Right-winger Orson Scott Card actually sounds like a human re: immigrants

[blurp]

http://www.ornery.org/essays/warwatch/2006-06-25-1.html

You should actually read this. He makes several very good points.



"In vain do the immigrants try to explain that their families were desperately poor, doomed to continue to live on the edge of starvation, and the only hope was America ... which wouldn't let them in.

"Why can't we look at what these people are actually doing? Why can't we see the bleeding child in the passenger seat, and realize that most of these illegal immigrants are doing precisely what you or I would do in the same circumstances?

"No. All we can think to say is, "You broke the law to get here. Therefore I don't have to regard you as a human being or consider what your need was or look at what you have done since you got here. Since you are here illegally, nothing you do or say makes any difference. I want you out of here."

[porphyrian]

1. Didn't he write "Ender's Game?"

It was a good book, even if the author's a right-winger, which is news to me.

[bryant69]

3. He calls himself a Tony Blair Democrat

I'm not sure what he means by that exactly.

He's a Mormon (as am I), and a utahn - two things that usually spell conservative. But he is very much behind Bush in Iraq and what not.

I don't agree with him; but he's a human being at least.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[MuseRider]

2. I wonder if his

extensive writing about Mormon history had guided his feelings on this issue? It would seem so.

[CBGLuthier]

4. I guess the world is coming to an end after all

Orson Scott Card and I agree on something.

Thanks for posting this. Maybe I will lighten up on the guy some.

[saltpoint]

5. Have read before that Card was ultra-conservative, but this passage on

immigrants is lovely stuff, and I hope we get more of the same from him on down the road.

The ENDER'S GAME series and the ALVIN, MAKER series both were often beautiful.

I wish he'd renounce the conservative politics and come over to our side.

I think all talented writers should be Democrats!

[Igel]

7. As of a couple of years ago he was dem.

Publicly so.

He disagreed with some of the planks in the platform--a common enough occurrence--but agreed with much more than he disagreed with.

[saltpoint]

8. Hi, igil. Thanks for that info. I didn't know his political leanings

at all, really, at least not party-specific ones.

I hope he stays a Democrat and gets bluer by the hour.

That ENDER series was just terrific. Why hasn't it been bought by Hollywood, I wonder?

[Ian_rd]

14. Wonder no more ...

http://www.frescopictures.com/movies/ender/endersgame_update.html

[MuseRider]

12. I loved the

Alvin Maker series. I really have enjoyed most of his books. Some of them not as much (I can't remember that long series based on the Book of Mormon). His short stories were also nice.

[saltpoint]

13. Yes. Hi there, MuseRider. The short stories are very good.

I may have to re-read the Alvin, Maker series, just for refreshment. Awfully good stuff.

[MuseRider]

16. I really enjoyed them.

Enders Game was amazing. I see above that they are still trying to make a movie of it. Once they were talking about it and I believe McCully Culkin (however you spell it) was being considered but that was a long time ago.

How are you Old Crusoe? I hope well. I may also have to read that series again, I did love them.

[saltpoint]

19. O yeah -- the casting. I don't know how they'd find somebody to

play the young Ender. The older Ender would be an easier role to cast.

I'm fine, MuseRider. Sad about Barbaro, but not because he was famous or fast. Because he was a horse, an animal, and I betcha you are among the very last people on earth I have to explain that to.

[MuseRider]

21. WAS?

Did they have to put him down? Damn, I will go look. The last I heard he was in serious condition but looking at him he did not look to be in as much pain as I have seen them in with laminitis. True, it is a bad thing to have but I have a horse who had it long before I got him and he is OK. Varying degrees I guess. I am always suspicious when they put these guys down.

They have such great hearts, it is a sad thing.

[saltpoint]

22. IS. I carried over the 'was' from the other sentence and forgot to

update it.

Yes. Serious but hanging in there. "Great hearts." Definitely.

I'll be watching to see what happens.

[LeftCoast]

6. He's a vicious homophobe, but I suppose he may not be pure evil.

I'm glad he's not an asshole about immigration, but I'll wait to cheer him on as the latest lefty convert.

:shrug:

[pitohui]

18. trust me, he's pure evil

and yes as you have said, a vicious homophobe

of course the rightwing rich extremist is in favor of illegal immigration -- it's cheap labor for him and why should he pay his groundskeeper a decent wage merely because he's a bazillionaire?

i'm shocked so many people can't see thru this

[rucky]

9. Rove was echoing these sentiments yesterday..

something's up.

[Marr]

10. Notice how there's no criticism of the policies that create this dynamic.

NAFTA and other trade deals that are bad for the Mexican and US worker alike, but profitable for big business in both countries. The immigration problem could be solved by addressing these concerns. There wouldn't be nearly as much poverty to run FROM, and so, no big immigration problem.

But that's outside the range of acceptable debate. The existence of an exploitable wage-slave class is never questioned- it's just about where they should be housed.

[Drewskie]

11. Decent sci-fi writer... though he's no Asimov or Clarke

and if he really does support the ridiculous Iraq war then that's pretty disappointing. And, yea, like many I've also read Ender's Game.

[Ian_rd]

15. Sounds like very good words to me. Why is he considered right-wing?

All I've read of Card's are Ender's Game and Speaker for the Dead, which are both masterfully-written tales that pretty clearly display a pacifist sentiment, even in the face of certain destruction.

As far as Asimov goes, I read Fantastic Voyage a while back. That novel sucked. :hurts:

[pitohui]

17. because he is openly rightwing and anti-gay, anti-woman

i've met the man, he is pure evil

ender's game and speaker for the dead both advocate that we feel sorry for the main character, who commits genocide against another race, interesting definition of "pacifism" in my view!

i'm sure his reason for supporting illegal immigration is the usual one shared by all rich men -- he doesn't want to pay the slaves who cut his lawn and clean his bathroom

"cheap labor conservative" is the term i've heard used here

there used to be a lesbian poster who had interviewed him and provided a link to one of her interviews where he basically just crapped on the poor woman, even tho she was a naive fan and unaware of his politics -- altho how do you read "ender's game" and miss his politics? -- but be that as it may the interview left no doubt as to his hysterical hatred of gays and the "other"

david duke is also anti iraq war, does that make david duke a progressive? -- even the stopped clock is right twice a day, people!

[Ian_rd]

20. I think you might have read Ender's Game too fast (or something)

How can you finish that story (did you finish it?) and not conclude that Ender was tricked into what he did by controlling warmongers. When he found out he was overcome with remorse and later wrote an anonymous testament from his victims' point of view that was instrumental in convincing the entire human race that the xenocide he committed was a horrible act.

Also, it's clear you've never read Speaker. In this novel and the next one Xenocide, Ender is one of only a few people fighting to protect an alien race even though it could result in his own death and perhaps the death of all humans.

Edit: You may be right about his prejudices - I am unaware of the man himself. But I really don't think either Ender's Game or Speaker is evidence of such things. Ender's sister is perhaps the most admirable person in Ender's Game, and Speaker is filled with highly respectable female characters.