I was so pissed this weekend at a Dem Breakfast

[LittleClarkie]

when the person across from me asked why I like Kerry so much. She said something to the effect that she wasn't impressed because she's heard that he never sponsored not even one piece of legislation as a Senator.

I surprised myself by reacting the way I would have here. I even used one of my favorite words. HORSEHOCKEY! I mentioned the Randall Cunningham legislation and she was fairly impressed.

I also told her about his role in Iran/Contra. She had no idea. God I bet she was just SOOO effective on the campaign trail.

I've spent two such breakfasts convincing the same woman that no Dems took money directly from Abramoff. She started in on Reid this time, saying he'd taken money just before a vote. And so I asked how he'd voted. She didn't know. I pointed out that he represents the tribes, but he ALSO represents Las Vegas, and so has a stake in keeping the tribes from expanding too much as well. And I do believe I read on a blog somewhere that in the vote in question, he did NOT vote witht the tribes. So that's what I told her. I also looked her right in the eye and told her to stop listening to right wing media.

But still, the Kerry stuff got to me.

I get the feeling this person is going to get on my nerves. She wants Hillary in 2008, and I commented that I thought her war stance would hurt her by then. This person actually said that she thought Hillary was waiting for the number of the dead to be higher, and then she'd come out against it. WHAT!? Oh good GOD!

Sheesh. She tried to run for office once, but fucked up her paperwork. Probably for the best, I'm thinking as I get to know her.

But anyway...

[JI7]

1. the person is probably influenced by the whore media

it's not just republicans who fall for the whore media shit and right wing talking points.

they probably think they are informed on politics because they watch shit like chris matthews and even fox news and other shows which are about nothing more than pundits who love to hear themselves.

(this points to another way the right wing media benefits from their whoring. even if certain dems may never vote for republicans they do get influenced by the talking points which in turn hurts us when they go out and "support" our candidates)

[emulatorloo]

7. The talking points are like air pollution, everybody breathes them in

You see it on DU all the time --

It really got brought home to me during the 04 election

I have a friend, a very intelligent guy, a very independent thinking, who went with me on most of my "let's go grill the candidates" expeditions during the Iowa Caucus season. By the end he was solidly Kerry.

Then during middle of 04 campaign I got a call from him, Kerry came up and he went on a wild 7 minute RANT about how Kerry was nothing but a FLIP_FLOPPER. I eventually talked him down, but it was certainly an eye opener for me that even independent thinkers can be susceptible to the repetition.

[FreedomAngel82]

2. Wow

Maybe you should print her out some information on Kerry. Show her how he's way better than Hillary. Don't forget BCCI! She'll be really impressed with that one!

[Island Blue]

3. That's a great idea.

You could also print her out a list of websites where she could go to find even more information.

[karynnj]

4. I agree with you - the BCCI stuff is impressive

and counters so many myths simultaneously.
- It is extremely complex, and very detailed. This is not the type of work an empty suit taking up a Senate seat would even consider. Even if the staff put most things together - asking the questions in the hearings would be too much. Taking it further to see the dangers and to recommend ways of dealing with it, shows intelligence, creativity and leadership.

- It shows persistence and determination, the opposite of flip flopping - He spent 5 years on it. Then when forced to stop, he took it to the justice department and to the NY DA, who was able to pursue it. Even then he didn't stop - first the official report included many key things that need to be investigated, led by the need for more investigation of the Pakistan bomb financing, which if done might have prevented the Khan network from doing the damage it did. Then he wrote his book, because he wanted to make people know that this problem was there. The unspoken possibility is that it is very unlikely that he wrote the book and didn't use his position as a Senator to lobby the Clinton administration to do something.

- He did most of this work with his own party absolutely against him. The photo of him sitting alone at a hearing visually shows how alone on this he was, but he continued. It may well be that this late 80s early 90s work was one of the most successful anti-terrorism things done before 911. Doing something that all the elected and non-elected leaders of your party want you to stop is not the action of a self serving out for himself politician - this is a dedicated public servant doing what's right.

As to Clinton, not only didn't they act on anything Kerry proposed, there is one famillar name on Kerry's list of things to investigate. Marc Rich - whose speculation was partially done with BCCI money - now where did we hear that name before? As BLM has psted any number of times, Clinton could have contributed more in holding back terrorism if he would have listened to Kerry.

[whometense]

5. Here's something that might

make you feel a little better -

Bill Maher was on Matthews' show last night. Crooks and Liars has video: http://www.crooksandliars.com/2006/02/14.html#a7160

He was there to discuss Cheney, but they got into presidential politics. Maher was openly derisive of the idea of HRC as a presidential candidate (I think his words were, "She'll never be president.") - to a degree that I think shocked Matthews, who was po'd that Maher wouldn 't play along with his fantasy.

I don't consider Maher any great predictor - but I do think what he was saying reflects the views of a whole lot of democrats out there.

By the way, did anyone here know that Matthews' "baby brother" is running as a rethug for something. He's gonna get a lot of in-kind help for his campaign. :eyes:

[wisteria]

6. Mathews brother is running alongside Lynn Swann in PA

Governors race as Lt. Governor. One big happy family. I'm sure the repubs will play this up as much as possible along with Swann being a former Steeler. Gee, these connections make them both well qualified to run the state don't they?

[_dynamicdems]

8. She's obviously one of the mindless masses that are being brainwashed

by the MSM. And the thing is: these people are so stupid that they will still believe what is broadcast on television as gospel truth no matter how much evidence they are given to the contrary.

IMHO, the greatest danger to our society isn't evil, it's stupidity.