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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:11 PM
Original message
Hagel has called for * to demand a ceasefire. CNN
On the Senate floor today. Where are Dem leaders? Lining up for more war.
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Beelzebud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:12 PM
Response to Original message
1. Our Dems in Washington are a fucking joke at this point.
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City Lights Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #1
15. I'll second that!
Edited on Mon Jul-31-06 03:15 PM by No Surrender
They make me sick!

edited for typo
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IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:21 PM
Response to Reply #1
19. Dems Unite In Calling for a pullout from Iraq by End of Year...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2426076

They *should* also be calling for an immediate ceasefire in Lebanon and Gaza AND they are not "a fucking joke".

At this point - less than 100 days from an election - harsh criticisms of Dems will take them and us all in the wrong direction, IMO.

:kick:
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Beelzebud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. The reason they are a fucking joke is simple.
They don't speak out until it is SAFE.

They supported our invasion of Iraq, and only opposed it when it was politically safe to do so.

They support Israel blindly, because they view it politically safe.

THEY NEED TO TAKE A STAND AND STOP LETTING FOCUS GROUPS STEER THEM INTO "SAFE" TERRITORY.

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furman Donating Member (363 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #1
24. This is not a Democrat/Republican issue
it's a lot more complicated.
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marmar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:15 PM
Response to Original message
2. If I were Hagel, I'd watch my cup of coffee very closely...
There might be some leftover anthrax sitting around Cheney's office.
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BOSSHOG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:16 PM
Response to Original message
3. Conservative logic
bush says he won't call for a ceasefire because Hezbollah might not stop shooting. I don't have a dog in this fight but I am:

- Pro cease fire
- Pro truce
- Pro negotiation

I must be an insane liberal veteran.
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gordianot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:22 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. In dealing with Bush logic in any form, deductive inductive does not work.
Edited on Mon Jul-31-06 02:24 PM by gordianot
Logic works best in reality not in the dream world Bush occupies.
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JackNewtown Donating Member (703 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:20 PM
Response to Original message
4. Why can't any major Dem do the same?????????
At least Hagel is stepping up to the plate. Justice is justice, Hagel must be applauded for this regardless of his politicial affiliation. The 44 Dems in the Senate, the Dem presidential contenders, are doing what is politically good for them, not what is right on this issue.
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QuestionAll... Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:40 PM
Response to Reply #4
23. smells a bit too much like good cop bad cop to me
Hagel is being allowed to prime up for '08 - I don't think he really believes a word he himself says. and neither should we.
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madinmaryland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:22 PM
Response to Original message
6. WWJD?? What would Joementum do?
I doubt whether it would include a cease fire.

:grr:
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JackNewtown Donating Member (703 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:43 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. Why single Liberman out?
Every other Dem Senator, Dem presidential contender is supporting Bush/Olmert on this as well, even some progressive icons such as Feingold.
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B Calm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 05:16 AM
Response to Reply #9
46. because he's the leader of the DLC...
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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:36 PM
Response to Original message
7. Just saw Hagel's statement and it was strong indeed.
Said that we cannot just support Israel at the expense of our relations with the Arab nations in the region. That Lebanon was a nation that was our friend and just letting the sickening destruction go on was not an option. Demanded that * call for a ceasefire NOW.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:39 PM
Response to Original message
8. I'm with him
and apparently not with the democratic members and bush.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:47 PM
Response to Original message
10. It's obvious
to me world leadership is lacking in the US in both parties. Time for someone in the EU to step up in the UN.
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Beelzebud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
11. If Dems wait much longer the Repukes will become the anti-war party...
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marmar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:27 PM
Response to Reply #11
20. The ultimate Rovian feat...
:eyes:
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 02:53 PM
Response to Original message
12. He's joining the chorus of Dems demanding peace....oh, wait.
It's pretty goddam pathetic when the alleged "progressives" back aggressive war and a Republican speaks for peace.
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Little Star Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:01 PM
Response to Original message
13. K&R, plus.......
I've said it before he is the dark horse candidate on the repug side. Watch out for him, he seems to know what many undecideds want.
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tbyg52 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #13
47. He may be right on this, but...
Don't forget he is the guy who did not disclose his former part ownership of a voting machine company, and that he won ("won"?) on machines from that company.
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JackNewtown Donating Member (703 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:13 PM
Response to Original message
14. Read Hagel's statement, very strong and 100% right
http://hagel.senate.gov/index.cfm?FuseAction=PressReleases.Detail&PressRelease_id=219463&Month=7&Year=2006


Hagel Floor Statement on the Current Situation in the Middle East

July 31st, 2006 - WASHINGTON, D.C. - U.S. Senator Chuck Hagel (R-NE) delivered the following statement on the Senate floor today regarding the current situation in the Middle East:

“Mr. President, The Middle East is a region in crisis. After three weeks of escalating and continuing violence, the potential for wider regional conflict becomes more real each day. The hatred in the Middle East is being driven deeper and deeper into the fabric of the region...which will make any lasting and sustained peace effort very difficult to achieve. How do we realistically believe that a continuation of the systematic destruction of an American friend, the country and people of Lebanon, is going to enhance America’s image and give us the trust and credibility to lead a lasting and sustained peace effort in the Middle East? The sickening slaughter on both sides must end now. President Bush must call for an immediate cease fire. This madness must stop.

The Middle East today is more combustible and complex than it has ever been. Uncertain popular support for regime legitimacy continues to weaken governments of the Middle East. Economic stagnation, persistent unemployment, deepening despair and wider unrest enhance the ability of terrorists to recruit and succeed. An Iran with nuclear weapons raises the specter of broader proliferation and a fundamental strategic realignment in the region, creating more regional instability.

America’s approach to the Middle East must be consistent and sustained, and must understand the history, interests and perspectives of our regional friends and allies.

The United States will remain committed to defending Israel. Our relationship with Israel is a special and historic one. But, it need not and cannot be at the expense of our Arab and Muslim relationships. That is an irresponsible and dangerous false choice. Achieving a lasting resolution to the Arab-Israeli conflict is as much in Israel’s interest as any other country in the world.

Unending war will continually drain Israel of its human capital, resources, and energy as it fights for its survival. The United States and Israel must understand that it is not in their long-term interests to allow themselves to become isolated in the Middle East and the world. Neither can allow themselves to drift into an “us against the world” global optic or zero-sum game. That would marginalize America’s global leadership, trust and influence...further isolate Israel...and prove to be disastrous for both countries as well as the region.

It is in Israel’s interest, as much as ours, that the United States be seen by all states in the Middle East as fair. This is the currency of trust.

The world has rightly condemned the despicable actions of Hezbollah and Hamas terrorists who attacked Israel and kidnapped Israeli soldiers. Israel has the undeniable right to defend itself against aggression. This is the right of all states.

Hezbollah is a threat to Israel, to Lebanon and to all who strive for lasting peace in the Middle East.

However, military action alone will not destroy Hezbollah or Hamas. Extended military action is tearing Lebanon apart, killing innocent civilians, destroying its economy and infrastructure, creating a humanitarian disaster, further weakening Lebanon’s fragile democratic government, strengthening popular Muslim and Arab support for Hezbollah, and deepening hatred of Israel across the Middle East. The pursuit of tactical military victories at the expense of the core strategic objective of Arab-Israeli peace is a hollow victory. The war against Hezbollah and Hamas will not be won on the battlefield.

To achieve a strategic shift in the conditions for Middle East peace, the United States must use the global condemnation of terrorist acts as the basis for substantive change. For a lasting and popularly supported resolution, only a strong Lebanese government and a strong Lebanese army, backed by the international community, can rid Lebanon of these corrosive militias and terrorist organizations.

President Bush and Secretary Rice must become and remain deeply engaged in the Middle East. Only U.S. leadership can build a consensus of purpose among our regional and international partners. To lead and sustain U.S. engagement, the President should appoint a statesman of global stature, experience and ability to serve as his personal envoy to the region who would report directly to President, and be empowered with the authority to speak and act for the President. Former Secretaries of State Baker and Powell fit this profile.

The President must publicly decry the slaughter and work toward an immediate cease fire. The UN Security Council should urgently adopt a new binding resolution that provides a comprehensive political, security and economic framework for Lebanon, Israel and region – a framework that begins with the immediate cessation of violence. I strongly support the deployment of a robust international force along the Israel-Lebanon border to facilitate a steady deployment of a strengthened Lebanese Army into southern Lebanon to eventually assume responsibility for security and the rule of law.

America must listen carefully to its friends and partners in the region. Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Jordan and others – countries that understand the Middle East far better than we do – must commit to help resolve today’s crisis and be active partners in helping realize the already agreed-upon two-state solution.

The core of all challenges in the Middle East remains the underlying Arab-Israeli conflict. The failure to address this root cause will allow Hezbollah, Hamas and other terrorists to continue to sustain popular Muslim and Arab support – a dynamic that continues to undermine America’s standing in the region, and the governments of Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and others – whose support is critical for any Middle East resolution.

The United States should engage our Middle East and international partners to revive the Beirut Declaration, or some version of it, proposed by King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia and adopted unanimously by the Arab League in March 2002. In this historic initiative, the Arab world recognized Israel’s right to exist and sought to establish a path toward a two-state solution and broader Arab-Israeli peace. Even though Israel could not accept it as written, it represented a very significant “starting point” document initiated by Arab countries. Today, we need a new Beirut Declaration-type initiative. We squandered the last one.

The concept and intent of the 2002 Beirut Declaration is as relevant today as it was in 2002. An Arab-initiated Beirut-type declaration would re-invest regional Arab states with a stake in achieving progress toward Israeli-Palestinian peace. This type of initiative would offer a positive alternative vision for Arab populations to the ideology and goals of Islamic militants. The United States must explore this approach as part of its diplomatic engagement in the Middle East.

Lasting peace in the Middle East, and stability and security for Israel will come only from a regionally-oriented political settlement.

Former American Middle East Envoy Dennis Ross once observed that in the Middle East a process is necessary because process absorbs events...without a process, events become crises. He was right. Look at where we are today in the Middle East with no process. Crisis diplomacy is no substitute for sustained, day-to-day engagement.

America’s approach to Syria and Iran is inextricably tied to Middle East peace. Whether or not they were directly involved in the latest Hezbollah and Hamas aggression in Israel, both countries exert influence in the region in ways that undermine stability and security. As we work with our friends and allies to deny Syria and Iran any opportunity to further corrode the situation in Lebanon and the Palestinian territories, both Damascus and Tehran must hear from America directly.

As John McLaughlin, the former Deputy Director of Central Intelligence recently wrote in the Washington Post,

“Even superpowers have to talk to bad guys. The absence of a diplomatic relationship with Iran and the deterioration of the one with Syria -- two countries that bear enormous responsibility for the current crisis -- leave the United States with fewer options and levers than might otherwise have been the case. Distasteful as it might have been to have or to maintain open and normal relations with such states, the absence of such relations ensures that we will have more blind spots than we can afford and that we will have to deal through surrogates on issues of vital importance to the United States.

Ultimately, the United States will need to engage Iran and Syria with an agenda open to all areas of agreement and disagreement. For this dialogue to have any meaning or possible lasting relevance, it should encompass the full agenda of issues.

There is very little good news coming out of Iraq today. Increasingly vicious sectarian violence continues to propel Iraq toward civil war. The U.S. announcement last week to send additional U.S. troops and military police back into Baghdad reverses last month’s decision to have Iraqi forces take the lead in Baghdad...and represents a dramatic set back for the U.S and the Iraqi Government. The Iraqi Government has limited ability to enforce the rule of law in Iraq, especially in Baghdad. Green Zone politics appear to have little bearing or relation to the realities of the rest of Iraq.

The Iraqis will continue to face difficult choices over the future of their country. The day-to-day responsibilities of governing and security will soon have to be assumed by Iraqis. This is not about setting a timeline. This is about understanding the implications of the forces of reality. This reality is being determined by Iraqis – not Americans. America is bogged down in Iraq and this is limiting our diplomatic and military options. The longer America remains in Iraq in its current capacity, the deeper the damage to our force structure – particularly the U.S. Army. And it will continue to place more limitations on an already dangerously over-extended force structure that will further limit our options and public support.

The Middle East crisis represents a moment of great danger, but it is also an opportunity. Crisis focuses the minds of leaders and the attention of nations. The Middle East need not be a region forever captive to the fire of war and historical hatred. It can avoid this fate if the United States pursues sustained and engaged leadership worthy of our history, purpose, and power. America cannot fix every problem in the world – nor should it try. But we must get the big issues and important relationships right and concentrate on those. We know that without engaged and active American leadership the world is more dangerous. The United States must focus all of its leadership and resources on ending this madness in the Middle East— now!”
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Strelnikov_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:16 PM
Response to Original message
16. Hate To Say It, But Hagel Is The Presidential Dark Horse
Edited on Mon Jul-31-06 03:18 PM by loindelrio
I would be watching.

I am afraid he is going to come out and grab McCain's 'straight-talk' cred. And rightfully so, as he has repeatedly called Chimpco on the carpet re: foreign policy.

He is 'Brand Republican' that has differentiated himself from the far-right neo-con element, thus allowing the more moderate/centrist elements to stay with their 'brand' (team, etc.).

The big question is whether the GOP Taliban base will 'McCain' him, and if the GOP Oligarchy will allow him to run.

One plus of a Hagel candidacy, though, is we would get to see McCain break down (ie Joementum) in living color at some point during the primaries.
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malaise Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:18 PM
Response to Original message
17. The Dems should hang
Edited on Mon Jul-31-06 03:19 PM by malaise
their heads in shame. Still Hagel did not deal with proportionality and that was extremely vulgar. To suggest that their is 'slaughter' on both side is an outright lie.
Add.
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:19 PM
Response to Original message
18. Go Chuck. He's been against that 'other' war too.
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izzie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 03:28 PM
Response to Original message
21. Good luck Chuck, as I do not think one questions Bush
When you have the faith your right , reason will not help
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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 04:14 PM
Response to Original message
25. I wonder why he hasn't called for a cease fire in Iraq yet?
I suspect this is all for show.

Don
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4nic8em Donating Member (382 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
26. Oh my goodness gracious...
The Hagelmeister has done gone and turned into a democrat!!! What a self serving lying sack of Bush loving horseshit...this bastard is saying all the right things...but for all the wrong reasons. Must resist the temptation to believe the sincerity of this neonut fundie.
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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. Whatever his motives, he's dead right on this one.
Doesn't mean I'd vote for him, but he's right on this one.

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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 04:49 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. Being right doesn't mean he is not asshole Republican pandering for votes
One doesn't cancel out the other.

Don
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JackNewtown Donating Member (703 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. Pandering by votes by opposing Israel?
Edited on Mon Jul-31-06 04:55 PM by JackNewtown
If calling for a cease-fire was a politically wise move why are none of the other 99 Senators following suit? They all know where the political advantage on this lies. That is why they are ALL silent. Obviously, not all of them agree with Bush's position but politically they would lose if they defied Bush/Olmert on this.

Hagel has long been one of the few pro-peace Senators on Israel/Palestine and his feelings logically extend to this.
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w4rma Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 05:08 PM
Response to Reply #29
32. As a Republican and someone who owns voting machine companies
He's pretty secure in whatever he says. Big media won't jump on him like they would a Dem.

And in the long term it's a brilliant political move. He wants to run for the Repug nomination for Pres.
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JackNewtown Donating Member (703 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 12:36 AM
Response to Reply #32
36. Yes, and how does this help him politically?
It is no coincidence that the other 99 Senators have not called for a cease-fire. They know where the the political advantage on this conflict is, especially in the Republican Party, which has plenty of rapture zealots. Do you think all 99 actually believe in the Bush/Olmert/Netanyahu strategy?

Hagel showed some conscience and spine on this IMO. Too bad no Democratic Senator or presidential contender can do the same. I highly doubt all 44 Dem Senators and all of the 6-8 prez contenders all agree with Bush/Olmert/Netanyahu on this.
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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 04:53 PM
Response to Reply #28
30. Well we've got more than a few
Edited on Mon Jul-31-06 04:54 PM by Skidmore
asshole Dems pandering for votes right now by supporting this mess, too. In the bigger world, everything gets cancelled out. That's why nothing is moving forward and everything is regressing. What does conservative mean? Do nothing. This is where doing nothing and nodding in assent to doing nothing gets us.
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JackNewtown Donating Member (703 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 04:55 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. With Hillary leading the way! nt
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oasis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 05:13 AM
Response to Reply #31
45. All Hillary has to do is snap her fingers, and Bush demands a ceasefire.
I almost forgot how easy it was. :think:
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PaDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 05:13 PM
Response to Reply #28
34. huh???
I'm by no means a fan of Chuck Hagel, but how is suggesting that our loyalty to Israel regardless of their actions may be hurting us in the Arab world pandering for votes? Closer to political suicide I'd say. I tip my hat to Hagel on this one, because he's correct and he's standing alone in the corner.
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JackNewtown Donating Member (703 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #34
37. I agree nt
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blues90 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 05:13 PM
Response to Original message
33. It doesn't matter
If any of these senators where serious and cared about the future of this world and any of the problems then instead of standing there bellowing out a few easy to say words they would toss out all the trash issues they know is a complete waste of time like flag burning and get their fool heads together and agree for once to do something about bush and all this killing . No instead one pops up his head and rants and really does nothing other than that . It is all bull shit .
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mom cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-31-06 06:26 PM
Response to Original message
35. I would support a Hagel - Kucinich ticket in a heartbeat.
:toast: to the peacemakers :toast:
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GAPeace Donating Member (314 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 12:38 AM
Response to Original message
38. OH GOD I agree more with a Republican than a Democrat
How sad has this country become?
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cynatnite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 12:46 AM
Response to Original message
39. I'm very wary of Hagel
He's saying all the right words that appeal to many of us, but his voting record scares the jeebus out of me.

I advise checking him out more thoroughly before jumping on any bandwagon he might be on. You never know who you might be riding with.
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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 03:12 AM
Response to Reply #39
40. Who said anything about voting for the man?
I don't understand these types of responses. He is saying what needs to be said, as our Dem leaders should be doing. This issue, as far as I'm concerned, should not be part of a political game because it is costing lives--just like the war in Iraq. Truth needs to be spoken, and I don't care who starts that conversation. It needs to occur.
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cynatnite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 04:31 AM
Response to Reply #40
43. Chuck Hagel says we need a military draft...
I knew I read something about this a long time ago. It took some hunting, but here it is:

WASHINGTON, D.C. -- Due to the deteriorating security in Iraq, the United States may be forced to reintroduce the military draft, a senior Republican lawmaker said Tuesday.

Nebraska Senator Chuck Hagel told a Senate Foreign Relations Committee hearing on post-occupation Iraq that there isn't an American that doesn't understand what the troops are engaged in Iraq and what the prospects are for the future.

"Why shouldn't we ask our citizens to bear some responsibility and pay some price," he said.

http://www.nbc13.com/news/3026352/detail.html

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Skidmore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 04:56 AM
Response to Reply #43
44. What does this have to do with anything I've said?
All I've posted is that Hagel is right about the need for a ceasefire and for a policy of an evenhanded peace process. That does not necessarily make me a "fan" of his (referencing your other thread). It is a comment of agreement only combined with a statement that I am extremely disappointed with Democratic leadership for not having made a similar statement sooner.
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JackNewtown Donating Member (703 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 03:38 AM
Response to Reply #39
42. His record on Israel-Palestine is pro-peace
Edited on Tue Aug-01-06 03:39 AM by JackNewtown
Unlike that of many others, such as AIPAC's favorite, Hillary...

Those who are pro-peace on I/P are extending that to the current conflict, while the cheerleaders for Jerusalem continue their usual fare on this.
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Aug-01-06 03:14 AM
Response to Original message
41. Chucks got a lot of power.
Notice how it is always Chuck throwing down with Bush. Wants to beat Jeb in 2008.
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