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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-18-08 03:17 PM
Original message
Question for the historical Kerry peeps?
or any MA peeps(decided to phrase it like this so that it wouldn't seem like a call out thread).

I was listening to an radio http://wtkk.everyzing.com/viewMedia.jsp?e=19601593&s=PZSID_0001090198">interview the good senator had with a radio show host named Michele McPhee (Hat tip to Kerryvision.com :)). It was a good one considering that she put him on the spot (he does good with that too :)) with the bitter comment and Obama's race speech.

I am not for cherry picking an interview or comments, but right around 6:00, she was commenting on reading Obama's race speech and how she was offended by the "average white American" remark, and so on. Kerry himself was saying that Obama was "courageous" in making that speech and that he touched on the same topic 20 years ago and he got "my head cut off" (that's a figure of speech) for saying some of those same things (about resentment) because South Boston went through busing, and other things in the state, and so on.

I didn't follow politics 20 years ago, although I remember Jesse Jackson, and Dukakis running for president, but for anyone that remembers, what did Kerry say that was well controversial about race?

I am not familiar with MA or Beantown, but I remember reading an interview Gov. Deval Patrick did with EBONY magazine about being the 2nd AA governor, and the 1st from MA. He noted that even though Boston is known for it's history of racial strife (i.e. busing in the 70s, 80s, etc), he noted that more hispanics now live in South Boston, and that race relations have are improving since then.

Just like Obama, whatever the good senator said about the issue of race, he was bold to take that on.
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JI7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-18-08 07:00 PM
Response to Original message
1. i would like to hear more about it also
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-18-08 07:40 PM
Response to Original message
2. okay, but this is a long reply
I used my trusty Boston Globe subscription to access their online archives and refresh my memories of this. Ah, we have to warm up the Way-Back machine though to do this.

Sen Kerry gave a speech at Yale University back in late March of 1992. The Rodney King incident had happened the year before that. Charles Stuart had played on widespread racial stereotypes when he murdered his pregnant wife and then blamed it on a black resident of Boston's Mission Hill neighborhood in late 1989. (Stuart committed suicide when his fraud was uncovered in 1990.)

John Aloysius Farrell, then Boston Globe writer (and contributor to the biography of Sen. Kerry that the Globe came out with in 2004) was in attendance at this speech along with about 100 Yale students. He wrote an article 3 1/2 weeks after the speech that summed up the event.


April 19, 1992
WASHINGTON -- It was vintage John Kerry: outraged and impatient, beguiled by risk and clumsy with the political niceties, plowing ahead as friends groaned and struggled to keep up. Disdaining the advice of staff and advisers, the junior senator from Massachusetts says he followed his gut when deciding to tackle the volatile issue of race and politics in making a major policy speech on affirmative action last month at Yale University. As when choosing to address the POW-MIA issue last year, Kerry made this call by himself, against -- or without -- the advice of his staff. Despite a year of writing, Kerry essentially leapt before looking -- with few solid answers and no firm direction, startling some allies whom he was asking to come along as an act of faith.

And if Kerry had any doubts he was raising expectations about his ability to solve such intractable problems as racial politics and the crisis of urban America, they have vanished in the tumultuous weeks that followed his well- publicized remarks.

"This is unfinished. Unfinished. There is clearly more to be said and a hell of a lot more to be done," Kerry states. "This is something I want to make a difference on."

At least on this point, Kerry and his critics agree. "He has to establish alternatives," says state Sen. Bill Owens, (D-Boston), who chairs the Legislature's Black Caucus. "If he is not posing alternatives, then he's just adding to the fire that already exists."

As for Kerry's own affirmative-action efforts, of the 36 members of his Senate staff, most are women and six are members of minority groups. Last year, a spot check conducted by The Boston Herald of the staffs of all 13 members of the Massachusetts delegation placed Kerry slightly above average in a ranking of his colleagues as regards hiring minorities. Like the overwhelming majority of the delegation, he has no minority staffers in executive positions.

In a recent two-hour interview, Kerry said that his speech is no one-shot deal but the start of a long-planned assault on the crisis in America's cities and the policies of "rationalization . . . avoidance . . . and exploitation" that have doomed previous efforts.

In the long run, the clamor over Kerry's speech may save him. If Kerry's political strengths stem from his image as a risk-taker, his weaknesses result from the belief he's opportunistic. The sheer din surrounding his speech will ensure that Kerry's attention doesn't wander. Intentionally or not, he is now committed to the issue, and planning his next talk on the subject, at a yet- to-be chosen venue in Boston.

Since returning for his second term, Kerry has voiced a desire to become more of a national leader. That ambition, along with the scare he got from James Rappaport, his well-financed Republican opponent in 1990, and the frustration he feels with the political gridlock in Washington, have stirred a certain derring-do in him.

There are more themes -- about Democratic myopia on economic issues, for example -- that have also been in the works for months and may soon make their way into speeches. He recently cast a pro-business vote on cable TV legislation and has been pushing his own version of a capital-gains tax cut.

"This totally comes from within Kerry," says his pollster, Thomas Kiley. "He has always chafed under the stigma of being labeled just another Massachusetts Democrat, in the long shadow of Ted Kennedy. He's working to publicly assert what those who know him already know, that he is independent- minded on issues, wanting to challenge Democratic orthodoxy. That's been there: a desire to exercise his intellectual side."

In this case, says Kiley, "there is no question he irritated black leaders and black voters . . . I don't think he would claim that it was perfectly crafted, or that he shouldn't have spent more time talking to folks up here to fully understand what buzzwords and phrases could be misinterpreted. But I don't think any of the damage is permanent, and it struck me in general that it prompted a healthy debate."

When asked about the fallout, Kerry acknowledges that he angered liberal activists and hurt some black supporters with blunt talk about the costs of affirmative action. He also says he could have done a better job preparing admirers for his challenge to liberal orthodoxy.

"I know some people who are friends of mine are disappointed I did it," Kerry says. "I think a lot of people on the staff were questioning what I was doing, and why." But "I never ran it by the political side" because "this is not a political speech," he says, adding that he played his cards close to the vest in part because he feared cautious advisers might try to modify his passion on this issue.

Kerry does not budge an inch on his central thesis: That to advance the civil rights agenda, Democrats must supplement support for affirmative action with ideas and programs that stress law and order, individual responsibility, the work ethic and other values that enlist the support of the white majority.

"This speech was given because we have a crisis in this country, and I'm tired of hearing about a crisis and seeing no response," says Kerry. "I think the dynamic is locked, frozen."

Part of that paralysis stems from an excessive focus on affirmative action, Kerry says, which in some cases creates the "reality of reverse discrimination" and alienates many white supporters of civil rights.

"I know people who don't have a racist bone in their body who think the system is rigged; that it's crazy," Kerry says. "The stereotypes have become dangerous and embedded, and the leadership has become craven. You need to deal with the reality that there are more whites than blacks on welfare; you also need to deal with the reality of a third generation on welfare," he says. "And you have to deal with why America refuses to deal with these realities."

"I think John simply felt this was his responsibility to speak out," says Larry Rasky, a Democratic consultant and sometime Kerry adviser in Boston. "To that extent, it is an example of John at his best . . . at the cutting edge of difficult, controversial issues, whether as a peacemaker or a warrior. He could have obviated some criticism by discussing the matter with more people in the community before he gave the speech. But so what? It's John's role to be a leader, not a follower. I don't think he needs to ask permission, and we shouldn't want him to."

Kerry's speech had its genesis in his personal background, which, he acknowledges, is largely white and privileged. "I don't think any white man in America can completely know" what it's like to be a minority, he says.

Kerry suggests his feelings on race were shaped by his parents; by an admired black member of the faculty at his prep school, St. Paul's, in Concord, N.H.; by the inspiration of the civil rights movement in the '60s; and, above all, by his own exposure to black comrades in the armed forces during the Vietnam War. In a 1971 appearance before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee as a veteran against the war, Kerry decried the racist nature of the war and the draft.

"The largest exposure I've had came in the military," says Kerry. "That was when I was on a working level with blacks on a day-to-day basis. I had a black gunner on my boat. We bled the same color."

In preparing his speech, Kerry says he read widely: from the speeches of Martin Luther King Jr. to the work of recent authors such as Yale law professor Stephen Carter, who questions the wisdom of affirmative action, and Thomas and Mary Edsall, who argue that the Democratic Party's inability to forge a broad consensus on race has helped cost it the White House.

Despite the flak generated by the speech, Kerry says: "I stand by it. I stand by this effort. And I stand by my description of the predicament."


This is why the Senator said he had "his head handed to him" about this speech. Rarely do topics stay in the news for nearly a month or provoke a firestorm like this did.

There are ideas in this that were ahead of their time. There are arguments in here that are being made today, 16 years later. There are certain "bitter" discussions that indicate both that we have changed in terms of discussing this topic and have not. Maybe it's better. I do think we are better off discussing race and backlash than not discussing it.

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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-18-08 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Thanks for finding this link
Edited on Fri Apr-18-08 09:41 PM by politicasista
I appreciate it and understand you have lot on your plate right now. :hi:

After reading this link, I think the good senator was bold (as I said above) to make this speech. I remember the movie about the Stuart incident and of course, Rodney King and the L.A. Riots. I understand not everyone was happy about the speech and felt he could have talked more to the community first, but he went out on a limb to do what he thought was right.

After reading this, I don't know what his approval ratings among black voters are, but I wonder if the supporters that were lost after all that, and people that may have been disappointed came back to him during the 96, 2004 election and now the 08 campaign. (I guess that's why I don't like him being on Imus' show, but that's just me I guess).

After all the criticism Obama himself got for "throwing his former pastor under the bus," skipping the State of the Black Union, MLK events in Memphis, and for "running from the issues that are important to the black community," I am understanding that you can't please everyone. He has had to tread lightly or be careful not to be seen as the black liberal candidate or the angry black candidate. There's a long list of similarities between 2004 and 2008 (as far as complaints go) it's almost hilarious.

As I said in the "May I come in" thread, I applaud the senator for getting a 100% Civil Rights record. That's a nice thing to have considering all the complaints about Dems taking the black vote for granted in every election.

And I will say it again, you can and won't please everyone (i.e. Obama endorsement), but Kerry, Uncle Ted, and others have made a bold move in supporting Obama and going against TPTB D.C. establishment. And I appreciate them for that. :)

























edit for word
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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-18-08 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. I believe the Senator's support was strong then and strong now
Yeah, that was a firestorm, but I kind of wish people would provoke more firestorms. When I reread this, given that it happened 16 years ago, I am struck by a couple of things. The points about the suppositions that white power-brokers had about what was good for minorities was not discussed in the commentary about that speech. That is remarkable. I am reminded that the early 90's were still showing a rising conservative ascendancy in thought. The discussion was about preserving the pieces of the pie as they were, maybe against what was coming. The discussion was not about making the economic pie bigger, figuring out how to re-slice the pie or baking more damn pies to give out in the first place. That was a 'man the barricades' discussion. Remarkable.

Maybe we have made progress since then. Maybe not. The Senator's argument, in this early form, had a lot of merit. The argument he advanced, back in 1992, is basically what Thomas Frank wrote about in "What's the Matter with Kansas" in 2005. We have set working class groups against each other. We have divided people instead of uniting them in their common concerns. This current argument that "blue collar" voters, who are always presumed to be white, won't vote for Obama is a false argument. Now they are trying to make Obama into an "elitist." I wonder if this is the 2008 way of saying that he aligns with the upper class liberals to ignore the "blue collar" workers.

I once had a discussion with someone in MA about "affirmative action" jobs. She lamented about how the firemen who had passed their entrance tests with high marks couldn't get jobs because their were quotas for minority hires. This puzzled me so I asked her how many minority firemen there were in her town. Ah, none. There were no minorities at that time in the police force or at the fire houses. This was a false argument that was a crutch for a lot of people.

We need to have a discussion over this type of thing. We need to have a discussion about responsibility and how to genuinely bring positive change to people. I wonder if we can do that honestly.
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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-18-08 11:11 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. I agree that this is discussion that we should be having
It's also a discussion that the Democratic party should be having. I am glad that Kerry, Obama, and others have brought that out in the open. I welcome that.

Thanks for the on the ground perspective. That must have been some firestorm to go through, but the good senator has weathered lots of them in his lifetime. :)
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Luftmensch067 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 01:50 AM
Response to Original message
6. Thanks for asking about this, Politicasista!
Edited on Sat Apr-19-08 02:07 AM by Luftmensch067
And thanks to Tay for the great history lesson! I had heard about and even read tiny quotes from the speech, but didnt know much more, and this article is fascinating indeed... I see in it the Globe's frequent tendency (they're not alone in this, of course!) to perform Olympic-level gymnastics in order to portray any motivation as purely political and leach it of any actual principle. I found this interesting press release from 2000:

"YouthBuild programs across the country are rejoicing that Congress finally gave a significant boost to YouthBuild's annual funding in response to the President's request and Senator John Kerry's persistent advocacy," said Dorothy Stoneman, Executive Director of YouthBuild USA. "Senator Kerry has been the champion of YouthBuild since he sponsored the original legislation in 1991, and he has never let up. This year he got 59 of his colleagues to call for an increase. We have learned that we can always count on him to take the next step for the young people in YouthBuild."

Guess he meant it when he "said that his speech is no one-shot deal but the start of a long-planned assault on the crisis in America's cities and the policies of "rationalization...avoidance...and exploitation" that have doomed previous efforts."

I think it's even more revealing of JK's attitude that the Dept. of Justice described YouthBuild this way in 2001:

Nationwide, about 6,000 young people, ages 16 to 24, participate in YouthBuild each year. Approximately 70 percent are male and 30 percent are female. They are racially diverse—55 percent African American, 20 percent Caucasian, 22 percent Latino, 1.5 percent Asian American, and 1 percent Native American. Ninety percent are from very low-income families.

Leadership Development
YouthBuild changes the way young people see themselves. By treating them consistently with respect, staff help students uncover their innate knowledge and abilities—traits that, in many cases, have gone unrecognized. Under the guidance of a nurturing staff, students learn to take on responsibility and overcome obstacles. In every YouthBuild program, students develop leadership skills by serving as key decisionmakers within their own programs and providing various forms of service to the community.



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TayTay Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 10:07 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. Thanks for posting this!
The problem with posting any news articles is that it is a frozen moment in time. It sort of answers the question that was posed above, but then cuts it off. Posting this shows that the experience went on, lessons were learned and acted upon. Politics is a supremely fluid thing. I think adding this shows that.

It is fascinating to how this topic has and had not been discussed in the national news. Maybe we will have some of that discussion in this extraordinary political year. That would be nice.
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Inuca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 06:13 AM
Response to Original message
7. Very interesting
Thanks to both politicalsista for bringing it up and to TayTay for the info.
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ralbertson Donating Member (264 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-20-08 08:07 AM
Response to Original message
9. Also, to correct one small but salient error in the OP...
The good people over at KerryVision do astoundingly good and hard work day in and day out, and they are some of The Tall Guy's most loyal and ardent long-time independent supporters in the online world, and we love them dearly, and, in fact, from time to time have the opportunity to cross-post some of their good stuff while touting them shamelessly, as we did, for example, here...

But, gosh darn all those pesky extra domain name suffixes they've handed us these days, it's so hard to keep track! Which is why the confusion is perfectly understandable, but for the record and for the sake of enabling all who read this forum on DU to more easily apprehend the KV peeps' swirly goodness on a daily basis, please let me note that it can actually be savored at www.kerryvision.net instead.

Great question and great answers in this thread, though. See, thanks to DUers like you guys, I still get to learn new (well, in this case, old) stuff about JK every day. Yay!

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politicasista Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 02:09 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Thanks for the correction
And thanks for the responses everyone. :hi:
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