McCain, did Bush poison your brain?

[elshiva]

JK was your true friend. He loved you. What happened? To the love you shared...
Doing homework together...

Suffered through the same annoying speeches...

Shared the same dancing partner...


Why? Why? You were some brainwashed neocon fascist, but one of the dying breed of bipartisan repubs. What's going down?

[GRLMGC]

1. There's no loyalty in politics

Seriously.


God, I'm so depressed.

[elshiva]

2. But Kennedy was loyal to Kerry all these years and vice versa

Is it just that repubs and dems can't be loyal to each other, even though they have so much in common and worked together like McCain and Kerry.

[GRLMGC]

3. I'll give you that example

but I think it's rare. I don't have faith in very many politicians. Once in awhile, one will come along. Now, I don't trust Republicans, haha.

[elshiva]

4. I do not trust repubs, either,

but I can't hate McCain cos of The Nam. I feel sad for him.

[JohnKleeb]

5. I feel similiar about Chuck Hagel

[elshiva]

7. Yeh, Hagel is OK

Susan Collins, Maine Senator, is a good liberal repub who is getting the brunt of a strange excommunication/treason case that also includes JK and Kennedy, just for that I sort of like her. Also I dig Maine and most Mainaics like her, too.

[JohnKleeb]

8. Ive actually met Hagel

He told my group he would vote against the gay marriage ban if it came up.

[elshiva]

12. Oh, go, Hagel, go, man

Hope to God he gets the repub nomination and not some ass like Cheney or Jeb/

[JohnKleeb]

13. well I Dont want him to because he could win

thjey wont let him win their primaries you know that though, hes too much a maverick, too much of a shades of gray dude.

[Pirate Smile]

25. Oh, no. We need her Senate seat.

[GRLMGC]

6. I respect him for that

but i don't respect his views. I don't respect Bush and I don't respect anyone who supports him.

[elshiva]

9. Yeh, but McCain should have got the nomination in

2000, it still makes me mad all the stupid smear things Dubya did to that Nam vet... Deja vu 2004!

[GRLMGC]

10. That's what gets me the most

I understand that he's a Republican and wants the nom in 08 but I don't understand how you can support someone who's attacked you so viciously and personally. I don't get it.

[elshiva]

11. He wants the nomination, that bad, I think.

Maybe he'll be lucky and beat out Cheney for the repubs that would be cool and have a half-way decent repub candidate, the first in eons.

[JohnKleeb]

14. Cheney won't run

I dont think so at least.

[LittleClarkie]

16. I just about popped a blood vessel earlier

when someone said they wished McCain had died in Hanoi. I told him to go to hell.

[GRLMGC]

17. That's just wrong

I don't particularly care for him but I would never wish death on anyone. He went through a horrible ordeal that most of of will never, ever have to go through. I hope that post got deleted. That's just wrong.

[angrydemocrat]

23. What the hell ? Why would someone make a statement like that?

That is wrong! Hell McCain has made mistakes but who the hell hasn't for that matter. And I did get pissed over the way he campaigned for * against Kerry because I felt he was being crazy for doing so after all the dirty smear tactics * done to him in 2000 then Cleland in 2002 and Kerry in 2004. But to say shit like that? Apparently whoever said that shit don't know the real John McCain and was talking out their ass! Which shouldn't be suprising after what I see some around DU say about Kerry as well. :grr: :grr: It is one thing to be pissed at the man and to questions his actions and motives but to say that shit is ridiculous!

[Pirate Smile]

37. That is just nasty. I hope everybody slammed them and the mods deleted

it.

[LittleClarkie]

15. Maybe it was that kiss on the forehead

Evil spell? Bush sucked out some of his brains?

I dunno.

I wonder if they're speaking right now.

Here's another one:



The quote that got me was when McCain said that he was "weary" of Kerry mentioning their friendship.

Then there was that article I quoted a while back where they sounded like such great friends.

Did McCain get warned to straighten up and fly right or "no nomination for you!" Sad, really.

[GRLMGC]

18. That's sad

I guess he's not much of a friend. What can you expect in Washington?

[karynnj]

19. Poor McCain, How mean of Kerry to mention friendship

From the talk shows, McCain looked incredibly uneasy when asked questions where the Republican talking points were personal attacks on Kerry. I think that it is normal for Republicans to support Republicans - even if on a personal level they prefer the Democrat. What wasn't normal was the viciousness of the Bush attack on Kerry.

In spite of everything, I would bet if Kerry thinks that he could get McCain's vote or co-sponsorship on something he finds important, he would put aside any personal hurt. There are only 100 Senators, the Democrats are a minority, avoiding one who in the past has been a maverick would not be something a 20 yr Senator would do. Kerry allied himself with Helmes to investigate the Contras!

All the same, it had to hurt Kerry on a person level. (and I hope the "weary" comment means that on some level, Kerry did get to McCain's conscience with his saying they were friends. It speaks better for Kerry than for McCain as McCain himself had talked and written about this friendship.)

[elshiva]

38. That Photo, LittleClarkie always gets me.

They worked together so well. It hurts when friends abandon each other for petty political reasons. The sad thing is all of McCain's kissing up to Dubya can not help him. McCain is not a neocon and that is just that. His support for Dubya was hollow and stupid.
Still respect McCain for the Nam and the POW work with Kerry, but I hope that he wises up to Bush's dirty manipulations and goes back to being friends with Kerry and Feingold. No finer friends than Feingold and Kerry, Sen. McCain! A couple weeks ago McCain got a video jeopardy answer whose question was "who was Feingold." McCain looked sad and blinking wistfully for the for the old days.

[whometense]

20. Did you see him speak yesterday?

If he didn't piss me off so much I'd find it sad. He says all the repuke lines as if he had to memorize them for homework. It's like the fiery McCain is dead.

Do you think they threatened his family or something? I mean, seriously.

[karynnj]

21. Saw it

I really hated the tone he used when he was talking about it being because the Democrats were bitter about the election. What's weird is that if he's acting like this to get the Bush nod in 2008, he may simultaneously be losing independent (or moderate democratic) support.
His "likability" should really suffer.

[whometense]

22. Agree.

It makes absolutely no sense to me.

[angrydemocrat]

24. Well McCain Is Fooling Himself To Think * Will Back Him

You wait and see if what I'm saying don't turn out to be right. All Bush did was use McCain in this past election as a tool against Kerry. The sad fact of the matter is McCain let him. But * will be backing Frist. Wait and see. Sure * will be nicey nicey to McCains face but wait and see if you don't see his name smeared with dirty tatics just like 2000.

[karynnj]

26. Agree with you

My only question was could he really be that blind? The other thing is that Bush may not even be in control of who succeeds him. The religious right is still there and powerful in the primaries. Until the comments after the election, I thought it was maybe just partisan politics - especially because he did have limits on what he was willing to say about Kerry. (compare to Dole)

The thing that's really weird is that the last book he wrote had lots of stories about the POW/MIA work he and Kerry did. Reading the pages on Kerry, I came away absolutely impressed by Kerry's skill and patience in handling the committee, the issues, and the Vietnamese. (oddly - I was less impressed by McCain after reading it than I was before I did.)

(Note: I was killing time at a library waiting for my daughter who would live in a library or bookstore if given the chance)

[angrydemocrat]

27. I agree that it's weird

I'm still pissed at McCain over the shit he has done and the remarks he has made. I was in shock at his attitude and action as I'm sure Kerry was as well. You know it bothered Kerry. If one thing is for sure McCain ought to be totally ashamed and if he doesn't regret how he has done Kerry eventually his concious will get the best of him. McCain lost a lot of respect with a lot of people over what he did and what he has said. Some believe that if McCain runs that he will win the republican nominee but I don't. He will be smeared so bad that it wouldn't suprise me to see Kerry and Cleland end up coming to his rescue. We will have to wait and see. But Kerry is not the type of man to hold grudges and stay bitter at someone like McCain. Kerry will be there for McCain if he needs it and that I truly do believe that. It's just sad that McCain doesn't have the same respect for Kerry.

I have McCain's book called "Worth The Fighting For"-a memoir. And in that book he talks a lot about Kerry and in a very positive caring way. It is a book worth reading. But he talks about Kerry all through the book. So it is hard for me to understand what the hell is going on with McCain none of it makes any damn sense. I'm sure Kerry is still scratching his head and bothered a great deal over it all and ask's himself all the time what the hell? What is his problem? What is going on here? I would like to know the answers to those question myelf. Everytime I see McCain I can't help but wonder why he has said and done the things his has.

[karynnj]

28. All in all something was weird with McCain this year

You didn't see some of the other Republican senators, such as Lugar, Hagel, or the Maine women prominately campaigning for Bush - so McCain clearly chose to do it. Given his past experience with Bush and his respect for Kerry, you think he'd have ample reason to decide it was a great time to vacation somewhere. (Unless he somehow felt Bush was a better President)

The fact the Kerry was the first person to defend Kerrey, Clealand, and McCain when they were attacked makes it sad how wishy washy McCain was in standing up for Kerry. (At least Kerrey and Clealand were great) I also thought it was appauling that McCain put out elaborate details about the VP offer - I would think that there should almost be an assumed confidentiality. )

The funny think is that McCain's appeal is supposedly that he is a straight talking maverick. This year hack politician fits better. (Oddly straight talking maverick fits Kerry better - although the "straight - talking" hides though a veneer of polished eloquence, it really seemed that Kerry placed importance on truth.)

[angrydemocrat]

30. McCain was being a total ass when he told about the VP offer.

I don't know if he thought he would make his own image look better or if it was just pure damn greed and he wanted the whole damn package for himself. I was pissed along with a lot of other Americans for a long time over that crap. And so many people talk about what a total dumbass he was after that. Many still do. Republicans and Democrats. Because there were alot of Republicans that voted for Kerry and most of them that did said that they would never vote for McCain if he was to run after that crap happen. I have to say that would have been a hell of a ticket.

A lot of those who use to call McCain a straight talking maverick no longer think that way about him and he sure doesn't have the support that he once had. This was one time McCain chopped his nose off to spite his face. And the people on the far right don't like him that well either. McCain's major supporter came from the less conservative republicans, people on the fence, and democrats that were more moderate or to the right. McCain has lost a lot of that support over the past year or year and a half. McCain won't do as well as people think. I live in a state that is full of republicans and you here all the time from these people that they would never vote for him because he is a put on and doesn't say or do what he promises. They say what you are seeing out of him now is a for political gain and he is a joke. Hell democrats don't talk as nasty about him as the republins do around here. Don't get me wrong he still has supporters out there but nothing compared to what he had.

Frist is the candidate the people on the far right and the neocons want not McCain. And he lost other supporters over what he said and did to Kerry. So I personally don't see it happening for McCain between losing the support that he has and the smear tactics that will happen against him but oh well he did to himself.

[Pirate Smile]

29. Bush only backs Bush loyalists and McCain isn't one no matter how

hard he tried in 2004. Bush will screw him.

Did you see the C-span forum over the weekend with Eleanor Clift and Evan Thomas talking about the Newsweek book on the election.

Eleanor talked about how JK had spoke to McCain about being VP and Sec. of Defense in 2003 (when he was way behind) and McCain didn't really say anything.

Later JK went back to McCain and pushed him hard to do this. He thought a unity ticket would be good for the country. The last Prez that did it was Lincoln. McCain said no and JK went off with a string of expletives about how could he do this after what they did to him in South Carolina.

McCain sold his soul to the devil (Bush).

[angrydemocrat]

31. No I Didn't Get To See That

I missed it. I would like to have seen it. McCain was being a total ass when it came to the VP deal and running his mouth the way he did. I have said it for a long time now and you wait and see if I'm not right Bush will back Frist. It was with Bush's help Frist got to be the majority leader. Why? Because if Bush tells Frist to jump he jumps. Before all is said and done McCain will deeply regret what he did to Kerry. I wouldn't blame Kerry if the next time McCain needed his help if he just told him to go to hell. But as I said Kerry is not the kind of man to hold grudges and have bitterness towards someone like McCain. Kerry will be there to help McCain if he needs it. But I know he pissed Kerry off and it bothered Kerry at what McCain said and did. So if he did tell him to go to hell I couldn't blame him a bit.

[Pirate Smile]

32. At the time a lot of Dems were saying "no way" not a Repub as VP but

the Country is so extremely divided I can see how it would have been a unifying and bold move.

[LittleClarkie]

33. Same reason he gave for the concession, so it makes sense

He doesn't want the country to be so divided any more. But there isn't a ton he can do to stop it. I thought suggesting Hagel for his cabinet was interesting too, for the same reason. But yeah, people on both sides were going to have trouble with that.

[Pirate Smile]

34. They would have won in a landslide and McCain is NEVER going to

be any closer to Prez then he is now as a Senator.

[CBHagman]

35. Pirate Smile, is there a print account of that?

I would be interested in reading about that conversation. That really makes for an interesting scenario.

My friends and I have speculated about why McCain has kowtowed to Bush. Does Karl Rove have naked pictures of Cindy? Was one of the McCain children held hostage? It just boggles the mind.

I'll bet most people don't know about the smears against McCain in the 2000 primaries, particularly in South Carolina. It says volumes about Bush's character that he can't run without smears and he always, always, always has someone do his dirty work for him, so that the general public won't notice and can maintain the fiction of Bush being a good Christian man. That just makes my blood boil. :mad:

[Pirate Smile]

36. I don't know. Evan and Eleanor were speaking at a book store to

promote the Newsweek book about the 2004 election.

Eleanor said she got 3 scoops that she had to hold until after the election for the special Newsweek. 1. How seriously JK pursued McCain about VP; 2. Clinton telling Kerry to back the Fed Constitutional Amendment banning gay marriage and Kerry saying (when he got off the phone) that he would NEVER do that, and 3. I can't remember 3 - I'm sorry. Maybe it will come to me.

It should be in the book and I don't know if they do transcripts for those C-span segments or if it is on their website. They only played it once. It was taped near the Inauguration and Thomas mentioned that he figured the crowd was almost all Kerry supporters and you could tell from the reaction to that statement that it was true so they spoke more about Kerry then Bush.

I'll look at C-span's website although I'm not very experienced at tracking things down over there.

edit to add - Eleanor mentioned McCain saying he thought the Sec of Defense/VP might not be Constitutional. Well, buddy, I think you could have had either.

[CBHagman]

Thanks. I saw something that might have been the book...

...at work last weekend. I'll have to go back and check (Bookstore is my part-time gig).

[Pirate Smile]

40. You may want to just read the parts on JK but I've heard it is

mainly a slam on his campaign. This is it. Plus a lot on Bush and that sounds like torture to read.

[CBHagman]

39. Thanks. I saw something that might have been the book...

...at work last weekend. I'll have to go back and check (Bookstore is my part-time gig).

[Siyahamba]

41. He seemed to tack hard to the right since 2000

He seems most interested in his own job security, unfortunately.

[saracat]

42. Lincoln Chaffee has more integrity than McCain.

He voted against the War and he didn't vote for Bush. Even election day he said he did what he had publicly promised. He wouldn't vote Dem so he wrote in Poppy's name as a protest.