Why is condemnation of homosexuality the #1 Christian value to RWers?

[Rocknrule]

They sure don't have a problem with "thou shalt not kill, steal, covet, bear false witness, worship idols, or use the Lord's name for evil." And I'm sure they eat lobster (which according to the Bible is a sin) at big fancy GOP fundraiser dinners every chance they get. So why is homosexuality the only unforgivable sin to them?

[NewJeffCT]

1. They are afraid they're really gay?

Only thing I can think of off the top of my head.

[porphyrian]

31. That's pretty close, I think.

They believe homosexuality is a bad "sin," so they want to be as hetero as possible. The problem is that sexuality isn't a binary, it's a spectrum, with pure homosexuality on one end and pure heterosexuality on the other. Most people fall somewhere in between. Thus, most of these people who are trying frantically not to "sin" have probably had some kind of homosexual thought or urge, even if relatively minor. Depending on their level of concern over these feelings or that they might be discovered by others, they tend to overcompensate, sometimes to the point of hate crimes.

[OneBlueSky]

50. exactly . . . well said . . .

what terrifies many is the homosexual part of their own psychosexual makeup . . . hatred is bred of fear, and homophobes fear that part of themselves enough to hate its overt expression by others . . .

[slackmaster]

51. I'd phrase it as "Insecure in their own sexuality"

:evilgrin:

[Cronus Protagonist]

65. It's the Gay Agenda (link)

http://cronus.com/agenda

enjoy :)



Educate A Freeper - Flaunt Your Opinions!
http://brainbuttons.com/home.asp?stashid=13

[dave123williams]

2. Many of them are secretly gay?

Ah, the sham marriage as it creeps in to middle age...

Plus, it's about the only bigotry that's acceptable to them. I mean, other than their bigotry for blacks, hispanics, jews, muslims and anything else that's not white, straight and Christian with a capital 'REBORN' in front of it.

I loved Colbert's question the other night, 'so - do we give fags driver's licenses?'

[BuyingThyme]

3. Because if you're not not somebody, you're nobody.

Hatred gives them an identity which they can feel deep down in their dark souls.

[novalib]

4. I Thought Stopping ALL Abortion

was # 1 on their list....

?????

[Rocknrule]

8. That's another thing; does the Bible ever say abortion is wrong?

I don't think it does

[novalib]

16. As Far as I Know,

the Bible says absolutely nothing about abortion.

[Thtwudbeme]

18. not only does it not say anything; God damn near smites a pregnant

woman.

In another passage, a priest appears to have a woman drink something that causes her to miscarry...and...back on the smiting stuff...when God was whacking people off willy nilly, you NEVER read where he thundered something about saving the poor fetuses.

So, no. The bible isn't a help to the prolifers.

[NYC Liberal]

29. Skeptic's Annotated Bible comes in handy

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/says_about/abortion.html

Abortion is not murder. A fetus is not considered a human life.

"If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life." -- Exodus 21:22-23

The Bible places no value on fetuses or infants less than one month old.

"And if it be from a month old even unto five years old, then thy estimation shall be of the male five shekels of silver, and for the female thy estimation shall be three shekels of silver." -- Leviticus 27:6

Fetuses and infants less than one month old are not considered persons.

"Number the children of Levi after the house of their fathers, by their families: every male from a month old and upward shalt thou number them. And Moses numbered them according to the word of the LORD." -- Numbers 3:15-16

God sometimes approves of killing fetuses.

"Give them, O LORD: what wilt thou give? give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts." -- Hosea 9:14

"Yea, though they bring forth, yet will I slay even the beloved fruit of their womb." -- Hosea 9:16

"Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up." -- Hosea 13:16

God sometimes kills newborn babies to punish their parents.

"Because by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme, the child also that is born unto thee shall surely die." -- 2 Samuel 12:14

God sometimes causes abortions by cursing unfaithful wives.

"The priest shall say unto the woman, The LORD make thee a curse and an oath among thy people, when the LORD doth make thy thigh to rot, and thy belly to swell. And this water that causeth the curse shall go into thy bowels, to make thy belly to swell, and thy thigh to rot: And the woman shall say, Amen, amen. ...
And when he hath made her to drink the water, then it shall come to pass, that, if she be defiled, and have done trespass against her husband, that the water that causeth the curse shall enter into her, and become bitter, and her belly shall swell, and her thigh shall rot: and the woman shall be a curse among her people. And if the woman be not defiled, but be clean; then she shall be free, and shall conceive seed." -- Numbers 5:21-21, 27-28

God's law sometimes requires the execution (by burning to death) of pregnant women.

"Tamar thy daughter in law hath played the harlot; and also, behold, she is with child by whoredom. And Judah said, Bring her forth, and let her be burnt." -- Genesis 38:24

[noonwitch]

35. They use a quote from Psalms about god knowing the writer in the womb

I don't know the exact quote or reference, but I've seen it posted before.

There is no scripture that definitively denounces abortion. Like any other issue, you can find justification for either side. It should be noted that God uses miscarraiges to punish people-like David and Bathsheba, and orders the Israelites to kill all people, specifically including women and children, in some of the wars they fought in the Old Testament.

I would guess that pro-lifers would say the fact that God did use such an extreme method to punish David and Bathsheba for their sin means that only God should have that kind of power. Whatever.

As far as homosexuality goes, there is nothing in the words of Jesus that forbids it. The OT and Paul have issues, but Paul is not Jesus, even if some think he speaks for Him. Leviticus calls it an "abomination before the Lord". Pretty much acting human in any way is an abomination before the Lord in Leviticus.

A lot of my coworkers (even liberals who don't like gays) will quote that part from Leviticus. I usually respond with "Isn't that the same part of the Bible that tells us to stone urban rape victims to death for not screaming loudly enough? We don't do that anymore." (Actually, it's Deutoronomy that has the thing about the rape victims, but it's all Moses' law). They usually don't have a response to that, generally because they are running to look in their Bibles to see if there really is a commandment to stone urban rape victims who don't scream loudly enough. Since it's there, they usually don't come back to argue scripture anymore with me.

[novalib]

37. It's From the Same Part of the Bible that says

that eating shellfish is an abomination.

[BeTheChange]

63. Wow, talk about twisting

The first verse you referenced does say that if that child dies, a eye for an eye, life for a life. etc. If the baby is premature and lives, the man got to figure out the penalty.

"If men who are fighting hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman's husband demands and the court allows. 23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise.


In the second verse where you claim it says children under 1 month arent persons they are speaking about this:
"Give the following instructions to the Israelites: If you make a special vow to dedicate someone to the LORD by paying the value of that person, 3here is the scale of values to be used."

They didn't baptise, christen, etc children that were under a month during those times so it wasnt even factored in. Sometimes we have to look at the old testament in historical context.

Now good old Hosea.. Are you kidding me? Perhaps you should read all of Hosea 9. # That is Hosea talking, not the Lord and #2, it is a pleading, a sparing request, not a punishment. Hosea 9 is some harsh shit.. but this isnt some whim that came upon the Lord, this is reckoning for generations of disobedience to a Lord that regularly showed his face through more then word. It spares not young, old, born, concieved... its pretty equal.


2nd Samuel.. I like how you added newborn in for some shock value and pizzaz. Again, it wasnt some lark. Here is David, which the Lord has appeared to.. has given to this guy a kingdom! And David becomes a total and complete jerkoff, time and time again. He steals a guys wife for a one night stand, knocks her up and then kills her husband. Its not like David was just sitting around being all pious but not believing in God so God decided to kill his baby.


Numbers 5.. I adore when people try to twist things to their ends. Both sides of the aisle try to do it but goodness! This says nothing about abortion:
11And the LORD said to Moses, 12"Say to the people of Israel: `Suppose a man's wife goes astray and is unfaithful to her husband. 13Suppose she sleeps with another man, but there is no witness since she was not caught in the act. 14If her husband becomes jealous and suspicious of his wife, even if she has not defiled herself, 15the husband must bring his wife to the priest with an offering of two quarts of barley flour to be presented on her behalf. Do not mix it with olive oil or frankincense, for it is a jealousy offering--an offering of inquiry to find out if she is guilty.
16" `The priest must then present her before the LORD. 17He must take some holy water in a clay jar and mix it with dust from the Tabernacle floor. 18When he has presented her before the LORD, he must unbind her hair and place the offering of inquiry--the jealousy offering--in her hands to determine whether or not her husband's suspicions are justified. The priest will stand before her, holding the jar of bitter water that brings a curse to those who are guilty. 19The priest will put the woman under oath and say to her, "If no other man has slept with you, and you have not defiled yourself by being unfaithful, may you be immune from the effects of this bitter water that causes the curse. 20But if you have gone astray while under your husband's authority and defiled yourself by sleeping with another man"-- 21at this point the priest must put the woman under this oath--"then may the people see that the LORD's curse is upon you when he makes you infertile. 22Now may this water that brings the curse enter your body and make you infertile." And the woman will be required to say, "Yes, let it be so." 23Then the priest will write these curses on a piece of leather and wash them off into the bitter water. 24He will then make the woman drink the bitter water, so it may bring on the curse and cause bitter suffering in cases of guilt.

25" `Then the priest will take the jealousy offering from the woman's hand, lift it up before the LORD, and carry it to the altar. 26He will take a handful as a token portion and burn it on the altar. Then he will require the woman to drink the water. 27If she has defiled herself by being unfaithful to her husband, the water that brings the curse will cause bitter suffering. She will become infertile, and her name will become a curse word among her people. 28But if she has not defiled herself and is pure, she will be unharmed and will still be able to have children.

29" `This is the ritual law for dealing with jealousy. If a woman defiles herself by being unfaithful to her husband, 30or if a man is overcome with jealousy and suspicion that his wife has been unfaithful, the husband must present his wife before the LORD, and the priest will apply this entire ritual law to her. 31The husband will be innocent of any guilt in this matter, but his wife will be held accountable for her sin.' "


But the best one.. the absolute cream of the crop is your Genesis 38 reference .. First, this was what Judah said.. and I love how you neglected what happened next.

About three months later, word reached Judah that Tamar, his daughter-in-law, was pregnant as a result of prostitution. "Bring her out and burn her!" Judah shouted.

25But as they were taking her out to kill her, she sent this message to her father-in-law: "The man who owns this identification seal and walking stick is the father of my child. Do you recognize them?"

26Judah admitted that they were his and said, "She is more in the right than I am, because I didn't keep my promise to let her marry my son Shelah." But Judah never slept with Tamar again.

27In due season the time of Tamar's delivery arrived, and she had twin sons. 28As they were being born, one of them reached out his hand, and the midwife tied a scarlet thread around the wrist of the child who appeared first, saying, "This one came out first." 29But then he drew back his hand, and the other baby was actually the first to be born. "What!" the midwife exclaimed. "How did you break out first?" And ever after, he was called Perez. 30Then the baby with the scarlet thread on his wrist was born, and he was named Zerah.



As for some things that touch on life before birth:
Isaiah 44:2
I am your Creator.
You were in my care
even before you were born.

Isaiah 49:
1Listen, O coastlands, to Me,
And take heed, you peoples from afar!
The LORD has called Me from the womb;
From the matrix of My mother He has made mention of My name.

5 “ And now the LORD says,
Who formed Me from the womb to be His Servant,
To bring Jacob back to Him,
So that Israel is gathered to Him
(For I shall be glorious in the eyes of the LORD,
And My God shall be My strength),


Psalm 139:13 - 15

13You are the one

who put me together

inside my mother's body,

14and I praise you



because of

the wonderful way

you created me.

Everything you do is marvelous!

Of this I have no doubt.

15Nothing about me

is hidden from you!

I was secretly woven together

deep in the earth below,

16but with your own eyes

you saw

my body being formed.

Even before I was born,

you had written in your book

everything I would do.

Jeremiah 1:5
Then the word of the LORD came to me, saying:
5 “ Before I formed you in the womb I knew you;
Before you were born I sanctified you;
I ordained you a prophet to the nations.”

[pdxmom]

5. Because that is the only "sin" they aren't guilty of on a regular

basis. They commit all those other sins all the time, so they take the one thing that they DON'T do and turn it into the worst crime imaginable.

[AndyTiedye]

44. Can You Say "Jeff Gannon"?

only sin they are not guilty of on a regular basis

[pdxmom]

66. But he's seen the error of his ways. And the Christian Right is

always ready to forgive a repentent sinner. Unless that person's name is Clinton. I hate their hypocrisy!

[Larissa238]

6. Because they are scared

and probably in the closet, but so far in that they can never see the light. Not all of them, mind you, but some of the biggest homophobes have closeted homosexual tendancies. The other RW's just follow, since some of them want to do what they are told is Biblical.

Plus, we are probably "gross" to them.

[kaygore]

11. Wow! Great answer--I never thought of that but it makes sense

They sure don't shy away from any other sin.

[Larissa238]

39. There was some study done

and homophobic men were more aroused by gay porn than normal straight men (who were not really aroused at all). http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1589/is_n730/ai_20799514

[novalib]

17. There Was Some Guy Back in the '80's

I can't remember his name, but he was a guy who was in charge of one of the conservative "pac's" that helped to get Reagan elected and helpd to get a Republican Senate elected in 1980.

Anyway, this guy was completely closeted. He was so self-loathing that he campaigned against gay rights in the 80's.

He died of AIDS in the mid-80's.

[formerrepuke]

58. That sounds like Roy Cohn.. see "Citizen Cohn" with James Woods

or "Angels in America" with Al Pacino playing Roy Cohn.. for some idea of what a creep he was.

[napi21]

7. It just happens to be the ONE at the top of their list today!

Talk to them some time, and you'll find they have a rather long list. They just alternate between Gays, abortion, and pre-marital sex, as being their "soup of the day"!

[DUHandle]

9. A part of the glue that hold the right together is hatred.

Russia for while, communists before that, jews (on and off), catholics (on and off) people who aren't fair-complected (subtly and always)

[triguy46]

13. Absolutely,

well said. the unifying power of shared hate is a powerful tool.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

10. Homophobia

Most homosexual bashing is against gays, and I think it is because many men are not comfortable with their own sexualty and also with what exactly it means in this society to be a man. To many of those men, showing any kind of tender feelings is "gay"-they fear they are "going gay" because they'd like to hug another fellow. They don't realize that these feelings are natural human feelings-to touch is something primates do!

[One_of_8]

34. It's not only the men that feel this way

but a good many right-winger women. I read a letter to "Dear Abby" not too long ago supposely from a wife and mother. She was concerned that her husband might be instilling gay tendencies in her son because he cooked and was teaching his son how to cook. She read in Dr. Dobson that that sort of behavior could lead to turning your child into a homosexual. (For what it's worth, sounds like she's got a much better husband than she deserves!)

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

61. Wow

I didn't realize that so many women had drunk the Kool Aid on this matter. That's what comes from hanging around with strong women who know who they are, and this includes homosexuals and heterosexuals.

[triguy46]

12. They need witches to burn.

Burning a witch is a tangible way to rally the believers. Gays are their favorite witch right now, the hatred that christians have unites them is what they believe is a crusade, and it also, in their minds, allows for justification of all kinds of non-christian behaviors, (ends justify the means yadda yadda).

[shenmue]

14. Because they're nuts

Got to beat up somebody about something.

Bunch of jerks.

[mntleo2]

15. They Did It With Witchcraft Too...

I suspect this is because they have some fascination with it or are closeted themselves and they are ashamed. Why I do not know. Maybe Mommy whipped them when she caught them masturbating while fantasizing about the boy next door? Some of the most vehement critics are caught literally with their pants down and this is always ironic to me. They deserve the very treatment they promoted for everyone else. It is karma in action IMO.

My 2 cents.

Cat In Seattle

[saltpoint]

19. Fundies like to control other people generally and they like to control

them sexually particularly.

[saltpoint]

20. The operatives of the GOP take notice of this irrational fear and

whip it up, if I may use that phrase, to insure fundie voter turn-out.

If the idiot fundies didn't make it an issue of their own volition, the Atwater/Rove people would have had to invent it, and as it is, they make sure these ballot initiatives against same-sex marriage flood state ballots to drive up red turnout.

[izzybeans]

21. There is no hatred like self-hatred.

[ClassWarrior]

22. They'll tell you that it's because it's a sin. But one of the keystones...

...of Xtianity is that all sins are equally sinful, and Christ forgives them all anyway if you accept His forgiveness.

Okay, the short answer is hatred and fear.

NGU.

[deaniac21]

32. not so....look in Wikipedia

Defined types of sin
Original sin -- Most denominations of Christianity interpret the Garden of Eden account in Genesis in terms of the fall of man. Adam and Eve's disobedience was the first sin man ever committed, and their original sin (or the effects of the sin) is passed on to their descendants (or has become a part of their environment). See also: total depravity.
Concupiscence
Venial sin
Mortal sin
Eternal sin -- Commonly called the Unforgivable sin (mentioned in Matthew chapter 12, verse 31), this is perhaps the most controversial sin, whereby someone has become an apostate, forever denying himself a life of faith and experience of salvation; the precise nature of this sin is often disputed.

[A HERETIC I AM]

23. I think their objections to homosexuality are because they dont procreate

The religions that are the faiths of the god of Abraham dont like homosexuals because homosexual sex doesnt produce offspring. I honestly think the the historical reasons behind hating gays so much comes from the idea that gay sex is essentially hedonistic (at least in the eyes of the church) and things that satisfy self are to be shunned. Also the fact that no children are produced means less believers and ...well.....they JUST CAN'T HAVE THAT!

Not to mention that studies have shown homosexuals tend to be in the higher percentile of intelligence and the smarter a person is, the less likely he is to be a believer. (i might get flamed for that, but it's true. There are damned few gay idiots, and even fewer overtly religious ones)

[DanCa]

24. well its conservative dogma not christianity for starters

And I can't stand the rwing. There so anti science that they wont let us have stem cell research that could possibly cure parkinsons disease. Do you know that one Bishop actually said to me that I deserve PD because I want to harvest babies for my own ends? I can't truly can't stand these people.

[stopbush]

25. Because it's an easy "sin" to take on compared to the rest of

the OT.

Can you imagine the can of worms you'd open going after polyester suits?
(Duet. 22:11 Thou shalt not wear a garment of divers sorts, as of woollen and linen together.)

[Raksha]

40. Just for the record, that commandment doesn't apply to polyester,

only to the mixing animal of and vegetable fibers (i.e. wool and linen or cotton). The odd thing is that if you keep kosher you can EAT meat and vegetables together (but not meat and dairy products), but you can't WEAR them! Go figure...

[Swamp Rat]

26. This 'condemnation' theme is woven into a complex system of denial.

;)

[Roland99]

27. It's an easy way for them to "challenge" their "faith" and come out on top

thus validating their faith and their self.


There was a Rolling Stone reporter that went undercover as a B/C volunteer in Florida back during the '04 election and stayed with families, mostly fundies from what I remember, and came away with eyes opened. They see it as a literal threat to their faith and they need to claim victory somehow.

It's like they're suffering from Stockholm Syndrome.

IMO, it's merely a matter that their self is as fragile as blown glass and needs constant repair and shoring up.

[MamaBear]

28. All of the Above, plus this.

Why to Fundies hate gays? I think their subconscious thought process goes something like this:

They want to feel welcome and secure in their families and communities, and since religion is important to them, very much so in their churches. (This same thinking, however, applies to all strict and/or fundamentalist sects of any religion.)

Their religion demands strict codes of behavior from them, especially concerning their sexual behavior: sex with spouse only and only for procreation.

In order to feel secure in their community, they try to hold themselves very rigidly to that code of conduct. It's not easy, sometimes not at all satisfying. The only payoff is their sense of belonging and hope of future reward (going to heaven).

Along come people who do not believe as they do; who like to party; who may have more than one sexual partner, consecutively or concurrently; who "indulge themselves" in all sorts of behavior that is proscribed to the fundamentalist (use of alcohol, for instance, or maybe some gamling, or even dancing). These "sinful" people, further, are not struck down by God and, even worse, want to live among them, raise children who also will not be bound by their strict laws. Further, the fundamentalist's own children may see all the fun these other kids are having and want to "join" them and be lured into this sinful existence.

Some may feel themselves "lured" and "tempted" to be free to relax a bit, to try out new things, maybe to explore their own feelings about people of the same gender. But always in their mind will be those "teachings" that are "eternal" and "true" and, literally, written in stone: that those feelings are "wrong" and "sinful" and will result in their being shunned from the community of true believers and, worse, tormented for all eternity after death.

What to do? For some, an answer is to try to remove the source of their "temptation" -- which they perhaps see as Satan in the form of their gay or lesbian neighbors, or maybe Satan in the form of Rosie O'Donnell or Heath and Jack, or the two guys living quietly on the next block raising their kids together.

Because the life the fundamentalist has chosen for himself or herself -- consciously or as a result of upbringing -- is a difficult one. Their view of God is ultimately ambiguous: the loving Father patriarch who has only their good at heart, but who will, for the slightest unrepented infraction, gladly torment them for all eternity. And they are living alongside fellow congregants who are keeping a very sharp watch out for any "slippage" among their fellows, to keep their ministry pure and, therefore, more worthy of protection and reward in God's eyes.

Living under that kind of background stress, it's not surprising these people are intolerant. These rigid structures may be good for some, but I think that even for people who choose them, they are not particularly healthy -- not for the people "inside," not for their neighbors, and especially not for those who are doing the things these people say they don't do, because people outside the circle are ultimately seen as temptors (and therefore tools of Satan), and a threat to the believer's very soul.

Just my two cents.

[Roland99]

30. Very well said.

[FlaGranny]

33. Great post and very true. n/t

[Maine-ah]

36. is eating lobster really a sin in the bible?

[Saphire]

45. any shell-fish are unclean

[Raksha]

49. Yup, eating shellfish is considered a sin, just like eating pork.

The commandment applies to any kind of aquatic creature (like lobsters) that doesn't have fins and scales. Orthodox Jews observe these dietary restrictions to this day. Just for the record, I'm not one of them but I tend to remember this stuff.

It's often said that originally there were solid health reasons for these dietary restrictions, but that is NOT true. Any health reasons for not eating pork (for example) are secondary and were discovered after the fact. The original reasons are not known, and the people who actually observe these commandments ADMIT that they are totally arbitrary! "God told us to do X or not do Y" is the only reason given, and apparently the only reason they need.

That gets pretty sticky with regard to homosexuality, because we know now that some people are born gay or lesbian. It isn't "a lifestyle choice." That would imply that God CREATED certain people with a tendency to sin???? The Catholic Church seems to be stuck with the same problem these days, and isn't handling it too well either.

[BeTheChange]

64. Yes, in the OLD testament..

Now there is the New Testament with this guy called Jesus.. maybe some of you have heard of him and can stop giving the OT Christians further fuel for their fires in the ridiculous crap that is dragged up from the OT.

Forget the whole society in which the OT was written for. Let's just druge up the most severe parts of it when it suits us.

38. hypocrisy. you can call yourself anything you like

but that does not mean you are actually that thing. I would say most Christians do not live up to that term at all.

Why are gays so especially disliked? Male dominant society where free thinking is evil.

[Initech]

41. I think it's just cause the fundies hate sex

And if they dont get laid, no one gets laid! That's my theory, anyway.

[sinkingfeeling]

42. Because that have forgotten everything that Jesus actually taught.

[EstimatedProphet]

43. Small minds need something to look down upon, in order to feel superior

[TheBaldyMan]

46. IMO it's because they are a bunch of closet cases

they can't come out or be honest about their sexuality with consequent self-loathing. Their basic inability to regard homosexuality as just as healthy and normal as heterosexuality eats away at them.

[baldguy]

47. b/c alot of "Good Christians" are murderers, thieves & adulterers.

[Beelzebud]

48. Hate is their moral value.

It's not ok for them to hate african americans anymore, so they hate the homosexuals.

[novalib]

52. Judgmentalism, Too

Their moral values include hatred and judgmentalism.

They love sitting in judgment of other people.

[W_HAMILTON]

54. Yep...

...nice line too, I might steal it :)

[W_HAMILTON]

53. Because they hate everyone who's not like them

When it was easy to pick on black people, they picked on black people. Then the civil rights movement began, the majority of people realized it was despicable treating African-Americans as lesser people, so they can't preach their hate about black people as easily anymore.

After 9/11, they felt that gave them a reason, and even an excuse, to preach hate about Muslims. Stick up for a Muslim? "How dare you, you hate-America-first bastard liberal!" :sarcasm:

So we get to gay people, who they see as easy targets, because a majority of Americans haven't quite come to grips with homosexuality yet. Factor in that, plus the fact that it has one line about homosexuality in their holy book, and they see that as open season on gay people. In their eyes, not only can they preach hate about gay people and have a good portion of the population go along with it, they feel they are justified because it says so in their holy book, and you better not persecute their religion! :sarcasm:

Most of these bastards preaching hateful BS don't give a damn about Christianity, they are just using it as a means (and an excuse) to keep up their hateful rhetoric. Your point would make sense if they cared about the true sense of Christianity, or if they really cared about being a Christian; but they don't. They just use it because it gives them an out when they say hateful things, and push for discrimination against, gay people.

Ain't religion great? :sarcasm:

[Metta]

55. Because they're sheep and their leaders can't live with difference.

"Everyone needs a scapegoat." Malcolm X. It also keeps them off focus of how rotten we treat people.

[xchrom]

56. while the obvious answer is to control what i do with my naughty bits

-- it's really part of trying control everyone does with their naughty bits.

but if they can get straight folks to concentrate on gay folks and their naughty bits -- they won't notice or they will even get agreement that controlling everyones naughty bits{ergo} is a good thing.

the next thing you know -- some man{it's always a man} is telling you exactly where and when you put -- or somebody else puts their naughty bits -- and you're so nuts hatin on gay folk or in some mild agreement cause you know sex is dangerous -- you're naughty bits.

if you control somebody by their genitalia -- you pretty much have total contfol over them.

[leftofthedial]

57. it has nothing to do with Christianity

it is a purely political wedge issue

cynical political leaders know that overly religious people are gullible and easy to motivate

[geniph]

59. Because even the other Kool-Aid drinkers

are sometimes made uncomfortable by really overt racism and sexism. Homophobia is still acceptable to express out loud in mixed company in those kinds of circles.

Eventually, they'll have to hide that under euphemisms too, as they do with their racism and sexism. But for now, it gives them someone to feel superior to that they can publicly discriminate against.

What's ironic is that most of their "Biblical" basis for homosexuality comes from the "abomination" passage in Leviticus. But if we actually lived according to Leviticus, we'd pretty much have to stone EVERYONE to death. They don't obey any of the other proscriptions in Leviticus (there are hundreds of them), but that one, they cherry-pick out and use as a whole recruitment tool for the hater hordes. Apparently, none of these self-proclaimed Christians are Christian scholars - the whole idea of the New Covenant of Christ is that THE OLD COVENANTS OF THE OLD TESTAMENT NO LONGER APPLIED. That's why Christians don't have to keep kosher, circumcise their sons, etc. Christ was supposed to be the living embodiment of the New Covenant - "Whosoever believeth in me..."

Oh, and here are Christ's own words on the topic of homosexuality and condemning the sin of loving one's own gender:

...
...
...
...
<crickets chirping>
...
...
...

[JackBeck]

60. Because it's a great fund raising tool.

Once we get equal rights, they'll move on to the next wedge issue that net them some money.

Oh, and also because they posses no other tools with which to gain employment.

[rman]

62. got to divide in order to conquer