These draft dodging bastards aren't tough..

[butterfly77]

I am so tired of hearing this garbage about how the democrats are weak, this is a bunch of bull. What is it that the uninformed and the hateful republicons see that makes them believe that these hypocritical,non negotiating,draft dodging , liars are tough. Bush struts all over the country looking like he has a stick up his ass and they clarify this as being tough.

What have they done that makes them look tough and why are the dems seen as weak if they are not in charge of anything in the congress how would they know if the dems haven't been in control of the house and senate for years. Some people are so brainwashed by limbuger and o'lielly that it is pitiful. By the way, who are these stupid people who believe that o'lielly is looking out for them.

[fasttense]

1. The religiously insane.

Neocons have avoided risking their lives for their country and they are considered tough on national defense? What do they know about it except how to get deferments and avoid the National Guard. Are the bush twins in the Iraq war yet?

[madokie]

2. My take is they gave up their rights to the tough label long ago.

I'm a pacifist, a vet, a tough sob and a proud assed okie Democrat

[livvy]

3. Here is a list I have seen before.

I can't verify its contents, although I'm sure if someone wanted to, they could find the data available online.

Democrats
* Richard Gephardt: Air National Guard, 1965-71.
* David Bonior: Staff Sgt., Air Force 1968-72.
* Tom Daschle: 1st Lt., Air Force SAC 1969-72.
* Al Gore: enlisted Aug. 1969; sent to Vietnam Jan. 1971 as an army
journalist in 20th Engineer Brigade.
* Bob Kerrey: Lt. j.g. Navy 1966-69; Medal of Honor, Vietnam.
* Daniel Inouye: Army 1943-47; Medal of Honor, WWII.
* John Kerry: Lt., Navy 1966-70; Silver Star, Bronze Star with Combat V, Purple Hearts.
* Charles Rangel: Staff Sgt., Army 1948-52; Bronze Star, Korea.
* Max Cleland: Captain, Army 1965-68; Silver Star & Bronze Star, Vietnam.
* Ted Kennedy: Army, 1951-53.
* Tom Harkin: Lt., Navy, 1962-67; Naval Reserve, 1968-74.
* Jack Reed: Army Ranger, 1971-1979; Captain, Army Reserve 1979-91.
* Fritz Hollings: Army officer in WWII; Bronze Star and seven campaign ribbons.
* Leonard Boswell: Lt. Col., Army 1956-76; Vietnam, DFCs, Bronze Stars, and Soldier’s Medal.
* Pete Peterson: Air Force Captain, POW. Purple Heart, Silver Star and Legion of Merit.
* Mike Thompson: Staff sergeant, 173rd Airborne, Purple Heart.
* Bill McBride: Candidate for Fla. Governor. Marine in Vietnam; Bronze Star with Combat V.
* Gray Davis: Army Captain in Vietnam, Bronze Star.
* Pete Stark: Air Force 1955-57
* Chuck Robb: Vietnam
* Howell Heflin: Silver Star
* George McGovern: Silver Star & DFC during WWII.
* Bill Clinton: Did not serve. Student deferments. Entered draft but received #311.
* Jimmy Carter: Seven years in the Navy.
* Walter Mondale: Army 1951-1953
* John Glenn: WWII and Korea; six DFCs and Air Medal with 18 Clusters.
* Tom Lantos: Served in Hungarian underground in WWII. Saved by Raoul Wallenberg.

Republicans
* Dick Cheney: did not serve. Several deferments, the last by marriage.
* Dennis Hastert: did not serve.
* Tom Delay: did not serve.
* Roy Blunt: did not serve.
* Bill Frist: did not serve.
* Mitch McConnell: did not serve.
* Rick Santorum: did not serve.
* Trent Lott: did not serve.
* John Ashcroft: did not serve. Seven deferments to teach business.
* Jeb Bush: did not serve.
* Karl Rove: did not serve.
* Saxby Chambliss: did not serve. “Bad knee.” The man who attacked Max Cleland’s patriotism.
* Paul Wolfowitz: did not serve.
* Vin Weber: did not serve.
* Richard Perle: did not serve.
* Douglas Feith: did not serve.
* Eliot Abrams: did not serve.
* Richard Shelby: did not serve.
* Jon! Kyl: did not serve.
* Tim Hutchison: did not serve.
* Christopher Cox: did not serve.
* Newt Gingrich: did not serve.
* Don Rumsfeld: served in Navy (1954-57) as flight instructor.
* George W. Bush: failed to complete six-year National Guard assignment; re-assigned from Texas to Alabama National Guard so he could campaign for family friend running for U.S. Senate; failing to show up for required medical exam and duties, was stripped of pilot status.
* Ronald Reagan: due to poor eyesight, served in a non-combat role making movies.
* B-1 Bob Dornan: Consciously enlisted after fighting was over in Korea.
* Phil Gramm: did not serve.
* John McCain: US Navy 1958-81; Silver Star, Bronze Star, Legion of Merit, Purple Heart and Distinguished Flying Cross.
* Dana Rohrabacher: did not serve.
* John M. McHugh: did not serve.
* JC Watts: did not serve.
* Jack Kemp: did not serve. “Knee problem,” although continued in NFL for 8 years.
* Dan Quayle: Journalism unit of the Indiana National Guard.
* Rudy Giuliani: did not serve.
* George Pataki: did not serve.
* Spencer Abraham: did not serve.
* John Engler: did not serve.
* Lindsey Graham: National Guard lawyer.
* Arnold Schwarzenegger: AWOL from Austrian army base.

Pundits & Preachers
* Sean Hannity: did not serve.
* Rush Limbaugh: did not serve (4-F with a ‘pilonidal cyst.’)
* Bill O’Reilly: did not serve.
* Michael Savage: did not serve.
* George Will: did not serve.
* Chris Matthews: did not serve.
* Paul Gigot: did not serve.
* Bill Bennett: did not serve.
* Pat Buchanan: did not serve.
* John Wayne: did not serve.
* Bill Kristol: did not serve.
* Kenneth Starr: did not serve.
* Antonin Scalia: did not serve.
* Clarence Thomas: did not serve.
* Ralph Reed: did not serve.
* Michael Medved: did not serve.
* Charlie Daniels: did not serve.
* Ted Nugent: did not serve. (He only shoots at things that don’t shoot back.)

This particular list came from here:
http://www.novoteleftbehind.net/wordpress/?p=81

I'll see if I can find another link.

[butterfly77]

4. So is this why they always throw out Mc cain..

as though he is the expert.

[livvy]

6. It's hard to figure how he fits with this bunch.

They seem to have so little in common.:shrug:

[butterfly77]

8. They are hypocrites no matter how many times ...

he comes out as though he is against bush on something, if you notice he always makes sure that he jumps back to their side. When they were talking about the torture issue I just counted the days until we would hear that they have come to an agreement to make bush look good. even though he doesn't to most americans.

[livvy]

5. Here's another list from BuzzFlash.

Elliott Abrams - Sought deferment for bad back.
Richard Armey - Sought college deferment, too smart to die.
Bill Bennett - Sought graduate school deferment, too smart to die.
Pat Buchanan - Sought deferment for bad knee.
George W. Bush Daddy got him in the National Guard
Dick Cheney - Sought graduate school deferment, too smart to die.
Tom DeLay - - Sought college deferment, too smart to die.
Newt Gingrich - Sought graduate school deferment, too smart to die.
Phil Gramm - Sought marriage deferment, too loved to die.
Jack Kemp - Sought medical deferment while in the NFL.
Rush Limbaugh - Sought deferment for ingrown hair follicle on his ass.
Trent Lott - Sought deferment, didn't want to muss his hair.
P.J. O'Rourke - Sought deferment, too stoned.
Dan Quayle - Family got him into the Reserves.
Pat Robertson - Father pulled him out of Korea as soon as the shooting began.
Kenneth Starr Sought deferment for psoriasis.
John Wayne - Sought deferment to further acting career.
Vin Weber - Sought deferment for asthma.
George Will - Sought deferment, too much of a wussy.

http://www.buzzflash.com/editorial/2001/05/121501_Cowardly_GOP.html

I also found this info about the 108th Congress in this pdf file dated 2004:
http://www.senate.gov/reference/resources/pdf/RS21379.pdf#search=%22congressional%20military%20service%22

Membership of the 108th Congress: A Profile
Mildred L. Amer
Specialist in American National Government
Government and Finance Division

CRS-6
Military Service14
There are 153 Members of the 108th Congress who have had some form of military
service, some 14 fewer than in the 107th Congress. The House has 117 veterans: 69
Republicans and 48 Democrats, including one woman, who is a Republican. In the
Senate, 35 Members are veterans: 19 Republicans and 16 Democrats. They have served
in World War II, the Korean War, Vietnam, the Persian Gulf, and Kosovo, and during
times of peace, as well as in the Reserves and the National Guard. One Senator is a
former Secretary of the Navy. There has been a steady decline in the number of Members
who have served in the military, which may be attributed in part to the end of the
Selective Service System draft in 1973.

and here is the 2006 info from the same source:
http://www.senate.gov/reference/resources/pdf/RS22007.pdf#search=%22congressional%20military%20service%22

Military Service
According to the Military Officers Association of America, there are 139 Members
of the 109th Congress who have had some form of military service.15 The House has 109;
the Senate 30. They have served in World War II, the Korean War, Vietnam, the Persian
Gulf, and Kosovo, and during times of peace, as well as in the Reserves and the National
Guard. As noted above, one Senator is a former Secretary of the Navy.
The number of veterans in the 109th Congress is 13 fewer than the 108th Congress
and 14 fewer than in the 107th Congress showing the recent trend of a steady decline in
the number of Members who have served in the military. This may be attributed in part
to the end of the Selective Service System draft in 1973.

[butterfly77]

9. Everybody on this list has the biggest mouth ...

And the most media exposure so that a lot of the uninformed believe this bull. Perfect example Bill Kristol is running his damn mouth again to start another war.

[KharmaTrain]

7. We Fight This "Beat Your Wife Game" and Democrats Lose

This is one of the oldest tricks in their arsenal...it's the ultimate of arrogance and hyporcrisy. Repugnicans are like the man who was caught screwing another woman by his wife and trying to deny what his wife is seeing. While she's in hysterics, he finishes up his "business", put on his clothes and moves on...telling his wife that she should do something about those hallucinations she's having. They've worked this trick out so that any angle you come at them...or even worse...attempt to defend yourself, you're always going to look weak. They want quick, soundbite ideas...slogans...feel good words...not concepts, not long-term and not if it requires making a personal sacrafice. It's an appeal to the selfish...and it works.

The antidote is to keep these asshats on the defensive. Make them do the explaining...put the ball in their court and watch them shoot themselves in the head almost any time. Put the questions to them that they're trying to put to us...and don't let them wiggle out with some esoteric bullshit...demand specifics and not talking points. They wilt and look weak. Am I the only one who sees this?