Teens Defend Polygamy at Salt Lake Rally

[spindrifter]

Detroit Free Press
Aug 19, 8:53 PM EDT

By JENNIFER DOBNER
Associated Press Writer

SALT LAKE CITY (AP) -- Calling their lives blessed, more than a dozen young women and girls from polygamist families in Utah spoke at a rally Saturday, calling for a change in state laws and the right to live the life and religion they choose.

"Because of our beliefs, many of our people have been incarcerated and had their basic human rights stripped of them, namely life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness," said a 19-year-old identified only as Tyler. "I didn't come here today to ask for your permission to live my beliefs. I shouldn't have to."

Polygamy is banned in the Utah Constitution and is a felony offense. The rally was unusual because those who practice polygamy typically try to live under the radar.

It drew about 250 supporters to City Hall, said Mary Batchelor, co-founder of Principle Voices of Polygamy, which helped organize the event.

<more>

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/P/POLYGAMY_RALLY?SITE=MIDTF&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

[Rabrrrrrr]

1. I gotta say it, I see no logical reason to ban polygamy

Though I think it would be fair to the health insurance companies and employers to say that a person can only one other person as a dependant in terms of providing extra coverage.

But, hell, let people whoever and how many other people they want.

Who cares? No one should.

All the power to ya if you can find six wives, or three husbands, or two wives and four husbands three of whom are married to seven other people...

No skin off my back.

[Yupster]

26. You're right of course Rabrrrr

The idea of the state telling people who they can and can't marry is pretty distasteful, assuming everyone involved is an adult.

Do you want to enforce age requirements? Well every state already has an age limit for marriage so that's already taken care of.

This is just a case of people being against something because it seems strange to them.

Then there are the comments from people who say they'd never be part of a polygymist marriage. Well good, that's easy to handle. If you don't want to do it, then don't. Just don't dictate your tastes onto everyone else.

To me this issue is pretty clear.

[LanternWaste]

47. Just out of sincere curiosity...

Just out of sincere curiosity, what is the precise and relevant moral difference between the state determining the age of consent (which you appear to support) and the state determining the definition of marriage (which you appear not to support)?

[kiahzero]

58. Determining the age of consent prevents exploitation.

Marrying a 13 year old as a 30 year old is almost certainly exploitive. Having two spouses is not inherantly exploitive.

[Yupster]

70. The difference to me would be that

everyone agrees that children should not make adult decisions.

The question then becomes when is a child an adult which is arguable.

The idea of two adults or three adults making decisions for themselves is very different to me.

[daleo]

27. I think insurance, etc. is the crux of the matter

Any number of people can live together, and have all the sexual relationships they want. I don't know of any law against that (although some states may have laws on the books that aren't enforced). But it is precisely those legal aspects, like naming dependents and beneficiaries that would be problematic. There would also be very serious issues about child support and spousal support, should people leave a multiple legal relationship like this.

If wife 3 leaves, can she take any children that she bore? What if that child doesn't want to leave his other mothers? Same for husband 3 if he leaves. Does he have to pay child support, and if so for only his own biological children or for others too? If a man with 3 wives dies, who gets the insurance money? Who gets widow's benefits? Who gets to be on his health care benefits? The same goes for a woman with three husbands.

Then there is the problem of the rich and powerful dominating the mating pool. Right now, and in the foreseeable future, that would usually be rich men. I just don't know if a society that valued womens' rights could accommodate polygamy.

I think a case can be made for a limit on the number of marriage partners and a limit on their ages, without necessarily disallowing same sex marriage. Society wouldn't be infringing on the right of who a person can marry, just who they can marry at a given time. Yes, you can marry John A or Ellen B, but not while you are still married to somebody else.

[Scout1071]

49. My only problem is when 13, 14, 15 yr old girls are forced to marry

men much older than them. Sick, and frankly, I think it's pedophilia. So many of these young women are literally brain washed and are not exposed to any part of the world except for their community for their entire lives.

Other than that, I have no problem with consenting adults in a multi-person marriage.

I actually have a cousin that lived with a married couple for more than 25 years. She is an attorney and was kind of the "intellectual" and money-making woman in the family and the other woman had 3 kids and home schooled them. The husband had 2 very different women. This worked for more than 25 years, but very bitterly fell apart in the end. My cousin would never really confirm what their status was, but it was clear to the family that they were a "three-some." Oh well. Other than that aspect, I deeply respect my cousin, so I learned to be a little open-minded about the whole thing.

On a side, my cousin married another man this year and seems happier than I have ever seen her.

[Rabrrrrrr]

51. That has nothing to do with polygamy, though. There's no reason

even to mention it in the context of this thread.

That goes under the category of "child abuse", not polygamy.

And yes, there are some polygamists who do that; but that doesn't make it part of polygamy any more than some military people involved in sexual harassment means that one has to be a harasser to be in the military.

[Scout1071]

55. Like it or not, that is the image most people have when you discuss

polygamy. And it is the reason that so many people are anti-polygamy. So, they are not all that easy to separate in the larger discussion of the subject. It's like discussing dog bites - people are going to bring up pit bulls because the two are part of the public conscience.

[Rabrrrrrr]

68. Yes, but just because people are going to bring their stupidity

to the discussion doesn't mean that it should be allowed, tolerated, or go uncorrected.

[undeterred]

63. Those mormons who still practice polygamy typically marry

young female teenagers.

So, we can talk about a theoretical polygamy among consenting adults or the actual practice of a man marrying a steady stream of underage girls because his religion commands it. I think young teenage girls deserve to be protected from this by the state.

[Rabrrrrrr]

67. Considering that young girls are already protected by the state,

as to age of consent to be married, the possibility of underage girls being married in a polygamous situation is a moot point, and thus irrelevant to the discussion, and not worth bringing up.

The only possibility would be the possibility of illegal marriage taking place, but, since that is already happening, that issue, too, is a moot issue and not related to the question of whether polygamy should be legal.

[undeterred]

69. can I sit in the corner and wait for your scraps, o thou righteous man?

:sarcasm:

[Rabrrrrrr]

74. That bit of sarcasm doesn't help the conversation at all.

Why call me righteous? Even in sarcasm? It doesn't make sense. I've said nothing that could or could not be construed as "righteous", not even in a sarcastic way.

I'm totally fucking confused.

Perhaps if you addressed the points I made, that will help more than making obscure sarcastic points that have no handle on which to strap them. Or else I'm just dense, and missing something hilariously sarcastic here. That could be, too.

:shrug:

[Donald Ian Rankin]

66. Nothing *directly* to do with polygamy.

:-Not all polygamy involves undue pressure being placed on young women to marry much older men.

:-In principle there is no reason why any polygamy should involve it.

:-In practice, it's a hallmark of most polygamous cultures, to a considerably greater extent than of current American culture.

:-There is sufficient correlation that it is a factor that does need to be taken into account when discussing polygamy.

:-In those cases where it is happening, it is the undue pressure, not the polygamy itself, that is immoral.

[OzarkDem]

76. Those teens in the story are "wives"

of older men. That is how polygamy is practiced in the conservative Mormon faith - young girls, older men and often involving incest.

[Rabrrrrrr]

82. Yes, you are correct.

:applause:

You are, in fact, entirely correct. That's how it is practiced in the conservative Mormon faith.

Well done!

[helderheid]

57. That's my only problem with it too.

[OzarkDem]

75. Except that it sanctions rape, child molestation and kidnapping

Mormons who practice polygamy do so by choosing their "wives" from young girls about age 14 or 15. These girls have been raised all their lives in a religion that teaches them that having sex with older men and bearing children at an early age is "what God wants them to do".

Did you also approve of what happened to Elizabeth Smart? It was the same thing.

[Rabrrrrrr]

81. No it doesn't.

The mormon version, practiced by this small subset of mormons, sanctions all that. Polygamy itself neither sanctions nor anti-sanctions it. Polygamy, if it were allowed in this country under the same laws as regular marriage, would continue not to sanction it.

[OzarkDem]

83. How do you know?

Is there some international society of polygamists who have rules for practice of ethical polygamy?

If one group of people is able to break the laws in practicing polygamy what's to stop another? Sorry, it just doesn't seem to serve any purpose other than to allow men to control women.

[Rabrrrrrr]

84. We have laws in place about legal ages of marriage.

Hence, even if we allowed polygamy, we would not have the abuse of children under polygamy that the conservative mormons practice. They would still not be able to marry 13 year olds.

It's just simple logic - do we have this abuse in the current marital system? No, we don't. Not **legally**. So why do you, and a number of others, think that all of a sudden it's gonna be a problem if we allow consenting adults to enter into polygamous relations?

:shrug:

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

2. More proof: religion draws and makes stupid people.

[BushOut06]

WTF?

Are you not aware that polygamy is a common practice throughout the world, and usually has nothing to do with religion at all?

[Matariki]

30. yeah, it usually has to do with a lack of women's rights

and a lack of education and economic opportunity available to girls and women.

[etherealtruth]

40. Touche` eom

[kiahzero]

59. I suppose two men and one woman is explotive to women too

Polygamy is not equivalent to polygyny or polyandry.

[Matariki]

87. Oh yeah, like that's prevalent

Tell me where.

[Dorian Gray]

85. Bingo, Kineta!

[undeterred]

65. Are you still beating that dead horse?

[BushOut06]

3. Why not?

Can anyone give me a solid reason, one that isn't based on any moral rationale, why polygamy shouldn't be legal? It's common in many cultures around the world. One can still enforce existing laws that currently exist - ie domestic violence and child welfare.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

4. I've been married....

And the very idea of more than one wife scares the shit outta me!

[breakaleg]

5. As they say on Big Love..

It's a huge responsibility and not every man is up for the challenge!

[pnwmom]

7. LOL! I loved the show "Big Love" -- about the polygamous family.

The script writers were doing a great job, I thought, in showing the possible complications without taking a black and white point of view. Just when you're beginning to think these people are nuts, they would show another facet of the family that was very positive, e.g, the kids' attachment to all the mothers.

[orpupilofnature57]

33. Kick!! Best New show in Years!!

[w4rma]

8. Because structures like this are corrupt.

Why stop at 2 wives, or 10 wives, or 100 wives, or 1000 wives, or 10,000 wives.

The same goes for husbands. Can you imagine a world where every man or woman except for the elite, are one of 1000s of wives to one person?

The heck with that. I will never support polygamy.

[BushOut06]

10. Yeah, because the current monogamous setup is soooo great

It's almost the same argument that RWers make about same-sex marriage, that it somehow invalidates the "sacred institution". We're supposed to believe that a "normal" marriage where the husband treats his wife like shit, constantly berates her, and uses her as his personal reproduction machine, somehow that is preferable to a loving, carring polygamous family.

[w4rma]

28. How the hell is a husband suppose to have any *time* to "love and care"

for ten different wives? Give each wife 3 days a month? Yeah, that's really "loving and caring". The other 27 days the wife has nothing to do but be "his personal reproduction machine" and housekeeper and babysitter. 3 days a month is *not* "loving and caring".

The fact is that polygamy is not an equal relationship. Its a relationship of masters and near-slaves.

[sgxnk]

31. the point is

that it is hypocritical to claim it is unconstitutional for the govt. to make gender restrictions on marriage but perfectly ok to make numerical distinctions regarding # of partners

the issue is not whether it is "loving and caring". again, you are using a double standard.

you are allegedly protecting women (of course not even mentioning distinctions to include polyandry etc.) by limiting THEIR choice to freely enter into a marriage contract that YOU think isn't "loving enough" for you

double standards. it's what's for dinner

[w4rma]

32. Wow. I couldn't disagree more.

Anyway, whether or not it is unConstitutional for polygamy. It sure as heck will always be against the law.

[fishwax]

39. how is it hypocritical

"it is hypocritical to claim it is unconstitutional for the govt. to make gender restrictions on marriage but perfectly ok to make numerical distinctions regarding # of partners"

I've heard from right-wingers for years that once we legalize gay marriage we'll have no basis upon which to prevent polygamy. My initial response was always "so what." But in all seriousness, I fail to see a contradiction or hypocrisy in the position that the government cannot tell an individual whom to marry, but it can tell an individual how many to marry at one time.

[BushOut06]

36. Wow, that's an awful broad brush you're using there

And I refuse to believe that everyone in the world shares your definition of what love is. The notion that a person cannot love more than one person at a time is absurd.

[Kickoutthejams23]

15. I have trouble enough with the one wife theory

That said I really don't care if other people choose a different way. As long as all the spouses are of consensual age why should we care. Adults should be able to choose to live their lives in any f@#ked up manner they want to. I think this holds true for drugs, prostitution and well polygamy. If a woman or man wants to sell (okay rent) his or her body I say let them. If they want to spend their time getting high okay by me. (just don't expect society to finance your habit) And if they want to marry a man who already has a wife or three who are we to say no. We should worry more about how we conduct our own behavior and stop worrying about how other people conduct theirs. If their decisions are good ones then more people will adapt them. If not it will continue to be a fringe activity. Either way let adults decide for themselves.

[enfield collector]

18. I agree with most of this. however some things are just too stupid

for society to accept. child brides(bridegrooms) may be one of them.

[Yupster]

71. Yes - I don't think you'd find much

support on DU for children getting married, whether in monogomy or polygamy.

I guess the argument would be when does a child become an adult.

[Bobbieo]

12. The answer lies in 'a dozen young women'

Where were the young men? According to articles in the Arizona Republic last spring, they were forced out of their communities on the AZ -Utah border by the elder men in the communities.

It is a religion (system) not unlike the Muslim Taliban.

[BushOut06]

14. Again, there are laws that deal with that

If young men are being forced out, I'm sure there should be some sort of legal remedy for that. What I'm saying is that polygamy in and of itself shouldn't be illegal. Could polygamy be abused? Of course - but then again, "normal" marriage is abused all the time. If consenting adults decide they want to engage in that lifestyle, who are we to tell them they can't? If polygamy suddenly became legal, it doesn't mean that every man is suddenly going to rush out and marry as many women as he can.

[Bobbieo]

19. Your answers make the polygamous problem sound so simplistic.

Tell them to law enforcement in both Utah and AZ who have been trying to find their leader since last April. This is a very complex issue that also has adherents in both state legislatures. The polygamous lifestyle not only hinges on child abuse but fraud and income tax evasion.

[BushOut06]

21. If it sounds simple, it's because it IS

Sounds like your problems have more to do with a wierd cult-like group. Once again, polygamy in and of itself isn't the problem here, it's the other actions these polygamists are taking. If they're marrying women against their will, if they're marrying underage girls, if they're forcing young men out of their communities, deal with THOSE issues. But please, don't try to use this one example to paint every polygamist with a broad brush.

As far as fraud and income tax evasion, are you telling me that we don't have those problems with the current system? What about men who marry women from overseas for the sole purpose of bringing them to the US and getting them green cards? Besides, if polygamy were legal, you could set up tax laws accordingly.

[OzarkDem]

77. Actually they don't

The communities where polygamy is practice are made up completely of fundamentalist Mormons. The police, judge, prosecutors are all people who believe in these practices, as handed down to them by their weird religion.

They don't enforce state laws within their own communities.

[elehhhhna]

38. Read "Under the Banner of Heaven"...

These folks support their big families with state welfare funds...the women are all "single mothers" per the law...it's called Bleeding the Beast.

[OzarkDem]

78. I'm reading it now

its appalling that this kind of thing is still allowed to happen. These people should be put in jail and the girls adopted by foster families who can care for them and help them repair their lives and self - image.

[pitohui]

42. agreed this is destabilizing to society

corrupt rich old men seize on multiple wives and young not-so-much-rich young men who are not able to have families de-stabilize society, it is simple demographics, more young unattached men = more crimes of violence, it is true in every society there ever was and the only way around it is then to treat the unattached young men w. great harshness and oppressiveness -- such a society cannot tolerate very much in the way of freedom -- and as we all know, utah is the one state most famous for its lack of freedoms in even the smallest things

in a one-on-one marriage neither partner is property, they are partners

but polygamy is about one person being wealthy and powerful and his multiple "partners" not being "partners" at all but being servants/slaves/faces in the harem or in a crowd

it's illegal for a reason, a good one

gay marriage is not the same idea at all, gay marriage promotes an equal partnership and again provides a stabilizing force for society

polygamy is about rich men hogging all of the resources (the women become as property and proof of conspicuous consumption) -- completely different idea

yes, there will always be slaves who cling to their slavery because they fear change, that is sad and pathetic, but i don't respect their views, these "women" are a disgrace to themselves and other women

[Hamlette]

29. do you care that you subsidize the "lifestyle"?

I'm an attorney with the welfare office in Utah. Polygamy is not, in the vast majority of cases, financially viable and an astronomically high percentage of polygamists (mostly their children) recieve a huge amount of welfare. Tom Green was prosecuted for failing to support his children and marrying an underage girl. Between housing, food stamps and medical, he, his 5 wives and 30 children were costing the tax payers at least $100,000 per year. I can tell you because the case went to court and it is a matter of public record. I can't tell you about other polygamists except a newspaper estimated at least 50% of polygamists are on food stamps. I would bet money far more are and a much higher percentage are on medical.

Someone suggested earlier that the reason polygamy is not allowed is health insurance. So, you are willing to pay for medical care for the rest of them? (I know, I too believe the government should foot the bill for health care, but it does not.) And food, and subsidized housing? We're talking kids, so we can't just say no, not morally that is.

And there are TONS of legal issues when the families break up, which they do on a regular basis. Tom Green was on his second set of wives. He'd had 5 previous to the 5 he had at the time of the trial. Who gets custody? Who gets visitation? Who gets the house? Who pays child support? The other moms? I actually believe the law, with some thought, could fashion answers to those problems but there are lots of problems.

And what do you do when a polygamist group starts a child care center where the multiple wives tend the children and because they meet the low income limits the state pays the child care? Trust me, you have no idea how much money you are spending to support the lifestyle.

They also force boys out of the community at a young age. We call them "lost boys" here. Many are homeless, many are in foster care. And what lessons are these people teaching the kids? That the father is so inconseqential that you share him with 30 other kids? That boys should be forced out to support the lifestyle? I think kids deserve better. I was pretty libertarian about this until I "saw" it close up.

[dsc]

44. wouldn't legal polygamy end that problem?

They are on welfare because legally they have no income. But if they were married then his income would count for each wife.

[roseBudd]

54. They are on welfare because it is a rare man who makes enough to support

that many people. Other than CEOs, lawyers, doctors, what other professions pay enough to support 15 or more people on one paycheck. The polygamist women have a tendency to not work.

[dsc]

56. They are on welfare due to being single mothers without income

I admit that even with his income added in there would be some welfare but not nearly as much. Also states are far more willing and able to push married people off welfare than singles.

[roseBudd]

60. They are on welfare because they don't believe women should work. a

polygamist husband can give as much money as he can afford to each wife and their children regardless of wheher polygamy is legal or not. The problem is the polygamist husband does not make enough to support 5 wives and 20 children.

[Hamlette]

89. not sure what you mean by "legally" they have no income

They are on welfare because the poverty level for a family of 30 (not unusual) is over $100,000. (actually the poverty tables don't go high enough for 30 kids, so that is just an estimate based on making adjustments to the top level.)

Not many people make that much money.

While it is true that some (all?) polygamists believe in bleeding the beast (taking advantage of all government "handouts") because they believe the government has wronged them by not accepting their religion, their bitch with the government is not just polygamy. Because they are fundamentalists, chances are they would remain isolated.

I have a problem with women being subservient. I'd rather not legalize lifestyles where women have no possibility of being equal. And, I'm pretty old fashioned about wanting my mate to be faithful. Polygamist men can/must always be on the prowl.

[marions ghost]

64. 30 kids, 1 father

== messed up kids

Yes kids deserve better.

good point, Hamlette

[Yupster]

73. Unmarried teens having babies

are almost always subsidized too, but I don't think it should be illegal for that reason.

[Tsiyu]

80. Thank you for this addition to the thread

There seem to be a lot of pie-in-the-sky visions of polygamy.

You show the reality.

When rights and the public intersect, we must be careful to preserve rights without hurting someone else in preserving those rights.

A gay couple does not hurt anyone - they do not ask for more than what any married couple would receive. Comparing their very acceptable call for equal rights to the unacceptable demands of the polygamist is like comparing apples and oranges and no reasonable person would fall for that argument.

Men who want to throw all teenage boys out into the streets and to screw all the teenage girls and make lots of babies ARE hurting society, by creating economic and social chaos in their communities.
Overworked judges and juvenile detention facilities and strained social services attest to that.

Personally, I believe people should be able to marry any other adult or adults they choose. Privately, I'll tell you these men and women disgust me.

[SeaBob]

6. WTF

Spindrifter only you could find something this wierd. Great Job

[pooja]

9. The only problem I have with it, is the seemingly older man-younger

woman (teenager) becoming another wife.

[enfield collector]

11. what about older woman and younger man?

[pooja]

13. Again depends on the age. I'm not sure a teen should be with

someone old enough to be their father or mother... But then again each to their own.. and whatever floats your boat.

[BushOut06]

16. Then enforce those laws

Enforce the laws that exist. Would a 36-yr old man be allowed to marry a 14-yr old girl in a standard marriage? Of course not. So then why does everyone assume that a polygamous marriage should be any different?

[OzarkDem]

79. the enforcers are polygamists also

These people live in their own towns and control their own governments. They ignore the laws when it comes to rape, polygamy, sex with minors, domestic violence and all the other lovely benefits of Mormon polygamy.

[Rabrrrrrr]

52. That has nothing to do with polygamy.

That only has to do with the beliefs of a snall minority of Mormons.

[treestar]

17. This should be a free country

And if people want to live that way, so be it.

[Bobbieo]

22. The polygamists elders want no outsiders in their communities.

including law enforcement that does not belong to their group. The communities of Hillsdale, Utah and Colorado City, AZ have been in existence since the '60s and the ruling alders have become very rich and powerful. This group parallels the Muslim Taliban.

[BushOut06]

24. Again, that's one particular group - not all polygamists are like that

In fact, most would prefer to just be left alone, and remain a part of normal society. Because it is illegal, they have to live outside mainstream society. Don't try to paint everyone the same because of the actions of a few extremist groups.

[Rabrrrrrr]

53. It's amazing how many people are defining "polygamy"

as "the abusive structure of multiple partner marriage as enacted by a small segment of Mormons who are outside the Mormon tradition".

People - polygamy goes way, way, way, way beyond the few Mormons who practice it in an abusive way.

One might just as well, whenever one talks about Europeans, say stupid shit like "I don't mind them being European except for the Jew-gassing."

:wtf:

[TlalocW]

20. I support polygamy

Except for Mormons.

I don't need more of those idiots knocking on my door when I'm trying to nap on the weekend. :)

TlalocW

[BushOut06]

23. Dealing with door-to-door mormons

I haven't had to deal with any of them yet, but I'm sure I could have some fun with them. I could pretend to be a Jehovah's Witness, and ask them if they're one of the 144,000. If it's JW's at the door, ask them if they've read the Book of Mormon.

[orpupilofnature57]

34. I usually ask them if they know their in a cult, Having less to do with the

Bible and more to do with Agendas.

[TlalocW]

37. I used to have a sign

On my door that was a variation of No Solicitors except I made sure to include, "Anyone wanting to tell me why their religion is better than mine.*"

The asterisk related to a small note at the bottom:

--------------------
* Jehovah Witnesses are an exception if willing to talk about Deuteronomy 18:20-22 (false prophets) in regards to the elders of your church consistently predicting the end of the world.
** Mormons pretending to be Jehovah Witnesses will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

--------------------

I got 0 knocks after putting that up. :)

A friend of mine has Jehovah Witnesses (mom, dad, little girl) come to her house and after some small talk on the porch she asked, "Is this your little girl? She's so cute." Then she bent down to talk to the girl and said, "Did you know your mommy and daddy are in a cult? When you get older, I'll give you sanctuary if you find your way back here."

JW's never bothered her again.

TlalocW

[breakaleg]

45. That's hilarius!!!! My friend who is Korean

but born here, used to say, in her best Korean accented voice "no speak engwish" and slam the door on them.

[Yupster]

43. I offer them a soft drink

and a chance to use the restroom, and then send them on their way. They've given me a Book of Mormon which I have yet to read, but maybe someday.

[Bobbieo]

25. The Short Creek , Arizona Raid in 1953

should have taken care of the problem but the men were merely fined and gradually drifted back into the community to rebuild the system which is now very rich and very corrupt. BTW - Getting to those communities is not an easy task - hot, mountainous desert country straddling the two stateswith no major highway.

[Scout1071]

50. I saw them out and about yesterday.

Well, I believe they were JW's. Husband and wife team dressed like they were out of 1955.

There is a "Kingdom Hall" only a mile or so from me, so they make the rounds.

When the Mormons come knocking, it is usually 2 young men who are working on their "mission." Black pants, white short-sleeved shirt, black tie, often on bikes. I see them peddling around in the summer heat and I can remember them knocking on our door in college. They look miserable, but they sure seem dedicated. I had a friend who was a skater, punk, generally fun, adventerous guy in high school. His family/church shipped him off to year on a Mormon ranch for his "mission" and he changed completely. I never saw him cuss, smoke, anything. Shit, I hardly ever saw him again after that. I've never seen anyone change so completely. It really freaked us, his friends, out because he seemed almost brainwashed.

[CrushTheDLC]

35. Polygamy ROCKS!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A326pE_kPYQ

[Occulus]

41. Well, since I can't get married AT ALL:

FUCK the polyglops and FUCK the religion that allows them to do it.

I'll rescind those comments..... when *I* can get married *once*.

[Fleshdancer]

46. I support it for anyone over the age of 18

As long as people are making their own decisions and aren't pressured into it, then it's all good.

[guinivere]

48. I don't care. As long as all the parties involved are of age,

and are willing to enter into such a relationship, go for it.

[Disturbed]

61. Islam allows polygamy:

A man may marry up to four wives at one time.

[CrushTheDLC]

72. Utah's mostly desert. Looks like a good match

Elohim = Allah close enough....

[Deja Q]

62. If one or two of them would date ME, then I'll reconsider my beliefs.

[LostinVA]

86. Lots of ignorance on this thread about the FLDS

and other like organizations in Utah, Arizona, BC, etc. These are the huge, gigantic majority of people in the US who are in polygamous relationships. It's legal child rape. It's incest. It's disgusting.

[sweetheart]

88. Where are all the teens promoting promiscuity?

I don't blieve in polygamy, but would be more interested in a rally for sex with whomever
as a sign of making love. :-)

[Warren DeMontague]

90. Someone should tell them that plain ol' group sex is cheaper & simpler.

Believe me, kid, one wife is plenty.