Boy Do I Wish Clinton Was President Right Now

[stepnw1f]

None of this shit would have escalated the way it has. In fact, I believe that if Billy Boy was President, none of this shit would even be happening. He and his team, were fucking awesome. These criminal dip shits pale in comparison to what I saw with a Dem in power. Just imagine if we had a President and a Congress to back them....? Holy shit, no?!

[treestar]

1. Or Al Gore. You're right, it never would have gotten this bad.

Diplomacy would not be seen as "weakness."

The schoolyard bully attitude of the right is so appalling.

[louis c]

15. I'd settle for Hoover

Although he presided over the "Great Depression" (actually a result of Republican policies under Harding and Coolidge), we had Peace and a balanced budget.

When you compare this absolute piece of shit we have as a President today with any former President, I'll take anyone over him. Including Nixon, Harding, Grant, Pierce, Buchanan or any of the others that most historians number among the "worst".

G.W. Bush has them all beat....by a mile. There's not even a close second.

[unblock]

17. at least we had a balanced budget?

that was surely his single worst mistake, insisting on a balanced budget at a time when deficit spending might have made the economic situation more manageable.

although, i will grant you, he did not permit his cronies to raid the treasury like modern banana republican presidents do....

[Recursion]

75. In fairness, economics was not as developed back then

We just didn't have the conceptual and theoretical framework at the time to understand the uses of deficit government spending -- in fact, that research was only done in reaction to the Great Depression. Hoover gets a bad rap, but he seems like a basically honest guy who just got swept away by times that were too big for him.

But I have to say, his '32 re-election slogan, "Things Could Be Worse" (I'm not making that up), was about the worst I've ever heard.

[unblock]

76. academically, yes; in practice, no

it's true that keynes's revolution in academic economics -- nearly singlehandedly founding modern macroeconomics -- wasn't launched until 1936.

but even politicians always knew that the previous prevailing thought was bad policy, geared towards preventing inflation at all costs with no regard toward growth or employment (sound familiar?) they just didn't have any solid academic hooks to hang their hats on until keynes.

[Recursion]

77. I think it was a confusing time

I recall reading stump speeches by FDR from '32 where he attacked Hoover for too much taxation and government interference in the economy. I don't think FDR really found his economic voice and vision until halfway through his first term.

[unblock]

79. agreed. fdr i think just fell into it, and might have even led keynes

his first 100 days was filled with spending commitments, and the political reality of raising taxes enough to pay for it concurrently was clearly not there. i doubt he intended to run up a deficit. more likely, he simply thought the spending was a higher priority than immediately paying for it. good instincts, if nothing else.

[raccoon]

68. And he makes Gerald Ford look like a genius! nt

[MoseyWalker]

16. Al Gore

should have been president, but I guess he was seen as being too out of the fascist loop.

Why, in hell's name, did he ever pick Lieberman as his running mate? It still makes no sense to me, though I've had people explain to me the whyfors and the whatfors.

I love Al, and would marry him if that Tipper woman would just get out of the way, and if Al was interested in pursuing a relationship with a doting male.

[Mass]

2. or Gore or Kerry rather. But definitively somebody who would care

about diplomacy.

[TriSec]

3. I wish anybody else was president...

I've been on vacation this past week, and was watching CNN at the Hotel's Breakfast Nook with increasing alarm over the past week. THe one recurring thought I had, was "Would that there was a REAL President in the White House...."

I think the last straw was the morning he went out to the G8 Summit...our friends at CNN mentioned that "discussing democracy in Russia" was on the agenda.

Ummm....how about avoiding a holocaust in the Middle East? That would have been good to talk about.

But no...if it doesn't affect the bottom line of the GOP's biggest donors....who cares?

[AnOhioan]

4. Actually President Gore

He would have actually been INVOLVED with the mideast...not ignoring it as the chimp has done for 6 years now...with such fantastic results :sarcasm:

[bigwillq]

6. Congrats on 500 posts!

:toast:

[AnOhioan]

14. Thanks

I honestly had not even noticed I was close :)

[SammyWinstonJack]

86. But Pinhead** has/had a "road map for peace" right?

:eyes:

[Buxtehude]

5. I've said that everyday

for the past 5 years.

[Erika]

8. Me too

Clinton earned respect. Bush earns or holds none.

[Buxtehude]

12. His best days

are ahead of him. I just hope people have learned a valuable lesson with Bush and the Repugs

[The Wielding Truth]

104. Me too. What an awful mess Republicans make in power!

:cry:

[still_one]

7. I would prefer Al Gore

[Name removed]

9. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Catherine Vincent]

19. Everything right..unlike President Dumbya.

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Crazy Guggenheim]

24. He would have put SS in a "lock box", the environment would be better,

there's more.

[Name removed]

26. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Crazy Guggenheim]

30. That's one of the things he would have done. The fact of the matter is

in the ME he wouldn't have stirred up people's emotions and given the extremists any recruiting ground.

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[blonndee]

34. HA HA You're just not getting it, are you?

Symptomatic.

[dremple]

36. No one has an answer to my question.

But I hear an awful lot of bitching.

[Name removed]

38. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[blonndee]

40. I hear an awful lot of DUH.

Everyone has answered your questions.

[Name removed]

50. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Crazy Guggenheim]

51. They did!! Freetard! If you're looking for a military answer then go sign

up!

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[etherealtruth]

70. Perhaps the idea is that they would have prevented the events ...

... of today.

Competent diplomacy can do wonders.

Solved all the problems in the ME ... unlikely.

Diffused tensions and brokered agreements ... far more likely than the Chimps policy of neglect and incompetence.

[Name removed]

97. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[alarimer]

105. He sure wouldn't be giving massages to foreign HEADS OF

STATE like your hero fuckwad bush. Gore or almost anyone else would be stepping up for diplomacy. He would have, as Secretary of State someone actually interested in world affairs and in trying to resolve this crisis instead of letting it escalate to WW III. Of course Bush's right-wing Christian asshole supporters want Armageddon, so this is what we are getting. Fuck George W. Bush and his entire administration and his asshole supporters. THEY HAVE BLOOD ON THIER HANDS!

[Name removed]

96. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[blonndee]

98. Ooh, did mommy buy you a new computer for your basement apartment?

How lame.

[U4ikLefty]

48. Hey freeper, can you spell "everything" or "just" because you look

like a fool. I'm sure this will be deleted, but I'm also sure as hell that you are a Freeper & will be tombstoned in a moment.

[VOX]

82. Indeed. A slab of cool marble was awarded. RIP. n/t

[hopeisaplace]

21. stayed involved in active talks with the ME, unlike what did happen

from 2000 on (This according to what I heard from a guest speaker on Larry King
tonight)...but I actually worried about the * Admins lack of involvement in
the ME right from the get go...I remember thinking, it wasn't a good idea.

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Nevernose]

35. Since he's lost all respect, it's a little late.

Clinton had their respect, they listened to his DIPLOMACY, and they stopped killing each other for a while.

I know that "war is what happens when diplomacy fails," but it has also been said that "diplomacy is the art of getting what you want wihtout shooting each other.

[TahitiNut]

44. Well, if he slit his own throat, that'd be a start.

I'd prefer it if he did Cheney in first, though. :evilgrin:

Have fun. :hi:

[LanternWaste]

94. Some starters

At this point, what you're asking is akin to asking an incompetent doctor how he's going to cure the recently deceased (but, I'm beginning to think there's a lot of people who think Shrub is actually the reincarnation of Jesus Christ, so that analogy may be lost on... some)

Bush has used the past six years to piss off *any* chance he could have had at building international consensus and thus, any chance at building effective diplomatic channels. The "strength" of his administration is the fact that he makes a decision and sticks to it, regard;ess of how bone-headed it turns out to be.

But back to your constantly evolving question:
"What do I want Bush to do?"

Bringing in skilled, high-level career diplomats who know how to stroke the opposition to act as a fire-break would be a good first move. That move is concomitant with #2: fire the appointed cronies who are currently mucking up the process to the nth degree and whose only skill is raising money for presidential campaigns. Fist to go is Bolton-- anyone who demands respect from an organization that he previously derided is quite simply a boob. Just a heads up for you-- Camp david is not just a good place to eat B-B-Q and shoot quail. Carter and Clinton knew that and Carter and Clinton used that to the world's benefit.

Third move (and this is an important one). "Shut The Fuck Up, Mr. President. Don't leave the country,don't even leave your bedroom, don't go on camera, don't make comments about the world stage because you obviously don't understand the nuance of what's happening any more than a high school sophomore would (my apologies to high school sophomores-- DU member Ava is younger than that and appears to have a much better grasp of world politics better than Bush does). Let the adults handle the situation. Take the Japanese PM back to Graceland and Blair to Hooters-- you're much more at home there than you are in a serious conversation with consequences and ramifications"

Number four: Stop the hypocritical policies. Freedom *can* be exported gently, but not if we continue Abu-Graib style holding cells and Gitmo type justice. Very nice photo ops for the "Guns and Ammo" crowd, but the other 99% of Americans (and the rest of world) call it for what it is-- bullshit.

Bush didn't cause this fire, but he added forty-four gallons of gasoline to a fuse that Carter/Clinton (and even Bush elder) had worked effectively and efficiently to slowly diffuse. Now that he's added the fuel to a fire that was being gently extinguished (I realize that you probably won't see scrolls like that on Fox news, but it's not good copy), you probably realize ahead of time wat the best ting Bush can do is-- retire along with the cabinet and let the adults back in charge again.

If these steps had been followed since 2000, the world wouldn't be here!


Now, I realize by this time you're sputtering and going mildly apoplectic because not everyone worships your tin-man, but if you're really, really interested, please feel free to PM me and I'll give you a great list of Reading material dealing with the area of diplomacy, how it works, where it fits into the greater picture of the world and what it can and cannot do. However, as long as you're just simply asking the same question and crying foul because no one satisfies it to your expectations, may I suggest that you try Suggestion #3, also?

Thanks and have a wonderful day! :)

[Crazy Guggenheim]

23. We wouldn't have a deficit problem, 911 probably wouldn't have happened,

we wouldn't be in Iraq, ME, etc.

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Crazy Guggenheim]

33. The OP was asking about what it would be like if Clinton was Pres!

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

42. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hopeisaplace]

43. IMO, cause Clinton is a Diplomat. Wounds would not have been

allowed to fester as they have over the last 6.5 years.
IMO, ME Diplomacy would have been at the top of his agenda,
I'm sure of it.

[dremple]

47. And so what would you have him do today?

[Crazy Guggenheim]

49. How wouldn't it????

[Name removed]

53. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Crazy Guggenheim]

55. Let me tell you a story about Bush foriegn policy. Donald Rumsfeld

is giving the president his daily briefing. He concludes by saying: "Yesterday, 3 Brazilian soldiers were killed."

"OH NO!" the President exclaims. "That's terrible!"

His staff sits stunned at this display of emotion, nervously watching as the President sits, head in hands.

Finally, the President looks up and asks, "How many is a brazillion?"




Does that answer it for you?

[Beetwasher]

74. For Starters, Einstein, Clinton Would NOT Have Insulted Hezzbollah

and Syria in front of an open mic and talked w/ his mouth open while chewing food.

Secondly, Clintion would ALREADY (immediately, as soon as the situation started) have people (if not himself) in the Mid-East trying to broker a cease fire. Chimpy STILL has no one (high level) there.

That's just for starters, Chester.

[alarimer]

106. You are not listening

You are willfully ignorant like the rest of the Bush supporters.

[hopeisaplace]

56. oh sure, ask how a Dem would clean up a mess they didn't make.

you know what...

someone posted something perfect on a post below.... "LEAD".

I believe it was George Mitchell (forgive me if I have the name wrong)
on Larry King tonight, who gave, what I thought to be, very good
suggestions about what should be done by the US. The major point
that was made by several people tonight on the panel, was that
the US should be engaged in active discussions with all parties. They
(the * Admin are currently, not, and have not been, on "speaking terms"
with Syria or Iran) and the opinion was this type of "diplomacy" is
doomed to fail. The only way to resolve this matter is to TALK. The US
needs to lead the "mediation front", as they have done for years, decades
before this Admin.

When the parties are not speaking, extreme positions grow, fester, explode.
Anyway, that's what I've been hearing from pundits the past few days.

So what would Clinton do, have done, and keep doing:

He would engage in discussions, mediate, and lead <---IMO.

[madokie]

69. as President Gore would do also

[RoyGBiv]

45. Some specifics ...

Assuming (a huge assumption) everything else is to the point it is today in the ME, he would:

Be Presidential, not whacking himself and offering unintelligible blurbs about "right to defend, but show restraint."

He would he a diplomat.

He would immediately dispatch those whose jobs are to be diplomatic in such situations to, well, do their damn jobs.

He would lead.

[Name removed]

54. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[RoyGBiv]

57. Yes...

Next question.

[stepnw1f]

61. Specifics...nice try

Only one with a crystal ball could give you specifics on a hypothetical, and you know that.... debate tactic 101 for people who have to argument.

So I guess you think Bush is doing a great job? How about giving specifics as how he is doing a great job? It isn't hypothetical so I'm sure you from observation you can BE SPECIFIC.

[stepnw1f]

59. He Wouldn't Have Esculated the Mess We See Now

What part don't you understand exactly? What to be done now is a totally different point. But I'm sure he would handle today's situation a bit better than the fuck up you voted for. Truth hurts, doesn't it.

Ya see... we wouldn't be in this mess in Iraq if Bush WASN'T in office. COMPRENDE? Therefore, Clinton wouldn't have to do shit to deal with the present violence we see. That takes leadership and intellect, something right wingers don't have but pretend to... that's why they keep fucking up the World then blame all their shit on Dems and foreigners.

Now go back to fruitcake land and stay in that bubble you presently live in.

[MannyGoldstein]

64. He Felt Our Pain

He would've felt our pain.

But seriously, he waged war on the Middle Class, but he sucked less than Bush.

[LanternWaste]

90. Maintain an effective dialog

Maintain an effective dialog with the leaders of the ME countries and deny them moral justification to recklessly approach the brink as is being done now; much like he did in the nineties- a lesson well learned from Carter's effective approach.

He would not have been banal and tiresome (and puzzling) when speaking, rather, he would have lifted up with words (while current leadership knows only how to tear down, and that's at it's best).

He would have spoken on the world stage of hope and man's shared traits rather than "pig meat" and "Hezbollah's shit". He'd've realized that words have meaning and those meanings have consequences in every part of the world.

He'd have the wisdom to know that it takes more than a big arsenal and U.S. flag-pins on your lapel to have a good democracy and effectively advertise that as a beacon to those who lack wisdom.

That's one small aspect of Clinton leadership... but one big aspect so sorely missed now.

[MissWaverly]

10. Me too, I wish they would reveal how the election was stolen

and let Gore become President, Bush has no qualifications, he is clueless and he is in over his
head and the same thing for his cabinet.

[rubberducky]

11. I would be willing to bet that there are

more than a few people who voted for the idiot,wishing that Clinton was back. Wish it could be Clinton(Bill)/Gore in `08.

[rurallib]

13. Must've heard that same sentiment over a dozen times this weekend.

[dweller]

18. no.

but a President Kucinich would have in place a Dept. of Peace already functioning.

since we are wishing.
dp

[hopeisaplace]

20. Me too. Dito.

[Gabi Hayes]

25. who could possibly be WORSE than Bush?

he's just a puppet like Reagan, but without the thespian skills, and that's not saying much.

seriously

our M$M is the ONLY bunch of craven morons on the whole PLANET who's buying what this halfwit is selling, outside of the benighted cretins who allegedly voted him into office TWICE!

[oasis]

31. Worse than Bush? How about an untranquilized Bush?

That would be about as bad as the planet could stand. :scared:

Whatever they have him doped up with, keep it coming.

Pleeeeze.

[Guaranteed]

28. Yup. Well said. nt

[jerry611]

37. You know what really bothers me?

That Bush just does absolutely nothing... Even if he does something I disagree with, at least he would be doing something.

This guy seems to be a very slow reacting president. He is not good at putting out fires. He allows them to turn into infernos and then expect some act of god to put them out.

You got all these fires brewing all over the world. And he isn't doing ANYTHING to put them out. Does he have a plan? Does he have a roadmap? Does he have any fvcking idea what is going on in the world on any given day????

[madokie]

73. The answer is NO he does not

he, *, lights fires not extinguish them
Nothing can be done to change the fact bush* is a FAILURE

[earth mom]

39. No thanks, we don't need another republican in office. nt

[stepnw1f]

58. So You'd Rather Have Bush Instead? (nt)

[earth mom]

80. Open your eyes.

There is no difference between Bush and the Clintons. Have you heard Bill or Hillary lately? Both are DINOS. :puke:

[stepnw1f]

84. Whatever

and you have your eyes sealed shut. Huge difference between the two. But hey... I see more than you do obviously.

[The Count]

66. The most misplaced comment of the day!

Give this guy a golden banana peel.

[earth mom]

81. Hardly. Just can't join you in the hero worship of Bill.

Let's get a real dem in office who will do the job-for the people they are elected to represent! Maybe Gore or Robert Kennedy Jr.! Or even someone like Michael Moore or Robert Redford!

The bottom line is that I'm sick of the Clintons almost as much as the Bushes! The last thing we need is more reTHUGlicans in the W.H.! :puke:

[HughBeaumont]

83. 300 million people in this country and there seem to be only 2 families

qualified to run it? I think not. I too, say end the dynasties and get some new PROGRESSIVE blood in there.

But for the sake of argument, Clinton would have performed a FAR better job than what Shitbag is doing . .. simply because unlike Bewsh, he would actually DO the job he's supposed to do. Whether he would do it RIGHT or not is up for debate, but at least he wouldn't chop off a toe for a gangrenous finger.

[stepnw1f]

85. Bill Clinton Was Much Better as President Than Bush

Making that comparison, is hardly "Hero Worship".

[Gloria]

46. Clinton has said that as long as people keep talking, there is

less violence and this was actually true with regard to Israel and the Palestinians.

Bushco, of course, doesn't believe in talking at all.

Wes Clark keeps repeating how we should be talking to Iran and N. Korea directly...for the benefit of the FAUX audience. He's about the only sane one on cable.

[lonestarnot]

60. Wish in one hand and shit in the other.

[madokie]

71. and see which one will fill the fastest

:hi:
pss, 'morning

[midnight]

62. How much damage can they do?

That was my response when the 2000 election was stolen. First they blew up the Twin Trade Towers, removed our privacy, robbed our US treasury, blew up Nola, destroyed the economy, escalated global warming. Did I leave anything out? O, I just thought of one more. Made college tuition unattainable for most.

[Swamp Rat]

63. like night and day... er, day and night n/t

[The Count]

65. he was about to negotiate peace. BFEE waved the "future power" stink

want over the talks (in the form of Richard Perle) and broke it off.

[SammyWinstonJack]

89. That's right! BFEE gets what it wants, always.

[ecstatic]

67. How could anyone disagree? Are you guys THAT well off?

There must be some really wealthy people here on DU, who would actually prefer Bush in office to Clinton--yet still claim to be liberal. Yeah--the liberal elite. lmao

[Xenotime]

72. I wish he was president too.

[FSogol]

78. We all do. n/t

[mtnsnake]

87. Times were relatively fine under Bill. He was taking us up the good path

and then everything went to hell in 2000.

I'm sure we wouldn't be suffering the difficult times under Clinton as we are under Bush. Clinton was such a smart president.

[Catherine Vincent]

88. Well, the little disruptor didn't last long.

I could've had fun with him but I chose not to. Why? I don't know.:)

[stepnw1f]

92. Actually,

you did good. Disrupters love getting duers bumped off this site.

[bluestateguy]

91. My president is named Matt Santos

[BrklynLiberal]

93. You are right..since all this shit was what they planned to happen!!!

[Name removed]

95. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[gatorboy]

99. You're still here?

Man the mods are slow today. :rofl:

[blonndee]

100. Did you see that lame-ass, nonsensical blog?

Trying to make Democrats look bad when all it does is highlight what an utter failure her "president" is. LOL :rofl:

[gatorboy]

101. I enjoyed the pic of the Bush rug.

It was sewn from thousands of Barbara Bush pubic hairs...

[stepnw1f]

103. Guh-Hilp, Guh-hilp, snort

burp..... duh.

[ronnykmarshall]

102. Me too!

Hillary would be doing such a great job.

:hide: