Best Places for Atheists/Agnostics/Secularists to Live

[blueblitzkrieg]

I'm stuck in NM for awhile, at least until I get my degree, but I'm thinking toward the future of where I might want to live.

Which cities (in America or abroad) or countries are the most atheist-friendly? Places that have large atheist populations, are largely non-religious, or just accepting of people like us, that sort of thing...list them please!

[immoderate]

1. I heard that Uruguay is very atheist.

Don't have anything to back that up, though.

--IMM

[Sabriel]

2. Madison, WI

Home of Anne and Annie Laurie Gaylor's "Freedom from Religion Foundation." (Although technically it promotes nontheism.)

[Socialist Dem]

3. Chicago

WAY to many religions/spiritual belief groups for one to be dominant.

[MelanieArt]

5. Another vote for Chicago!

For the exact same reasons! Although, I was downtown last weekend and a very insistant individual was standing on a corner waving around pamphlets. On closer inspection I realized they were Chick tracts! My favorite. ;) He mistook my glee for wanting to be converted I suspect, because he held one out to me as we passed by like someone holding out a life preserver to a drowning man. I wish I would've taken some. I've wanted to start a tract collection for a while now (okay, I'm strange! :crazy: LOL!)

[Socialist Dem]

7. Chick tracts rock!

The demonic teacher and lil' fundy Suzie out to save mankind....

Another reason Chicago is good is that the Southern Baptist have NO foothold here. Lots of Protestants, but none of the SB variety.

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

9. Grab 'em, you can sell 'em on eBay

I had a collection of full-sized Chick comics that I highly prized. I bought them at a Chicago Comicon back in the early 80s, and they were jam-packed with nutsoid goodness. Here are the covers from two of them:



I put them up for auction and discovered there are some rabid Chick collectors out there. I also got several "question for seller" emails from people who wanted to pray for me and save my soul, because my description of the comix was less than reverent. :D

Any big city is a haven for heathens, but I'm partial to Chicago.

[Kolesar]

4. Well, the Blue states are "electorally secular"

You know, sort of like Howard Dean, who never embellished his speeches with all that "God Bless" bullshit. There was that embarassing moment when things were getting serious and he told a reporter his favorite Bible passage was the book of Job.

Cleveland is secular. People here generally don't start asking you where you go to church. Don't move here though. There are no jobs and the air will kill you.

[curse10]

6. I live in Boston and all my friends are generally atheist/agnostic

but we just seem to find each other. I can't remember the last time I had a religious friend.

[lazarus]

8. Birmingham, AL

has a huge pagan population, and pagans tend to be very accepting of atheists.

Bizarre but true.

[RebelOne]

34. But it also has a huge fundie population.

I think they outnumber any pagans.

[Stuckinthebush]

48. He's right

Some pretty cool people, too.

However, the downside is that you are surrounded by fundamentalist X-tians who control the state and city.

We also have a great UU church here.

[Philostopher]

10. Canada is more secular.

I haven't seen statistics in a while, but if I recall correctly, only 60% (or thereabouts) of Canadians identified themselves as Christian. When you hold that up against the varying 75%-90% numbers I see here, it would seem to be more tolerant of those who don't believe in mainstream Christian dogmas.

Of course, I wonder if that 75-90% number I've seen recently for the U.S. is cooked. Does it only include people who attend church regularly, or does it include people who sorta' believe there's a God, and Jesus was born on Christmas? Because there are a heck of a lot of people out there who probably say 'yeah, I believe in Jesus,' but who aren't actively Christian and don't really live their lives as if they cared. Also, there are 'buffet' or 'holiday' Christians who attend church four or five times a year, but live the rest of the time as if they'd never touched a bible. Are they Christians, too?

Anyhow, sorry for the rant -- you might see if you can scare up some statistics on Canada, anyhow. I'm sure British Columbia and Ontario would be the provinces that were most secular -- the more highly populated/urban areas seem to have the highest concentration of agnostics/atheists/pantheists/humanists, from my anecdotal observation.

[politicat]

25. The number is cooked.

We just had a study come out that puts the non-religious (encompassing none, atheist, agnostic, secular, humanist) at 16% of the population. So that 90% number is out the window.

There are lots of holiday xtians who self identify as xtian, claim a belief but never read the babble and do nothing about it either way.

I'd say 1/3 of the US is in that "Not Xtian" category. It runs about 40% here in Colorado - lots of No Religions here. (The fundies in Colorado Springs are just loud and have a big platform.)

Pcat

Here's the referring documentation: track down from there.

Chrisma News
November 16, 2004 edition
World News
Survey Reveals Nation's Unchurched Has Doubled in Last Decade

The proportion of Americans who claim no religious affiliation has doubled in the last decade and now stands at 16 percent of the population. That's some of the findings of a new study on religious identity, which noted that only Catholics (24 percent) and Baptists (17 percent) outnumber the people who don't identify themselves with organized religion, "The Los Angeles Times" reported.

Based on telephone interviews with more than 10,000 people, the nationwide survey by the Institute for Jewish & Community Research in San Francisco said about one in six answered "none" or "no religion" or described themselves as secular, humanist, ethical-culturalist, agnostic or atheist.

[RaleighNCDUer]

47. In America, 90% of the population self identify as Xtian --

but 100% of 50% of that 90% believe the other 50% aren't, really.

[SiouxJ]

11. I don't know but stay away from my town!

I've heard there's one church for every 60 people who live here. They even do those "set up a tent and have a revival" things here. I had heard about them in the deep South but didn't expect them here in Arizona.

I put a Buddha in my yard to scare away the Christian fanatics and Mormons. :-)

[sherilocks]

12. In Cochise County they took away a woman's children

because she was a Wiccan. Parts of the state apparently are not very enlightened and probably not hospitable for atheists. I always found Tucson fairly liberal in its outlook. I even went to the Unitarian Church there from time to time because I liked the people.

[Is It Fascism Yet]

22. that sucks

what shit they are getting away with these days.

[leftofthedial]

23. praise gawd

and hand me a viper!

[Behind the Aegis]

13. Best place? I dunno, but you all live in denial!

Just joshing! Many European nations are good for agnostics and atheists. Actually, they are good places except for fundies! Larger cites are always better than smaller ones. Even large Southern cities, have a fairly large atheist/agnostic (a/a) population. Any place that has a large scientific community is going to be fairly tolerant of a/a folks. Wouldn't it be nice if we could live anywhere we wanted and not have to worry about how others viewed our beliefs?!

[fshrink]

14. In the world follow the link...

http://www.adherents.com/largecom/com_atheist.html

And be prepared for a few surprises!!!

[Rhiannon12866]

15. WOW. I'm not surprised about Russia, because I've been there

And it's mainly the older people who cling to religion. The younger ones were brought up not to believe, so they don't. This one guide that we had said that she was baptized as a Christian, acting like she was a little ashamed of it. And we had ordained ministers in our group, LOL! But Israel?! That one sure surprised me. And Slovenia. Don't tell JohnKleeb!:-)

[Behind the Aegis]

16. Atheists world-wide

That was an interesting bit of information! I am not too surprised about Israel though. Although deemed the "Jewish State," it is rather secular. Also, there are a few older Jews who had a hard time believing in G-d after the Holocaust. For some, it strengthened their beliefs, for others, it obliterated it! Coming from a Jewish background, I have met a number of Holocaust survivors who say G-d abandoned them, and if He can do that, they can leave Him. I wonder what else resulted in Israel ranking so high?

[Rhiannon12866]

17. I'm sure that there are, but I was surprised that there would be

such a large percentage in Eastern Europe and Israel. My mother's family is from Eastern Europe (Poland) and I just assumed that most everyone was Catholic. Shows what happens when you assume, LOL! I believe what you say about Israel and understand it, but I would think that Israelis would need to believe in something, just to cope with living in such stressful circumstances. There I go, assuming again. Perhaps it's similar to Northern Ireland, which I've also visited, and the violence is restricted to specific areas.:shrug:

[Behind the Aegis]

18. I think it Eastern Europe is in the same boat

I am talking out of my ass, but it is my opinion that the reason atheism is so high in Eastern Europe is because religion was suppressed for so long. I would gather it is the same as China and North Korea. They also saw much sorrow while under the Iron Curtain and then when freed, there was so much chaos that believing in religion seemed like a wasted effort to them. Perhaps I am not even close, but it is my only little 'theory.'

[Rhiannon12866]

19. This makes perfect sense to me. I don't know why I didn't think of it

When my both of my grandparents came to this country from Poland, they were listed as "Russian" on the ships' manifests because that part of Poland was considered part of Russia, at the time. It was only after 1945 that most of the eastern part of Poland ceased to belong to Russia. And, because my mother is Polish, I'm certainly aware of Solidarity and Lech Walensa and the part he played in liberating Poland from the Communists. And, you're right, things were very rough for them. Even though the USSR has fallen, my mother still hates the Russians, despite visiting there, herself, and my positive experience there. I guess I was assuming, again, that most Poles were like my grandparents as far as religion is concerned. I'm really going to have to quit that! And they also left Poland as teen-agers.:D

I also agree with you that the same would be probably be true for North Korea and China, though I can't speak from personal experience.:shrug:

[politicat]

26. Russian Jewish immigration.

I've been told that many, if not most, of the Russian Jews immigrating are secular Jews, and even then are not very observant of the cultural practices. They're interested in the land and benefits and getting out of Mother Russia. That would account for a lot of the secularization of Israel. (As it happens, the Russian immigrant community is often the group that ends up on the front lines in the new settlements.)

Pcat

[lazarus]

28. Israel I can believe

My Dad converted to Judaism, and he said something interesting the other night. Told me I would make a great Jew, because Jews don't actually have to believe in anything. :D

[Rhiannon12866]

49. That's very strange.

I understand, from the previous conversation I had in this forum, the reason that so many Jews have lost their faith. But why would your Dad choose to convert to Judaism, if he felt that they don't actually have to believe in anything?:shrug:

[Kolesar]

20. All this from a site that says communism is a religion

They even capitalize the first letter to make it a proper noun.

"Sociologically, Communism is as much a religion as other "traditional" religions such as Islam or Christianity, although it promotes (often forcibly) beliefs which would categorize its adherents as atheists. "

I suppose that "sociologically" is the qualifier. IMHO, religion is based on spirituality.

[lil-petunia]

21. Sydney Australia, Paris, London, Firenze, are good choices

locally, Even though there are a lot of churches in my area, chicagoland is not overboard or freeperish.

[Djinn]

24. In Australia - Melbourne is more secular than Sydney

and a while ago I would have touted us as pretty agnostic atleast - these days I'm getting less sure - the evangelical churches have popped up (Paradise in South Australia and Hillsong in Sydney) and we have the "Family First" which are a fundie Assembly of God bunch who are now suggesting creationism be taught in Australian schools (this gets howls of laughter here still thankfully)

Sydney is also home to Peter Jensen and George Pell, two of the most influential church figures (Anglican and Catholic respectively) in the country who don't seem that comfortable with the seperation of church and state.

[Modem Butterfly]

27. Portland, OR is great

Excellent town for freethinkers.

[Biased Liberal Media]

29. My husband wants to move there

and this is a perfect reason to!

[opiate69]

44. I'll second Portland..

if it weren't for the fact that my work and band are here in Olympia/Tacoma, I'd move to Portland in a heartbeat.

[porkrind]

30. Let me warn you off Salt Lake City

Lots of religious wackos here. Also a tense mix of atheist lefties who are always the underdogs fighting the religious establishment. It sucks.

[Caution]

31. Salem, MA

there are a few churches and on halloween some fundies descend on the city but they are generally outnumbered by the pagans and atheists. Fun place overall.

[BeeBee]

32. Try Northern California...

I've lived in the North Bay for 5 years and have to say that I've never felt more comfortable with my orientation or "religious" beliefs.

[pantouflard]

37. Yep. Santa Cruz resident here,

I love it. Been here since 1989. Athiests, pagans, unitarians abound. More health-food markets than you can shake a stick at. Beauty, beach, good people.

Kinda like living in a bubble. But it's a nice bubble. :)

[Dookus]

46. Oh yeah...

Santa Cruz here, too. It's pretty perfect.

[really annoyed]

33. Estonia!

Only a minority of the population has any religious beliefs.

Here's a fine "Christmas" tradition from Estonia....

"At Christmas time, sausages are prepared from fresh blood and wrapped in pig's intestine." YUMMY!

http://www.lonelyplanet.com/destinations/europe/estonia/culture.htm

[amandae]

35. Stay away from here too ... East Central Kansas ...

I'm near KC in a very suburban area and all we have the BIGGEST churches I've ever seen! They just keep building them, too! I can literally stand on the corner of a street not even a mile from my house and see three churches, one is in the process of being built. They just keep getting bigger and bigger! Think, Sunday morning broadcast churches. And these huge churches are all over the county.

Not only that but now my daughter (in 1st grade, public school) is starting to get an "education" about religion from her friends at school who attend church. I knew it would come, but didn't expect it so soon. We're hoping to move when she's done with 2nd grade, so I was hoping to be out of here before her friends started asking her about what church she goes to, what she thinks about God, etc. We're trying to answer her questions as they come in and encourage her to ask questions when she has them. We want her to think for herself. One thing we're stressing is that religion is deeply personal for each person - 20 people could listen to the same sermon and take away completely different things from it.

[Philostopher]

36. About the only place I know of in Kansas that isn't too bad ...

is Lawrence. I have some friends who live there, and apparently the university keeps the diversity and tolerance levels up a bit. I've never heard anybody say anything about any other part of Kansas that would make me think it was anything but worse than Ohio as far as diversity of opinion and tolerance go.

[amandae]

39. I agree with that assessment!!

Kansas is the worst place I've been to as far as tolerance goes. That and I'm in a county where the people are so almighty that it's beyond comprehension. I've about had it with the snobby righteousness. Don't get me wrong, there are some people that we've met who haven't been like that (and I've held on tight to those friendships!!), but the majority of them have been.

Anyways, I hope we end up living permanently in a blue state again! This place is driving me nuts!!

:hi:

[robbedvoter]

38. NYC is fine - East Village at least

[Karenca]

41. We're cool here in Central Greenwich Vilage too. :))...nt

[Carl Brennan]

40. Seattle has more churches

and less attendance than any city. I find that funny. It is almost like somebody built the churches and then nobody showed up.

It is a very non-religious city overall IMHO.

[Taxloss]

42. The UK is 14% atheist and rising.

The Christian majority is CofE, which is intensely tolerant by-and-large. I experience no problems relating to my lack of faith.

[politicat]

43. I edit the Freethought directory, the largest compendium of FT orgs in the

world. (No, really, it's like editing the phone book...)

The thing I've learned is the biggest, most active groups are in the most conservative areas. However, there are groups practically everywhere.

The UK is great for secular organizations and a secular community. Northern CA, Oregon and Washington are strong, especially on the western side of the Cascades. Florida has many organizations. New England is very secular, but is a bit low on organizations. South Dakota, Rhode Island and Delaware are lacking entirely in organizations.

If you'd like more information, please buy a copy. It's only $10, and it's a .pdf, so it's easy to search and use. www.atheistalliance.org/directory

Pcat

[fshrink]

45. OK. I've got the best answer to the question.

And that is China. China has been systematically resistant to any attempt at imposition of any type of religion, which includes maoism. Jesuits who were trying to convert reported that the poeple there were welcoming and willing to go by catholic stuff but would not let go of their other beliefs. Basically, they were just maximizing their odds on a Las Vegas mode. Which, of course, completely screws up the religious process. Pragmatism is the local "religion". Which is the closest you can get to no religion at all. That's also one of the places where you get the biggest bang for your buck.

[Rhiannon12866]

50. Interesting observation.

And this explains the reason that leaders like Chairman Mao were able to so easily control such an incredibly vast number of people.