This laid-off ford worker on CNN is PISSED

[w8liftinglady]

Kyra keeps trying to redirect him about relearning a trade with a career counselor,but the guy keeps saying how much it sucks that he and his co-workers have nothing to look forward to...and blames the current administration for putting profits in front of people.

[FreedomAngel82]

1. It's all so depressing

And here Karl Rove said they were going to run on a "great" economy. Great for rich people!

[mikeytherat]

25. Karl Rove said they were going to MAKE a run on a great economy

and they did. Ran it right into the ground.

mikey_the_rat

[Booster]

129. Yep. The dimson said he would run the country like it was a

business, and we all know how well he can run a business. God, we're just all doomed.

[fooj]

2. Good for him!

Kyra makes me wanna hurl...

Peace.

[RevCheesehead]

3. Yup.

And he ain't putting up with their bullshit, neither. :freak:

[Avalux]

4. That little jerk OBrien (the man) on CNN this morning -

interviewed the head of a job finding firm. He actually looked at the guy and said "So these people that worked for Ford, they're just going to have to get used to the fact that they won't ever make nearly as much money or have the benefits, aren't they?" They guy agreed and they both sat there and smiled. Assholes - and neither have a clue what it's like for these people.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

11. I don't either, really.

I have nothing to compare it to.

[insane_cratic_gal]

13. Difference is Gran you have empathy

corporate pigs like CNN anchors earning a 6 figure salary don't seem to have a the basic common sense never mind empathy for a class of people outside of their own tax bracket.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

15. It was not a smiling moment

that's for sure.

[Avalux]

16. Let me tell you.

When I was a kid, my dad worked as an electrician for the Pennsylvania RR which was then sold and became Conrail. They restructured and he lost his job. That part of the country was so depressed in the 70's - we lost our car and almost our home because he had such a hard time finding work. Now granted, we could have maybe picked up and relocated somewhere, but that's not the mentality with the people there, and there were no "retraining opportunities". So when I hear these jerks talk about hard-working people as if they're nothing, I get pissed.

Don't get me started on what they're trying to do to unions. :mad:

[TallahasseeGrannie]

33. How did the story end?

Did he find work?

[Avalux]

37. Good ending, lots of roughness in the middle.

My father spent several years working odd jobs, and to his credit, he's very creative - so he made a lot of handcrafted items circa 1700s and sold them, my mother worked as a secretary too. We got by, never lost the house - although we never had much. But even through all of this I have to say we were very close and had good times. My parents gave my brother and I the skills to do anything we want - and we have.

Eventually, my Dad got a job as an electrician with a good company and has just recently retired. I am happy he finally has a chance to relax and not work so hard. Thanks for asking...sitting here remembering stuff has me all choked up. :hi:

[GOPFighter]

35. The Haves and the Have Mores

In the 80s I worked in a department store at an upscale mall with the sons and daughters of upper middle class families. You should have heard the disparaging remarks they made about the poor and working class families. They and all their friends bragged about how they had been accepted at Yale and Brown and Princeton and Harvard and how the poor had only themselves to blame for their poverty. I was working there as a second job so I could buy my kids some C'mas gifts. They were working there because mommy and daddy thought it would be good for them to have work experience before going to college. I have a feeling these people are now in positions of leadership and responsibility.

[Avalux]

39. I'm sure they are.

It's that less-than-human mentality - which is why it's so easy for them to accept killing thousands of innocent people in Iraq.

[Marie26]

44. Seen that too

I am constantly astonished at how many people feel entitled to be wealthy, while doing absolutely nothing themselves to earn it. And yet also feel entitled to turn around and look down on people who struggle & work hard for a living. I suspect you're right that these people are the majority of Republicans in government, and I suspect they are also the majority of the media commentators. That's why the media constantly ignores or misunderstands the concerns of the working poor.

[Coexist]

19. uh, so instead of "going postal" it will be "going autoworker"

what a putz.

[VolcanoJen]

42. Jesus

I think I might have destroyed my television if I had seen that.

Miles is a noxious weed. He's never even attempted to hide his allegiances to the Bush crowd. I can just see his self-satisfied smirk now...

[HughBeaumont]

60. Makes my blood boil. DAMN.

They say that like "Oh well, not my problem. Their fault for not preparing!"

We are NOT taking care of enough people in this country and corporations deny there's a problem. Who loses? Those making less than $200,000 per year.

[Synnical]

66. I heard that interview

Was listening to the telly, not watching it. The comment that got my blood boiling, in addition to what you've mentioned, was this one:

M. O'BRIEN: One thing you say is keep self-esteem high.

BAYER: Right. M. O'BRIEN: Much easier said than done.

BAYER: It is, because you've just been laid off or fired. But you need to keep your self-esteem going. See a career coach. A career coach will tell you what you've done or help you figure out what you enjoy doing and what you've also done well. It presumes you've done something well.

Geez, talk about kicking someone when they're down.

Here's the transcript of the portion you mentioned:

M. O'BRIEN: Difficult to replace that. A lot of this has to do with expectations. So a lot of these -- I think a lot of these workers are going to face some -- face the prospect of making much less. They need to have their expectations tuned to reality, don't they?

BAYER: I think so. The key is the market. What will the market bear? And it's not going to bear, for many of them, the same salaries that they've been earning.

M. O'BRIEN: Richard Bayer, thanks for being with us.

He's with a group called the Five O'Clock Club. That sounds like a drinking club to me, but it's not.

BAYER: It's not. It's a job search group.

M. O'BRIEN: It's a job search group. And they have a book which you can check out, a couple of them, actually. "Shortcut Your Job Search" and "Targeting A Great Career." Both are aimed at helping folks network, get back into the workforce. Just some of those tips we just discussed are in that book plus more.

Thanks for being with us, Richard.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0601/25/ltm.08.html

[Avalux]

67. Thanks for posting this.

Mine was paraphrased from what I could remember - both of those guys were arrogant jerks. x(

[SoCalDem]

91. Career coach??? What a hoot. These are AUTO workers

some of them have done this their entire working lives.. Just WHAT "new" job will they learn? How to say "Basket, ma'am?" or "paper or plastic"?

A guy who graduated from high school, got a job at the auto factory and worked his way up to journeyman auto worker, and then worked that job for 20+ years is NOT going to be a suitable "trainee" for a job that pays 1/3 of what he NEEDS to live on..

The circular argument of this admin is astonishing.. In one breath they say.."spend..but stuff..go shopping...buy a house..send your kids to college.. and in the next breath they say "shoulda seen it coming..should saved more..shoulds trained to be "flexible".."

You cannot work 8 hrs a day and do the parent thing, and the homeowner,car-buyer thing and go to night classes to learn to be something else.. Why WOULD you? Are lawyers going to night school to learn a "trade" in case their caseload drops and they get fired?

Do plumbers go to night school to learn how to be landscapers?


People PICK a profession they plan to work at, and that's what they know..that;s what they do.

poor upper-management ruins THEIR livelihood, and they are supposed to just suck it up and learn something new to do??


what a crock..

[Catrina]

81. We can witpe the smile off their faces by causing them to lose their

jobs also. We have the numbers, we only need the will to do it. Cancel all cable subscriptions, and they will just have to get used to the fact that they will never have a free ride like we've given again.

We are FUNDING them. And in return, they lie, and the block major news stories and they thrash more than half the citizens in this country, every single day.

What's so hard about cancelling them? A huge, organized boycott until they get rid of this hacks and replace them with real journalists, would work. But sadly, we don't have the willpower to do it. So there's no point in complaining. They know the weakness. People are hooked, and would rather watch and complain, than kick them all off the air.

Maybe it has to get worse ~ it's such a little sacrifice really, and would only be temporary. They could not sustain themselves if one or two million people cancelled them even for a month or two.

[SoCalDem]

89. I wonder how HE would like to take a huge paycut and lose HIS

medical insurance for his family...at 50 something..

That's a lot of years before medicare kicks in, and practically a death sentence if one has a chronic illness..:(

[depakid]

131. I hope someone's making a list of these people

and their executives.

Kind of like Mme Defarge in Tale of Two Cities.

[insane_cratic_gal]

5. New Careers cost money and time

shows how in-touch she is with main stream American's ideals doesn't it?

Sure Kyra we'll just let the family starve and go without a house over their heads so this guy at age 45 can retrain and spend 20k he doesn't have and 4 years of being homeless and on public assistance for food that is getting cut every freaking day! With out health insurance for their families, and college money for their kids, because that's being cut too.


GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRrrr do they not get it?

[Marie26]

18. They don't get it

I cannot stand the "job-retraining" spin that's always put out there. It's spun as if all these industrial workers can just join the high-tech revolution & start working for Microsoft. It's BS. For one thing, many of these auto workers have families & mortgages that are completely dependent upon their income. Where are they going to find the time & money to go to college? Many of the auto workers are also in their middle-ages - where it is difficult to try to find entry-level work in another career. Finally, these auto layoffs are mostly in areas that have VERY FEW employment options. Industrial jobs are often some of the only jobs that can provide a middle-class income. Many of the towns also depend almost completely on employment by the auto industry - if these plants close, so does the town. There are many industrial ghost towns throughout Ohio & Michigan. If an auto worker loses a job in Flint, MI, he is not going to magically get a good-paying job to replace it. Most people end up simply struggling - doing menial jobs or construction or service work that pays not nearly as much. That's the truth of it - and I hate when commentators try to cover it up so we don't have to feel so bad about it.

[Armstead]

22. Hit the nail on the head

Unfortunbately, too many Democrats echo the "training will solve everything" mantra.

We need a combination of policies and values tht will get us to a more humanistic economy. We had a more humanistic economy until the mid-1970's. It wasn't perfect, but what is considered normal today wold have been vilified as outrageous back then.

[raccoon]

27. Yes! Retrain for effing WHAT?

"Many of the auto workers are also in their middle-ages - where it is difficult to try to find entry-level work in another career. "

You know that's right.

[Art_from_Ark]

134. You took the words right out of my mouth

Different people have different aptitudes. It's not like just anyone can go from being a career factory worker to a software analyst, even with training. And to get the training, you have to spend tons of money on what is in effect a big gamble that a) you will actually be able to acquire the skill and knowledge needed to find a job in the new field, b) you can actually find an employer who is willing to take a chance on an entry-level middle-aged worker, c) the new job (if it actually becomes available) pays anything even close to what is needed to maintain an above-poverty-level lifestyle in one's hometown.

And to those (like Asshole Reagan) who would way, "Vote with your feet!", I say, "Screw that!" Speaking from experience, if you go into a totally new environment looking for a decent job, you'll find that almost no one gives a rat's ass about you. They'll already have a stack of applications a foot high, and if you don't have any local contacts, they sure as hell aren't going to be impressed with "Took 2 years of training classes at local community college" on the old resume.

[raccoon]

139. You got that right, Art, especially the part about

"voting with your feet."

That's been my experience too.

[Art_from_Ark]

143. I can't even remember all the times I packed up

and went to some place like Kansas City, ot Tulsa, or San Francisco, or DC, etc., etc., looking for a job based on a tip, newspaper ad, or whatever, and being told that they were just looking for applications, or I had to get a local driver's license before they would consider me, or I had to be domiciled at a certain place for a certain amount of time or otherwise I'd be considered just a transient. And in those cases when I somehow managed to pass through those hoops, they would invariably say

DON'T CALL US, WE'LL CALL YOU!

:banghead:

[Kansas Wyatt]

123. For Republicans, that means an opportunity to start Retraining Schools

To manipulate laid off workers into further debt and despair. In the end, they will find out that that new career that was suppose to take off, crashed and burned before arrival, and no longer exists. Meanwhile the Republicans laugh all the way to the bank, and decide to purchase that newly built McMansion that the 'imported workers' built, join that luxurious country club staffed by you guessed it, drop a down payment on that yacht to keep up with their new neighbors, and decide to splurge on the loaded Hummer.

These idiots do not "get it" because they think everything is a racket to be exploited.

[FloridaPat]

6. Oh yeah, job retraining. Good idea. I looked into it two years ago

when I got laid off. There were some programs, but not enough money and * has cut more money from training programs. Go to school again? Sure. I can pay or get a scholarship. 25 year career in computer programming and I get to start all over again in another career that may or may not be here when I'm done retraining.

[classic1]

24. was in the same position as you once

but I chose not to whine or moan as most seem to do these days. I was a Unix admin for 25 years making pissa money, had a great time! I remember when I started in the computer field, it was mostly made up of unemployed english, history and music teachers. They also chose not to whine or moan about not getting a job in their field. Times were tuff and jobs were few. Reagan had just become president. Then came along the high way of technology, God we were in such demand, running the show.. Ah the good old days..
I saw the light not so long ago, I knew my days were numbered. I went to school nights to do what I always wanted to do, skin care. I realized all these baby boomers who were beginning to make up the majority and wanted to stay young needed someone to keep them young, or say they thought. I also realized jobs in this country were becoming service type jobs. Did I want to work at McDonald's? nope. Walmart? nope. I opened up my own business in my home, I am happier, I am my own boss, I am making good money and can't complain much.

Moral of the story, see where the opportunities are and work toward them. Stop the whining and complaining, it is was it is. Nothing is going to bring back high tech jobs. No more 25 years at a "Ford" with a pension and health care. Most important no more excuses to fail! There is money to be made out there YOU need to get off your @ss and stop expecting someone else to do it for you. Just one woman's opinion

[FloridaPat]

29. Actually I've been doing lots of things, including my own business.

I still like to complain a lot though. Good for my blood pressure.

[classic1]

47. thanks for the smile

:)

[Strelnikov_]

30. "Nothing Is Going To Bring Back High Tech Jobs"

So, Ms. Friedman, maybe you could help me out with this one.

If we are all selling each other real estate, doing each others hair, being each others personal trainers, <insert service job here>, how are we going to pay for those unimportant things we will have to import?

You know, those little things like oil, natural gas, industrial equipment <insert infrastructure component here>.

There is a concept known as balance of trade.

As Ben Steins dad said, "things that cannot go on forever, don't".

[Le Taz Hot]

32. Um, before you get too self-righteous

there's a LOT you left out of your, um, "story." Did you have health insurance? Did you have school-aged children? College-age children? Were rents $800-$1200 a month as they are in CA? Where do you live? Did you get retrained just to find your job outsourced 5-6 years later? You went to school nights? How nice for you. How did you afford tuition? Were you a single parent? Were you a parent at all? Hmmm . . . home-based businesses -- indicates you have a home. Too many variables you don't even begin to acknowledge. What simple-minded thinking.

And how sad that you interpret those in desperation as "whining."

There but for the grace of the goddess, sistah, there but for the grace of the goddess.

:wtf:

[classic1]

43. I wouldn't describe me as self-righteous

I like to think I am a hard worker, but let me finish my "story" for you. Health insurance is a huge issue, not just for me but millions of us. That is one reason I wont vote republican. I will give you that one. I will even go further as to say I worry about not just myself, but my parents and children when it comes to health care. For you second question, I have two boys and they were school age at the time now in college. My rent is and was $2000.00 a month. I live in a lovely town in CT. I went to school nights and paid for it myself.
As I tell my children, those who fail have lots of excuses.

I know times are bad, but this too shall pass.

Have faith my friend and work hard

[sandnsea]

54. I wouldn't describe you as self-righteous either

But I'd get kicked off of here if I used the words I'm actually thinking.

People who earn low incomes work hard too. 50% of households have incomes of less than $50,000. Most people never even get to an economic position of being well-off. Only the top 10% earn more than $100,000 annually. That's reality.

[ProfessorGAC]

138. I'll Use The Words, Then

The poster is an idiot, and i don't believe one part of the story. It's stealth republicansim and the poster is a jerk.
The Professor

[Le Taz Hot]

58. Sweet cheeks

I've worked my ass off for 30 years and I would never EVER associate or call someone "friend" with such a self-rightous, pompous-ass attitude. I associate with a better class of people.

[bettyellen]

87. self righteous, judgemental, and let's hope your hubby doesn't fall for

one of those cuties coming in for treatment- because you'll find your standard of living drop 75%.
what are the odds these days? a bit over 50/50.
and some self righteous asshole will tell you you should have "seen that coming" :rofl:

[elehhhhna]

98. bet, you're a doozy

in a good way

[bettyellen]

110. thanks, you're something yourself, sweetie!

:hi:

[BiggJawn]

88. $2,000 a month in rent...

Gee...You pay more than my annual salary in just RENT. I guess you're probably pulling in about 200K in order for that kind of housing bill not to keep you awake at night.

Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn wrote in his short book "One Day in the Life of Ivan Denisovich" the words "How can you expect a man who's warm to understand a man who's cold?".

AFAIC, someone who pays $2,000 a month for rent "in a lovely town in CT" and isn't freaking out about it has no inkling what it's like to be me, and I'm not going to try to illuminate you to what it's like, either. I learned a LONG time ago about trying to "give a pig singing lessons". In fact, you sound like one of those assholes Libertarians I used to deal with who'd look at me and say "i don't know what YOUR problem is, I made FAT cash during the Reagan years. You must be stupid or something..."

And I'm a "Hard Worker", too, Bucko. The "Dirty Hands" kind of hard worker.

Say....*ARE* you a Libertarian? A "Dope-Smoking ReTHUGlican"?

[bettyellen]

113. oh if she was paying it, she'd mention that or the lack of hubby....

she's one of the 48% is it that's still married. her husband is paying the rent.
two income family. explains alot. her money goes to education, business start up costs, manicures....

[BiggJawn]

119. Yeah, that could very well be.

Runs what used to be called "A 2-chair Betty-Boop" out of the basement of her "lovely" CT 2-Kilobuck rental.

That kind of 'tude is born of the knowledge that "Win lose or draw, I still get fed and housed, and it only costs me 2 BJ's a month!"

I have a confession to make. At $24,000 a year for rent, that's a little more'n HALF what I pull down in a year. My Error....

Probably a "I got mine, fuck YOU!" Libertarian.
Why these people don't go hang around Libertarian Undergrowd or Dope-Smokin' ReTHUGGy Republic is beyond my conception...

[bettyellen]

120. she woulda surely claimed credit if she was raising those kids herself-

so, she was the second income, and by her own admission, a big one. her story sounds suspicious in other ways, but i think that's a glaring omission on her part. and from the values shown in her post, i'm sure she married for money, and god help her if she slaacks off on those bj's huh? whoosh, there goes 75% of her income.

[kineneb]

132. dudes, I would like to make 24K

We are the medically poor, living on $14K/yr. of Hubby's disability...and if I make anything, he could loose his medicaid...the poster has no clue what really being poor is like...shheesh, 24K for rent??? thank goodness our house payments are only $167.00/month, otherwise we would be homeless and hungry...truely not a clue...

[BiggJawn]

136. Well....

You need to get off your ass and "apply yourself". Our correspondent with her hobby business and the 2 Kilobuck rent bill would probably advise you to dump your hubby and "Marry Up", too.

Like I said, how can a man who's warm understand a man who's cold?

At least the quality of trolls is improving a little bit around here! :D

A big hug for you and your hubby! :hug:

[TheWatcher]

122. In order to keep my message from getting deleted

I will withold the description of you that is going through my mind, and it is well deserved.

Since people of your ilk really don't deserve the energy of a response, acknowledgment, or attention, might I kindly direct you to venues which may help you find people willing to be more receptive to your drivel.

www.yahoo.com
www.freerepublic.com

[elehhhhna]

97. A DUer was recently fired immediately after having a seizure.

Now I feel stoopid for chipping in a few bucks when I should have just said "QUIT WHINING"


Should have said that to Andy, too.

I guess compassion's out of fashion.

[trogdor]

41. So we're going to keep the economy going by...

...cutting each other's hair, doing each other's nails, selling each other Amway, and detailing each other's cars? Is that it? If I wanted to live in the Third World, I'd move there.

[sandnsea]

51. The investor class and those who serve them

I keep saying. Forget the college education. Figure out how the rich make money and follow them. It's the only way.

[elehhhhna]

100. I don't have time to wait for reincarnation.

[sandnsea]

109. Me either

I'm afraid I'm in the peon server category for life. :(

[classic1]

57. don't do that

you make much more money here. Trust me

[sandnsea]

82. Now that is just brainwashed

There aren't any wealthy people in other parts of the world? How incredibly naive.

If it's all about hard work, then anybody can hard work themselves to riches anywhere in the world with a capitlist structure. Most countries have capitalist economies these days.

You can even kiss the right asses in communist countries and live very well.

[elehhhhna]

99. you forgot the incredible financial opportunities available in the

poop scooping field.

[GOPFighter]

49. So you judge everyone by your own experience

I was shopping at Food Lion last year and the cashier just broke down and cried while she was ringing me up. I asked her why. She has an invalid mother who needs her care so she can only work certain hours part time. Her Manager just told her they don't need her during those hours anymore. So she just lost her job and her only source of income for her and her mother, and she was devestated. Living in a small, rural town and responsible for caring for her mother, she had no access to training programs, and anyway unemployment was so high in that part ofthe state, part-time jobs were almost impossible to find.

Next time I see this woman I'll pass on your advice to stop whining, suck it up, and give thanks to the great free-market system that makes corporations - and their CEOs - breathtakingly wealthy and outsources American jobs overseas. :puke:

[classic1]

53. I hope you helped her in some way

Even if it was just a hug. Did you offer to buy her any food?
Instead of putting your money and energy into being angry at this country try helping those who are less fortunate then you. Maybe you can help care for her invalid mother a day or two a week

I only judge myself and try to share my experiences with others if I think I can help.

[GOPFighter]

63. No, you called those who have lost their jobs "whiners"

I gave her a hug and talked to her (that's how I know about her circumstances). I was only passing trough (I live 180 miles away) so there was no chance to help her through the crisis.

Most people, after the shock wers off, DO try to get training or find another job or start their own business, and some succeed, but some begin a downward spiral of dispair and unemployment through NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN. And I'm not angry at this country, I'm angry at our President and Republicans for being so insensitive to the people, the workers, of this country.

[HughBeaumont]

72. But see, YOU'RE NOT HELPING.

"Suck it up" isn't a solution. "Stop whining" isn't a solution. Corporations are placing profits over people and there's nothing at all new on the horizon for those not meant for college to gravitate to. We make nothing anymore and stocking shelves pays 1/3 as much as assembling an automobile.

Our "leaders" are leaving us high and dry and nothing is being done about it. Joe Sixpack isn't going to invent his way out of this mess like he did in the 80s.

[elehhhhna]

101. classic, headsup:

we tend to be suspicious of new people.

Your story is valid and helpful but a bit of compassion goes a long way here--both ways, in fact.

[TheWatcher]

124. Dear GOD you are a piece of work.

And why don't you list for us what you have gotten off YOUR ass and done to help the less fortunate.

This should be "rich".

As for suspicion of new people goes, although we have to be careful not to get out of hand and be suspicious unneccessarily, I'm sorry, with THIS one, it's warranted.

Just check her posting history, it fits the bill.

She obviously has no concept of what some in this country go through.

And it doesn't sound to me like she's experienced true hardship either or been faced with it.

[oneighty]

61. Ah! A true Horatio Alger story.

I am very proud of you but find it depressing that you find it necessary to tell people to stop the "whining and complaining."

Just one old man's opinion.

180

PS welcome to DU I think.

[Straight Shooter]

69. So you're a "people person"

But you think a person who is a factory type person should reprogram themselves. Okay. You did mention "what you always wanted to do." What if these people were doing "what they always wanted to do"?

I hear no empathy from your perch of judgment.

[Ignis]

75. I call shenanigans on this story!

1. 25+ years ago, most of the persons working in technical positions in the US--especially SysAdmin positions--were most decidedly NOT former teachers...let alone former Liberal Arts teachers.

2. Any competent (or even semi-conscious) UNIX sysadmin with 25+ years experience should be making decent money. Depending on the market and the industry in which you worked, that should amount to around $80-100k . If you were suddenly able to make a comparable salary by running a home-based skincare business with minimal training and absolutely no real-world experience, please share your secret with us. IT is hard work, and I'd much rather exfoliate and moisturize for a living, too!

3. Despite the specters of outsourcing, lack of formal training, and post-dot-com glut of skilled tech workers that supposedly haunt the IT industry, SysAdmins will always be in demand. Starting a company? You need IT. Shutting down a company? You need IT. Selling a company and transferring assets? You need IT. There may no longer be a need for as many webmonkeys as there was in 1999, but it's ludicrous to expect us to believe that there is presently very little demand for hands-on sysadmins with 25+ years experience.

4. Manufacturing jobs--be it for the auto industry or no--are not often considered to be high-tech jobs.

I don't mean to offend. Just calling it as I see it from a perspective with 15+ years of real experience (sysadmin, MIT, DIT, TRM) in the IT field.

Best of luck with the career as a fiction writer, though. ;)

[jackster]

83. Well well well, that entire post

and especially this line "There is money to be made out there YOU need to get off your @ss and stop expecting someone else to do it for you" proves you're in the wrong forum. Free Republic is at www.freerepublic.com

[SoCalDem]

92. Lucky Duck...

[sproutster]

118. F U. Typical. How much did you make?

Did you have kids?
Did you have insurance?
Did you have no job while.. oh you were taking night classes while still covered.
Did you have a mortage?

Kiss my ass - you are all that is wrong with the world.

[DiverDave]

140. I'm interested in your take on my experience:

I got hurt at work, had to have 2 surgery's to get my knee back to some sort of usability.
The docs told me I shouldn't drive a truck anymore.
I went to the state vocational rehabilitation and they told me that I would have to pay some to go to computer school (another scam, but another story).
You see the training funds were cut, by "libertarian" minded folks, why should THEY pay for me getting hurt?, Right?
So I do well in school, but, alas, there was a burst in the computer field, lots of folks with much more experience than me are competing for entry level jobs.
I had to take out another loan to keep my house, so I have 2 loans to pay off.
So, according to your"pull myself up by my bootstraps" philosophy, I've done all I was supposed to, right?
Well, I am back to driving a truck, over the advice from my doctors.
I will need more surgery as a result.
So, miss I did it so can you, WHAT did I do wrong?
Smug, self righteous, THINGS (I cant call you what I really want to) like you can shove your "advice" right up your behind.
Oh, congrats on showing us that if you have unlimited money, you can change jobs.

[sendero]

141. Hey..

... I embrace your plan. I hope that 500 auto workers take up the same line of work you are doing and run you out of business.

After all, we can all just "work hard" doing each others' nails, a pure service economy with nobody creating wealth through manufacturing or creation is perfectly sustainable.

The problem in this country is that too many folks think folks like you actually have a valid point. Dumbing down, I think it is called.

[Midlodemocrat]

142. Here. Have a granite cookie. They're good for the complexion.

[classic1]

46. I chose to view it as anew chapter in my life

a challenge. I didn't ask anyone for money to get retrained, I was able to pay for it myself.

You should look into it again only with a different attitude.

[insane_cratic_gal]

64. how much were you making at the time

1980's one of the few in your class in CT I'd say you were in the top 10% 100k

those lazy workers you so call deem them. aren't making half of what you were making.

You have a huge wake up call coming, it's called Karma.

What happens when those rich baby boomer's don't want to buy your skin care products because its' an expense they can no longer afford? Comes around goes around, try looking outside of your ego for bit and see the real world.

[juajen]

79. WOW, look up the word, supercilious, memorize it

and repeat it every morning as you gaze in the mirror congratulating yourself on your brilliance. Just sayin'.

[TheWatcher]

125. Hey, Princess Warbucks

What about those who CAN'T pay for it themselves?

You should pull your head out of your ass and start looking at things from a realistic point of view.

Your Tombstone cannot come soon enough.

[Lisa0825]

62. I work for the program that is supposed to provide retraining!

The damned regime keeps publicizing that they are providing so-and-so much dollars per person for retraining (last I heard was $3000), but they keep cutting our damned training budgets! We were supposed to squeeze the extra money out of our current budget somehow I guess! :mad:

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

7. "Let him eat cake!"

http://www.wnyc.org/news/articles/55934

NEW YORK, NY, January 11, 2006 — State Controller Alan Hevesi says, Wall-Street companies paid out a record total of 21 and a half billion dollars in year-end bonuses. That translates into average bonuses of more than $125,000 per worker.

Hevesi attributes the big bonuses to exceptional revenue growth, and solid profits, in the securities' industry. The city and state will collect a total of $2 billion from those bonuses.

[Diane R]

8. The world hasn't been like that for a long time.

Sad for the Ford employess, but welcome to the real world. Most of us don't have unlimited job security, with fabulous benefits and vacations. They are just now going to find out how so many other people live. No huge pensions and exorbitant health insurance premiums. Minimum wage jobs.

This is the way of life that Republicans want us to have. A lot of us have had to deal with it for a long time. I cannot imagine the security of being with one company for 35 years.

I wonder how many of those workers voted for bush? My guess is that quite a few did.

[Occulus]

36. "A long time" is within the past twenty years

I remember when there were still people and companies around that were proud to have a pension/strong worker base. These companies gave a lot to their employees and were rewarded with many, many years of loyalty from the employees. And why not? The employees were getting the job benefits including income and a guarantee of a pension/good retirement.

My own father was one of them- until he was fired for being too old. Quite literally; they had sent him all over the country supervising construction projects. He was a project engineer and held a master electrician's license. We were very lucky the pension renege era didn't start until after he had died and they were obligated to pay everything off.

And that's where my generation is: we hop from job to job because often the company just isn't secure enough to provide a "career". I'm lucky, myself, working for USPS; I don't have to worry about being laid off- contractually, they can't do that. I'm sure there will be a major push to alter that during the next contract negotiation, and I'm fine with that; piss the APWU off enough and we will simply realize the trade we made so long ago to keep us from striking simply isn't there anymore- so going on strike is again an option, if that is ever the case (that we lose our no-layoff clause).

And that, people, is the key to a national worker's strike: the APWU et al voting on one themselves. Other unions would quickly follow, and the entire economy would grind to a halt. I think, perhaps, such an action is the only way workers in the US will ever again obtain the rights and protections they had while I was growing up, even during the Reagan years.

It's quickly becoming time for workers to insist upon what they have until now had and have had taken from them. There are triggers within the working population that could set off a national action. We'll see which of those triggers gets pulled in the coming couple years, if things continue as they have (and there is no reason to think that that will not happen).

In any case, my generation looks forward to years and years of work with multiple companies, no secure pensions, multiple retirement plans (any one of which could tank at any time), lower medical benefits, higher living costs, and more costly housing and homes, all at the same time income to support these things is stubbornly refusing to rise- and even while the income gap between the board room and the break room continues to widen.

Something HAS to give, and soon, if America is to survive. The longer it takes, the more drastic the result will be.

Something HAS to happen- sooner, rather than later.

[realisticphish]

9. i desperately want the cable news channels

to lay everyone off, and tell them they have to "retrain" as an autoworker :evilgrin:

[BuelahWitch]

31. Yeah, outsource the anchors!

:bounce:

[insane_cratic_gal]

86. Oo good idea, we might get real news again!

[hippiechick]

10. Comment in our paper (The Indy Star) this morning: Blame Unions.

:wtf: :mad: :wtf: :mad:

[katsy]

bastards...

yeah lobbyists are cool, but don't let the worker bees have a voice or gain power.

:banghead:

everyone should join a union (not seiu) just to help these people out.

[izzybeans]

73. It is a rightwing rag. I'm sure it was presented as news.

I'm not a supporter of Bayh however when they ran him as the top story with his picture next to a picture of a "devilish" looking character (literally) I canceled my subscription. There is only so much Cal Thomas one person can take. It reads like the National Enquirer for Fundamentalists (with an entire Colts and High School basketball section).

Sorry for the rant: long rant short: You don't expect anything less do you? ;)

[hippiechick]

103. It was in Let It Out ...

... which, for the life of me, I can't understand WHY I read, but it's like a daily self-torture ritual for me to read Let It Out online in the morning and then drive to work in a state of aghast disgust at how stupid these people are.


:hi:

[izzybeans]

126. I do that sometimes too.

:hi:

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

12. no problem, kyra says she going to track his progress

[dogday]

14. Just another example of Bush's Reganomics!!

pay no attention to the lay-offs and home-loss. All is right with the world. We are doing great. Mfg jobs are up-most of that figure is in the hamburger sector of mfg mind you....

[Armstead]

17. Saw it -- It was the kind of reality that ought to get on CNN more often

That worker was not the most articulate speaker in the world, but he sure as hell articulated what a lot of real Americans are feeling.

"Education" is just a smokescreen for the real problem, whiuch is a total lack of concern for the plight of the majority of Americans by the corporate and political elite.

Remembr in the 90's, when so many people went to school to get trained for the "new economy" with esotric tech skills? Now those jobs too are being shipped to China.

Increasingly, the only education that does any good in terms of obtaining employment these days is a degree from Hamburger U.

[Broken_Hero]

20. Damn, isn't that the truth...n/t

[Boojatta]

34. Do you really think "education is just a smokescreen"?

"Education" is just a smokescreen for the real problem, which is a total lack of concern for the plight of the majority of Americans by the corporate and political elite.

If there are some companies that want to hire people who have certain educational qualifications, then how can you say that education is just a smokescreen?

Is it possible to modify the public education system to make it more beneficial for students? I think it might be possible.

For example, in California you have to be within 60 days of your 18th birthday (or older than that) to take the GED test. Why not let anybody try the GED? If it's expensive then the authorities can charge a fee.

If someone passes the GED test but "still has more years to go" then why not credit those years to the student who leaves the public education system early so that, when the student needs more education, the student can go back and get that many years of free education?

[justabob]

59. No amount of education can help you if there are no jobs

or too few jobs. Why should someone get a bachelors degree or masters or anything else if they are just going to have to wait tables?

[Armstead]

71. I didn't mean it is irrelevant

Obviously education is important, and tghere are still many good jobs that people can train for.

My point, though, is that all too often, it is presented as the only requirement to maintain a middle class and functioning economy. "These jobs are diappearing? That's okay, we'll just provide training for the new careers that are emerging."......Then a few years later, those "new careers" also start getting shipped overses and what's the response? "That's okay, we'll just provide training for these newer newer jobs."

That's lousy public policy, and it's rotten values and it's crappy economics. Education is one component, but it is only one, and cannot be used to distact attention from otehr necessary policies and values.

[DS1]

21. Well, if they'd all get off their asses and work three jobs Bush would

be able to say he created 90,000 jobs for Ford employees.

/obvious :sarcasm:

[izzybeans]

23. That is the same thing Reagan told GM workers when they

were laid off. "Well... I guess you might go to the career center in your town and learn a new skill."

[Broke In Jersey]

26. Manufacturing is dead in this country!!!

I'm sure there are openings in Asia though.

[gizmo1979]

76. What are you going to sell

once manufacturing is gone?Wheat?There's only so much wheat you can sell.So what will you use to lower the trade deficit?What?

[raccoon]

28. It's not just the Ford workers, but any businessperson or

professional whose customers/clients were mostly Ford workers, is going to see a decline is his/her income too.

[SoCalDem]

38. 40/50-somethings do not WANT career `counseling

They want their BOSSES to own up to the fact that THEIR piss-poor management is always rectified, but the loss of jobs of people who show up every day, do their jobs, and expect to keep that job.

Our 'business-leaders' seem to think that any business reversal can be 'solved' by eliminating the sources of livelihood of their employees.

When you are 40-50 you don't have the time to "re-train". There are house payments to be made, college tuition to be paid, probably car payments to be made, and people can get a little testy when they realize that they cannot afford COBRA medical payments when they are on unemployment, so now their family will have no medical insurance now..(or ever again)

[HughBeaumont]

74. Like you can simply put your life on hold while you retrain.

Doesn't work that way, I REALLY hate to tell Repukes.

[kineneb]

133. and lots of businesses won't hire them

Age discrimination is alive and well.
for the 40-65 crowd:
1. no time to retrain
2. no good-paying jobs available
3. employers unwilling to hire "older" persons
4. such jobs that are available have poor pay and no benefits

any wonder they are depressed?

[SoCalDem]

135. That's why a lot of them kill themselves

:(.. I had a friend who was laid off at 52, and his wife was so scared he would try it. he was depressed for months.. he did bounce back but it took a few years, and he did find work again, but he ended up with a $40K a year CUT in pay :(..

[Leftist_Warrior]

40. Bush isn't the only guily party, the Unions share some of that blame. n/t

[GOPFighter]

50. Why?

[elehhhhna]

102. Because if they'd never had raises, benefits, or protection they

wouldn't be so shocked now. See? Unions -- they spoiled us!

[B Calm]

70. Thats a right-wing talking point!

[gizmo1979]

77. Wow.

Because they made a decent wage?Because they fought for decent benefits?They don't control what the product looks like or how it acts,they just assemble what they are told to assemble.

[lastliberalintexas]

104. God you are so right

Damn those unions for thinking workers are entitled to pensions, healthcare and a living wage that is still about 300 times less than the top execs make. :eyes:

[Beaverhausen]

112. Maybe Ford should try to build some cars people actually want to buy!

They screwed themselves by not realizing that big gas guzzlers weren't going to sell anymore.

Bill Ford Jr. and the others at the top of the company need to pay for the training of all these employees themselves. Out of their own pockets.

[senseandsensibility]

130. hun?

Care to explain that remark? I guess not.

[Niche]

45. My mother/Union Worker is retiring after 30 years....

Thank god she's getting out in three months. Thank god she's got a union to back her.

All a corp. has to do is go bankrupt to steal pensions.... sad, sad times.

[Marie26]

48. But even after you retire...

the companies can still take away the pension plan or health benefits. It happened to the Diebold workers, and it seems to be the trend for companies that are seeking to decrease their costs.

[The Backlash Cometh]

52. Kyra is an asswipe. Education and retraining is becoming a

service industry.

[SammyWinstonJack]

55. These bottom feeders aka media news readers are sooo smug

in the knowledge that their jobs can't be outsourced. However, insourcing their cushy jobs would be a nice comeuppance for them! :evilgrin:

[earth mom]

56. We're in a class war...

Cnn and Bush Co want to see the unions go down! The Bastards!!! :grr:

[malaise]

93. And the more layoffs the sooner

the people will wake up and react

[newportdadde]

65. What do you train for, white collar is going offshore.

I work in IT, we haven't hired anyone here in our depart of several hundred people in.... FIVE YEARS+. Infact we have lost something like a 1/3 through retirement, regular departures etc and the slack is being sent to India. Hell we don't even keep the grunt programming work here anymore to TEACH a noobie how a system works.

I can't imagine being 45 and hit with this garbage.

Here is the bottom line, you just killed the buying power of 30k workers plus all of their suppliers. When they made 25$ an hour they could take some trips, buy some sports tickets, get a new car, new DVD player, you know part of our consumer driven economy. Now making 10$ thats not going to happen so CEO's don't bitch about sales when you turn around and find them down for the year, thank your friends.

[lastliberalintexas]

106. Yes, the ripple effect should be huge, unfortunately

30,000 jobs means a ton of money lost in other areas, and much less (or even no) disposable income for those families. Rather scary to think about.

[havocmom]

115. And when they made $25/hr, they paid more payroll & sales taxes too

Plus their employer paid a bit of payroll taxes to keep the system going. It is not just lost commerce, it's $$ lost to the Treasuries of fed, state & local governments. It means more places raise property taxes as sales tax revenue falls off. That hits the middle class and elderly disproportionately.

[B Calm]

68. I retrained and now make 1/2 as much as I use to...

[ArmchairMeme]

85. CEOs

When will corporations recognize that when the majority of people are unemployed they cannot purchase the products they are trying to sell?

The CEOs keep getting bonuses for laying off workers. They walk the halls with great smiles.

When a CEO doesn't get the promised million dollar bonus will they realize that it's no longer business as usual.

I was laid off and am still unemployed. The few jobs within 50 miles offer 1/2 the pay I had been receiving.

[Selatius]

90. CEOs realize what you are saying perfectly well.

Poor people can't buy anything. Why are they poor? Because they were robbed, tricked, and cheated out of their money over the course of years, perhaps even decades. It wasn't the typical kind of robbery where a gun is used and where your wallet is stolen in a few seconds. No, they don't work that way. They don't steal your wallet. They steal your future in a slow, deliberate fashion. Your future now rests in the bank accounts of the shareholders and of Mr. CEO.

They'll walk away and go home to their gigantic estates with high walls and private security, a modern day equivalent of the self-sufficient feudal manor run by the landlord. The economy on the outside could be imploding, yet these lords would continue to live in comfort using their servants and guards to protect their luxurious lifestyle and the money used to sustain that lifestyle, money stolen from everybody else. When everything outside is in ruins, they will re-emerge and exert their power over the countryside once more.

[lastliberalintexas]

107. Because they have a new consumer class

It happens to be in India and China, but CEOs don't care where the products and services are sold, so long as they continue to make money.

[rman]

137. Corps/CEOs act as though they no longer depend on US consumer market

And fact is there are emerging markets elsewhere (ie China, India).

I don't think CEOs care one bit exactly where their money comes from, as long as it ends up in their (off-shore) bank accounts.

[brook]

95. Same boat.

Used to make $30 an hour in a specialized part time field.I was able to help my kids -(I was a single mom) and buy a house. Forced out before vesting through an industry-wide 'gray list'. Lost the house, etc..

Now working 15 hrs. per week for the princely sum of 7.50 because that's what's out there. I'm in my 70's and this is "what it is" -to quote a previous poster.

Seen enough smug to know smug, I might add.

[Hubert Flottz]

78. It shouldn't take long to learn to flip burgers!

Or clean up barff in Wally World!

[Cobalt Violet]

80. Or "paper or plastic?" n/t

[Swamp Rat]

84. This is just the beginning.

Then comes the mass exodus of highly skilled workers... doctors, nurses, professors, engineers, etc.

:hi:

[SammyWinstonJack]

94. In sourcing should take of those professions.

But hey, at least Gays can't marry and God Bless guns/organized religion and Pat Robertson rules! :sarcasm:

USA! USA! USA! :patriot: :puke:

[SPKrazy]

96. Lay F*cking Kyra off

what the hell would she do?

I probably can't use the word on here, but let's just say she is already a media whore, so without the media, she would be.........?

What other skills does she have?

Shit, what a terrible thing to say to someone who just lost their job

[w8liftinglady]

105. This guy was 59 years old-been with Ford 38 years

you could tell his soul had been ripped out.They tried all the happy-feel good catch phrases...but the bottom line is when you're 59,and your experience is limited to one area,you are looking at working double shifts at the "wag and bag" to make ends meet.

[elehhhhna]

114. I ihear the coalmines need a few more people lately.

[Jamison]

108. It's sad.

What are we going to do as a country when it gets to the point where there is 80% unemployment, and the jobs that are available for the 20% who are employed pay no better than $6.50 an hour or so?

[bleedingheart]

111. he would be better off moving to India where the jobs are going...

cuz that is the simple truth.

Retrain for what???? The corporate elite are slithering all over the planet looking for the downtrodden and desparately poor who will make cars and tennis shoes for pennies a day...

[devilgrrl]

116. Well life is what you make it - so too f***ing bad!

Maybe he should have gone into another profession! :sarcasm:

[Deja Q]

117. Deliberate brain drain...

Population control and pure profiteering.

It may kill our country, but at least they'll get rich.

Trouble is, when our economy is nixed, it'll take everything down with them. That is why we get angry when all these oil companies want to start traading in the Euro instead. America can never allow that.

[RPM]

121. see Pittsburgh circa 1984

plenty of former steelworkers become nurses around that time.

23% unemployment

high suicide rate

been there done that....

[Ilsa]

127. Like what, Kyra? Not everyone is cut out to be soldiers or nurses.

Sure, train for another job only to see it outsourced to India.

[Ilsa]

128. Is Congress making $ available for retraining Kyra?

These "reporters" are so out of touch with reality.