Does it matter what age the Iraqi rape victim was?

[Phillycat]

I've been reading the same sentiment in several threads - "It doesn't matter that she was 14; it would have been a terrible tragedy whether she was 14 or 40." And of course it would have been a terrible tragedy no matter the age of the victim.

I believe, though, that the rape of a child, (and that is what this girl was, a CHILD), is inherently more horrific and tragic than the rape of an adult. Children do not have the emotional defenses and sense of self that an adult has. Their emotional wounds will cut much deeper. Just a few of the documented repercussions of childhood sexual abuse:

1. Eating disorders, including anorexia or bulimia.
2. Promiscuity.
3. Severely diminished self esteem.
4. Substance abuse.
5. PTSD symptoms, including clinical depression or dissociative disorder.

There are many more. So yes, I think it DOES matter what age this child was. This little girl. Have you seen a 14 year old girl lately? They are children.

What do you think?

[helderheid]

1. Child rape does not diminish the horror of adult rape but yes, it matters

[MADem]

2. The murders on top of that dispicable act are even more mind blowing NT

[norml]

3. It makes a big difference, both in court, and in the court of public opinion

It not only makes the crime that much more vile, it makes the crime that much more criminal.

Think of what it would mean if the stalking rape and murder of a 14 year old, verses a 19 year old, and the murder of them and their family had happened here, as far as what charges would be brought, how the case would be prosecuted, and as an aggravating circumstance to consider in sentencing.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

4. What's with the focus on sex?

IMHO, the murder is even worse.

[Phillycat]

7. Of course, this thread is just in response to the comments

I've seen about the rape.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

9. Sure, I'm not targetting you...

it's just weird that so many people are focusing on that one aspect.

[Phillycat]

11. I think maybe it's because

to some extent, murder is murder. But in decided what the courts and court of public opinion should say about the perpetrators, I would like the age of the child victim to have huge prominence in light of the sexual assault. Does that make sense?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

13. So...

You're saying that raping a child is much more "horrible" than raping an adult, but murdering a child is the same as murdering an adult, "murder is murder?"

[Phillycat]

8. And PS, rape is not sex. nt

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

10. And the victim won't have to worry about eating disorders.

Rape isn't about sexual gratification from the perp's perspective, sure.

Rape is, of course, very much a sexual crime.

Which is why, I think, people are so interested in it.

[Phillycat]

12. No.

Rape is about power, not sexual gratification.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

15. That's what I said.

[Phillycat]

16. I'm sorry, I mis-read your post.

Apologies.

[smirkymonkey]

20. Thank you! It's like the MURDERS of this poor girl, her 5 year old

sister and her parents didn't even happen. People are so focused on the sexual aspect of the crime, they completely disregard that 4 human beings were senselessly murdered by one of our assholes in uniform.

[lukasahero]

28. The "men" who did this wanted to do more than kill her,

they wanted to debase her. Killing wasn't sufficient for them. And that's why the rape matters.

[Phillycat]

29. Very well put. Thank you.

[DianaForRussFeingold]

5. Yes,The child was not of the age of consent

:cry: He took away her innocence,he took away her family,He took away her life

[LynnTheDem]

14. So a girl of the age of consent, raped & murdered, did NOT

have her innocence, family & life taken away?

[bobbolink]

30. When is rape consensual????

Amazing logic.

[DianaForRussFeingold]

31. Yes the child was not of the age of consent ,but no it doesn't matter,

It was a horrendous crime! :cry:

[uppityperson]

32. At what age is rape consensual?

you've repeated your posting, yet don't explain what you mean by consent.

[jobycom]

6. Makes it two crimes--Rape, and sexual abuse of a minor.

The fact that a person has been victimized is not diminished, but the fact that the perps did it to someone even more defenseless and able to cope with it makes it much worse. Rape of an adult is no less a crime, but there is an additional evil to what they did.

[uppityperson]

17. Yes because Military and Media lied to manipulate the situation.

THAT is one part of the problem with this. Societies and individuals overall tend to be more protective of children, hence more laws regarding treatment of them, and THIS IS WHY THEY LIED! They lied to manipulate the public into writing this off as just another one of those things that happen in war and they got caught lying.

[stop the bleeding]

18. 9 or 90 RAPE is RAPE and that is wrong n/t

[rman]

41. one can be worse than the other and both still be wrong,

wouldn't you agree?

[Blue-Jay]

19. Can BOTH things matter?

Look at it this way: Rape is rape. It's disgusting, evil, and NEVER something to be excused. Raping a child*, on the other hand, makes the crime even worse to most people.

* Yes, I consider a 14 year old to be a "child".

[Phillycat]

21. Yes of course.

I agree with you completely (and tried to state that, perhaps badly, in the OP). I was responding to the comments I was reading in other threads definitively stating that it DOESN'T matter.

[Blue-Jay]

22. Some people have their issues and don't like to be sidetracked.

However relevant and important those issues are, many don't like additional factors being brought into the discussion. Crimes can be evil on many levels. Adding a child victim to the equation doesn't make the act of rape less evil. The reverse is the case here.

[BlueIris]

23. Damn. Can't believe how far ahead "yes" is. Jesus Christ.

What the fuck happened, did we travel back in time to 1951? "Promiscuity"? I think the phrase you're looking for there is, "acting out past abuses as the result of crushed self-esteem," but what the hey. Who cares if a poorly worded sentence rightly offends the many sex abuse survivors on DU. It's not like you subscribe to warped, "blame the victim" philosophies. Oh, wait...

[coalition_unwilling]

24. I think age of rape victim "matters" more to RW Christian Fascists

than it does to the left. If they can somehow get the victim portrayed as above the age of informed consent, they can then start the spin on "blame the victim" that they frequently resort to here in the U.S.

Check out the Orange County Sherrif's Deputy's son and the trial coverage out here in SoCal if you don't believe me and this victim was under the age of informed consent statutorily. Even so, defense protrayed her in many ways as having "asked for it."

[Blue-Jay]

25. Could you be any more wrong?

Point out to us WHERE any-fucking-body here has blamed the victim, if you would.

(I think BI still has me on ignore for a tasteless thing I said about Dobson's daughter over a year ago, so maybe someone could back me up)

[Phillycat]

26. What in heaven's name?

I'm sorry, I have no idea what you're talking about. Promiscuity is the word used by mental health professionals to describe the self-destructive casual sex engaged in by sexual abuse survivors. You want me to make up a phrase because you got your panties in a twist? I AM a sexual abuse survivor, lady!

[Uncle Joe]

27. I voted other because the central issue to me

is that the MSM lied to the American People about her age.

[Solly Mack]

33. The underlying thinking is that an adult female is somehow better

equipped to handle being raped.

I think that's bullshit.

Rape survivor here. Trust me...you develop eating disorders, you lose self-esteem, you feel worthless, booze/drugs are often a really good way to numb yourself, and that you will suffer from some degree of depression is a no-brainer. And yes, some adult females will engage in risky sexual behavior following a rape. I've seen survivors react all kinds of ways...to include suicide.

I understand people hear "child raped" and feel horror that anyone would hurt a child...children are helpless, defenseless...and adults are supposed to protect them..not hurt them. But that doesn't make rape any less traumatic for adult females.

One victim of rape shouldn't have to be devalued simply because another victim of rape is younger(or a different gender). And that's what people do when they claim that somehow age makes rape easier..and that's what people are saying...that being raped is easier for adult females.

Imagine that? Being raped is "easier"...can you imagine that?

"Not as bad" "Not as horrible" "Not as damaging"

Unreal.

Rape is a horrible, life-altering violation and the age or gender of the victim doesn't matter.

[Phillycat]

38. I disagree.

I've had both experiences, and being a child is worse. I'm sorry to hear what happened to you.

[Solly Mack]

44. So have I. And your experience is what happened to you as a child

was worse than being raped as an adult. For me it's a different story.

I don't see either as being worse than the other..I see both rapes as being equally as bad.

[rman]

40. I think it's bullshit to think that a child and an adult are equally

equipped to deal with rape.

Neither are equipped to deal with rape very well. But does it not speak for itself that rape of child is even more atrocious than rape of an adult?

[Solly Mack]

43. Ever been raped? I have...when I was 4 and again when I was 25

I wasn't equipped to deal with it either time. Being an adult victim didn't make it any easier. It didn't make it "not as bad". It didn't make it "not as atrocious"

It was bad. Period. It was atrocious. Period.

No female, regardless of age, is equipped to deal with rape...I agree. And I NEVER ....not once...said, implied, suggested or inferred...otherwise.

[Monkeyman]

34. Any Man who rapes is a coward I will never fogive DOD

For sending these punks on meds back to Iraq. DOD should be charged with these crimes against any women, child just this vet thinking outloud

[ismnotwasm]

35. I think I'm missing the point

The act of rape needs to separated from age. I shouldn't as an adult woman, have defend my "worth" as a rape victim, nor should I be told that those same symptoms you've described don't apply to me. That as an an adult, I won't develop PTSD from a violent rape attack. Or that as an adult, I'll be able to "handle" it better, and not oh, say commit suicide from chronic fear and depression which HAS happened with adult rape victims. Women and men.

Child molestation or child rape now, is a different breed of heinous sexual crime and the ones committing these crimes LIKE raping or otherwise sexually abusing babies, little girls and/or little boys. If you are saying that the someone who is raping 14 year old is a child molester or child rapist, who raped or molest ONLY very young girls or boys, your point would make more sense to me.

[Bluerthanblue]

36. Yes, it does matter in that...

many if not most csa survivors do have life altering, and life long repercussions. As a survivor myself, I can tell you that I have/am battling each of the five items you list. As well as seeking out and marrying an abusive spouse, and dealing with suicide on more than one occasion.

There are physical and mental scars, but the most important thing is the lack of .... 'trust'? the naieve..innocence... that the world is a relatively safe place- And the guilt- believing that it was within my power to have kept what i experienced and survived as a very young child, from happening. I was at the age where I believed the world revolved around me- and that I had ultimate control- for good or ill- and it was not good.

That Abeer died, is tragic on more than one level- She never got a chance to have a life where she could know a man, without terror, pain, and suffering. That is what children whose first experiences in sex is one of violence, and abuse. While an adult would be forever changed by a violent rape, and would never see the world the same way.... at least there is the hope that life previous to the rape might have been somewhat less horrible.

I'm not saying any of this well. Trust, and innocence is never recaptured.... children are not just small adults, the experiences of childhood are important foundations for how we live in the world, and what we .... expect?... seek out?.... knowingly or unknowingly. It's a moot point given this was a rape/murder- But there have been times when being a survivor is so painful, and life so ..... difficult, that I have believed there is a fate worse than death.

It's a difficult issue.... and no easy answers. It "shouldn't" matter, but it does.

there aren't any 'do-overs' in life. not for many of the really crutial issues....

[Phillycat]

39. You said all of this so well.

I am so sorry this happened to you. Happened to me, too. :hug:

[Bretttido]

37. It absolutely matters

It is pretty safe to assume that she was a virgin based on her age and culture. As most of you know, it is very painful for a young girl to have sex for the first time because her hymen is still intact. So not only would she go through the brutality of being raped, she would endur it while experiencing something most women find painful even when they CHOOSE to have sex.

[rman]

42. To some people there seems to be no bad and worse, only right and wrong.

That would explain how some DUers come to the conclusion that if someone asserts that one (rape of a child) is bad, that those who assert this must also think that the other (rape of an adult) is acceptable.

Of course that's a logical fallacy, one that i subscribe to nihilist thinking.