- Doctors, treat a patient during initial admission that results in a readmission? Govt will penalize you.

Pg 317 L 13-20- OMG!! PROHIBITION on ownership/investment. Govt tells Drs. what/how much they can own.

Pg 317-318 lines 21-25,1-3: PROHIBITION on expansion- Govt is mandating hospitals cannot expand.

pg 321 2-13: Hospitals have opportunity to apply for exception BUT community input required. Can you say ACORN?!!

Pg335 Lines 16-25, Pg 336-339 - Govt mandates establishment of outcome based measures. HC the way they want. Rationing.

Pg 341 Lines 3-9: Govt has authority to disqualify Medicare Adv Plans, HMOs, etc. Forcing people into Govt plan

Pg 354 Sec 1177 - Govt will RESTRICT enrollment of Special needs people! WTF. My sister has downs syndrome!!

Pg 379 Sec 1191- Govt creates more bureaucracy - “Telehealth Advisory Committee.” Can you say HC by phone?

PG 425 Lines 4-12 Govt mandates “Advanced Care Planning Consultations.”

PG 425 the Federal Government will require EVERYONE who is on Social Security to undergo a counseling session every 5 years with the objective being that they will explain to them just how to end their own life earlier. in effect it does actually say this ... regardless of your health you will be required to discuss your death from age 65 onward.. it is worded

•HR 3200 IH : line 18
An explanation by the practitioner of the continuum of end-of-life services and supports available, including palliative care and hospice, and benefits for such services and supports that are available under this title.

Pg 425 Lines 17-19: Govt will instruct & consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney. Mandatory!

PG 425 Lines 22-25, 426 Lines 1-3: Govt provides approved list of end of life resources, guiding you in death.

PG 427 Lines 15-24: Govt mandates program for orders for end of life. The Govt has a say in how your life ends.

Pg 429 Lines 1-9: An “advanced care planning consult” will be used frequently as patients health deteriorates

PG 429 Lines 10-12: “advanced care consultation” may include an ORDER for end of life plans. AN ORDER from the Government.

Pg 429 Lines 13-25 - The govt will specify which Doctors can write an end of life order.

PG 430 Lines 11-15- The Govt will decide what level of treatment you will have at end of life.

Pg 469 - Community Based Home Medical Services = Non profit organizations. Hello, ACORN Medical Services here!!?

Page 472 Lines 14-17: PAYMENT TO COMMUNITY-BASED ORG. 1 monthly payment to a community-based org. Like ACORN?

PG 489 Sec 1308: The Govt will cover Marriage & Family therapy. Which means they will insert Govt into your marriage.

Pg 494-498: Govt will cover Mental Health Services including defining, creating, rationing those services.”

PG 502 Section 1181 Center for Comparative Effectiveness Research Established. - Hello Big Brother - Literally.

PG 502 Line 5-18 Government builds the “Center” to conduct, support, & synthesize research to define our HealthCare Services.

PG 503 Line 13-19 Government will build registries and data networks from YOUR electronic medical records.

PG 503 Line 21-25 Government may secure data directly from any department or agency of the US including your data.

PG 504 Line 6-10 The “Center” will collect data both published & unpublished (that means public & your private info)

PG 506 Line 19-21 The Center will recommend policies that would allow for public access of data

PG 518 Line 21-25 The Commission will have input from HealthCare consumer reps - Can you say unions & ACORN?

PG 524 18-22 Comparative Effectiveness Research Trust Fund set up. More taxes for ALL.

PG 525-620 deals with the Government basically taking over nursing homes,

PGs 525-620 deals with the Govt basically taking over nursing homes,long-term care facilities (think assisted living) through regulations of the facilities, the owners of sd facilities, the employees of sd facilities and even the land owners of that sd facilities reside on. Additionally as you read these 90+ pages you can come to the conclusion that any Health related svcs will be determined and rationed by the Govt for our senior citizens and others in nursing homes. This one post should do enough to raise awareness of the control the Govt is exerting over the older population of American citizens.

PG 620 Line 1-9 The Government will define, prioritize, and nationalize your Health Care Services.

PG 621 Lines 20-25 Government will define what Quality means in HealthCare. Since when does Government know about quality?

PG 622 Lines 2-9 To pay for the quality Standards Government will transfer $$ from to other Government Trust Funds. More Taxes.

PG 624 “Quality” measures shall be designed to assess outcomes & functional status of patients.

G 628 Section 1443 Government will give “Multi-Stake Holders” Pre-Rule Making input into Selection of “Quality” Measures.

PG 630 9-24/631 1-9 Those Multi-stake holder groups including Unions & groups like ACORN deciding HealthCare quality.

PG 632 Lines 14-25 The Government may implement any “Quality measure” of HealthCare Services as they see fit.

PG 633 14-25/ 634 1-9 The Secretary may issue non-endorsed “Quality Measures” for Physician Services & Dialysis Services.

PG 635 - 653 Physicians Payments Sunshine Provision - Government wants to shine sunlight on Docs but not Government.

PG 654-659 Public Reporting on Health Care-Associated Infections - Looks okay.

PG 660-671 Doctors in Residency - Government will tell you where your residency will be, thus where you’ll live.

PG 676-686 Government will regulate hospitals in EVERY aspect of residency programs, including teaching hospitals.

PG 686-700 Increased Funding to Fight Waste, Fraud, and Abuse. You mean the Government with an $18 mil website?

PGs 701-704 Section 1619 If your part of HealthCare plan that isn’t in Government HealthCare Exchange but you qualify for Federal aid, no payment.

705-709 SEC. 1128 If Secretary gets complaints (ACORN) on HealthCare provider or supplier, Government can do background check.

G 711 Lines 8-14 The Secretary has broad powers to deny HealthCare providers/suppliers admittance into HealthCare Exchange.

Pg 719-720 Section 1637 ANY Doctor who orders durable medical equipment or home medical services MUST be enrolled in Medicare.

PG 722 Section 1639 Government Mandates Doctors must have face-to-face with patient to certify patient for Home Health Services.

PG 724 Lines 16-22 Government reserves right to apply face-to-face certification for patient to ANY other HealthCare service.

PG 724 23-25 PG 725 1-5 The same Government certifications will apply to medicaid & CHIP (your kids) Pg 735 lines 16-25 For law enforcement purposes, the Secretary of Health & Human Services will give Attorney General access to ALL data.

PG 740-757 Government sets guidelines for subsidizing the uninsured (That’s your tax dollars peeps) Pg 757-762 Fed Government will shift burden of payments to Disproportionate Share Hospitals (DSH) to States. (Taxes)

Page 763 1-8 No DS/EA hospitals will be paid unless they provide services without regard to national origin Pg 765 Section 1711 Government will require Preventative Services including vaccines. (Choice?)

Pg 768 Section 1713 Government - Nurse Home Visitation Services (Hello union paybacks)

Pg 769 3-5 Nurse Home Visit Services - “increasing birth intervals between pregnancies.” Government Abortions anyone?

Pg 769 11-14 Nurse Home Visit Services include-economic self-sufficiency, employment advancement, school-readiness.

Pg 769 3-5 Nurse Home Visit Services - “increasing birth intervals between pregnancies.” Government ABORTIONS anyone?

Pg 770 SEC 1714 Federal Government mandates eligibility for State Family Planning Services. Say abortion & State Sovereign.

Pg 789-797 Government will set & mandate drug prices, controlling which drugs will brought to market. Bye innovation

Pgs 797-800 SEC. 1744 PAYMENTS for grad medical education. The government will now control Drs education. PG 801 Sec 1751 The Government will decide which Health care conditions will be paid. Say RATION!

Pg 810 SEC. 1759. Billing Agents, clearinghouses, etc. required to register. Government takes over private payment system.

Page 820-824 Sec 1801 Government will identify individuals ineligible for subsidies. Will access all personal finances.

Pg 824-829 SEC. 1802. Government Sets up Comparative Effectiveness Research Trust Fund. Another tax black hole.

PG 829-833 Government will impose a fee on ALL private health insurance plans including self insured to pay for Trust Fund!

PG 835 11-13 fees imposed by Government for Trust Fund shall be treated as if they were taxes.

838-840 Government will design & implement Home Visitation Program for families with young kids & families expecting kids.

PG 844-845 This Home Visitation Program includes Government coming into your house & telling you how to parent!!!

Pg 859 Government will establish a Public Health Fund at a cost of $88,800,000,000. Yes thats Billion.

PG 865 to 876 The NHS Corps is a program where Drs. perform mandatory HealthCare for 2 years for part loan repayment.

PG 876-892 The Government takes over the education of our Medical students and Drs.

PG 898 The Government will establish a Public Health Workforce Corps. to ensure supply of public health professionals.

PG 898 The Public health workforce corps shall consist of officers of Regular & Reserve Corps of Service.

898 The Public health workforce corps shall consist of civilian employees of the U.S. as Secretary deems.

PG 900 The Public Health Workforce Corps includes veterinarians.

901 The Public Health Workforce Corps WILL include commissioned Regular & Reserve Officers. HealthCare Draft?

PG 910 The Government will develop, build & run Public Health Training Centers.

PG 913-914 Government starts a HealthCare affirmative action program thru guise of diversity scholarships.

PG 915 SEC. 2251. Government MANDATES Cultural & linguistic competency training for HealthCare professionals.

Pg 932 The Government will establish Preventative & Wellness Trust fund - intial cost of $30,800,000,000-Billion.

PG 935 21-22 Government will identify specific goals & objectives for prevention & wellness activities. Control You!!

PG 936 Government will develop “Healthy People & National Public Health Performance Standards” Tell me what to eat?

PG 942 Lines 22-25 More Government? Offices of Surgeon General -Public Health Services, Minority Health, Women’s Health - THIS MEANS TAX DOLLARS USED TO PAY FOR ALL ABORTIONS.

PG 950- 980 BIG Government core public health infrastructure includes workforce capacity, lab systems; health information systems, etc

PG 993 Government will establish school based health clinics. Your kids wont have a chance.

PG 994 School Based Health Clinic will be integrated into the school environment.

PG 1001 The Government will establish a National Medical Device Registry. Will you be tracked?

PG 1003 9-11 National Medical Dev Reg ‘‘(iii) other postmarket device surveillance activities” you WILL be tracked.

PG 1018 States give up some of their State Sovereignty.

PEOPLE, THIS IS IT. YOU CAN NO LONGER IGNORE THIS BLATANT TAKEOVER OF OUR COUNTRY.



I beg you if you’ve never read Animal Farm, 1984 and Atlas Shrugged please, please, do.


Continue reading to learn about the racial preferences mandated by the bill.

The Democrats’ health care bill creates a very significant financial incentive for medical schools and other entities to lower admission standards for “individuals who are from underrepresented minority groups” if that is what it takes to have the winning “demonstrated record”.

On page 879-880, the bill states that the Secretary of Health and Human Services:

“shall make grants to, or enter into contracts with, eligible entities . . . to operate a professional training program in the field of family medicine, general internal medicine, general pediatrics, or geriatrics, to provide financial assistance and traineeships and fellowships to those students, interns, residents or physicians who plan to work in or teach in the field of family medicine, general internal medicine, general pediatrics, or geriatrics.”

On page 881-882 the bill states:

“In awarding grants or contracts under this section, the Secretary shall give preference to entities that have a demonstrated record of the following: . . . Training individuals who are from underrepresented minority groups or disadvantaged backgrounds.”

On page 883 the bill states:
“The Secretary shall make grants to, or enter into contracts with, eligible entities . . . to operate or participate in an established primary care residency training program, which may include-(A) planning and developing curricula; (B) recruitment and training of residents; and (C) retention of faculty.”

On page 884-885 the bill states:

“In awarding grants and contracts . . . the Secretary shall give preference to entities that have a demonstrated record of training . . . individuals who are from underrepresented minority groups or disadvantaged backgrounds . . . .”

On page 887-889 the bill states that the

“Secretary shall make grants to, or enter into contracts with, eligible entities . . . to operate a professional training program for oral health professionals, to provide financial assistance and traineeships and fellowships to those professionals who plan to work in or teach general, pediatric, or public health dentistry, or dental hygiene, to establish, maintain, or improve academic administrative units (including departments, divisions, or other appropriate units) in the specialties of general, pediatric, or public health dentistry, to operate a loan repayment program for full-time faculty in a program of general, pediatric, or public health dentistry.”

On page 889-890 the bill states:

“In awarding grants or contracts under this section, the Secretary shall give preference to entities that have a demonstrated record of the following: . . . Training individuals who are from underrepresented minority groups or disadvantaged backgrounds.”

On page 908-909 the bill states: “The Secretary shall award grants and contracts to eligible entities” to do the same things for the field of public health as the Secretary can do for dentistry.

On page 909 the bill states:

“In awarding grants or contracts under this section, the Secretary shall give preference to entities that have a demonstrated record of the following: . . . Training individuals who are from underrepresented minority groups or disadvantaged backgrounds.”




I inplure you to vet everything here and tell me where this is inncorect.
useing the evidence from the bill itself.

[iverglas]

17. google this:

"On page 889-890 the bill states"

Anybody who writes things like "I inplure you", "inncorect" and "useing" pretty obviously did not write that screed.

Apparently someone named Peter Fleckstein did.

http://blog.flecksoflife.com/

Recent Posts

* The HC Monstrosity-All 1,018 Pages
* The Freedom of the Individual
* Americans – What the hell is wrong with you?
* The Art of Distraction Obama Style
* Sotomayor – An Activist’s Confused Activist

Yes, just the sort of thing DU members would be getting their info, analysis and opinion from.

[Shagbark Hickory]

16. I could have written a healthcare bill on just one sheet of paper...

It would go like this.

"All Americans receive a government medicare card that entitles them to free healthcare at public health centers and participating private health centers and hospitals. The government shall set up public clinics and hospitals and employ staff including doctors & nurses, and negotiate prices with drug companies. Government shall negotiate and pay medical school tuitions for doctors and nurses that agree to work within the public health system. Anyone with a government issued medicare card that walks into a public health system facility shall receive as much care as they need to be made well at no charge. Funding for the public health system will be created by a 2% sales tax, ending the war in iraq and afganistan, and reversing the bush tax cuts."

Well, it looks like I re-wrote the bill in one paragraph. I should become a senator.