Why are we mad at Hugo Chavez again?

[TheFarseer]

Faux News is trying to beat that drum again in light of his visit to Tehran. What did he do to the US? I know the real reason they don't like him is because he won't play ball with oil and unrestricted capitalism. That can't be the reason they are giving to the masses. The only thing I hear about him now on Faux is that he's "anti-american" as if that was unique to him, or that he's a "mad-man", or a "dictator". Then they try to act like we've got a "Cuban Missile Crisis" brewing only Iran is the USSR and Venezuela is Cuba. Can anyone refresh my memory?

[HereSince1628]

1. Chavez is a socialist. Corporate Capitalists HATE them.

We are in a period of Robber Baron capitalism and Chavez is seen as being capable of treating capitalists' excesses similar to the way Castro did.

[sgxnk]

11. castro???

comparing somebody to castro is not a way to praise them

[rman]

14. Nelson Mandela thinks differently

Fidel - The Untold Story
http://www.chomskytorrents.org/TorrentDetails.php?TorrentID=1205
Fidel Castro has been one of the most influential and controversial figures of our time. This documentary offers a unique look at the man through exclusive interviews with Castro himself, public figures, historians, and close friends, with footage from the Cuban State archives. Alice Walker, Harry Belafonte, and Sydney Pollack discuss the personality of Fidel Castro. Current and former U.S government figures including Ramsey Clark, Wayne Smith, Congressman Charles Rangel, and a former CIA agent offer their political and historical perspectives. "Infuriating & fascinating! Required viewing." (The Miami Herald).

[sgxnk]

17. so?

file under: appeal to authority

[rman]

19. file under: check your facts

see my previous post (edited)

[sgxnk]

21. which previous post?

my point stands. frankly, there is a lot to like about chavez

there is VERY little to like about castro

you do chavez a disservice by comparing him to castro as an indication of chavez' kewlness

castro sux

[rman]

22. You've been buying into RW propaganda about Castro

"Fidel - The untold story" *will* inform you about things you didn't already know (thanks to the "liberal" media).

[sgxnk]

23. apparently...

if i disagree with you, it's cause i believe propaganda...

whatEver

i have read all sorts of literature on cuba

rightwing, leftwing, and any other wing

i also had the pleasure of speaking to two former cuban residents who left what they described as a "hellhole"

furthermore, cuba's situation is so bad that people jump on tiny rafts and risk sharks, dehydration, and castro's wrath in order to emigrate to america

that alone is strong proof of cuba's suckiness. if castro is so great, and cuba so wonderful, people wouldn't be rushing to leave and risking their lives to do so.

[rman]

30. your disagreement with me has nothing to do with it

[sgxnk]

31. read what u wrote

if i disagree with you, that's because i believe RW propaganda, according to you

that is as silly as me saying "you disagree with me, therefore you believe pro-castro propaganda"

let's talk about the evidence, not make accusations about being propaganda dupes, k?

[rman]

37. I didn't say it is because you disagree with me.

Yes, lets talk about evidence. Check out the documentary i have mentioned, then we'll talk again.

[Judi Lynn]

32. From whom are the Mexican people fleeing?

They die by the hundreds annually in the Mexican desert, mountains, river, California canals trying to cross over, from California to Texas, knowing if they live long enough to cross, they will be sent back as soon as someone catches them

Are they trying to run away from Vicente Fox?

What about the Cuban Adjustment Act which offers instant legal status the moment these boat people arrive on dry land, with the knowledge they will NOT be sent back after arriving, and what about the US taxpayer-funded Section 8 housing, food stamps, social security, green card, medical treatment, educational financial assistance, etc., etc., etc.

Do you have ANY IDEA AT ALL how many MORE THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS of Central Americans who have been coming through Mexico, and Mexicans would be dying in the deserts trying to get here? How MANY thousands of Haitians and Dominicans would be drowning annually if ALL THESE PEOPLE received the opportunity to stay here with no hassle, to receive food and housing from the U.S. taxpayers? Good grief.

I'm assuming either you don't know what you're talking about, or it will sound as if you're trying to con people who know better.

[cigsandcoffee]

27. Doesn't it bother you that he's been in power for 47 years?

Imagine how old that would get.

[Judi Lynn]

34. The Batista supporting "exiles" have been in Florida & New Jersey

that long, and it seems they've been here FAR FAR TOO LONG.

Look what they did to Miami. Goodlordalmighty.

They've claimed they changed Miami from "a little sleepy fishing village to a world-class city," whereas the truth more clearly shows they've changed Miami to a town which has been named "Terror Capitol of the United States" by the FBI, designated "Poorest City in a population over 500,000" by the U.S. Census Bureau time after time, a town with FILTHY politics, known all over the world for election fraud BEFORE the 2000 election, notorious race hatred, violence, bombings, drugs, etc., etc., etc.

Yeah, I'll bet they really miss these scums back in Cuba.

[cigsandcoffee]

35. How does that compare to a single leader in power for 47 years?

Indeed, there has always been a strong Miami resistance to Castro. After looking at his bearded mug for 47 years, it's understandable.

[rman]

38. In Cuba, "president" is merely title; a figure head -

it's a non electable position with no real power - much as the Queen of England is a figurehead with no real power.
Castro is however reelected every time for the council as representative of his district.

[HereSince1628]

20. Castro nationalized American assets in Cuba, US capitalists are

afraid of exactly the same thing from Chavez. Our robber barons see populist land reforms, nationalization of national resources etc as all being made from the same cloth.

Vietnam beat the US ass into the ground and we got over it quickly. We still don't have anything like normalized relations with Cuba.

[Minstrel Boy]

33. for you maybe

Not for me, or much of the world.

[Vidar]

36. In your opinion, not mine.

[davidinalameda]

2. maybe because he's shown his readiness to ally himself

with countries that have total disregard for human rights?

:shrug:

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

3. Like China and Saudi Arabia?

No, wait, that was another "dictator"...

[Vidar]

9. Chavez allied with the US? I think not.

[rman]

12. Uhm, he does not ally himself with the US. That's a good start

when you don't want to ally with countries that have total disregard for human rights.
I mean, you don't want me to bring up the history of US support for RW military dictators all over the world (especially in Latin America) do you?

[patdem]

16. dwickham is that you?

Why did you turn in your pink triangle and liberal ideas? You think reight wing fascists will be kinder to the gay agenda?

[stepnw1f]

18. I Noticed The Change Too

hmmmm....

[davidinalameda]

26. Iran is no friend of the gay community

anyone who gives the regime there any credibility is no friend of the gay community

[laura888]

4. They won't give us their oil n/t

[Nutmegger]

5. Uh oh....I fear we need to resurrect the Chavez debunking thread.

Official DU Hugo Chavez Right-Wing Falsehood Debunking Thread

[Why Syzygy]

10. Great!

Keep the reincarnation cycle going.

[Selatius]

6. We tried to overthrow him in 2002 and failed.

To be sure, I question his visit to Belarus and Iran. They are not people I would generally associate with. I can only speculate he's scrapping the bottom of the barrel when he's looking for allies because few in European capitals are willing to warm up to him, except maybe PM Zapatero of Spain, who is also a democratic socialist. The Europeans don't want to make the US government angrier by associating with Chavez.

[sallyseven]

7. He has oil. As much h as Saudi Arabia

He is selling it cheaper. Saudi-es whine to bush. bush tries to take over Chavez. Simple it is an american trick that they do so well.

[MGD]

8. Because he delights in threatening the U.S.

Just kidding, calm down. Everybody knows that Hugo Chavez is deeply pro-American.

[rman]

13. Venezuela does not want to "trade" with the US on US's terms.

So "he does not have the interests of the United States at heart" (Tenet on behalf of the State Department), therefor he is the enemy.

[TheFarseer]

25. I suspect Chavez has the intersts of Venezuela

at heart. Maybe we should try having the interests of our own country at heart.

[Robbien]

15. Chavez has been moving away from the dollar, the IMF and US Central bank

Always follow the money.

Iran is also moving away from the dollar, the IMF and is opening up its own bourse. Iran and Chavez just renewed their "friendship" yesterday.

Of course it is time for Fauxnews to start beating the anti-Chavez drums again.

[bananarepublican]

40. Chavez and Morales aren't anti-American....

... they're respectively pro Venezuala and Bolivia.

Bush is only pro neocon democracies, otherwise, any old pro neocon dictatorship will do.

[Jara sang]

24. Because Venezuela is trying to get a seat on the UN Security Council.

[LaPera]

28. Of course regressive, neocon Bush hates Chavez....

Bush is a complete right-wing fascist...If Chavez is a leftist liberal....He's a hundred times better than Bush's sick, greedy, oppressive regime, discouraging and intimidating opponents of free speech, even if one wears a tee shirt they don't like, BushCo hates any dissent and has government agencies investigate anyone who exercises their right to dissent... Stifling newspaper & media from reporting the truth calling them unpatriotic & treasonous if they disagree with Bush, eavesdropping on US citizen's, lying to go to war, insensitive republican asshole, as our kids die. Bush refuses to obey any laws he doesn't want to...does NOT support the Constitution, constantly finding new ways to subvert it for his ideological neocon corporate agenda believes in torturing prisoners & has left that option open even though congress & the courts said it's illegal, has broken every US treaty in the world, hates the poor and the workers, middle class, is an environmental disaster all for corporate profit...Bush is the war-mongering pig of ALL fascist war for profit (oil) pigs.

BushCo lies about everything!! Tell me just one truth you think he's ever said and I'll rip it to shreds!!!! Bush/Cheney/Rove are the most evil, wicked, sick, greedy, lying imperialistic motherfucking regime on the face on the earth!!!

[killbotfactory]

29. Because Iran is now "the enemy"

And Chavez has been dealing with that nation for a long time. Therefor he is evil, too.

[malaise]

39. Chavez is not some American child

who needs parental permission to visit anyone. Most of the world has no problem with the leaders of two sovereign countries with common interests meeting.

The US goverment and MSMachine (backed by corporations) have a long history of 'inventing' enemies, demonizing them and creating caricatures to bamboozle a US public who are largely ignorant about anything outside of their home state.

The well used phrase 'the emperor has no clothes' best describes Bushco's naked, aggressive foreign policy. Like the school yard bully and his gang, Bushco believe that they can beat up on every country on the planet and steal their resources. The problem is that when thinking students realize that they are doing what they are telling others they can't do, they come together and fight back.

Bushco has destroyed any shred of credibility the US government had left. While they continue to arm their mostly 'undemocratic' allies, they tell others they can't be armed. While their allies have nukes, they want no one else to have nukes. Well no one should have nukes, starting with the US and Israel, but if I was the leader of Iran watching Israel and the US in Iraq, I's be arming myself to the teeth. I don't want an Iran with nukes anymore than I want an Israel or US with nukes, but Israel and the US have a whole pile of nukes.

Only the naive believe people with thousands of years of their own history and culture will lie down and die while imperial powers seize their countries.

Chavez has done more for Latin America and the Caribbean than US governments for the past 50 years. He is using his oil money to help the poor of our region and we have no problem with him. If Bushco and his oil backers con't like that, we seriously don't give a fugg.