Establishing standing in ACLU FISAgate suit

[shockingelk]

I'm wondering how the plaintiffs will be able to establish standing. How would they be able to claim injury if they are suing to find out if they were unjustly spied upon?

Believe me, I think Bush should fry for willfully ignoring law as a matter of policy, but I'm having a hard time understanding how the plaintiffs will show they have or will suffer injury.

[napi21]

1. Listen to Bamfield. On one of his appearances yesterday, he

was asked that question. He said there is a precident for this kind of case. I can't recall the details, but it involved the NSA spying, and a case was filed against them, and during discovery or the actual hearing, they were forced to admit that they had in fact illegally spied on the guy who filed the suit.

I don't know how these two new ones will come out, but hearing that there's precident gives me hope!

[KharmaTrain]

2. This Is Purely Constitutional

You don't need a specific plaintiff...this is like a class action suit.

Listening to Bramfield and the lady from the ALCU explain it...the 1978 FISA law...based on illegal wiretaps during the Nixon era (and based on precedent) have been willingly violated by this regime and this is the executive overstepping authority granted it and overseen by the legislative. They'll argue that the FISA law was designed to do exactly what this regime wanted to do, and by not following those laws, they have violated the rights of countless Americans. Surely, they would subpoena the executive for names if needed...or even better, the telcoms that agreed to participate. They could also be held liable depending on how numbers and access was granted.

The object here is to stop this practice ASAP...then to make sure it doesn't happen again and to uphold the constitutionality not only of the FISA law but the power of the legislative over the executive. This regime won't go without a fight...they'll stonewall and try to drag this out for as long as possible to prevent a ruling from taking place that could be used in real litigation by real individuals who found they were illegally spied on. This sets up that groundwork.

[shockingelk]

4. OK

I can see it sort of like a class action ... but my stumbling block is determining standing that any of the plaintiffs were harmed ... in a class action, all plaintiffs were (or weren't) harmed.

[Sgent]

3. To answer the question

amongst the plantiffs were attorney's representing overseas people targeted with teorrism -- they are claiming the government spied in protected conversations with their clients.

Journalists, non-profits, et al are claiming that they were unable to get more forthwright answers from interviewees...