How do you feel about "Brights" ?

[beam me up scottie]

This was brought up in the Skeptic group and I am curious to hear others' opinions on the subject.

Here is the link to that thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=247x1796

[salvorhardin]

1. I really don't know much about the Brights

I have to admit to being a little prejudicial in that I've never really wanted to find out either. As others have pointed out, the name alone seems off-putting and smacks of being pseudo-religious. There is also an air of elitism to the name but, to paraphrase Groucho Marx, any group that would have me as a member sure ain't elite.

To be honest, their website says a lot of things I agree with, but who are the people really behind the Brights movement, what are their history and motives, where does their funding come from and what do they spend it on? I see a couple of names in their FAQ, Paul Geisert and Mynga Futrell, but that doesn't really tell me anything. I know Richard Dawkins and Daniel Dennett have promoted the concept and they're two very cool people in my book, but beyond that there seems to be little information out there and what there is, is vague.

I'd like to be enlightened on the subject though.

[beam me up scottie]

2. I'll admit to being turned off

as well.
I had the same questions when I first visited the site but I hurriedly left when I noticed what I perceived to be the beginning of a quasi-religion.
I do not think that atheists need a "belief system" or philosophy.
As a matter of fact, I hate the idea.
It mimics religion and I usually have a severe allergic reaction just thinking about it.

Off to get the Benadryl.

[NMMNG]

3. I've heard about them before

It seemed to me they were just some way of avoiding the derogatory "label" of atheism. Then they replace it with something designed to portray themselves as intelligent and glowing ("bright").

To me it seems like a silly subterfuge--like those who think calling people with mental retardation "special" makes them seem less disabled. :eyes:

[muriel_volestrangler]

4. I'm not keen on the term

It's not properly descriptive, and it smacks too much of a useless PR person (very Golgafrinchan 'B' Ark - if you don't know the reference, shame on you!). If you want to be 'positive', then I think 'humanism' covers that direction.

[Modem Butterfly]

5. Why are some folks so afraid of the "a" word anyway?

I can't tell you how many conversations I've had with folks who don't really believe in deities, but who refuse to use the term "atheist" to describe themselves. Very strange.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

9. F-E-A-R

Sometimes people manage to convince themselves they are not REALLY atheists. Out of fear.

A twisted version of the "No True Scotsman" fallacy, perhaps.

[toddaa]

6. Dawkins and Dennett need to read their own books

"Brights" is an attempt to engineer a meme to put atheists into favorable light. The problem is, if you apply the "selfish gene" theory to memetic engineering, you'll quickly realize that artificial memes don't work.

IMO, it's a stupid name and has all the appeal of some secret society formed by a group of teen age D&Ders who can't get dates.

[BiggJawn]

7. My take on it.

I don't know much about them, either. Their very name is enough to turn me off. See my response here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=247&topic_id=1796&mesg_id=1809

Can you imagine anything that would turn a magic believer off more?

"Are you wunnathem gawdless Atheists?"

"Oh, no, I'm a BRIGHT!"

"Bright"...Brings to my mind images of faeries and those scenes in Sci-Fi movies where the people who get "enlightened" start glowing or something...

[beam me up scottie]

8. Glad to see

I'm not alone.
I wasn't sure if I was being too skeptical.

I am an atheist.
I am a liberal.
I am a feminist

I am a republican's worst nightmare.

And I am not ashamed of being any of those things.

[MindPilot]

10. A me too post

I agree; the name itself makes my toes curl. It's just too cutesy, and sounds like "Well, I'm not really an aay-theist, more of an agnostic, I guess. You know you can't prove god DOESN'T exist", all wrapped up in one word. Unitarians who don't want to get up on Sunday morning.

[beam me up scottie]

11. "UU's who don't want to get up on Sunday morning"

:rofl:

[BurtWorm]

12. It doesn't seem to be catching on.

I can't say I'm unhappy about that.

[beam me up scottie]

13. I can't imagine why.

I mean, what do atheists have against organized pseudo-religions ?

They should have called it Religion-Lite, all the benefits of belonging with none of the icky god aftertaste.

:evilgrin:

[Modem Butterfly]

14. ROFL!

All the free-thought, with none of that nasty logical aftertaste!

[beam me up scottie]

17. Exactly !

Like putting lipstick on a church.

[Synnical]

26. Good One!

And I agree. I dislike the term "Brights" for all the various reasons listed herein.

-Cindy in Fort Lauderdale

[beam me up scottie]

27. Hee hee.

I keep picturing stained glass windows with smilie faces instead of religious icons.

Ew.

[immoderate]

15. I dislike the term.

It means that we are calling those that disagree with us "not bright." Some might be insulted.

I read James Randi regularly, but I was uncomfortable with it from the beginning. I notice that Randi doesn't use it much. I agree with those that say it isn't catching on.

People avoid "atheist" because of the negative vibe it gives to some. But if we keep on using it right, it will prevail.

--IMM

[trotsky]

18. Same reason I don't like it. n/t

[beam me up scottie]

19. Where the hell have you been ?

:mad:

[trotsky]

20. LONG weekend.

And by long I don't mean relaxing and enjoyable. :(

[beam me up scottie]

21. Oh no.

Everything okay ?

[trotsky]

22. Oh yeah, fine.

No lost limbs or property damage or anything like that! Just one aggravating experience after another. Let's say I started Saturday morning off with a toilet repair, and that was the best part of the weekend. :hi:

[beam me up scottie]

23. Yuk.

I've had one of those years, I think.
The way my life is going, I'm afraid to use the toilet some days... :D

Glad everything's okay.

[Book Lover]

16. Aeuphoneous and not useful

I tried saying it once ("No, I'm a Bright") and felt like a silly jerk; how useful is that?

[MindPilot]

24. I have a tough enough time with "freethinker".

I'm an atheist--sans theology--the meaning is clear and I don't need a weasel word to candy-coat it.

"Bright" reminds me of that term the humanists came up with a few years ago which was some odd concatenation supposed to mean "thinking about the world", IIRC, I think it was "euphraxy".

[Book Lover]

30. If not exactly, then something like that, yes

That's the problem with coining latinate words in this day and age; they come off sounding like a Federation homeworld.

[GOPFighter]

25. I like the term atheist...

...I love the expressions on people's faces, especially the relious. They're just not used to people admitting it in polite company.

For some reason I don't like the term humanist...must be from my Baptist days. I sometimes use the term "rationalist" to describe my beliefs.

Like everyone else here, "Brights" really really really turns me off.

[Modem Butterfly]

28. Never underestimate the power of words

Particularly the word atheist.

I consider myself a humanist, but you can be a humanist and a theist, or an atheist and a non-humanist, as my partner is (he's something of a misanthrope!).

[beam me up scottie]

29. Rationalist.

I like that.
Beats the hell out of "Bright".

[onager]

31. Late as usual...

...but "Bright" has irritated me from the very first time I saw it used. IIRC, it didn't get a very warm reception even in the skeptical magazines.

I'll probably stick with "atheist." After a while, you start to enjoy the shock value...

[beam me up scottie]

32. Exactly !

It's like sneezing in somebody's face...

[PassingFair]

33. When pressed for my religious beliefs, I just tell people that I'm...

"unaffiliated". If pressed further, I'll say I'm an atheist.
When someone asks about my family, I just say, "We're a secular family", and that seems to suffice.
I don't like my kids going around telling everyone that they're atheists, it gets them into rotten situations - but the little buggers use the term with reckless abandon (my 13 year old had half the study hall praying for her last year, with the permission of the freeper teacher...)

Today, an acquaintance asked me to join the local Rotarians...she said that they start the meeting with the pledge and an "invocation". Anyone know anything about these peeps?

[beam me up scottie]

34. I don't know what the "invocation" would be but

this is from their website

"Object of Rotary

The Object of Rotary is to encourage and foster the ideal of service as a basis of worthy enterprise and, in particular, to encourage and foster:

FIRST. The development of acquaintance as an opportunity for service;
SECOND. High ethical standards in business and professions, the recognition of the worthiness of all useful occupations, and the dignifying of each Rotarian's occupation as an opportunity to serve society;
THIRD. The application of the ideal of service in each Rotarian's personal, business, and community life;
FOURTH. The advancement of international understanding, goodwill, and peace through a world fellowship of business and professional persons united in the ideal of service."

and this is must be the invocation:

"Declaration of Rotarians in Businesses and Professions

The Declaration of Rotarians in Businesses and Professions was adopted by the Rotary International Council on Legislation in 1989 to provide more specific guidelines for the high ethical standards called for in the Object of Rotary:

As a Rotarian engaged in a business or profession, I am expected to:

Consider my vocation to be another opportunity to serve;
Be faithful to the letter and to the spirit of the ethical codes of my vocation, to the laws of my country, and to the moral standards of my community;
Do all in my power to dignify my vocation and to promote the highest ethical standards in my chosen vocation;
Be fair to my employer, employees, associates, competitors, customers, the public, and all those with whom I have a business or professional relationship;
Recognize the honor and respect due to all occupations which are useful to society;
Offer my vocational talents: to provide opportunities for young people, to work for the relief of the special needs of others, and to improve the quality of life in my community;
Adhere to honesty in my advertising and in all representations to the public concerning my business or profession;
Neither seek from nor grant to a fellow Rotarian a privilege or advantage not normally accorded others in a business or professional relationship."

Not a word about a higher power, I don't know anything else about them but it sounds like an honest organization.

Here's the web address: http://www.rotary.org/index.html

[PassingFair]

36. Why thank you, BMUS!

Looks like I'm in!
I'll let you guys know how it went, as they certainly seem to be an organization that believes in ethical business practices. What a breath of fresh air that would be....

[beam me up scottie]

37. You're welcome!

I was thinking the same thing!
I am, of course, a die hard skeptic, but I really couldn't find anything to be suspicious of when I looked at this organization.
It sounds like they've gone out of their way to assure that it stays secular.
A breath of fresh air indeed.
I go out of MY way to not give my business to the "fishy" folks here in the buy-bull belt.
If they feel it's necessary to point out that they are a christian business, I feel it's necessary to go elsewhere.
Let us know how it goes.

[PassingFair]

38. I like that they're working with that Society of Satan itself...

the U.N.!

[beam me up scottie]

39. Well, that tears it then.

No self respecting fundie would have anything to do with an international organization that's not converting savages.

[Taxloss]

35. I'm not keen.

It seems intentionally insulting. I have no trouble with "atheist". Ultimately, when we're in the majority, the term "atheist" will just wither on the vine as it becomes the default. The terminology of religion will shrink to the sidelines.

[Zhade]

40. It's slightly arrogant.

I know a lot of believers who, aside from their blind spot regarding the veracity of unproven god myths, are pretty bright people themselves.

I don't care for the term myself.

[lazarus]

41. appreciate the concept

but not a fan, and won't use the term. We should take possession of atheist, and be proud of it.