Kerrycrat Kucitizens -- how close were Kerry's and Dennis' Iraq stances?

[LittleClarkie]

I am having a discussion with someone on Kos, and I've said repeatedly that the only one shouting "OUT NOW" is Nader, that even Dennis' plan doesn't call for immediate withdrawl. I thought that both his and Kerry's plans were to get the UN involved and take the American face off the war.

Oddly enough, the discussion I'm having is in defense of Dean, not Kerry. Apparently folks don't realize that Dean's stance is quite close to Kerry's, and that he's never been an "out now" guy either. More of an "out as soon as we can" guy.

Right or wrong?

[JI7]

1. i don't think Nader's plan calls for immediate withdrawal either

when you ask what should happen specifically i don't think it's different than what Kerry's plan is.

[LittleClarkie]

2. I suspect it was mostly spin

but that's the sense I get, that the plans were pretty close, but the way each was selling themselves was different.

[JI7]

3. assholes

because some people are assholes. they get hung up on the word "withdrawal". never mind that the specifics aren't too different.

it's like when they kiss Ron Paul and Pat Buchanan's asses just because they were against the iraq war. never mind that these two are a major threat to progressive ideals, far more than the Chimp is.

[LittleClarkie]

4. Buchannan is more of an "out now" person... I think.

And speaks just like a leftie when it comes to "imperialism"

It's like they both went around the political spectrum and met on the other side. Perhaps he and the lefty freepers should go bowling.

Pat's a good example of the old saying that even a broken clock is right twice a day.

[JI7]

5. that's why i don't consider being against the war a "left" or "liberal"

thing. Robert Novak opposed the war in Iraq also.

[kerrygoddess]

6. I'm almost certain Dennis called for out now

Before the convention.

[blm]

7. DK calls for out now as a dramatic tool, but, he also stresses RESPONSIBLY

so that the UN can take over.

Kerry's position was to stabilize Iraq using overwhelming show of troop strength, so the UN and NATO can takeover the operation sooner, thereby ending the IDEA of a US occupation.

[Island Blue]

8. DK signed the June congressional resolution

(signed by a number of both Democrats and Republicans) that calls for the withdrawal of troops beginning October 1, 2006.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/06/16/us.iraqresolution/

I think he had a more hard line "bring 'em home now" stance during the primaries, but things changes I guess. I think this is similar to what Sen. Kerry is calling for - start training Iraqi troops now so our troops can leave sooner rather than later.