State to go 'Door to Door' checking residents health

[puffthemagicdragon]

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003139177_healthsurvey20m.html

By Warren King

Seattle Times medical reporter

Washington state health officials will soon start asking detailed questions about the health of some state residents — and even give them brief physical exams.

The door-to-door survey of 1,100 randomly selected households across the state will try to learn more about our health, and especially about our risk for cardiovascular disease and diabetes, to better target preventive educational programs.

[MADem]

1. Six years ago, I would not have been SUSPICIOUS about this sort of effort

But Monkey and his DHS have turned me into a suspicious old shit. Throw out a legit team of health care workers and have the media cover them, to lull everyone, and next thing ya know, they're in old Al Kada's apartment tossing the thing for evidence of anthrax, or pulling the hair out of Guardsman Bob's head to find out if he ever did any of them there drugs.

I know...it's a feeling that will pass. But why, now, is my FIRST thought that?

[hobbit709]

2. You don't think that

everything that's happened in the last 5 years or so has anything to do with that suspicion?:eyes:

[MADem]

10. Could be!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NT

[undergroundpanther]

3. WTF

Health Nazis,paternal state.It's fucking here. How can they determine who's a "useless eater invade their bodies 'for their own good health'?Invade their minds,invade their homes invade their bodies,invade their medical histories.
I for one DO NOT want some"state official" telling me HOW TO LIVE MY LIFE. I don't want their yardsticks for lunatics with one point of view(theirs).
Are they gonna note who's pregnant? Are they gonna take a peek?
Are they gonna tell them to lose weight and the same old shit that does not work because the state is too cozy with the corporate polluters that are causing most of our health problems? Are they gonna tinker with my lifestyle now? Will I suddenly find it harder to get help I need because oh,I'm transgender or maybe umm Bi? or maybe not Christian????

Fuck the health Nazis. I got a doctor,the feds can poke in my file freely now, I don't need some bean counter bullshitter telling me to change myself for the 'health' of the state.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1347695

[puffthemagicdragon]

4. I pay a lot for my own plan I don't need a nurse to visit me randomly

does anyone know if we can decline? The part about them walking around in yellow jackets is wierd to me.

[Sapphocrat]

13. Tell them you're a Christian Scientist.

And then rattle off a prepared spiel about religious freedom. Even the Bushistas can't touch that.

Btw, welcome to DU.

[undergroundpanther]

16. Yellow jackets?

Wasps..Huh?
Anyways uncanny you mention"yellow because in Baltimore maryland there is a citizen type group working with the state to harass people. It's strange they don't bother preppy looking types,whites or"normals" who are talking to their friends on the street. no they come up to blacks,to me,(I'm a freak") and to"riff raff" looking people.And tell us to "move on". I was at a meeting with a GBLT group,it's a multicultural group and their evening meeting got out late,I was talking to the group leader a really cool black guy about pride poster designs and helping out with some of the work.Since the support group went overtime and I was late,I didn't have time to connect with him earlier on this.. So we talked as he and a few other members waited for the bus which would be arriving diagonally across the street from where we were standing..We were not at the bus stop itself because the car I rode in was two feet away. These pale yellow shirted white people with official looking patches on their arms walked over to us and told us we could not gather there.I got offended,I didn't start anything at the time. We said our goodbyes and left I promising to call him the next day . But dammit I was pissed as I rode home realizing what just occurred.These yahoos in the yellow were not cops and we were not doing anything wrong.It was about 9 pm. WTF.

[SmokingJacket]

18. That is freaking nuts. nt

[ArbustoBuster]

43. I'm headed for Baltimore next month for work.

I may have to make and print out a few "I HAVE THE RIGHT TO PEACEABLY ASSEMBLE" stickers to put on my lapel in case those yellow-shirted goons bug me.

[mcscajun]

46. Sure it's voluntary. That's why they're offering the $45 gift cards.

It's the carrot and the stick.

The bit about them not looking for volunteers only means they don't want the survey skewed by self-selectors.

I wouldn't participate, but they're not going to force anyone into it, either.

There's enough moronic people out there to take the $45 without looking too much into what the consequences of their participation might be. The government won't need to force anyone, and if they get too many declines, they'll just reinterpret the results for the insufficient sample size.

Scientific standards: Who needs 'em? :sarcasm:

[WePurrsevere]

5. This had darn well better be voluntary participation n/t

[undergroundpanther]

12. VoLUnTary?

The state don't know what that means dear feline freind,purrrsurvere!

Remember this thread? It sank like a stone,scary it is relavant now
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1576321
And oh don't forget Polyheme..
The Thread,
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1590759
A story..
http://www.sdreader.com/php/cover.php?mode=article&showpg=1&id=20050728

[WePurrsevere]

28. I had not seen those threads & very much appreciate you're sharing them

with me. It's stuff like this that makes me spitting mad since the government has no right to be pulling this. Actually I can't imagine the fundies being wild about this if they knew about it so I think I'll send these links along to a Dem friend who posts on a board with a few of them... he'll enjoy watching the fur fly. :evilgrin:

I was glad to see that a hospital I'm familiar with in NY has suspended it's use of Polyheme and there are no others near us. Do you know if the ACLU or any of the patient rights groups are working against this BS? I can't do much but I have a BIG mouth and claws that can scratch a decent letter to Reps.

Again thank you for sharing this info B-) ... ::sigh:: I've been so zoned out with an overload of personal stuff that I must admit that I've been lightly skimming more then reading much of anything lately. :blush:

[undergroundpanther]

6. If you don't think this has squat to do with control...

Unconsentual medical trials
http://www.unknownnews.org/060710a-Panther.html
Pulling plugs
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1017296
Screening the country for"mental health"Is it door to door now?
http://www.unknownnews.net/040712a-upits.html
Corporate efficiency
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/undergroundpanther/11
The road to slavery
http://www.unknownnews.org/050607a-Panther.html
Contaminated
http://www.unknownnews.org/051209a-Panther.html
Mad Cows
http://www.unknownnews.net/madcow.html

Scared yet,this will get you thinking..If you got money,get out.
If you are poor you are basically..fucked.like me and plenty of others. the noose is closing,and I don't trust who holds the other end.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/undergroundpanther/11
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/undergroundpanther/2

[truebrit71]

7. If they try that crap with me they will be told to go Cheney themselves...

..and not politely either...

[undergroundpanther]

8. I'll slam the door and lock it.

And demand they leave my house I don't want to"participate" in this bullshit.. and I would not be so"polite" either.If need be I'll escape and not be found again.When I grew up I had to hide from bullies I know how to make myself invisible.Even with bright colored hair.

[Extend a Hand]

44. We don't even open our door

unless we are expecting guests.

[seafan]

9. Everybody needs to read this part from this article.

Seattle Times: State to check on residents' health

snip

In this latest survey, selected participants will be asked about their access to health care and whether they have dental problems, osteoporosis, emphysema or cancer. Other questions will center on diet, medications and other risks for disease such as tobacco and alcohol use.

A nurse on each survey team will measure blood pressure, pulse, height, weight and waist size.

A blood sample will be taken to measure cholesterol and blood sugar.

A hair sample, to measure mercury levels, will be taken from women of childbearing age and participants 60 and older.

"We'll ask about fish consumption to see if certain types cause higher levels of mercury," said VanEenwyk.

Surveyors will wear yellow vests and carry photo identification.

Participants will be given a $45 gift card for their help in the survey. Officials are not seeking volunteers; participants are being chosen to represent the diverse population of the state.

snip

Hell-oooooo!! More information to populate Total Information Awareness data bases! They are after genetic material on citizens. And all of this is under a pretext of *caring about our health.*

This is going to get very, very, very ugly.

[puffthemagicdragon]

11. yes, the blood and hair sample is over the top

nanny state.

[truebrit71]

15. Um, how about HELL NO!!!???

Blood samples? Hair samples? Why? So they can build a DNA database and circumvent the 4th and 5th amendments?

Fuck that!

[RB TexLa]

14. I don't give the doctor all that information

Name, what is wrong with me and the fact that I am not allergic to anything is all she needs to know.

I just put n/a for everything else, address, insurance, health history, phone, emergency contact, etc.


I've never understood the "emergency contact" you are at the doctor's office, do they want you to write 9-1-1 in there?

[MissB]

17. I get what you're saying

The "emergency contact" is in case you have to be transported to the hospital - they like to know who should be notified that you're en route to the hospital.

[undergroundpanther]

19. emergency contacts

I have PSTD,and for me, having a person I trust around helps me deal with shit better,Someone else able to bE THERE,who respects me,knows what I want,a witness,to protect my rights when I can't do that myself,is very important in making sure my rights are not violated.
Mind freedom has made a plan to help mental patients get protection...
http://www.mindfreedom.org/mindfreedom/shieldnewsrelease.shtml

Mind freedom is not associated with any cults. They are a MH consumer rights org,and they are not anti medication,they are wary of it however.,they are protectors of a person's consent.Considering locking people up involuntarily was called unconstitutional by alaska,they got a point considering the nanny state climate that is infiltrating our homes now..Mind shield is a good idea.maybe we need a health advocacy set up like mind freedom has to protect our bodily integrity.
http://www.voanews.com/english/archive/2005-12/2005-12-09-voa98.cfm?CFID=32324756&CFTOKEN=72125534
http://www.knowonk.com/freeourpeople/

[NotGivingUp]

20. WTF???? I wouldn't let anyone showing up at my door examine me!!!!...

What the hell is going on??? I'll tell you what's going on...they're trying to find some customers for big pharma's drugs. People should be up in arms!! And they're using grant money to do this?

[NotGivingUp]

24. Kansas and Arkansas also were awarded survey grants.

[icymist]

21. This is NOT VOLUNTARY people.....

<snip>
Participants will be given a $45 gift card for their help in the survey. Officials are not seeking volunteers; participants are being chosen to represent the diverse population of the state.

:wtf:

[puffthemagicdragon]

22. but can we decline?

that is my question, I know it is not voluntary but can we decline?

[robinlynne]

42. Of course you can. you do not have to let anyone in your home. much less

give a blood sample!

[Gormy Cuss]

27. This means that you can't volunteer, not that you can't decline.

The text you cited implies that the sample is drawn in such a way that the end result will include people across the demographic spectrum in the state (old, young, male, female, race/ethnicity, maybe region of the state, as opposed to waiting for people to sign up and hope that they'll get enough volunteers from across those groups.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

38. Officials are not seeking volunteers

right, because that would mean actually giving help to people who need and want it. That would be SOCIALIZED FUCKING MEDICINE OH MY FUCKING GOD COMMUNISSSSMMM NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

[mcscajun]

47. Of course it's voluntary. That sentence only means they're keeping Out

the "self-selectors" who would skew results.

The carrot and the stick approach will get enough participation from those too incuriouis to question further. No need to force anyone. If they get a lot of people declining, they'll just interpret the results accordingly.

If I lived in Washington State, those "yellow jackets" would get an earful from me, but no blood, hair or personal info. I'm just sayin'.

[NotGivingUp]

23. It's time to get the hell out of this country.

[NotGivingUp]

25. Here's a number to call for more information:

Chris Hanson, Survey Coordinator

Washington State Department of Health

1-888-438-2247

[Ilsa]

26. What I expect as a sample of some questions:

1. Have you had any abortions recently?
2. Have you fully recovered from that nasty case of syphyllis?
3. How often do you have sex?
a. With your spouse,
b. another opposite gender or
c. same sex?
4. Do you use any illicit drugs?
5. etc
}(

[Bush_MUST_Go]

30. What a waste of money. If they really cared, we'd have a natl health plan.

[Ron Green]

29. Geez, look at the Libertarian fear on this thread.

Public health has a hard enough time overcoming Big Tobacco and all its corporate cousins, but most people on a "democratic" and "liberal" message board seem to be more afraid of government than they are of our corporate masters.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

31. These days, the line between the government and "our corporate masters"

is very blurry indeed, since this government is hardly more than the servant of the corporations. And if you're not afraid of Bush's government, you haven't been paying attention.

[Ron Green]

33. The Right Wing wants citizens to be afraid of government,

especially in matters of public health. They want "individual responsibility" to take precedence over "corporate responsibility." Only government can regulate business, although market-monkeys and Libertarians would have us believe some bullshit about the "marketplace of ideas."

The fact is that a participatory democracy is what the fascists want to ELIMINATE, and they're doing a good job of it by scaring people of the "nanny state," while allowing advertisers to forge fear and brand awareness among generations of young people.

I'm disgusted that members of DU are so quick to disparage a program designed to gather important public health data. This is a response I'd expect from Free Republic.

[musette_sf]

45. right, the benevolent gov't wants to gather

"important public health data", by sending yellow-vested ppl out on house calls to collect bodily fluids and hair samples.

but vets get their health care cut, public health is virtually non-existent and most notably absent in crisis situations like the NO storm, unversal health care coverage is promoted as a "Socialist" taboo to tbe Bu$hCo sheep, and as Randi says, "Wealth = Health" these days.

i'm quite suspicious of a gov't whose first public health priority is NOT to provide care where care is needed, but to institute a program to monitor and track citizens. notice that the lucky participant gets to donate personal body cells to the gov't, and in return they get $45, and they "even give them brief physical exams" -- one would think if the gov't is so eager to pay a house call to "gather important public health data", the participant would then be referred for immediaate covered treatment for all those diseases they're looking for - "cardiovascular disease" - "including heart disease and stroke", "diabetes", "dental problems, osteoporosis, emphysema or cancer", "high blood pressure", and/or "high cholesterol". but NO, they get $45 and a quick once-over.

if we had excellent public health care and universal health care coverage, i might see that this deal honestly WAS an effort to help people. i'm surprised to see this in Wash State, it just seems so cold-hearted to send ppl out to get info but not to actually help anyone.

[Ron Green]

48. If you read the article, you know that it's the state health department,

operating with a grant from the CDC. When you say "a government," but don't differentiate between different agencies of a government, or even different governments, this is exactly what the right wing wants. They want people to think of "the government" as "they," some faceless menace whose purpose is to enslave us. The truth is that the Federal Government, through all kinds of grants, is the only real hope for better public health in this country. However, the corporate talking points have got lots of people convinced that the reason we don't have good health care is the fault of the government. There are literally thousands of initiatives, programs and grants given out by every department of the Federal Government to improve the lives of disadvantaged people, and they're given under very strict and competitive rules to groups of people who have to show capacity to help and accountability in their operation.

In contrast, corporations, through advertising and PR, have fooled countless Americans into thinking addiction is freedom and conformity is individualism. I never cease to be amazed at the naivete of free-market types who shout, "Don't trust the government!"

[musette_sf]

49. if you read my post, you know that I am aware that it's

the state health department.

and the CDC is a Federal agency.

actually, it is the libertarians who think of the "government" as "they". I live with a libertarian and it is he who rants on about how "the government" is out to enslave us. he does not have the critical ability to deal with specifics in a political discusssion. to him, all government is bad and all government is the same. political discussions with him are very boring.

I am quite clear that this is a state initiative funded by the (Federal) CDC. and I am quite able to discuss specifics. you are painting your arguments with a very libertarian-esque broad brush, and seem to be attempting to obfuscate the facts for some reason, if indeed you are a progressive, that I cannot readily comprehend.

your assertion that I am buying "corporate talking points" is absurd. our discourse on this point is over, as you either can't understand my statements, or choose not to.

[Horse with no Name]

50. If it was truly to benefit a community

Then why wouldn't they open a clinic to actually help someone?
This is intrusive and invasive for them to come door to door.
My guess is that there will be a "list" of volunteers that are preselected for whatever reason.

[moc]

52. They are collecting the data so they can target resources effectively.

"Opening a clinic" sounds easier than it is. Resources are not bottomless, so priorities need to be set. That's why we collect needs assessment data. Maybe they'll decide they need another clinic, maybe not. But you can't make that decision without data.

[Horse with no Name]

53. Sure you can

You don't need hair and blood samples to find out where poverty exists.
All you have to do is open your eyes.
Inner cities, around homeless shelters, go to an area that has low test scores in their schools.
There are many ways to know where poverty lives.
I never said opening a clinic was easy. But you don't go about it going door-to-door taking DNA samples.

[moc]

55. No you can't.

Look, I'm a professor at a school of public health. I know what I'm talking about. They're not "going door to door". They're doing a multistage probability sample.

Frankly, most of the time "opening a clinic" doesn't do squat if you don't start addressing the roots of the problem such as no access to affordable healthy food and that sort of thing.

Sure, these things covary with poverty but that doesn't tell you what the specific health needs are of that specific population.

You can't be effective without effective needs assessment data.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

41. and both are to be equally feared

it is time for a quiet revolution.

[madfloridian]

36. I assume you are kidding.

I am very upset that they would require people to let public health officials come to their homes and examine them. Why aren't you?

Only in severe epidemics should such a thing happen.

[puffthemagicdragon]

37. i don't think it is about being afraid

it is about privacy. I have a private health plan and I privately go to my doctor and privately discuss it with her. They should instead go to homes that DONT have health insurance and OFFER a free medical screening...maybe a phone call would be appropriate before they arrived. They should spend more time on getting health care to everyone than random sampling a few to collect data.

[Pacifist Patriot]

40. There's a difference between government and corporate masters?

:)

[Sydnie]

32. Didn't someone get arrested not that long ago by going

door to door giving gyn exams ... but he wasn't really a doctor? This doesn't sound like such a great idea to me. Opens up a lot of people to be scammed I think.

[spacelady]

34. So they can implant those nanomachines or whatever they have wanted

to implant for so long; it's the perfect opportunity.

[SlavesandBulldozers]

39. lol

well, nanomachines of course. That goes without saying.

But i think its a perfect opportunity for them to put the Mark of the Beast on me, as well as install SuperAids 3.0XP

[madfloridian]

35. That's creepy and scary and way overboard.

.

[moc]

51. I've done these kind of surveys before. I'm shocked at the

level of suspicion expressed in this thread.

"Volunteers" aren't sought because they are using a multistage random sampling method. The sampling method will be used to weight the data to estimate population level rates. If they took volunteers, this would invalidate those estimates. However, just because the participants aren't volunteers, that doesn't mean they will be coerced. All individuals approached have to go through an approved informed consent procedure and have the right to refuse participation altogether or even refuse to answer individual questions. Data are de-identified and won't be used to "track" people unless the participants agree to be part of a longitudinal follow up.

Such needs assessments are vital to public health program planning. People here need to get a grip. For what it's worth, I'm a professor at a school of public health and have been involved in a number of these endeavors both federally and state funded.

[Cocoa]

54. I think it's partly the article's fault

I think most people would first react to hearing about the govt coming around to people's houses and taking hair samples with "wtf?"

On the other hand, reading the article and thinking a little would lead most people to think obviously this is voluntary and there's a good reason for it.

On the other hand, it's weird the article doesn't address the obvious privacy question at all. Even confuses the issue a little by saying "they're not looking for volunteers."

[Ron Green]

56. Thanks for your informed opinion in this thread.

I, too, am disappointed but not really surprised at the suspicion here at DU of the government, as if it's some monolithic committee in the process of taking away our freedoms. This is exactly what corporate bosses want people to think about the government, and it's worked like a charm on the Freepers. However, I would expect people at DU to be able to understand that the Federal Government is so much more than this crooked administration, and gathering data in a randomized way, with all attendant protections, is something ONLY a government is willing to do.

I guess they'd rather have the Free Market figure out how to address our health needs; THAT'S really working well.