Does anyone else here eat raw vegetarian?

[leftyladyfrommo]

I'm just curious if I'm the only one.

My blood pressure has dropped dramatically. Usually its about 140 to 145 over 90 or 95. Now its down to 111/77. I don't think its all salt. The fruits and vegetables (mainly green vegetables) that I eat are also natural diuretics.

[tabatha]

1. You are also probably getting more Potassium and Magnesium.

[groovedaddy]

2. Check out this website:

http://www.raw-living-food-success.com/

[leftyladyfrommo]

46. Thank you. n't

[salvorhardin]

3. I usually like my vegetarians medium well-done.

Just a little bit of pink in the middle and some A-1 sauce on top. :silly:

[ChairmanAgnostic]

4. No, I cook my vegetarians slowly on an open flame.

Seriously, going meatless sounds like a good deal. I may try it, but have no idea how to do it safely. Any reading material that you could recommend?

I've read many arguments that humans are omnivores. Just look at our dentation for their intended use.

[Speck Tater]

5. My BP went fromt he 160's to the 120's by changing only ONE thing about my diet.

I now keep my sodium below 1000 mg per day. That made all the difference in the world. I still eat fish and chicken and a limited amount of beef. So while you may not "think" it's all salt, have you checked that conclusion, or is it just a wild guess? Double check it by running some controlled trials like I did.

[Kalun D]

6. Since about 1996

It's the best diet from a genetic standpoint, it's what we were originally designed to eat

you have to be careful sometimes though depending on your body type, to get all the vitamins and nutrients that you need. Meat is concentrated protein and nutrients, if you are used to it's effects it takes some adjustment when you stop eating it. One way is to get a juicer. It's hard to eat a 5 pound bag of carrots in 2 weeks but you can drink that much in 2 days.

I call it a live food diet as opposed to a dead food diet, any time you cook over 108 F you kill the food. It's like a flower, it will live after you pick it but cooking kills it immediately

there's 3 types of foods, detrimental, neutral, and healing. the green veggies fall into the healing category. With certain green diets you can actually reverse things like cancer and diabetes.

[paulsby]

9. utter rubbish

*if* it was the best diet from a genetic standpoint than it wouldn't lack b12, an ESSENTIAL nutrient

b12 does NOT exist in the plant kingdom. it is ONLY found in animal sources. now, many producers FORTIFY their products with b12. but w/o artificial fortification, there is no way a raw vegetarian woudl GET b12.

so, clearly it's NOT what nature intended.

science. it's what's for dinner

cites available on request.

[Kalun D]

15. Yes, Your Post is Utter Rubbish

Ever heard of Brewers yeast? It is a natural B12 source and not animal, it's properties were discovered 1000's of years ago in the form of floating wild yeasts.

And it shouldn't be assumed I'm talking in absolutes, we evolved from apes which are essentially vegan excepting occasional insects and some small animals

I'm promoting the superiority of a raw vegan diet. Not that raw meat is not just as good or better but that in the current day vegan is more viable from a conservation standpoint. If everyone on the planet ate meat like Americans do the Earth would die.

And cooking ruins a large part of the benefit of any food including meat. So you use up 32 pounds of plant matter to raise 1 pound of beef, and then you ruin 80 percent of it's nutritional value with cooking. All for your fricking decadent desensitized pallet.

""science. it's what's for dinner""

Science, it's what's poisoning your dinner

""cites available on request""

I don't need cites, I can do a nutritional beat-down from memory.

[paulsby]

17. ok, i was wrong

because i thought yeast was technically not considered a form of plant life, but as a form of fungi it is

fair enuf.

i WAS aware yeast had b12. i didn't realize yeast wasn't animal life then. i thought it technically was.

live and learn

;p

[Kalun D]

19. Fair is Fair

Okay then, I'll admit to my hyperbole

we are technically omnivores, made to eat plants and animals

be I still maintain that heating food in general terms degrades it's nutritional content

[paulsby]

20. my issue wasn't the heating part

it was the vegetarian part

it referenced raw VEGETARIAN diet.

meat has a lot of bitchen stuff in it

and a lot of the problems we have vis a vis meat in our society isn't a problem with MEAT as nature intended, but with factory produced meat

cows, for example, that eat a natural (grass) diet have a MUCH better EFA profile and taste better fwiw. less cholesterol and less arachidinoic acid.

natural tilapia is quite healthy. farm raised tilapia often has higher arachidinoic acid than beef, and loses some benefits

farm raised salmon, has to be DIED pink because it doesn't get the krill in its diet that gives it a wonderful fat profile

meat is good stuff

also, as a strength athlete, i find meat to be invaluable for training. even with modern supplementation (protein powders, etc.) meat makes a difference

i have yet to see a good vegan strength athlete.

otoh, i will admit there is one guy in the MMA world (that i know of) that is pretty darn good and he is vegan.

[flvegan]

22. Hi. Now you have.

Seen a good vegan strength athlete.

[paulsby]

25. NOT YET.

you got video? :)

what do you deadlift, clean and jerk and how far can you throw the shot?

i'd ask you about your snatch, but i have to be discreet

[flvegan]

26. No, I'm not an egomaniac.

I'm also a different sort of strength athlete in that I'm a bodybuilder (which you'll pooh-pooh like most "powerlifters").

[paulsby]

27. why do u assume i'm a powerlifter?

i also don't "poo poo" bodybuilders. they are brothers and sisters in the iron game

first of all ,there are some PHENOMENALLY strong bodybuilders. ronnie coleman was very very very strong, for instance

when i say strength athlete, i include strongman, highland games, olympic style weightlifting, arm wrestler, powerlifter, etc.

i am not sure i would include bbing as a "strength athlete", because bbers, as opposed to the other sports are not tested FOR their strength.

but the reality is to achieve such hypertrophy, they are generally very strong.

there is a goals difference. for a strength athlete, the GOAL is lifting the weight, or throwing the object. the MEANS they use to get better are resistance training. muscles are a means TO an end, but not THE end. and of course neuromuscular efficiency, timing, proprioreception, explosiveness, etc. are very important

for a bber, the GOAL is the muscles themselves. lifting of weights is the means to the goal, but it's not THE goal. it doesn't matter if bodybuilder A can lift more than B in exercise C. it matters who better meets the judging criteria (symmetry, leanness, definition, posing skill, size, etc.)

i have immense respect for bbing, and whether they are "strength athletes" is just a semantical wank.

they are brothers in the iron game, regardless

and again, don't make assumptions. i never said i was a powerlifter. (and powerlifting is misnamed, since the power generated in the powerlifts PALES in comparison to , for example, the C&J. it's not even CLOSE)

powerlifting should be called "limit lifting" or "strength lifting" or something

[flvegan]

28. I thought you had mentioned it in a previous post here.

If you're not, and I've confused you with someone else, I apologize for that.

Semantics aside, bodybuilders are strength athletes in that you can't really be one without being quite strong. And, as a vegan, and quite likely one of the biggest there are, you've now met one (so to speak).

[paulsby]

29. right

if by strength athlete, you mean "they are strong as fuck" they are strength athletes.

if by strength athlete, you mean "their sport is a test OF their strength", then they aren't

i generally go by the latter, but again, that's just a word definition wank

either way, they are brothers and sisters in the iron game

imo, arguably the greatest strength feat ever...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ISvwEH3N9Bw

you don't need big muscles if you have explosiveness, timing, technique, and are... sagir!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5yifpd3RBQ

the womens

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHAvZeEC1mw&feature=related

[flvegan]

35. I thought it obvious that I meant "they are strong as fuck"

and that they, and I, were strength athletes.

Anyone can go by "their sport" and that's fine.

Doesn't mean they don't look the fool at the gym next to me.

And yes, all gym rats are Brothers and Sisters in Iron.

[Flipper999]

55. Some other vegetarian/vegan atheletes

Can be found on this site: http://www.veganbodybuilding.com/

I'm especially impressed with this guy's physique: http://www.veganbodybuilding.com/?page=bio_avi

Not to pile on or anything paulsby. I'm not even a vegetarian myself. I'm just impressed with the results these folks have gotten on a vegan diet.

[Kalun D]

31. Meat is concentrated

compared to plant food but cooking hurts the nutrition. In Europe they have steak tartar. In Japan they eat a lot of sashimi and are much more productive and healthy compared to Americans

the guy that won the first Ironman Triathalon (and AFAIK subsequent ones) was a vegan although he occasionally ate sashimi. Guess he might not be considered a strength athlete though.

I agree with you about factory meat though it's bogus.

I do know from experience that it's a lot easier to stay healthy eating meat because it is so concentrated. It took me several years of research to learn what I needed in my vegan diet to stay as healthy and energetic as when I ate meat.

[paulsby]

32. i say this as a former endurance athlete

triathletes are NOT strength athletes.

i think "concentrated" is a nice way to put it. liver, for example, is simply chock full

fwiw, i eat a fair amount of raw fish and raw beef

my favorite way to do the raw beef is sliced very thin with some green onion, hoisin sauce, a couple of drops of fish sauce, and some lime

fantastic.

[haikugal]

10. Can you recommend a good juicer?

[Kalun D]

16. Something Like the Juiceman

It's a centrifugal juicer that has a tapered basket that slings the pulp out the back so you don't have to stop and empty it. It has a large mouth so you don't have to cut everything up as small, and it's runs at high RPM so it juices faster.

The Juiceman won't do thing's like wheatgrass but you can get the same green from spinach.

the best tip to save time on juicing is to juice from a 1/2 to 1 gallon at a time every 5 days or so instead of making 1 or 2 juices a day. But some like it fresher better.

[Name removed]

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[Codeine]

11. I find it amusing

that you extol how natural this way of eating is while simultaneously saying that you'll need to use a juicer to get the nutrients you need.

Seriously, cook your food. It makes it more digestible and allows for greater nutrient absorption.

[Kalun D]

12. Don't ever stop

deluding yourself

keep ruining your food by killing the beneficial stuff that's in it before you eat it.

If it's one thing that Americans are it's ignorant of nutrition

why do you think we pay the most for health care yet rank 36th in the world, a major part of that is a piss poor diet. Americans make themselves sick by being oblivious to what they shove down their gullet every day.

[trotsky]

14. If you're referring to enzymes, please remember two things:

1) They aren't alive.
2) Our very own digestive systems DESTROY any active enzymes we consume.

There's a lot of misinformation out there from self-styled "health gurus." Learn to think about things critically and understand the science.

[Name removed]

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[Kalun D]

13. Falsely amused

""that you extol how natural this way of eating is while simultaneously saying that you'll need to use a juicer to get the nutrients you need.""

I was referring to the food as natural, not the process, sorry you missed that. My life doesn't give me time to do it the slow way sorry.

The electricity of the juicer (from hydroelectric) is more than offset by the fact I'm a vegan, as it takes 32 pounds of plant food to produce 1 pound of beef.

[Codeine]

21. I've been a vegan for twenty years, sans juicer.

I also normally cook at least some of my veggies. I'm quite healthy, as is every other vegan I've ever known, all of whom also cook their food and live without juicing. It's just plain silly to skip a process that helps make food more easily digested.

Actually, I do own a juicer, come to think of it -- somebody gave it to me when they were moving. Never took it out of the box.

[Kalun D]

30. Candle

I burn the candle at both ends up the middle and around the back. I need the edge that juicing gives, it may also have something to do with body type. In our long dreary winters in Seattle I'll get sunlight deprivation and have some sashimi to counter it. Once you've had sashimi and have gotten used to it cooked fish just tastes wrong, you can actually feel the difference as you eat it. I'll do like stirfry but if you're careful it doesn't overheat veggies.

I discovered juicing during a previous sunlight deprivation period. Working indoors 2 fulltime jobs 6 days a week, no sunlight. Almost had a nervous breakdown. Juicing allowed me to continue at the same pace.

cooking does make food easier to digest, so does juicing. Ease of digestion doesn't necessarily equate to quality of nutrition gained.

[Codeine]

33. I thought you said you were vegan.

Sashimi? :shrug:

[Kalun D]

34. Generally

I eat sashimi about 3 times a year, depending on how bad the winter gets, or if there's a particularly grueling physical task planned.

[superduperfarleft]

36. If you eat fish, you're not vegan. Even if it's "only" 3 times a year.

Hate to break it to you.

And you also make it harder for us real vegans to communicate to omnivores what we will and will not eat. Thanks to people like you, people offer me chicken or fish when I tell them I'm vegan. Thanks.

[Kalun D]

40. hey hey hey hey hey

3 meals out of a year

since I eat about 4 a day if you count snacks between meals as a meal

that's 1460 meals a year

so I'm 99.79452055 percent a vegan

g i v e m e a b r e a k

LOLZ!!!!

[Name removed]

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[Kalun D]

47. Your Post is Offensive

I don't care what you think

I know I'm a vegan

and the offensive sexual connotation violates DU rules

[Codeine]

48. No real dog in this fight,

but you're not a vegan. Veganism is an all-or-nothing thing, by definition. The word has a specific meaning. You're an omnivore with an incredibly healthy diet. I don't see anything wrong with that. :shrug: Why call yourself something you're not?

[Kalun D]

53. I'm 99.79452055 percent a vegan

I'm 99.79452055 percent a vegan

and .20547945 percent omnivore

[superduperfarleft]

54. Donald Watson disagrees.

"The word "veganism" denotes a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude — as far as is possible and practical — all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of humans, animals and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals."

Look, we understand that you want to be part of the coolest club on Earth, but continuing to contribute to and apologize for animal exploitation completely disqualifies you. Sucks for you, the super-secret club meetings are awesome.

[trotsky]

56. It's like saying you are a virgin...

but having sex a couple of times a year.

[uppityperson]

43. I wonder if you have to use a "natural" juicer? Use your own power to make it work, etc?

[Name removed]

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[Oregone]

7. We have a raw veggie restaraunt in my town

Id rather eat poison and move to Haiti than eat there again

[Kalun D]

18. Many Restaurants

have a raw food section, it's called the salad bar.

[superduperfarleft]

38. If you're in Toronto, there's an excellent raw restaurant named Live. n/t

[niceypoo]

8. Too much chewing for me

Start to feel like Im grazing. Ill just stick with my bacon and pot roast.

[flvegan]

23. I'm probably at around 35% raw.

When I'm at the doctor, they normally run some tests twice because they don't believe them. My last cholesterol screening, the nurse was absolutely convinced that her reading was wrong. Took it 3 times.

[klm55500]

24. not a chance

[superduperfarleft]

37. I enjoy going to raw restaurants when I can.

It's amazing the kinds of things good ones can do without cooking.

I'm skeptical of the health benefits, though, other than the usual benefits you get from eschewing meat products and having a more vegetable-centered diet.

[Codeine]

39. That's pretty much my view.

I eat veggies raw because some veggies taste great raw (cauliflower with hummus, OMG!) but they're really not any healthier than properly cooked veggies. And some greens especially are simply inedible without a good cooking.

[superduperfarleft]

41. what, you don't love raw eggplant?

But an almond-paste sushi is amaaaaazing.

[leftyladyfrommo]

45. Whoa. Didn't mean to start an argument.

I really don't have an issue with other people's diets. I'm just concerned about my own health as I don't think I'm going to be able to afford medical insurance much longer.

Once you get used to eating raw stuff everything else just seems "dead." And not good. I have just lost all interest in eating meat or dairy products. Just not one bit interested in them.

I have a really good blender - not a juicer. I like to get the pulp.

I generally drink two quarts of green smoothies a day - 50% fruit and 50% leafy green veggies. And I also eat unsweetened coconut and raw pumpkin seeds and raw sunflower seeds.

Then along in the afternoon I have some sort of bean or lentil soup with Ezekiel Bread.

Feel great.

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[Orrex]

61. I only eat vegetarians after they've been properly cooked.

About ten minutes per pound, I believe, with just a suggestion of pink still lingering.

Delicious!