Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

The Qana Atrocity

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (01/01/06 through 01/22/2007) Donate to DU
 
Warren Stupidity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-30-06 09:46 AM
Original message
The Qana Atrocity
The Qana Atrocity

A dead Hezbollah terrorist:

This is what is being done. 51 dead, at last count, in a single IDF attack on a building in the village of Qana in south Lebanon, an attack on a building in which the villagers had taken shelter from the IDF air raids that have now become a fact of life. An attack against a civilian target that took place as there was movement on both sides toward a resolution of the crisis.

This sort of military action is acceptable, says noted jurist and leading member of the Israel Can Do No Wrong faction, Alan Desrhowitz.

"The Israeli army has given well-publicized notice to civilians to leave those areas of southern Lebanon that have been turned into war zones. Those who voluntarily remain behind have become complicit. Some — those who cannot leave on their own — should be counted among the innocent victims."
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-dershowitz22jul22,0,7685210.story

I wonder, Mr. Dershowitz, which category of your 'continuum of civilianality' you will place these latest victims of state terrorism? What a nice phrase of deceit that is, what a prime example of how brilliant intellectuals can become egregiously stupid by their own smug thought jumbles that rationalize their entrenched positions.

But it is unfair to the torture apologist Dershowitz to assume that he will place the dead here in the acceptable military target category, he has not had an opportunity to reflect on his essay attempting to abolish the clear legal standards of the Geneva Conventions in the light of the atrocity at Qana. So let us turn instead to those who have spoken directly of this affront to civilization.

"Prime Minister Ehud Olmert expressed "great sorrow" for the airstrikes but blamed Hezbollah guerrillas for using the area to launch rockets at Israel.
...
Before the airstrike, Olmert told Rice he needed 10-14 days to finish the offensive in Lebanon, according to a senior Israeli government official. The two said they would meet again Sunday evening."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060730/ap_on_re_mi_ea/lebanon_israel

"US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, whose latest Middle East mission was thrown into turmoil by the attack, she was "deeply saddened" by the loss of innocent lives and said it was time to "get to a ceasefire" in Lebanon but stopped short of calling for an immediate halt to hostilities on Sunday.

Israel expressed regret over the civilian deaths and ordered an inquiry but said it had warned residents to leave and pinned the blame on Hezbollah for launching rockets from the area."


http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060730/ts_afp/mideastconflict_060730141359;_ylt=Ah2Osw834QsXWFh2IbxT_78UvioA;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

For the Israeli government and its supporters, Hezbollah is to blame. The war must continue. There will be no ceasefire. Those who are killed in attacks on civilian targets are to blame as they were warned to leave.

When you do wrong you apologize, you as an ethical mature adult. You do not make excuses, you do not insist on pointing out how those you have harmed might have avoided the injury you have inflicted on them. When you do wrong you apologize for what you have done unambiguously, you make amends for your errors, and you examine your own life and actions to understand how and why you have done wrong and take actions to make sure that you will not do this again. Our leaders in this vile conflict are not mature ethical adults, they are spoiled willfully bad children.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
enough Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-30-06 09:53 AM
Response to Original message
1. Dershowitz's mind is an example of how one can be driven mad by
resisting reality too long and too hard.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Tom Yossarian Joad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-30-06 09:54 AM
Response to Original message
2. K&R...
This is a tragedy.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Burried News Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-30-06 09:57 AM
Response to Original message
3. Indeed ...
"When you do wrong you apologize, you as an ethical mature adult. You do not make excuses, you do not insist on pointing out how those you have harmed might have avoided the injury you have inflicted on them. When you do wrong you apologize for what you have done unambiguously, you make amends for your errors, and you examine your own life and actions to understand how and why you have done wrong and take actions to make sure that you will not do this again. Our leaders in this vile conflict are not mature ethical adults, they are spoiled willfully bad children. "
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
enough Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-30-06 10:00 AM
Response to Original message
4. Please read "Criminalizing Civilians" by
Partrick McGreevy from Beirut on Juan Cole's site. Written before the latest atrocity.

http://www.juancole.com/2006/07/criminalizing-civilians-patrick.html

snip>

Look at this logic: since Israel has asked civilians to leave, any that disobeyed have forfeited their status as civilians. Because the United States and its British followers have blocked the resolution to stop the killing, Israel will continue until Hezbollah “is no longer present.” But remember Hezbollah has been redefined to include all those “still in south Lebanon.” This crude logic renders all the people of southern Lebanon hominus sacres.

A serious war crime may be imminent. The responsibility to protect civilians does not end when an invading army asks them to clear out. An Nahar also reported that hundreds of people were trapped in southern villages. Moreover, there is evidence that some who tried to flee north in cars have been targeted.

On his web log informedcomment.com, Juan Cole argued on Monday that since Hezbollah fighters cannot effectively aim their rockets, and since they must understand they are most likely to hit civilians, they are therefore guilty of war crimes themselves. Hezbollah leaders would undoubtedly respond that they are not intentionally targeting civilians. From the beginning of the war, Israeli leaders have justified the deaths of Lebanese civilians by claiming that they also never target civilians; it is simply that Hezbollah fights from civilian areas and there is a lot of collateral damage when they are targeted.

All of this is bad enough, but what may be in store if the frustrated IDF begins to treat all people in south Lebanon as enemies will be a war crime of a different magnitude. In most past wars, the victors had the luxury of telling the story, and prosecuting the war crimes. In this war, the eyes of the world are squarely fixed on what is about to happen. Israel’s powerful alley may be able to prevent prosecutions of its decision makers, but all will know what decision they made. Most importantly the Arab World we know, and will not forget. Israel has a decision to make. '
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Warren Stupidity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-30-06 10:08 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Thanks for the link.
It is clear to me that the IDF has been tasked with inflicting enough damage on Hezbollah to forc it to agree to disadvantagoues terms, and that this is 'mission impossible' again, and as a direct consequence we have Qana.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
enough Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-30-06 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. To clarify the phrase "hominus sacres, " used in the McGreevy article
Edited on Sun Jul-30-06 11:17 AM by enough
One more snip from McGreevy>

In the days before the US-commanded forces unleashed the second siege of Falluja in November 2004, a quarter million women, children and old men fled the city, but males between the ages of 15 and 45 were denied passage. They were essentially criminalized and forced to remain in a zone upon which hell was about to descend. These poor souls were condemned to a legal category that philosopher Giorgio Agamben calls hominus sacres, those without rights who can be killed without it being called the murder of a human, homicide.

snip>


Applies to those in Lebanon too, as long as Israel goes on bombing and killing so many of those who attemp to flee, and destroying the infrastructure that would allow them to flee. By the twisted logic of a "continuum of civilianality," once you have trapped civilians in an area and made it impossible for them to escape, they cease to be "real" civilians, and can be killed with impunity.


(A commenter on Cole's page says the proper latin spelling is "homines sacri.")
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
teryang Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-30-06 10:43 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. The declaration of civil death precedes ethnic cleansing
The Origins of Totalitarianism Hannah Arendt
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BillZBubb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-30-06 10:38 AM
Response to Original message
7. Another day, another Israeli war crime.
What else is new.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Fri Apr 26th 2024, 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (01/01/06 through 01/22/2007) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC