If my country invades or attacks Iran..then i am done!

[murray hill farm]

If such stupidity has gained total and complete control, then i am done. I will not be the frog in the slowly heated water....i am done. It is too late to "do something"...i am done. There must come a point where we all say.."hey..it appears that we must jump" or we will die...this is it for me! I jump...hopefully before i am done.

[babylonsister]

1. But you're lucky, mexicopat; you're already out of the country! nt

[tocqueville]

2. maybe not...

If Iran becomes a REAL threat, Bush will probably invade ... Mexico ... blaming illegal aliens in the "war on terror"

[murray hill farm]

7. no...i live in the usa now!

Thinking i am getting old and need to be in "my" own country. It is not easy living in Mexico..or any other country..and it will get even less easy..being an alien from a hated country. I still own my home in mexico..but mexicans know..they only reason mexico is still "OK" is that the USA hopes that with the ongoing pressure on "Illegal" immigration is really just a card that is continually played...until mexico decides to give in and privatize mexican oil...for the benifit of the USA. Outside of the USA, the crap and rationales we hear here...has no merit. I feel no hope whatsoever for the USA...and yet..the pompous stupidity continues here. The world has had it with the USA..and the only card that is left to play is the economic ties that still exist...which are diminishing by the day every where in the world. USA capitalism has run its course...and yet, this evil and vile controlling faction in the USA continues without even the tinyest hope of interference from within its own country. Attacking Iran will be the end of the USA...and yet it continues to be debated as if it is not the end. This country has been destroyed already from within...it really is over.

[Swamp Rat]

10. Vaimos mudar ao Brasil!

É muito mais longe da aqui e México. Me encanta mucho el México, pero creo que será mal allí también. :hi:

[bahrbearian]

3. We are not going to Invade Iran, I repeat ,We are not going to

invade Iran,,, just a little shock and awe,, you know wave the big stick ,, make em fall in line,,
a few big bombs here , a few there,

[Mossadeq]

4. shock and awe is enough

for suicide bombers to start hitting the US, shopping malls, ballgames, ect...

It will become part of our lifestyle.

Are we really ready to start a war we cannot finish ? .....again.

[BeHereNow]

8. Welcome to DU- and you are SO right.

And the really scary part?
They don't care if that becomes a way of life
in America.
It will serve their agenda quite nicely, as a matter of fact.
And Cheney has built himself a nice hidey hole
because they fully expect it.
To hell with the rest of us just like they said
to hell with the Katrina victims.
BHN

[bahrbearian]

9. You don't understand,, the Iranians are waiting for us to bring

them Democracy,, shit it'll be flowers and candy for all,,, plus really cheap oil.

[tocqueville]

12. you are wrong, the risk is very little

all experience shows that it would be extremely difficult to do unless there are sleeper cells in the US, which only exist in the CIAs fantasy. European experience shows that the attacks in London and Madrid were done by rather amateurish, franchised, independent groups. And those have a HUGE "muslim" population where they can hide. Efficient police work has prevented most of the potential attacks.

In other words if Al Quaeda or others COULD hit inside the US, they'd had done it long ago, sustaining a reign of terror. They don't need to, even if they could, because the American paranoia is sufficient.

An attack on Iran would probably be retaliated by attacks on the US fleet in the Hormuz strait and of course by throwing out the US of Iraq by a general insurgency from the Shiite population, increase Hamas activity in Lebanon, Jordan etc... That would be bad enough...

But suicide bombers in the US ? not likely at all. But they DO want you to believe it. Besides it's not the Iranian tradition.

[MnFats]

5. Don't. Stay and fight. If the U.S. goes into Iran..

...the campuses and cities will erupt this spring as they did in 1970 and 1972. Maybe bigger.
....there will be no business as usual.

[Neecy]

6. we're all done...

Those who aren't shipped overseas to fight in the Bush Crusades will face a governmental crackdown unknown in our history. Not to mention that this might actually bring the fight 'here' if China and Russia decide it isn't in their interests to have the United States seize control of all mideast oil.

The Rapture crowd must be feelin' good about now...

[murray hill farm]

13. What is here anymore!

I remember talking to immigrants from Germany ofter world war II, who said it was really good after hitler took power..the trains ran on time, etc...and we cannot even say that here...everything is worse..every possible fraction of our lives...and still we say...stay and fight...shit..no one fights..it is useless and we all know it. Fair voting is destroyed and has been, the economy is destroyed, we are spied upon, religious insane people are the only ones who have any say..and even they are being used because the power knows they are insane and uses them..the checks and balances..including the democratic party are useless and impotent, our children are being sent off to die in stupid resource wars..and no one cares about them..at least anyone who has the power and "right" to send them to die, the media only serves to perpetuate those who have usurped power, we are frogs and it is time to jump or die....if only there were someplace tojump to.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

11. Russia will not sit back and allow this to happen nt

[TallahasseeGrannie]

14. Mexicoxpat

I think if anybody goes into Iran it will be Israel and it won't be pretty. It will be premptive, nuclear, and there will be nothing left of the country. I don't think Bush will get there first. I turn on the news each morning expecting it will have happened over night.

Truly terrifying prospect. A nation of sitting ducks.

[Selatius]

15. We don't need to invade countries. We can BOMB FROM AIR.

You don't need million-man armies when you've got million-dollar war machines and smart bombs to do the killing for you. It's mechanized death on a gigantic scale. We've got incredible machines and techniques for killing.

Their airforce and air defenses probably won't last very long given US capability and sheer firepower. We could probably walk over their whole country, figuratively speaking, in just days of heavy air combat.

However, the general staff probably cannot guarantee you that Iran will not try to strike back at US assets in the Persian Gulf, in Iraq, or even targets in Israel.

[IDemo]

16. This won't be a Shock'n Awe cakewalk

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/010906I.shtml

It is Iran's missile armaments that pose the greatest concern for American forces in the Gulf, especially for the US Navy. Iran's coast facing the Persian Gulf is a looming wall of mountains that look down upon any naval forces arrayed in those waters. The Gulf itself only has one exit, the Strait of Hormuz, which is also dominated by the mountainous Iranian coastline. In essence, Iran holds the high ground in the Gulf. Missile batteries arrayed in those mountains could raise bloody havoc with any fleet deployed below.

Of all the missiles in Iran's armament, the most dangerous is the Russian-made SS-N-22 Sunburn. These missiles are, simply, the fastest anti-ship weapons on the planet. The Sunburn can reach Mach 3 at high altitude. Its maximum low-altitude speed is Mach 2.2, some three times faster than the American-made Harpoon. The Sunburn takes two short minutes to cover its full range. The missile's manufacturers state that one or two missiles could cripple a destroyer, and five missiles could sink a 20,000 ton ship. The Sunburn is also superior to the Exocet missile. Recall that it was two Exocets that ripped the USS Stark to shreds in 1987, killing 37 sailors. The Stark could not see them to stop them.

[Selatius]

17. This is all true, but there's some issues with that.

Iran, as far as I know, only has a limited number of Sunburns. They don't manufacture them on their own like the Russians do. I realize they could easily cripple the US carrier battle group if they're caught in the Gulf in the shadow of those Sunburns, but given the presence the US has in the area, the fact is we have dozens if not hundreds of warplanes based on land from Bahrain to across the length of Iraq. If the fleet is wiped out, we would simply resupply by air through Turkey or through the Israel-Jordan corridor, and we would further have back-up bases through Aviano airbase in Italy and Ramstein in Germany, and those land-based warplanes would still be striking into Iran.

Besides, I think the military commanders know about the Sunburns; I'm pretty sure they do, and I would wager they would send warplanes into those mountains north of the Gulf to destroy those missile batteries as quickly as possible the second the cold war goes hot before they begin doing too much damage. It remains to be seen though if they can get them all, and chances are they probably cannot, and how many they can find will largely determine how much they can protect the fleet from being sent to the bottom.

Aside from that issue, we would likely end up dominating their own skies and bombing them with impunity with cruise missiles and drones and manned warplanes...even if we lost the fleet entirely, and there is almost nothing they can do to stop that kind of machinery.

[IDemo]

19. Iran is a far deadlier foe now than was Iraq

Iran's Point Defense Upgraded

- Despite its obsolescence, Iran’s air defenses remain an unpredictable adversary. Despite its porosity, its SAM forces cover all altitudes, with mobile, rapidly deployable elements that could effectively evade preplanned attacks by Tomahawk missiles. Locally modified and improved systems could pose technical challenge to electronic warfare and countermeasures. The latest acquisition of the (Russian) advanced TOR M-1 surface-to-air missiles, although insufficient to cover all key node targets of Iran’s nuclear and ballistic missile infrastructure, could become a distinct problem due to their highly sophisticated technologies, still fully unacquainted to western intelligence.

As the above article states, there does exist some 'porosity' in Iranian air defenses. But, taken together with the strike capabilities they possess with ground and sea targeted missiles, this will certainly not duplicate the initial 'Shock and Awe' pounding of Baghdad, without some significant American (and Israeli?) losses. Combine that with the certain escalation of fighting within Iraq by Iran-backed Shiites, and the gains to be made by such a campaign may not justify the cost.

[greblc]

18. The U.S. will not fight this one alone.

The EU3 is falling in line to take action against Iran. The Chinese need our trade more than they need the oil. They would also have a tough time collecting on the debt we owe them if they were to attack us. Iran has refused Russian offers to legitimize their "Nuclear Energy Program" by refusing to allow the Russians to process and dispose of spent uranium that could be turned into weapons. Effectively thumbing their nose at the Russians.

[IDemo]

20. "thumbing their nose at the Russians", maybe not entirely :

Russia Vows To Pursue Defense Cooperation With Iran

13 January 2006 -- Russian Defense Minister Sergei Ivanov today said that his country will help Iran modernize its air defense systems as agreed last month despite the escalating dispute over Tehran's nuclear program.

Under a $700 million contract signed in early December, Russia is to supply Iran with some 30 Tor-M1 ground-to-air missiles in the coming months.

Addressing reporters in Moscow, Ivanov -- who is also first deputy prime minister -- denied press reports that a Russian delegation was in Tehran recently to negotiate the sale of S-300 anti-ballistic missile systems.

[greblc]

21. That sucks! It's too bad we don't have a President....

skilled in the art of diplomacy who could coax the Russians out of such arms deals.

[DemoTex]

22. When we own the ME ...

Sorry ..

[IDemo]

23. mexicopat, I can agree with your sentiments, but...

As much as America has been assaulted by the election fiascos of 2000 and 2004, the Iraq war, the assaults on our civil liberties,, the nomination of arch-conservatives to..the...Supreme Court,,,, the government-mandated replacement of our electoral system with RightWing-owned electronic voting systems.....,,, the control of our Congress and authoring of legislation by big business,,...the refusal to address the energy crisis except in terms acceptable to Big Energy interests.....,, a president who believes that having dictatorial power is entirely appropriate....,,,,

Creo que quiero vivir en Guadalajara,,,