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n2doc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:16 AM
Original message
Churches Putting Town Out of Business
Churches Putting Town Out of Business
Stafford, Texas, has 51 tax-exempt religious institutions and wants no more: `Somebody's got to pay for police, fire and schools.'
By Lianne Hart, Times Staff Writer
July 31, 2006

STAFFORD, Texas — They are not the words one expects to hear from a politician or a Southerner, and Leonard Scarcella is both: "Our city has an excessive number of churches."

Scarcella is mayor of this Houston-area community, which has 51 churches and other religious institutions packed into its 7 square miles. With some 300 undeveloped, potentially revenue-producing acres left in Stafford, officials are scrambling to find a legal way to keep more tax-exempt churches from building here. "With federal laws, you can't just say, 'We're not going to have any more churches,' " Scarcella said. "We respect the Constitution, but 51 of anything is too much." Stafford, population 19,227, is the largest city in Texas without a property tax, and it depends on sales taxes and business fees for revenue. Nonprofits have been attracted by its rapid growth and minimal deed restrictions. "It's thrown everything out of balance, plus providing zero revenue. Somebody's got to pay for police, fire and schools," City Councilman Cecil Willis said.

In 2003, around the time the 45th church settled in, city leaders began looking for a way to slow the pace of construction. Public meetings were held; "we had people of different religions attending, people in their religious garb, Buddhists in their orange gowns and whatever else, talking about this very openly," Scarcella said. An ordinance eventually passed that required those who wanted to build a church — and other public gathering places, such as bowling alleys and community halls — to undergo a rigorous review process and obtain City Council approval.Before the ordinance, "you could pretty much come in here and say, 'I want to open up a church,' and I'd say, 'OK,' " said Gene Bane, the city's director of building permits. In his office is a large map of Stafford that is dotted with round yellow stickers, each dot denoting a church or religious facility. In some parts of town, the dots are so close together they nearly meld into a big yellow glob.

In one quarter-mile section near the city center, parishioners can choose among 17 churches. There are three small churches in the Quail Ridge Plaza shopping center, and three large brick churches on the street behind it. Down the road, the Evangelical Formosan Church is tucked behind a muffler shop. "If you can't find religion in Stafford, Texas, you ain't looking hard enough," Bane said. There are no synagogues in Stafford, but there are religious facilities for Buddhists, Muslims, Chinese Baptists, Filipino Baptists, Spanish-speaking Baptists, and "every other variety of Christian you can imagine," Scarcella said. "As best as we've been able to determine, the overwhelming majority of people who attend here don't even live in Stafford; they're coming from everywhere else," Willis said. Elsewhere includes Houston, about 15 miles northeast, and nearby Sugar Land.

"I don't hate God. I'm not against America and apple pie," Willis said. "We just have to protect what's left for commercial development." Lawyers researching ways to stop church growth here will report back to city leaders in about six weeks, Scarcella said. Lola Onita, assistant pastor at Jesus House Texas, said churches should be allowed to spread unfettered in a country that respects religious freedom. "People need a place to worship and hear the word of God," she said. But Nilda Martinez, who owns a flower shop between two churches, has had enough. "The churches, they're everywhere here," she said. "There are too many; the city should control it. It hurts the city when you don't have enough businesses paying taxes." Willis said he asked the last six applicants why they wanted to build a church in Stafford. "Every one of them said they prayed about it, and God said to come here," he said. "I can't compete with that, so here we are."

http://www.latimes.com/business/taxes/la-na-churches31jul31,0,406070.story?track=mostviewed-homepage
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ixion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
1. gee, sounds pretty profitable to have a church
maybe we should all form churches. I would have no problem not preaching politics, and only talking about living life well. :-)
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CottonBear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:20 AM
Response to Original message
2. Oh, the irony!
Edited on Mon Jul-31-06 11:21 AM by CottonBear
Perhaps the churches should have to form their own volunteer fire departments And why, oh why, is the school system overburdened? I would think tha all of these church people would homeschool or send the kiddies to church school? God forbid that their Christian offspring should attend "government school."
:sarcasm:
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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:22 AM
Response to Original message
3. When all of them there folks get raptured, that city can have all
Edited on Mon Jul-31-06 11:25 AM by Skidmore
the land it wants.
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karlrschneider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:25 AM
Response to Original message
4. Wotta surprise, it's 4 miles from Sugar Land (Bugman's home)
:eyes:
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:31 AM
Response to Original message
5. Here's a Yahoo Yellow Pages List.
All Businesses Showing 1 to 17 of 64

Abiding Life Christian
(281) 565-6405 4133 Bluebonnet Dr
Stafford, TX Map

Abiding Word Baptist Church
(281) 530-5222 12220 Murphy Rd
Stafford, TX Map

All Saints Episcopal Church
(281) 499-9602 Web Site 605 Dulles Ave
Stafford, TX Map

All Saints Lutheran Church
(281) 498-5047 12111 W Bellfort St
Stafford, TX Map

Association Of Vineyard Chrs
(281) 313-8463 Web Site 5115 Grove West Blvd
Stafford, TX Map

Bethel Baptist Church
(281) 499-9148 631 Avenue E
Stafford, TX Map

Bethel Ministry
(281) 261-5688 3015 5th St
Stafford, TX Map

Brighton Church
(281) 988-7755 11925 Southwest Fwy
Stafford, TX Map

Calvary Church
(281) 634-0200 12410 Sugardale Dr
Stafford, TX Map

Congregation Beth Messiah
(713) 271-5757 10555 W Airport Blvd
Stafford, TX Map

Cornerstone Community Bible
(281) 313-8555 Web Site 10701 Corporate Dr # 172
Stafford, TX Map

Debra Alderman Ministries
(281) 499-3467 910 Brand Ln
Stafford, TX Map

East Wind Bapt Chr & Christian
(281) 208-2734 2503 S Main St # P
Stafford, TX Map

East Wind Missionary Baptist
(281) 499-9196
Stafford, TX Map

El Shaddai Ministries
(281) 403-3963 732 Murphy Rd
Stafford, TX Map

Emmanuel Pentecostal Church
(281) 499-3102 437 Murphy Rd
Stafford, TX Map

Episcopal Church Of Advent
(281) 499-9602 605 Dulles Ave
Stafford, TX Map

Evangel United Chr Of Christ
(281) 261-6206 13000 Murphy Rd # 116
Stafford, TX Map

Family Worship Ctr
(281) 499-0551 910 Brand Ln
Stafford, TX Map

Fellowship Of Praise
(281) 277-8080 4100 Greenbriar Dr # 250
Stafford, TX Map

First Presbyterian Church
(281) 240-3196 502 Eldridge Rd
Stafford, TX Map

Full Gospel Christian Church
(281) 499-1876 3135 5th St
Stafford, TX Map

Gardner Ronald J
(281) 261-7945
Stafford, TX Map

Good Shepherd Apostolic Church
(281) 491-5557 4643 S Main St
Stafford, TX Map

Graceland Community Church
(281) 261-0495 869 Dulles Ave
Stafford, TX Map

Greater Harvest Church
(281) 208-5282 435 Murphy Rd
Stafford, TX Map

Greater Houston Church
(832) 328-1720 Web Site 10563 W Airport Blvd
Stafford, TX Map

Heal Our Land Intl Church
(281) 499-7190 2503 S Main St
Stafford, TX Map

Houston International Chr
(832) 328-1724 10563 W Airport Blvd
Stafford, TX Map

Houston Knanaya Catholic Comm
(281) 208-4527 2210 Staffordshire Rd
Stafford, TX Map

Immanuel Marthoma Church
(281) 561-9147 10212 Fountaingate Dr
Stafford, TX Map

Immanuel Marthoma Church
(281) 879-9595 12803 Sugar Ridge Blvd
Stafford, TX Map

International Bible Church
(281) 568-5007 12955 Stafford Rd
Stafford, TX Map

International Buddhist Progess
(281) 495-3100 12606 Jebbia Ln
Stafford, TX Map

Jehovahs Witnesses
(281) 499-4295 114 Staffordshire Rd
Stafford, TX Map

La Viden Cristo
(281) 261-0545 2735 5th St
Stafford, TX Map

Living Word Faith Ctr
(281) 240-2371 12821 Capricorn St
Stafford, TX Map

New Hope Baptist Church
(281) 499-7931 1030 Staffordshire Rd # A
Stafford, TX Map

New Life Church Southwest
(281) 403-9988 335 Avenue E
Stafford, TX Map

New Revelation Church
(281) 564-1942 12240 Murphy Rd
Stafford, TX Map

Philippine Trinity Baptist Chr
(281) 313-4373 4808 Sugar Grove Blvd
Stafford, TX Map

Pro Christ World Ministries
(281) 575-8001 12111 W Bellfort St
Stafford, TX Map

Rccg Dominion Chapel
(281) 208-3510 1203 Craven Rd
Stafford, TX Map

Rccg Jesus House
(281) 208-1160 4307 S Main St
Stafford, TX Map

Royal Family Worship Ctr
(281) 313-5104 4611 S Main St
Stafford, TX Map

Royal Family Worship Ctr
(281) 313-5104 1302 Raintree Cir
Stafford, TX Map

Second Mile Mission Ctr
(281) 261-9199 504 Murphy Rd # I
Stafford, TX Map

Southwest Chinese Baptist Chr
(281) 495-1511 Web Site 12525 Sugar Ridge Blvd
Stafford, TX Map

Southwest Church Of God
(281) 499-9600 235 Avenue E
Stafford, TX Map

Spanish Bible Chapel
(281) 499-3605 10408 Cash Rd
Stafford, TX Map

St George Mission
(281) 240-4845 4111 Greenbriar Dr
Stafford, TX Map

St John's Kso Church
(281) 499-1204 802 Brand Ln
Stafford, TX Map

St Joseph Syro Malabar Church
(281) 261-7700 211 Present St
Stafford, TX Map

St Jude Shrine Roman Catholic
(281) 499-1813 3101 Highway 90a
Stafford, TX Map

St Thomas Evangelical Church
(281) 568-5932 10502 Altonbury
Stafford, TX Map

St Thomas Kerala Catholic
(281) 499-7494 1622 Staffordshire Rd
Stafford, TX Map

Stafford Church Of Christ
(281) 499-2507 435 Fm 1092 Rd # J
Stafford, TX Map

Sugar Grove Church Of Christ
(281) 530-9651 Web Site 11600 W Airport Blvd
Stafford, TX Map

Sugar Land Vineyard Flsp
(281) 491-4757 Web Site 5015 Grove West Blvd
Stafford, TX Map

Sugarland Chinese Baptist Chr
(281) 499-1763 10408 Cash Rd
Stafford, TX Map

Thoreau Unitarian Universalist
(281) 277-8882 Web Site 3945 Greenbriar Dr # D
Stafford, TX Map

Vineyard Christian Fellowship
(281) 240-8463 5015 Grove West Blvd
Stafford, TX Map

West Side Baptist Church
(281) 499-0440 211 Brand Ln
Stafford, TX Map

Willowridge Baptist Church
(281) 499-8003 2803 S Main St
Stafford, TX Map


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varkam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
6. It's pretty obvious, to me.
Willis said he asked the last six applicants why they wanted to build a church in Stafford. "Every one of them said they prayed about it, and God said to come here," he said. "I can't compete with that, so here we are."

God doesn't want Stafford, Texas to have a police or fire department. :D
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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. Maybe the applicants should be told just that..
"Sure you can have a church. If it burns down, there will be no one to come put out the fire and if it is burglarized, tough toenails."
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China_cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #6
16. Or street signs or schools or
any of those troublesome things cities usually have.

Maybe they could do it the way several small communities here in SC do it...you pay for a subscription to fire service (but Staford could add in police service, etc). It's not a tax, you aren't required to pay it. But if your building catches fire and you haven't, it burns. They'll try to save lives, but not the property.

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tyedyeto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. We have that here... subscription fire dept.
But if they come to fight a fire and you didn't subscribe, they bill you for all costs.
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Fuzz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 01:35 PM
Response to Reply #6
18. I knew a guy as a kid (my dad's a preacher)
who had a career as a singing christian dude with his family. He was at our house having dinner one time and was explaining to us how God had told him where to settle down and minister, Florida or Hawaii.

After he left I asked my father, not really expecting an answer, "Don't you find it weird that the two places he mentioned have warm climates?"

I was a smartass even back then. :)
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fasttense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:32 AM
Response to Original message
7. Sounds to me like it's time to use eminent domain laws in the city
They need to get back some of that non-tax paying land and turn it over to some tax-paying businesses. Eminent domain was put in their hands by god and the dancing supremes for just this reason. :sarcasm:
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happyslug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #7
15. Read the Article, there are NO PROPERTY TAXES.
Thus the tex exempt status of the Churches does NOT come into play. You can't be exempt from a tax that doesn't exist.

The problem sounds to me is that this suburb had reached the limit of its land and now finds itself in need of more revenue but no land for new businesses to move onto. If the Churches did not exist you would have 51 more pieces of property for business to move onto. Thus the Church Issue sounds more like an excuse of why the City needs to pass a property tax more than the problem with to many churches. The city is now to big to be a tax free city and blaming everyone but that fact they are to big to be a tax free city.
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:33 AM
Response to Original message
8. Welfare queen churches
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TlalocW Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
10. Sounds like Tulsa
Except we have plent of non-church businesses, but, good grief, it's impossible to travel more than 2 blocks without seeing a church - whether it's a well-established one with a typical church appearance, or it's a storefront one set up by another graduate of Oral Roberts University or freakin' Rhema Bible College in Tulsa-suburb Broken Arrow.

And, oh, are they stingy - especially the big ones. I do magic and balloon twisting on the side, and they always want a special price for them. They expect free stuff from the magic stores where I buy my equipment too because they're doing the Lord's work, which doesn't fly.

When contacted for a job, I normally tell them, "I have a special church fee of X dollars an hour." That keeps them from trying to dicker, and that X amount is $25 higher than my normal fee. :)

TlalocW
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Generic Other Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
11. Sounds like kudzu
Hahahahaha

Must be a tax scam. Or Stafford is the land of milk and honey.
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Norquist Nemesis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
12. But, but, but...this is Grover's DREAM!!
No taxes! The (city) government is swiling in the drain of the bathtub! eeeeeeee haaaaaaawwwwwww!
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
13. I predict
A "natural" MIHOP disaster will befall Stafford, and all these churches will get mucho dinero from the govt to relocate.
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BeTheChange Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. The churches should start providing grants and donations
to the organizations that are being overburdened. A community tithe.


It's a shame that they don't already. :(
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valerief Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #14
17. That'll happen when Hell freezes over. n/t
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happyslug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #14
21. In a city with no property taxes??????
Edited on Mon Jul-31-06 03:34 PM by happyslug
In the article it CLEARLY states that this city is BOOMING for it is the ONLY city in Texas without property taxes. I can see asking the Churches to pay a fee in place of property taxes, but this is a property tax free city.

The problem is the city needs to pass a property tax and does not want to, it is blaming the Churches for they don't vote and less lilly to lobby than the businesses in the City. Right now the Churches are paying the same taxes as if they were private home owners. If the churches should pay a fee why not private home owners? Remember NEITHER is paying taxes except if they buy something and pay the local sales tax.

I am sorry, I can NOT sympathize with this city, they have a good way to solve the problem, pass a property tax then and only then can they ask these churches to pay a fee in place of the property tax the property would have to pay if it was privately owned.
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BeTheChange Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:39 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. True..
I believe the church owes the community more then the individual tho.. but that can be legislated. The property tax must be levied of course you are right. It's a no brainer.
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earth mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
20. With the * cabal passing out OUR tax money to churches...
sounds like churches have quite the scam going these days. Government help plus donations from their victims-er-congregations. No wonder most church leaders live in McMansions and drive luxury cars. :eyes:

Meanwhile anyone on welfare can go to Hell! :sarcasm:

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