Fake Vets

[AbsoluteArmorer]

I thought there was another thread in this section that covered fake veterans who wore medals illegally. I did not find that thread when I searched. I wish to start one so to keep information fresh about the problem.


http://www.ksdk.com/news/news_article.aspx?storyid=108402

Man Falsely Wore Military Medals, Says U.S. Attorney

(KSDK) -
Michael Gerald Weilbacher, 48, of the 200 block of Horsehoe Drive is charged with violating section 704 (a) of title 18 of the United States Code which reads:

Whoever knowingly wears, manufactures, or sells any decoration or medal authorized by Congress for the armed forces of the United States, or any of the service medals or badges awarded to the members of such forces, or the ribbon, button, or rosette of any such badge, decoration or medal, or any colorable imitation thereof, except when authorized under regulations made pursuant to law, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than six months, or both.

According to the complaint, which was filed on Nov. 11, Weilbacher attended the Marine Corp Ball in St. Louis County wearing a series of military medals including, among others, the Navy Cross.

Weilbacher made an initial appearance before United States Magistrate Judge David D. Noce Wednesday in St. Louis. Weilbacher will be arraigned on Dec. 7. Weilbacher was released on $1,000 bond. If convicted, Weilbacher faces six months in prison and/or a fine of $50,000.

[acmejack]

1. I'll be interested to see what he ends up getting.

It didn't say if he was even a veteran, if he was era veteran, and if he was combat veteran. Inquiring minds want to know!

[Monkeyman]

2. There are a lot who claim to be vets

But they never served a day

[The Wizard]

6. Ask for their

MOS, service number and unit.

[AbsoluteArmorer]

8. Good idea but........

The only problem with the service number aspect of answer is that since approx 1969 (unless it's changed again) the service number is one's own SS number. Not many will be willing to surrender their SS number which is understandable. Usually, a few questions from those who were also in a war zone under the same MOS/duty being claimed by such a fake motor mouth can be tripped up fairly soon until nailed to the wall.

I do admit that some will study a war that helps them to learn more than most who actually served in that war. For the most part, that motor mouth will come off as an expert in his/her war, but the cool thing about those who were really there, not all in country experiences / information makes it to the library for others to copy from. That's where they screw up in time. Take away (remove) the John Wayne bravado and medals until all you have left is the basic true life war experiences that are more 'normal' and sometimes boring. Plus, each unit also usually had there own little 'quirks' that took place within their own operations during that particular time! Again, not usually in any library books.

Another tip that I learned just recently from a few other Nam Vets here in DU and another forum. Those motor mouths will take an attitude against real war vets which becomes obvious just in the motor mouth's actions around other real vets. My few comrades in these forums explained it out to being of one whose merely 'jealous'. That seems to stand out more than anything in their actions and the manner that they say things. Jealousy. After what I saw in some of their examples of this one particular wannabe just this past year, I agree with them. That's another way to spot such a faker. An attention grabber because of their jealousy.

[BikeWriter]

15. I have the Service Number. I still say it in my sleep.

[unhappycamper]

19. RA 17xxxxxx

I don't say it in my sleep, but that number is burned into my brain.

[BikeWriter]

20. I know you're right. They were good at training memory.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

22. I can't say mine ...

I can only yell it -- real loud so even a drill sergeant can hear it.

US54950xxx, Drill Sergeant!!!

Social security number started being used around 1967.

CRS is creeping in, I can't remember the serial number of my rifle.

[Lasher]

25. I was drafted in May 1969 and was issued a service number

I think I made it through basic training before they made us change to our SS number. Had to get new dog tags and paint over the stencil on my duffle bag. I'll never forget my service number either.

If memory serves, the 'US' at the beginning of my service number indicated I was a draftee. If I'm right you were drafted too.

[malmapus]

27. Yeah, kinda funny that they do use SSN

I lost my "toe tag" in Somalia, so always joke now and again that some Somali probaly can pretend to be me if it ever gets found.

[qnr]

26. Though technically, many veterans never had an MOS, but I know what you mean, just

mentally replace with AFSC for the Air Force and ratings & NEC for the other two.

[cassiepriam]

3. You mean like Bush? He describes himself as an old fighter pilot.

Probably even has some medals to prove it.

[BikeWriter]

16. I hear the bastid claims to have been on active duty for one day?

Anyone know about that?

[Ready4Change]

4. Do you know if this always applies?

Or does it only apply when attempting to impersonate a member of the armed services?

I used to wear surplus rank insignia and patches as costumes when I was a kid/young adult. But I was never trying to pass myself off as a member of any real military service. (It was for a made up Sci-Fi service.)

I remember hearing about this law, and always wondered.

[BOSSHOG]

5. I suggest if any non-vet wants to "dressup" that they put on the NAVY SEAL

Trident warfare device over their heart. Navy Seals know who are Seals and who aren't and the Trident is retrieved rather noisily and quickly and sometimes violently. If a non-vet wants to dressup then they should go for the gusto.

CNO Admiral Michael Boorda took his own life when it was reported he may have been wearing a device on a ribbon he may not have qualified for while serving in Vietnam.

[pecwae]

21. Just saw this

and wanted to reply. There's always a parade in the small rural town I just moved from for Veteran's Day. There's always a float with locals dressed up in military uniform waving to the crowd. Not one of these individuals is a vet. When I was still living there a woman who had been on the float was still walking around town in BDU's and camo paint, laughing, joking, bascially being a real ass to my mind. I was about to blow a gasket! She wasn't too old to enlist! Maybe I'm too sensitive, but if an adult is going to don the uniform do it the way it was meant to be done.

edit for lots of spelling errors!

[Lowell]

7. This is becoming a real problem

back in the day most vietnam combat vets just kept their mouths shut. It wasn't popular then. Now everyone wants to be one. On one of my websites we've had an ongoing struggle with these damn posers and several long discussions about stolen valor. A good site to check out is http://want2be.info/index.php. Another problem is all these dirtbags claiming to be pows. Check out this site for some good info http://www.pownetwork.org.

[4bucksagallon]

9. I have a book by Al Santoli named "Everything we had".

I have reread it and I was wondering about one of the stories in it by a guy who claimed to be in the Ia Drang with the 7th cav., he also claimed to be taken POW for a short time. While looking into it more I read this review on Amazon about that book. Here it is.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/customer-reviews/0345322797/ref=cm_cr_dp_pt/002-8157491-0488048?ie=UTF8&n=283155&s=books

"There are actually two false war stories in this book, those of Thomas Bird ("Ia Drang") and Mike Beamon ("The Green-Faced Frogmen"). Mr. Bird apologized to the author after the book's publication. He did serve in Vietnam, not in combat, and the POW story is a complete fabrication. Mr. Beamon did not even serve in the US military, never mind the SEALS or Vietnam. At the time the book came out, 1981, it was difficult to get veterans to discuss the war at all, never mind insist they verify their stories. Mr. Santoli, who I knew personally, was as disappointed as any of his critics that he had been taken in by these accounts. Still "Everything We Had"is a monumental work, from the days before the Vietnam Wall. Then the popular culture wanted nothing more to dismiss the war completely and held the men who fought there in contempt as losers or criminals. The feelings of Santoli's real contributors are still a compelling read today, twenty years later."


This is all the info I have but I was wondering if anyone else had read it and if this is true or not, I have looked but as of now I have not been able to find any more info about these two instances and I still don't know if this is true or false. I had not even questioned Beamons account of his experiences. Goes to show you, you just never know.

[james101]

10. Ali Muhammad fake Green Beret?

I saw this show on TV talking about Ali Muhammad is a Green Beret. The problem is that they say Muhammad was only a supply clerk in a Green Beret unit. That doesen't make him a Green Beret does it? I don't see any proof that Ali Muhammad went through special forces training. This has been bugging me a while and it's even more annoying how much it's been talked up on TV.

[US_Army_Vet]

11. Only One Way To Know

His DD-214 will have everything listed. Even "Spec Op" units need cooks & typists, but they generally are not "tab qualified" - no reason to be.

[malmapus]

24. It depends on when he was in.

Actually when I went to 3rd Group in 92, everyone in the unit wore the Green Beret. Was the same for all units under UNASF command. They changed it to where it was only those who were 18 series (had completed selection and the Q course) in '93. Kinda funny cause I did get to wear the green beret for a while, then went back to maroon when they changed it (served with MI Det of 1/3 SFG).

Rumors as to the change were that we got a new General in, who didn't like the idea of pregnent green berets (some of the support Bn's like 112th Signal had females and they wore the berets as well). So had it changed.

EDIT: So technically if this guy was in a Special Forces command unit at the time, he could have worn a Green Beret without having gone through all that training. Heck what made me kinda sick was we would even have "legs" in our unit who still got to wear the beret. I at least went to Airborne school and earned the right to wear a beret at all in my thoughts lol.

[Major Hogwash]

12. It's enough to make ya want to grind your teeth in your sleep.

I hope that asshole chokes on his store-bought Navy Cross.
I hope he finds out it's made of pot medal.

We don't wear medals at the little get together we throw here on the Marine Corps' birthday.
Lots of orange Marine Corps tee shirts and hats, but no uniforms.

I met a Marine that was on Iwo Jima this year.
Let me tell ya, it was a humblin' experience.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

13. There is another issue inside the veteran issue ,guilt about not having been sent

for some reason there are those that believed they should have been sent to Vietnam Granada,middle East phase one Nixon Bush-Middle East phase two Nixon Bush- Bush.If you think it is a Nixon flashback -it is.
Remember the V for victory Nixon threw just before he poured himself into the helicopter-just what was that(?).

But the guilt thing- may have a little to do with survivors guilt.
You talk about the Navy seal and the bus bench tragedy. What do you know about dolphins?

Had some drinks with a Navy seal once in Chicago-rare occasion. My invite came because a Friend on a boat I was assigned to was a former air force special forces- all special forces are the same at a point.TM one was the special operatives diver and landing party commander., among other responsibilities.I say commandor because he was top in his element ,wasn,t he? When he cross branched to the Navy- it was a career move geared to retirement. He became a torpedo men 1st. class Submarine Navy.

Most of the guys were afraid to wake Rosy up -as it was his time for the watch.
Rosy always left specific instructions about that. It seemed at my young age of eighteen with all of what little experience I had in the world- I was one of three people out of 130 that understood his language.

What I found out later ,that means something to people like Rosy, which is why I assume I was invited out for a Seals night on the town latter on when I was older.Hadn,t seen Rosy in a number of years-but I had heard that special forces people have friends everywhere.

I never got to see Rosy's special forces insignia on his uniform.
But in Chicago I did see how that is in how it appears.

A couple of other of the invites seemed to have hang ups because they were never in Vietnam.

I said , you know- to those that return - it,s about the job-and knowing people on the job-don,t you think knowing the person on the job in the time of the job for what they do in the here and now means anything? Does Vietnam define these people?
Why no said one- maybe thats why we are here together.

It,s not about the medals is it?
Because the medal does not make the man,does it?

Keep that in mind when you are stuffing your opinion out there.

[Major Hogwash]

14. Most of the men who were awarded Navy Crosses were awarded posthumously

So, I don't feel any sympathy for someone who had guilt for not being sent to fight over there, but then felt it was okay to buy a Navy Cross on some shelf 35 years years later and wear it around.

Most of the men who were awarded Navy Crosses never knew about it.
Because they were already dead.
They were awarded the medal posthumously.

[malmapus]

28. My Great Uncle who passed this year was awarded a Navy Cross

He almost didn't make it. Was a PFC and led three charges against a Japanese position (when a PFC is taking charge you know it's been bad!). On 3rd charge he was badly wounded, his own buddies thought he was dead. Wasn't until another squad was running up and one of them was strading him and noticed he was still breathing, called a Corpsman up. Luckily was able to patch the grapefruit sized hole in his back.

But yeah, always stood in awe when I would visit him. I have no sympathy either for anyone who just goes out and buys a medal to pin on themselves, espicially that one.

[BikeWriter]

17. We have a WWII jarhead in our American Legion post...

he's a tough old shithead, and my favorite WWII vet.

[sarge43]

23. As usual Sgt Maudlin got it right

Willie and Joe at an aid station, "I already got a Purple Heart. Gimme a couple of aspirins."

[BikeWriter]

18. The purple shaft with barbed wire cluster.