British government breaks with Bush over Israel

[mr blur]

Britain has dramatically broken ranks with George Bush over the Lebanon crisis, publicly criticising Israel's military tactics and urging the Americans to 'understand' the price being paid by ordinary Lebanese civilians.

The remarks, made in Beirut today by the Foreign Office Minister, Kim Howells, were the first public criticism of the US voiced by Britain. The Observer can also reveal that Tony Blair urged restraint in a private telephone convseration with the Israeli Prime Minister, Ehud Olmert, last week.

<snip>

Speaking to a BBC reporter before travelling on for talks in Israel, where he will also visit missile-hit areas of Haifa and meet his Israeli opposite-number, Howell said: 'The destruction of the infrastructure, the death of so many children and so many people. These have not been surgical strikes. If they are chasing Hizbollah, then go for Hizbollah. You don't go for the entire Lebanese nation.'

He added: 'I very much hope that the Americans understand what's happening to Lebanon.' Only hours earlier, President Bush used his weekly radio address to place the blame for the crisis squarely on Hizbollah and their Syrian and Iranian backers.

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/world/story/0,,1826904,00.html

[uppityperson]

1. wow, good. very good.kick

[Waya]

2. Ouch.....

.no treat for the Poodle when he comes over again.....

[acmavm]

3. Well, who put the starch in Poodle's spine? I thought the Labor

government was going to go along with the murderous schemes of the bush** administration and by extension their buy Ohlmert's schemes without a squawk.

I must admit I am surprised.

[sinogirl]

4. Bull.... the poodle will never break ranks

He's leaving office soon and need buddies to play golf with....


... He's just playing to the sentiments of Labour Party supporters. Music for the ear, expect no action.

[SammyBlue]

5. These are the same European bigots that expelled Jews from their

country four times. Not surprised they criticize Israel and not surprised they say nothing when Hezbollah and Hamas attack Israel.

[w4rma]

16. I think its extremely unfair and incorrect to say that they have been

"saying nothing" when suicide bombers blow up in Israel. In fact, they helped invade Iraq for similar stated reasons that you are complaining about. Of course they were conned, but that's beside the point.

It's utter BS to say that someone is "bigoted against Jews" because they want the slaughter of folks (many of whom are American and British citizens) in Lebanon to **stop**.

I'm also going to add that the BS that Israel is pulling isn't making Israel any safer, in fact it probably will result in a heck of alot of misplaced folks who used to be content with their lives in Lebanon and who are out for revenge. And European leaders realize that also, and they don't want to be blamed for Israel's attacks on Lebanon.

Just to let you know, before you assume otherwise, I'm pro-Israel and want to see it prosper. I also want peace there and don't give a flip which country gets to govern this strip of land or that strip of land. The people there are much more important than that.

[DemonFighterLives]

18. You are right

Nobody wants this blood on their hands. Israel is creating one hell of a bad karma.

I'm sure dubya is smiling- death, destruction is what he loves- I hate to say. "They" love displaced, powerless people. Sanitation- bah, Halliburton can handle that. Electricity - bah- Halliburton. Water- bah-Iraq and Lebanon have that- Halliburton can find that.
:nuke:

[mr blur]

22. Don't be ridiculous.

This has nothing to do with being anti-Jewish or anti-Israel. It would seem that your government's great "War on Terror" is very selective about who it names as a terrorist. For some reason the US administration seems happy to let Israel do anything it likes, rather than invade it just to teach it a lesson, which seems to be Bush's usual solution for dealing with people willing to bomb and kill innocent civilians. Unless they're US Marines, of course.

[mitchtv]

6. Syria did it, Syria did it

I can't hear you:grr:

[KansDem]

7. Yo, Blair!

You sure this is the right shit to say?

[Anarcho-Socialist]

8. The Foreign Office has been traditionally pro-Palestinian

but it has become overridden somewhat due to the increasing influence over British foreign policy as wielded by the US State Department.

[Spazito]

9. Wow, that is GREAT news!

I can't express how relieved I am to see this! Because Great Britain has a veto, like the US, at the Security Council, I kept thinking that nothing would even reach the Council, knowing that if the US didn't veto any resolutions that were critical of Israel's actions, Great Britain would. Now, the US IS isolated among the 5 permanent Security Council members.

[Imagevision]

10. Israel could care less killing baby's,-kid's and women as Bush approves

There's defending yourself and then there's bullshit!!
Kill what? 100,000 civilians as Bush did to get to the enemy's wmd's?!!

Lebanon looks too much like 9-11 and it continues on daily as our President condones the killing of civilians. Tyhe USA has been going down the tubes with this President!

[Cha]

11. KNR! This is great news

..there is some sanity left in the World!

Our fucking government doesn't want Peace they want WAR and MORE WAR.

And this what will Ignite more terrorists just like the bushits did in Iraq!

[Hubert Flottz]

23. Karl Rove said that...

"War is good for GOP politics!"

[ananda]

12. too little

too late

Where were you on the first or second day, Blur?

[Mr_Spock]

13. It's nice to see an occasional person with the guts to call a spade a spad

bravo!

[mogster]

14. This may be the reason

"About 800 foreigners were evacuated by sea, leaving Tyre’s remaining inhabitants fearing the worst. “The foreigners have gone. That means the war will really begin now,” said Hassan Bazzi, a port worker. Amir Peretz, Israel’s Defence Secretary, said that a full-scale ground attack to stop Hezbollah rockets was an option. “Let no terror organisation feel we would cower from any operation,” he said. “We have no intention of conquering Lebanon but if we have to act to complete our tasks and reach a victory we will do it.”

The British Government was urgently drawing up plans to rescue 86 Britons trapped in the south. “We’re very concerned about the safety of these British nationals,” an official said."
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,251-2279462,00.html

And not only British nationals was caught in the jam.

Yesterday, analyst of Norwegian Institute of Foreign Policy (NUPI), Kari Karame, said: - Israel may easily win the war in Lebanon, but they will lose support from the world opinion. She dubs the General Secretary of NATO, Javier Solana, who says: Israel struggles to win the heart and minds of people.
And no wonder; many Norwegians was trapped in the bombed areas and suffered the true experience of war together with the Lebanese people. A ship had to be arranged in all haste to evacuate, and it would go without saying this affects the Norw. opinion in disfavor of Israel. This is top news all the time, Norwegians care about each other.

Caption: '180 Norwegians was evacuated by the ship Hual Transporter from Lebanon to Cyprus on Tuesday'

The same happened to Irish, Swedish and Baltic citizens.
http://www.aftenposten.no/spesial/bildeserieviser/?id=1391839&start=1

Cynically speaking, this war is a public relations blunder of momentous proportions.

[EFerrari]

17. I wonder if Israeli elections are rigged, too.

When a government behaves as if it isn't accountable, it probably isn't.

[mogster]

19. Aye

Seen thru the glasses of what we now know about the US elections, one might wonder if the current government reflects the Israeli opinion. At the time it was elected, of course - now the war-effect kicks in, and just as in the US, a lot of people support whatever the govt does out of natnl. security needs.

If we rewind back to 2003 and another invasion, only 46% of Israelis was for the Iraqi invasion by the US-led coalition (survey January/February 2003). Taking into account the enormous level of WMD BS prior to the war and the history of Israel vs. Saddam Hussein, this is remarkable.
Going into that survey, following numbers are very interesting:

20% was against invasion, even if the UN was involved (which it wasn't), and an additional 23% was against invasion before 'every diplomatic solution was tried'. 55% thought that Israel should respond to attack if Iraq attacked Israel, while 23% thought this should be dependent on the seriousness of the Iraqi attack. 48% of Israeli Arabs thought Israel should respond immediately with retaliatory attacks if Israel was attacked.

I only have a Norw. link for this, but it was a survey by the Ha'aretz.
http://www.aftenposten.no/nyheter/uriks/article489805.ece

I have so total control of the People opinion on that subject in various countries (and especially Norway) after doing a lot of research :D
Whatever the diverse Govt's opinion (and political manouvering), the People across Europe, in the US, in the Arab world and also in Israel, was firmly against (or at least heavily split on) the desicion to invade. Despite heavy propaganda from the US/UK governments.

Democracy has a wider aspect than just elections, and the media carry a responsibility in exposing the seduction of fear going on towards us all, but instead only forward it. Or too many forward it. I remember one of the most scary moments during the election campaign in 2004; an interview I heard at BBC Radio in my car while driving through the summer night, where a BBC reporter interviewed a Republican official at the Republican National Convention in New York. They had a long exchange about the RNC, and the conversation turned to the way the Bush supporters behaved, the undying way they totally endorsed Bush and the manipulation by the Republican party to keep it that way, to stimulate it, stimulate the fear to acheive militarism/nationalism. And the media participation in doing so. In short: the 'feel good' effect.
The Repub blatantly told the reporter they had no moral limits to keeping people in oblivion as far as truth is concerned, as long as it served their needs. It was all up for grabs. When the BBC reporter said he had problems in understanding this ethics, the Repub replied: - Well, you wouldn't understand - you're a journalist!

This contempt for the ideals of journalism really reflects a deep contempt for the People; if you lie to them and they buy it, you're morally covered. It is individualism gone berserk, lacking even the most basic community feeling and responsibility. The electorate is your power battery, to be recharged with fear at regular intervals and the power released by stimulating nationalism and glorious victories. I mean, did somebody study how power was maintained in the old empires or something? ;-)
It is one of the many redefinitions of democracy going on, of which the election process - the right to cheat if you can get away with it - is but one of the problems.
At the root of it all lies extremism propelled by religion or greed (or both - the leaders want their 'feel good' as well), and if you look at it from their point of view, democracy is just an obstacle on the way to their God given power, and does not carry any values of it's own.
Needless to say, I strongly disagree with that.

[EFerrari]

21. mogster, have you checked out 'Dark Ages America"?

I have to read it again, because I read it too quickly to get the larger scheme. But that author decontructs American culture very thoroughly. It is the Cult of the Individual gone crazy although he doesn't say it in those terms. But he does use words like "bubble". :)

Hadn't thought of it in terms of the media but I had always had this misconception that the role of the press for example is to inform. Boy, was I naive! It never occurred to me to look a little bit behind the propaganda we sneer at in those OTHER countries and see American-controlled corporate interests.

(slaps forehead)

[mogster]

25. No, I haven't

Must check out ;-)

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

15. Bush must've forgotten to give Tony his Puppy Chow.

Or, Tony might've noticed that those "birth pangs" are bodies.

[AnOhioan]

20. K&R n/t

[grannylib]

24. About time they woke up and started distancing themselves from the

imbecile in the WH who's done nothing but bring shame and embarassment to our great nation.

Never could figure out why Tony Blair put up with the little POS that calls himself 'president'