Italy bans kebabs and foreign food from cities

[Tab]

WTF??

The tomato comes from Peru and spaghetti was probably a gift from China.

It is, though, the “foreign” kebab that is being kicked out of Italian cities as it becomes the target of a campaign against ethnic food, backed by the centre-right Government of Silvio Berlusconi.

The drive to make Italians eat Italian, which was described by the Left and leading chefs as gastronomic racism, began in the town of Lucca this week, where the council banned any new ethnic food outlets from opening within the ancient city walls.

Yesterday it spread to Lombardy and its regional capital, Milan, which is also run by the centre Right. The antiimmigrant Northern League party brought in the restrictions “to protect local specialities from the growing popularity of ethnic cuisines”.

Luca Zaia, the Minister of Agriculture and a member of the Northern League from the Veneto region, applauded the authorities in Lucca and Milan for cracking down on nonItalian food. “We stand for tradition and the safeguarding of our culture,” he said.

Mr Zaia said that those ethnic restaurants allowed to operate “whether they serve kebabs, sushi or Chinese food” should “stop importing container loads of meat and fish from who knows where” and use only Italian ingredients.

Asked if he had ever eaten a kebab, Mr Zaia said: “No – and I defy anyone to prove the contrary. I prefer the dishes of my native Veneto. I even refuse to eat pineapple.”

[Tesha]

1. Food Snob!

I get trying to protect your country from dangerous imports... like milk from China that's contaminated.
I fully understand trying to promote your beloved traditions to increase tourism.
It makes sense to support your local products, especially when they are world famous.
There's no question that one way to balance a local economy is to buy from your closest neighbors.

but this guy is going waaaaay too far, suppose he's being paid off?

[Warpy]

2. No, he seems more like a garden variety sour xenophobe

who hates the smell of kebab stands as he goes to and from work.

It's funny, France usually produces more of those than Italy does, but it's the same mindset behind any sort of purification, whether it be purging sinful fiddle music or eliminating foreign words from one's language.

They want a world as unchanging as though it were dead and mummified.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

33. well stated. partly because i think their glory lies in their past and not in their future

[Tangerine LaBamba]

3. If you knew Lucca,

this ban might make some sense to you.

My best friend lives in a 16th century villa just outside Lucca, so I'm very familiar with the place. It's delicate, which might seem like a strange word to describe a city with such a tough history, but within the ancient walls that contain the city, there has been such a great influx of foreigners, I can understand the council's desire to preserve what they regard as their heritage, especially in terms of food.

We've eaten in all sorts of restaurants, but always return to the local establishments owned by natives. The fare of Tuscany is by far superior to anything else in Lucca.

It seems extreme, but my friend, who was born and raised in the Boston area, doesn't think so. He approves of the idea. And he's hardly anti-immigrant. He sees it as a matter of quality.

[NashVegas]

11. I Understand, But You May As Well Not Accept Immigrants

If you won't allow people to bring such an important part of their own culture.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

14. Yep

And that's probably next on the Mayor's agenda. The exodus from the Middle East into Western Europe has caused a lot of ill-will and trouble in Italy, France, the UK. Spain doesn't seem to have as much trouble with it, but Spain is unbelievably hip.

Just for fun, this is where my pal Gil lives. The photos truly do not do Villa Massei justice. It's on a big hill, overlooking the city:

http://tinyurl.com/ab3re3

[NashVegas]

19. Oh God I'm So Jealous

How do I get that gig?

Spainiards are probably aware they've got some remnants of the previous occupation, so ...

The West is feeling the direct results of 75 years of meddling in the Middle East.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

20. First,

be born to the father who came up with the idea of strip malls. That makes you unbelievably wealthy. Then, grow up to be the kind of man everyone should be, using your money not only to live well but to do an incredible amount of charity work with it. That's my friend, and I love him madly.

The place, in real life, is even more beautiful. Paul, who is the artist in the family, has written a wonderful book about the place, called "A Garden In Lucca." The European edition came out last year, with pictures.

My room is all white, including mosquito netting in the summer, around my big canopy bed. They spoil me.

You're right about the meddling, and our current invasions aren't doing any good, either. We need to get out of Iraq and Afghanistan and come to grips with the reality that we don't understand their culture and have no business trying to shove our ideas down their throats.

[hippywife]

4. I'm really of two minds on this.

I am not xenophobic and I love ethnic food of most all kinds so from that angle I wouldn't mind. But from another point of view, I can also see how the homogenization of the American landscape has had a deterimental effect on food and culture native to various areas of our country, too.

It's a really difficult issue, I'm sure. Maybe they can find a way to strike a compromise.

[grasswire]

5. It is an interesting dilemma

Tourism is so important there, and what tourists are seeking is the essential Italian experience and food. Don't Europeans -- hell, don't some American communities -- ban McDonald's already? Is this different from banning fast food restaurants? Maybe not. Some of our own communities would be more attractive without chain restaurants and chain retail operations.

[hippywife]

6. That's exactly the POV I was looking at.

But then all cultures are the blends of all the other ethnic cultures they have mingled with over centuries. It's kind of like they are only looking at the past and present, but only to a future that would preserve those, not necessarily what it might evolve to be. (This assumes the barring of McDonalds, et al.)

I'm the kind of person that believes that where one is born and their heritage is a matter of accident anyway and it's really ridiculous on so many levels to swell with pride because of it, ya know?

[Tab]

7. I think it depends on WHY you're there

We're foodies, so we have a different take on things, but there are plenty of tourists who are leery of "local" food and want something familiar to them. And it doesn't have to be the whole family, it could just be one spouse who insists on going somewhere he or she knows, and chances are that if they don't go out, they're only eating at their hotel, which I'll guess will also be a major chain.

And you are correct in that various cultures are trying to avoid being "Americanized", so to speak. Our culture is particularly insidious, and it's really not very old, when you think about it, compared to others. France, for instance, spends tens of millions of dollars a year to protect their "language" which, if you recall, was once the "language of diplomacy" and international business. It's not anymore, and is simply the language of just pretension and romance. Finland (I think) has restrictions on names given to children, so you can't just name a child "Dweezil Zappa" or whatever. The problem, of course, is that it results in a limited number of names, and so everyone and their brother is named Johannson.

I myself am not going to travel all the way to Europe to eat at frickin' Applebee's, but there are lots of people that want something familiar. So it works both ways, I guess.

I can say that where I live, whereas when I moved here from a much more rural setting (and, yes, I've lived in bigger cities), I thought there'd be a plethora of places interesting to eat, but being here I see that some 95% are major chains. That's not to say that I can't find good food, and there are some extremely interesting places to eat if you know where to look, but the majority are things like KFC, Pizza Hut, Applebee's, whatever.

[hippywife]

8. I had the same experience moving

from central Ohio to the Tulsa area. Chain after chain and it's only gotten worse.

However, if one is a tourist, I would suggest that if the local food isn't to one's liking then they need to travel somewhere that it is. I personally have no love for certain cuisines so I have no desire to travel there. Of course, being a foodie, that would be my first consideration. :rofl:

[Tab]

9. Yeah, well, some people have different agendas

They want to see the Pope, or Trevi Fountain, or whatever. Food isn't high on their list.

I wouldn't travel to Italy just for the food, unless I was doing one of those week-long cooking excursions, which I would love to do. That said, I have a few other countries that I would put higher on my list, food-wise.

[Tesha]

10. The food was amazing....

In Genoa we were walking down a little alley by the docks and a waiter comes out of his restaurant and urges us in, seats us and proceeds to take us to foodie-heaven. From the dock to the table, lots of pride, skill and one more thing - tradition. Everywhere we went small local places were amazing... oh and if you can't find a restaurant, go to a grocery store and put together a picnic.... mmmmm

[Retrograde]

13. I second the picnic suggestion

and if you plan to be someplace for several days, consider looking into renting a studio apartment or looking for an "apartel": sort of a cross between an apartment and a hotel. Once you have cooking facilities you have a great reason to look for the local markets.

I like to occasionally try local versions of ethnic food (e.g., Ethiopian in Germany, Indian in Japan) to see how it's modified for local tastes. When I was lucky enough to go to Japan fairly frequently on business I once went with my local co-workers to an Italian restaurant near the office: we had a lot of fun trying to figure out what we were eating, since most of them were unfamiliar with Italian cuisine and the Americans were trying to guess by sounding out the katakana names.

I'm planning a trip to Italy soon, and while I wasn't planning on doing so before I now want to go to Lucca to get a kabob. I'll also try all the local specialties I feasibly can.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

15. The thing about Italy

is that even when it's not great food, it's still pretty good.

I've had bad restaurant meals in Italy, but they have been few and far between.

I'm Italian. I'm so biased, I should just shut up now................

[Tab]

18. And my wie is too, effffffectively

(my keyboard is screwed up, so orgive me. Mainly the f key)

I'd still love to go there. Just sayin' that or some people the ood isn't the priority. I do agree that at least, for me, it'd be a priority but for others it's not. I''d love to get into certain kitchens, but that doesn't carry over to everyone.

[hippywife]

16. Yeah but not eating the local cuisine

and only frequenting familiar chains smacks of the ugly American abroad, don't you think?

I wouldn't travel there just for the food, either, although it would be one of my top two considerations. Even before I was a foodie (or knew I was, maybe?) I would think about places I would like to travel and scratch off the ones where I didn't like the cuisine. Why go if you're gonna be miserable coz you can't eat?

[The empressof all]

12. I confess to eating at Wendy's in Venice

I have also eaten at several McDonalds in France. I even stayed at a place called Mr Bed which is a chain of motels in France similar to our Motel 6. I haven't a clue if they are still in business. Sometimes you do want something familiar, and quick. I knew what to expect and I got it. Don't kid yourself it's not hard to find bad fast food in Europe and I'm not just talking about the American chains.

I think this has more to do with anti immigration/anti Romanian/anti Turkish sensibilities mixed in with regional pride and focus on the financial benefits of supporting local foods. It's good, it's bad....the Kebab guy should throw a locally produced kebab into a good tomato sauce, throw it on a roll and call it an Italian hoagie. :shrug:

It's also not hard to find decent "ethnic" food in Europe.

[Tab]

17. Wendy's in Venice???

I, um, uh... '

I guess I'm at a loss for words, and that's not easy to do...

[The empressof all]

21. Yep....and right off the Piazza San Marco

The huge square with the Pigeons. In fact I believe you can even see the Wendys from the Square itself...but you never see that in the pictures. Venice is a gorgeous mess of a city but as far as the food goes it's reminiscent of Disneyland. You really have to know where to go and it's very over priced. It's been my experience anyway- that you don't go to Venice to Eat. In theory Venician cuisine should be fabulous...in practice...in the moderate restaurants...not so much. :shrug: In their defense, it is an incredibley expensive city and it is hard to get around in. It's not so easy to schlep fresh produce into your restaurant every day. I also thought the quality of seafood was a little suspect but I've also had fabulous calamari there.

I've been to Venice a few times and my memories don't really include the food which is not the case with other cities I've been to in Italy. If you want to go to Italy to eat go to Bologna...OMG!!!!

[Tab]

22. Perhaps you can see Wendy's...

But can you see Russia?

[Tesha]

24. so we're on the vaporetti

- like a bus for the canal. Lots of other boats, all kinds - like any road, only wetter.And what goes floating by but an eggplant... hhmmm

But Venice was the first place I'd ever had squid-ink pasta - wonderful! We often rely on the wait staff to give us advice - you know, ask nicely in your very best Italian. Cosa mi consigliate, smile - and poof! help from everywhere, and conversation but ... don't order the eggplant....

[Warpy]

23. My ex ate at Burger King in Hong Kong

after he'd spent a month eating beautifully catered food all over China.

He said it was a letdown. I said duh.

[bicentennial_baby]

27. And McDonald's in France doesn't suck!

Not like it does here, b/c they actually have standards re: meat quality. Plus, they serve beer. :D

[The empressof all]

29. The first time I ate at a French McDonalds was when I was 14

My French wasn't very good (still isn't) I ordered a Hamburg aux cheval which I thought was the Cheeseberger option. Last time I was in one, I noticed that particular item was no longer on the menu. Almost 40 years later I can safely report that I learned a valuable lesson from that experience and have never ordered "blind" from a menu in another country ever again.

You're right the McDonalds in Europe do serve beer and wine and I don't know if it's just because they are familiar or not but I do pop into them especially when I'm on a long visit and I want something quick, fast and reasonably priced. They are what they are.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

32. in my experience it has never been the places like nyc or sf that have multiple foreign restuarants

that have bad homogenized food but instead places that have no particular cuisine. Suburban new jersey has literally the worst food i have ever had and i barely see thai restaurants around. On the other hand some of the best american food and food in general that i have had is in nyc, where there are multiple other cuisines.

i am sorry, but i think this is xenophobia and has nothing to do w.the homogenizing of cuisines

[hippywife]

34. That's what I was saying, Pri.

Re-read my post. :hi:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

35. i did reread it and thats not what i get from your post...

i think that one should protect ones food from becoming generic, however i do not see how banning kebabs does this.

[The empressof all]

36. Oh my goodness Northern New Jersey is a foodie heaven!

It may not be the kind of food you enjoy but the Cheesecake, the bakeries, the hot dogs and the Italian food is top rate. I think with every area of the country there are strengths and weaknesses. Out here in the PNW ---our only option for Bakery items is Costco and forget about getting a "real" cheesecake. (North Arlington Diner in NJ has the EPIC cheesecake---there is none finer) I can get perfect salmon but can't get a Pastrami on Rye or a knish.

Clearly there are benefits and weaknesses with eating local. The ethnic cuisine is impacted by the immigration patterns. You can get great Cantonese in NJ but I've yet to find good Szechuan, there's very little Thai and I didn't' see any Vietnamese the last time I was there.

There are days though that I'd give up some of the Pho and Pad Thai joints that are on every corner here for Some deli and a great Prune Danish.

And Yes...all you Baking folks out there....I know I can make my own but I don't have a baking bone in my body... Though I can make a great brownie and a half way decent cookie.

[eridani]

25. Or maybe they are locavores n/t

[hippywife]

26. Ah, but a locavore

will eat food prepared from local ingredients no matter the ethnicity. I would imagine that much of he street food is prepared from local ingredients, just not traditional Italian dishes. I dunno, maybe. :shrug:

[Stinky The Clown]

28. Good intents run amok?

Italy - in fact, most European countries - have a variety of commissions to protect their traditional and artisinal foods and products. I think it is a good idea. Balsamic vinegar is regulated as is pizza and tomatoes and hams and cheeses and wines and all the other good stuff. France does this. England, Germany, Spain ...... etc.

What this would seem to be is that mindset run amok. Overlay that with nationalism born out of the current economic strife and this is the result.

I really like the idea of DOC or VOP or appellation controllee or any other name by which these programs are known. I wish we would start some of them here in the US. We have as much or more unique indigenous food as anywhere on earth.

[The empressof all]

30. I actually like it too

It helps protect the consumer and assures a higher quality product for the most part. You KNOW that if you are drinking Champagne it is coming from Reims/Epernay...The same goes for the Parmesan Reggiano or Prosciutto. I like knowing where my food comes from.

[Stinky The Clown]

31. Yup ...... the benefits are all clear and real

Prices may go up ... or not. And even if the real stuff goes up, the cheap stuff will not be able to command what the real stuff commands and consumers can make their choice.