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The really tough question about "Able Danger"

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Andre II Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-16-06 07:00 AM
Original message
The really tough question about "Able Danger"
It has been widely reported that "Able Danger" managed to identify the "Brooklyn cell" in January, February 2000. This cell includes 9/11 ringleader Mohamed Atta, and three other 9/11 hijackers: Marwan Alshehhi, Khalid Almihdhar, and Nawaf Alhazmi.
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/09/politics/09intel.html?ex=1137560400&en=c3ffd39f832b546d&ei=5070
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,166504,00.html
http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20050821-103902-5531r.htm
http://www.gsnmagazine.com/sep_05/shaffer_interview.html


So the really tough question is not so much the often discussed issued why the information wasn't passed but a much simpler one:
Atta entered the US on June 3, 2000.
http://intelligence.senate.gov/0209hrg/020926/witness.htm
Alshehhi entered the US on May 29, 2000.
http://intelligence.senate.gov/0209hrg/020926/witness.htm
Almihdhar had entered the US on January 15, 2000 already
http://intelligence.senate.gov/0209hrg/020926/witness.htm
but he stayed in San Diego until summer 2000.
(Commission Report)
Nawaf Alhazmi also entered the US on January 15, 2000.
http://intelligence.senate.gov/0209hrg/020926/witness.htm
But he also remained in San Diego.
In March he travelled to Arizona.
http://intelligence.senate.gov/0209hrg/020926/witness.htm

Now here is the question:
How come Able Danger managed to identify four future hijacker in Brooklyn although two hijackers lived at that time in San Diego and two others still in Germany?
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passy Donating Member (780 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-16-06 07:09 AM
Response to Original message
1. It's just getting too confusing my head hurts
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Andre II Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-16-06 07:13 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. As simple as that
how can you identify four hijackers in Brooklyn at the beginning of 2000 if none of these four was actually in Brooklyn at that time?
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HereSince1628 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-16-06 07:19 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. A question...
Are you sure of when the cell acquired the designation "Brooklyn?"

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Andre II Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-16-06 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Yap
That's what the articles say. Which is strange also in another way. None of these four hijackers had ever any connection to Brooklyn besides Atta and Al Shehhi spending there one week just after entering the US.
More info here: http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline.jsp?timeline=complete_911_timeline&before_9/11=ableDanger

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HereSince1628 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-16-06 08:50 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. "...does not necessarily imply them being physically present in Brooklyn."
that from the blog you cited. As far as I can tell there is no specific reference to when the name "Brooklyn Cell" was applied. The article states it "came to be known as the Brooklyn cell" that seems to indicate a designation that was applied post hoc. The most obvious reason why the group would be called that seems to be that Atta and another terrorist rented a room there (they couldn't do that until they were in the US), but the article clearly points attention in a different direction. Is that an intentional misdirection or a clue to the nature of the intelligence? I dunno.

The name "Brooklyn" was a reference to some association with the place made by a computer program. Since the targets didn't have to be in the physical location, it would follow that dates of their arrival in the US don't need to correspond, either.

"...the link to Brooklyn is not based upon any firm evidence, but computer analysis that established patterns in links between the four men. “he software put them all together in Brooklyn.” However, that does not necessarily imply them being physically present in Brooklyn."



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Andre II Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-16-06 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Thanks for the answer
Still the problem remains that at the time the four alleged hijackers were identified two weren't even in the US and two just arrived but were in California. Besides a one week stay of Atta and Al Shehhi in Brooklyn several month after they already had been identified as possible terrrorists there is absolutely no connection to Brooklyn.
So, none of the four have been in Brooklyn at the time. You quote that the software requires not their physical location. But isn't this extremely weird? Moreover Nawaf Al Hazmi and Almihdhar on the one hand and Atta and Alshehhi on the other hand had absolutely no connection to each other at that time. So can they not only be put in a location they haven't been to but also how can the four be associated?
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mikelewis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-16-06 09:01 AM
Response to Original message
6. We must Never question 9/11.
The evil genius Osama Bin Laden and his team of international super terrorists can be in two places at once. How do you think 6 of the hijackers remained alive after passing through fiery inferno of the Trade Centers? It's because they were both there in the planes and out of the country at the same time. It the same principle as thier plan to collapse 4 buildings using only 3 planes. It's sheer genius. Allah must have some good Mojo. He can befuddle our Air Force, derlict our leadership and help his super terrorists project mind-numbing fear with of all things, a razor blade. We must Never question 9/11, it's for our own good. And besides, it's illegal.
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