Talk with a conservative about why the 9/11 Commission was rigged

[leveymg]

The following exchange is in the string over at DKos that follows my cross-post today of "Big Questions about the Big Lies Told to the 9/11 Commission": http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/10/3/11225/4574

The 9/11 commision was rigged (0 / 0)

Glad you guys are finally noticing.

I hope as a Conservative we reopen the commission and dig deep and get to the real truth. If Bush had a problem so be it, as a conservative I never said he was blameless, but we have got to get to the truth.

Democrats have to be willing to not let Clinton CYA (Sandy Burgler, Jamie Gorelic SP?)specialists on the panel and republicans have to stop this useless whining about Bush just took office.

Until we get to the bottom of what really happened America will never be safe

Engineering principle #1 - Never underestimate the power of an idiot

by Old Conservative on Tue Oct 03, 2006 at 09:57:35 AM PDT

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I'm glad you brought that up. (0 / 0)

The reason the Democratic Members of the Commission made the dirty deals they did with the other side was the simple fact that Clinton, Berger, Tenet and everyone else who knew about it broke the FISA wiretap laws.

But, I'll argue in their defense, the violations were limited to specific operations against known terrorist cells and their support network inside the United States. It was nothing like the wholesale FISA violations under Bush, but the Dems have been at a disadvantage since because there was some violation of law due mostly to concerns about operational security within CTC about the potential that FISC and the FBI had been penetrated. So, no FISA warrants were sought for the al-Qaeda cells coming from the Kuala Lumpur summit.

After January 2001, the Bush Administration closed down or scaled back some of the warrantless domestic surveillance operations, including Operation Catchers Mitt and Able Danger. I've written extensively both programs and you can easily GOOGLE, most recently about CATCHERS MITT a week ago.

I will also argue that 9/11 happened because the Bush Administration got greedy, jealous, lazy and careless during the summer of 2001. Greedy because they didn't want any of the Clinton carry overs to share the spotlight with their own programs being rolled out at the 9/4 Principals meeting scheduled to be introduced to Pakistani ISI and Saudi intel on 9/11. That's the significance of the date chosen for the attack. Lazy and careless because they cut Rich Clarke and John O'Neill out of the loop, but didn't replace them with anyone of any comparable CT program management ability.

So, there was a deal made right after 9/11. We won't criticize your negligent mishandling of programs that led to 9/11, if you don't implicate us in the domestic illegal CT programs we were running.

Someone needs to break this cycle of co-dependency. For the sake of the country, the time is now.

by leveymg on Tuesday, October 03, 2006 1:38:59 PM

[formercia]

1. It's for the good of the Country

Is your career more sacred that the lives of those who made the ultimate sacrifice on your orders?


"Someone needs to break this cycle of co-dependency. For the sake of the country, the time is now."

[Old and In the Way]

2. Wow, you got my attention on this post Mark....

"The reason the Democratic Members of the Commission made the dirty deals they did with the other side was the simple fact that Clinton, Berger, Tenet and everyone else who knew about it broke the FISA wiretap laws."

and

"because there was some violation of law due mostly to concerns about operational security within CTC about the potential that FISC and the FBI had been penetrated."

and

"Greedy because they didn't want any of the Clinton carry overs to share the spotlight with their own programs being rolled out at the 9/4 Principals meeting scheduled to be introduced to Pakistani ISI and Saudi intel on 9/11."

I think this is quite interesting....1st time I heard about this. Penetration of FISC and the FBI? Tell us more!

[leveymg]

3. Mistrust of FBI security was endemic within CIA

Recall that FBI counter-intel chief Robert Hanssen was exposed as a Russian mole in early 2001. Aldrich Ames, ranking CI SE at CIA, a couple years earlier. So, the FBI and CIA distrusted each others' security, intensely, at that time.

Accusations had been made against the chief FISC judge after the court turned down wire tap requests submitted by one of the SAs at the Chicago office, and banned him from further warrant requests. He had been investigating financial sources for Hamas and the Muslim Brotherhood. I don't think there was really anything to that accusation aganst Judge Lambeth, but the perception was pretty widespread pre-9/11 that some of the FISC judges were overly liberal and sympathetic to Islamics.

There also wasn't a lot of trust among line CI and CT people at the Agency and FBI about some of the Clinton people, such as Jamie Gorelick, running FISA policies, and the changes that were made in the mid and late 1990s to tighten up application procedures were very unpopular among operational types at both agencies.

[Old and In the Way]

4. Thanks....k/r You really help to flesh out the backdrop on which

9/11 played out. Thanks for shedding a little light on this murky mess....

[Old and In the Way]

5. kick

[Old and In the Way]

6. Hope this post gets more traction....

[leveymg]

7. Thanks.

I'll roll the parts worth saving into something else. Kinda like making a stew.

[Old and In the Way]

9. Good analogy...sometimes it just takes a little repackaging and maybe

adding a little spice to the mix!

:hi:

[seabeyond]

8. clinton administration cia were also picking up suspects and flying them

to other countries for "interrogation". i was suspect of clinton being hte reason why the 911 commission sold out

[bbgrunt]

10. You're right. It is time to stop this co-dependency.

Unmitigated praise for Clinton's actions only exacerbates this co-dependency