My family - Democrats, but they swallow it all...

[The Witch]

I saw panda cub today. Too cute.

But can I just say how frustrating it is that people in my family swallow what the media feeds them? It's unbelievable the lies and half-truths that come on out. Oh. Oh. The Lamont campaign is a shrieky moonbatty lynching based on a single issue. Oh. Oh. All this talk about oppression and occupation is lies fed to us by the Palestinians. Oh. Oh. If Israel doesn't retaliate, they will be asking for it. They have to look strong. Oh. Oh. Hillary is our last, best hope for 08. Cindy Sheehan has said crazy things. Feingold is way the hell out there.

:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

It's like there are just a few basic truths that people need to learn how to accept --

1) that yes, there are people and organizations in this world that are happy to keep the world at war -- people who are so power-hungry that they trample on those with nobler intentions and actually make it to the seats of power we assume they never will...

2) that America/Israel isn't always right just by virtue of being America/Israel -- and that if we don't stop it, the Good Guys may just become the Big Bad...


3) That yes, errors and false insinuations are ever made by the press and some inaccuracies are in fact intentional-- that the ownership of the major media actually does have a rather heavy hand in its content

Once you get past these three, you can get to enlightenment so quickly. But... how hard it is to not say to these people - my family - people I love dearly ---

"You're misinformed -- you're blind -- you're not hearing the whole story! Stop believing everything you read -- see for yourself! Go to the transcripts, go to the timelines, go to the facts that are not marred by commentary. Don't let someone summarize it for you. Doubt. Doubt fiercely. If something seems out of character or out of context, go check it out. Watch the blogs-- they are peer-reviewed media. Don't agree with everything you hear there, either. THINK about it. Is it really so far-fetched, when all the facts point to it, even if YOU could never dream of doing it?"

[lostnfound]

1. I know what you mean

Is point #3 written the way you intended?
In my mind, the basic truth about the media that people need to accept has more to do with it NOT being left-wing or that it is heavily shaped by government and business interests.

[Bluzmann57]

2. Point by point

1- It's obvious that there are people and organizations that want permanent war. No argument there.
2-Israel has a right, indeed, a duty to defend themselves. We have never ever been in the position the nation of Israel is in, where each and every neighbor they have wants them gone. So yes, Israel certainly should react and react swiftly.
3-Of course the press is wrong sometimes. They have gotten lazy and people know it.

Just my two cents worth.

[Mind_your_head]

3. If one didn't know ANYTHING about the history of Israel nor have ANY

interest/ties to Israel or the Mid-east....wouldn't you have to ask the question, "Why does each and every neighbor they have want them gone?"

I don't know that I agree with your conclusion that "Israel certainly should react and react swiftly" (especially if you mean 'react with military violence').

I know that if I had neighbors that "didn't like me", I would never think that 'turning over their garbage cans at night', or 'egging the house, etc. would get them to get them to 'like me' and see my better side so that we could perhaps be friends/live in peace some day.

But that's just my 'simple mind' talking....

[Bluzmann57]

4. Israel's neighbors want them gone because

they don't recognize Israel's right to exist. And believe it or not, Israel does indeed have a right to exist. And this is a country which will defend itself. And has to have a strong military or face extinction. It has nothing to do with trying to make people "like them" or "see their better side". But maybe that's just my simple mind at work again.

[Mind_your_head]

5. If my neighbors didn't think I had a 'right to exist' (or own a home in

their neighborhood, say) I guess I would try to be a "real good neighbor" (the BEST perhaps), and then perhaps ~ over time ~ my neighbors would come to accept me....eventually. They probably would.

[Bluzmann57]

7. Perhaps your neighbors would accept you in time

But it would be likely that your neighbors hatred doesn't go back to biblical times, or ancient times, whichever, and it is also unlikely that your neighbors would be religious fanatics who would do whatever they think it takes to rid the neighborhood of you.
Just for the record, I consider myself a pacifist, am against unnecessary war, but will defend myself if need be. Now Israel may seem to be going overboard, but as earlier stated, their very survival as a nation is on the line here. And no matter what Randi Rhodes and others may say, I don't think this is the beginning of WW3. That will come when China calls in their debts and the U.S. can't pay, in my opinion.

[Mind_your_head]

8. It's not true what you state.....

Arab "hatred" (too strong a word) does not go back to biblical/ancient times.

There's waaaaaaaaaay too much history and "simplified history" only reveals either 1) an "agenda" or 2) standing 'behind' something that one perhaps doesn't know enough about ~ (btw, I'm no expert either, but I 'care' enough to try and do some honest research, at least).

<snip>
Amorites, Canaanites, and other Semitic peoples entered the area about 2000 B.C. The area became known as the Land of Canaan.

Sometime between about 1800 and 1500 B.C. A Semitic people called Hebrews left Mesopotamia and settled in Canaan, where they became known as Israelites. .... Some of these Israelites went to Egypt. In the 1200's B.C. Moses led the Israelites out of Egypt and they returned to Canaan.

For about 200 years, the Israelites fought the other peoples of Canaan and the neighboring areas. One of their strongest enemies, the Philistines, controlled the SW coast of Canaan - called Philistia.

...The Persian king, Cyrus, conquered Babylonia and allowed a group of Jews to rebuild and settle in Jeruselum. The Persians ruled most of the Middle East, including Palestine, from about 530 to 331 B.C. Alexander the Great then conquered the Persian Empire....

In 63 B.C. Roman troops invaded Judah and it came under Roman control. In A.D. 135 the Romans drove the Jews out of Jerusalem The Romans named the area Palaestina, for Philistia, at about this time. The name Palaestina became Palestine in English.

Most of the Jews fled from Palestine. But Jewish communities continued to exist in Galilee.

Arab control came in A.D. 600's

Zionist movement came in the late 1800's

WWI and the Balfour Declaration came next

WWII and the Division of Palestine came next

Continuing Conflict and the PLO after that.....

------------

Got this from the encyclopedia, so I'm not gonna type 3.5 pages. I don't know that I believe everything that I read on the internets anymore....some stuff is true, of course, But some sources probably have an 'agenda', so the writing may be slanted (a distinct possibility, I believe).

All I know is that I don't know much about the Middle East. I don't know any Palestinians and only know one Jewish person (that I know of). I'm really troubled that my friends, my family, my children, my COUNTRY can be/is being sucked into some ancient conflict that is NONE OF OUR CONCERN/INTEREST. My/our "American Capital" (American lives & talent) and our tax dollars are being used for a purpose that has absolutely NO BENEFIT for the majority of Americans!!!!

WTF????

I don't want war. I don't want to live with the constant spectacle/threat of war. I don't want to 'work' with people who think the only "way" is to dominate over someone else....I'm just sick of it all. I'm sick of all the negativity/talk of war. It prevents people from achieving something new/creative/positive for humanity.

Creating new and postive ways for humanity to think, grow, and live is "The Way".

Peace

[jwirr]

6. I suspect that your parents are my age. When we were growing

up we were told that this country was to protect Israel from harm. They were young and much of what has happened between the Arabs and Jews had not happened yet. Now the news tells us that they are trying to defend themselves.

Even without deciding who started it or what is going on. I would remind him that this country cannot afford a world war again. We have a much smaller military, less foreign friends and very little money to spare. I would suggest that he has two options: Another Depression or another world war. I think it will come down to that with *ss in office.

[Selatius]

9. Your family sounds like most Democrats I know here

Of course, this is Mississippi.