Who Is The Best President We Ever Had?

[Dinger]

If you can get it down to one that is. I can't, but if I had to, was FORCED to pick one, it'd probably be Abraham Lincoln.

[mad-mommy]

1. Bill Clinton

[Dinger]

6. Now, You're Making Me Pay . . .

It is indeed a hard choice, but I guess I made it. Oh, if Bill were only in the White House yet. . . .

[calico1]

71. FDR

Guided us through the Depression and a World War. Can you imagine if Bush had been President then? The Nazis surely would have taken us over and we would all be poor.

[Nite Owl]

2. FDR

he was there for the people of this country when a President was needed the most.

[Benhurst]

7. I agree.

And if he had been of another generation, I don't think old Ma Bush would have ever considered him her adopted son.

[yourout]

8. FDR

[Hepburn]

21. Totally agree.

I have been an FDR fan since I was in grade school in the 1950s.

[Kiouni]

25. yeah FDR takes the cake.

[ComerPerro]

35. and not only that, he did more than just provide the illusion of a leader

which is all Bush seems to care to try to do.

Its all fake with Bush...

[Zomby Woof]

36. I disagree

FDR was great in some ways - but his weaknesses nearly overshadowed his strengths.

To point:

His succumbing to pressure from western senators to inter Americans of Japanese descent into concentration camps, depriving them of liberty without due process.

His ridiculous attempt to pack the Supreme Court.

His failure to enact or enforce anti-lynching laws, so that he wouldn't alienate southern Democrats. LBJ faced a similar dilemma with Civil Rights laws in the 60's, but he did it anyway, knowing that the freedom and equality of Americans MUST trump political expediency. If not for Vietnam... what might have been.

Although FDR's charisma and optimism in leading us through the Depression is commendable, and his command of World War II deserves plaudits, his flaws keep him from being the best. The New Deal ultimately saved capitalism from itself (in spite of right-wing propaganda that it was socialism), by enhancing its role and prevalence in American life - namely, through the rise of ubiquitous consumerism, the American Disease.

FDR was a great president, but by no means the greatest.

[geniph]

102. Zomby, you ignorant slut!

:hi:

Hey, in 14 years, he's entitled to some horrid mistakes...but they are balanced, for the most part, by the stunning successes. Principal among these being his recognition that, if the us did not move to regulated capitalism and a more equitable system of wealth distribution, we were headed down a bloody road to revolution.

So who would YOU pick? Zachary Taylor?

;-)

[alphafemale]

FDR. If only society would have accepted that he needed a wheelchair...

...most of the time. And he if in those times he could have openly used mobility aids. Many other people adapting to similar circumstances, (and everyone else) would have had a powerful, inspiring role model.

[alphafemale]

39. Delete/Double post

[Yupster]

62. I'll go # 2 for FDR

To me there have been two presidents that are far above all the others.

They are Washington and FDR.

Washington is tops because he could have made the presidency and even the USA into anything he wanted, and he put the country far ahead of himself.

FDR is # 2 because he faced a crisis and was far-sighted enough to change the direction of the country to tackle it.

I think Lincoln was a poor president, in the bottom half of all presidents for his bumbling, Bush-like handling of the secession crisis.

I think Herbert Hoover is the most under-rated president.

[lumberjack_jeff]

86. Yup. n/t

[Mr_Spock]

3. Bill Clinton

.

[Imagevision]

111. If Hillary is elected, Bill will be stronger the second time around

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

4. Washington. Had the opportunity to be "President for Life" i.e. King

Recognized the value of "by the people/for the people".
Good for him. MKJ

[spoony]

64. That's the first thing that popped into my head

He's one of those all-too-rare people in powerful positions who turn down the chance to gain MORE power. To think that the American experiment could've ended right there!

[leftofthedial]

5. FDR

Washington also was good.

Lincoln was the most overrated (discounting the ideologues who make it currently fashionable to idolize raygun)

Clinton was excellent in many respects, but his legacy viewed in the context of concentration of wealth, failure to address the healthcare problems we faced, NAFTA CAFTA and a woefully inadequate attention to looming environmental disaster, won't get such good marks.

king george, of course, is the worst ever. If you take his two terms seperately, he is both worst and next-to-worst.

[rwheeler31]

9. FDR

nt

[1620rock]

10. Kennedy: he put a man on the moon. America's finest hour. n/t

[bobbie]

12. If Kennedy hadn't been the victim of a coup

He would have become one of the greatest. He was a fine person.

[Odin2005]

44. I disagree. IMO he was all style with little substance.

Most of his stuff paled in comparison the LBJ's Great Society programs. There was the Bay of Pigs debacle, and significant envolvement in Vietnam started under him, and I think escalation of US envolvement in Vietman would of still happened (grabs flame-retardant suit). The current idolization of JFK is just a result of mix of his charisma + impact of TV + the conspiracy theories surrounding the assasination.

[bobbie]

63. Disagree with your disagreement, JFK was killed *because* of substance

The Bay of Pigs debacle was due to a CIA run amok (a fact both Eisenhower and Truman commented on). It was planned under Eisenhower and JFK inherited it. In spite of the fact that the CIA was inept and blew a covert op, then wanted an *overt* op to bail them out, JFK was classy enough to publicly take the heat.

Regarding the Vietnam policy of JFK vs LBJ, I think it would help to look at facts.

One fact is that JFK was getting the US out of Vietnam:
-------------------------------------------------------

"NSAM 263, signed on Oct. 11, 1963, recommended that:

"A program be established to train Vietnamese so that essential functions now
performed by U.S. military personnel can be carried out by Vietnamese by the end
of 1965. It should be possible to withdraw the bulk of U.S. personnel by that
time.

"In accordance with the program to train progressively Vietnamese to take over
military functions, the Defense Department should announce in the very near
future presently prepared plans to withdraw 1000 U.S. military personnel by the
end of 1963. This action should be explained in low key as an initial step in a
long-term program to replace U.S. personnel with trained Vietnamese without
impairment of the war effort" (Pentagon Papers, NY: Bantam, 1971, pp. 211-212).

The withdrawal policy was confirmed at a news conference on Oct. 31, where
Kennedy said in response to a reporter's question if there was "any speedup in
the withdrawal from Vietnam":

"I think the first unit or first contingent would be 250 men who are not
involved in what might be called front-line operations. It would be our hope to
lessen the number of Americans there by 1000, as the training intensifies and is
carried on in South Vietnam"
http://eserver.org/govt/gulf-war/jfk-lbj-and-vietnam.txt

However, due to the coup that took JFK's life (likely because of his Vietnam policy and rift with the CIA over Cuba), LBJ seized power.

Now lets look at the facts about LBJ's buildup in Vietnam:
----------------------------------------------------------

LBJ increased US involvement in Vietnam based on the a lie--the supposed Gulf of Tonkin incident.

"President Lyndon Johnson on Aug. 5, 1964 said, "As president and commander-in-chief, it is my duty to the American people to report that renewed hostile actions against United States ships on the high seas in the Gulf of Tonkin have today required me to order the military forces of the United States to take action in reply." As we later learned, there was no unprovoked attack and Johnson's lie opened the door under the Gulf of Tonkin Resolution for the United States to expand the Vietnam War.

More than 58,000 Americans would eventually die and 304,000 young Americans would be wounded in over a decade of fighting..."
http://www.military.com/NewContent/0,13190,Defensewatch_103003_PSL,00.html

Also at the time JFK was murdered, he was doing the following:
--------------------------------------------------------------

-Pursuing peace with Russia by signing the nuclear test ban treaty, promising not to invade Cuba (actually negotiated during the Missile Crisis), and gives a major speech at American University making it clear he wants to end the cold war.
-Printing US currency instead of Federal Reserve currency (to prevent us from paying interest on our own money).
-Planning to reduce or eliminate the oil depletion allowance that is a major factor in making Texas oil moguls so rich.
-Making it very clear that he thinks the CIA are out of control and wants them eliminated.

He was killed precisely because he was making substantial changes. Policy changes the war profiteers didn't want.

Oh, and JFK didn't have as much time as LBJ to leave a legacy. The CIA, with LBJ's help, saw to that.

[never_get_over_it]

78. I don't think JFK was the greatest

but he might have been right up there had he not been killed. LBJ's Great Society programs might have come from Kennedy in a second term - and my understanding is JFK's plans were to get us the hell out of Vietnam. Of course we don't know if these things would have happened - but I don't think its fair to criticize him for not getting more done in less than three years in office...but I do admit he is idolized probably more than is warranted - but lets face it he died in office - so if he gave his life and people want to idolize him than so be it....

I also think JFK gave a lot of people hope and he was very inspirational in his speeches....

[bobbie]

100. I hate to be a ditto-head never_get_over_it, but...

I agree with everything you said. And you said it better (and more succinctly :)) than I could have.

JFK was brave. Brave in the real sense; he had the courage of his convictions, his very UNpopular (with the CIA and armed forces) convictions. He knew damn well his enemies were very very mean, yet he showed what he was made of and pursued *peace*. That takes courage to oppose the war machine.

Obviously he didn't knew just how mean his enemies were though...I don't think anyone could have known that in 1963. Eisenhower tried to warn him, and us, but we just didn't get it.

Then again by 1968 MLK knew how mean they were, he knew. And he died for pretty much the same reason. He spoke peace to power.

[Monkeyman]

14. Agree

[A HERETIC I AM]

19. It was Kennedy's idea but it happened under Nixon

so he deserves as much credit too if for no other reason than the funding continued. Also, Nixon, for all his personal faults, was probably one of the greatest we ever had in the foreign poicy arena in spite of Viet Nam. He went to the Soviet Union AND China and truly broke ground with those two countries. It could be argued his visits were the beginning of the end of the Cold War.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

26. Johnson had more funding time under his watch

5 years. When Nixon got in the thing was almost finished.

[NoSheep]

34. That is one of the most ...amazing posts I've read on DU. n/t

[NoSheep]

56. Man on the moon. I had to elaborate.

[lumberjack_jeff]

87. self delete

[bobbie]

11. Lincoln

eom

[Mojambo]

13. FDR. n/t

[Spider Jerusalem]

15. Franklin Delano Roosevelt.

I'd put Lincoln at number two, and Washington third. You can debate the order, but I don't think you can argue that those three are our country's greatest presidents.

I can only assume that anyone who says "Bill Clinton" isn't particularly versed in history (or perhaps they're overwhelmed with nostalgia for the years before the current administration); he's not even in the running. Top twenty, and possibly top ten, but I'd rank Thomas Jefferson, Theodore Roosevelt, Andrew Jackson, and possibly JFK and Harry Truman (and maybe one or two others) ahead of him.

[Poiuyt]

16. I would say FDR because he led us through not one, but two national

disasters... The great depresion and WWII

As a previous voter said, Washington was also great. He kept the republic together when many forces were trying to tear it apart.

[ruiner4u]

17. RONALD REAGAN!!!!!

Just kidding... :)

[NoSheep]

33. I am the world's most gullible. I was about to tear you a new...ASSHOLE!

[lumberjack_jeff]

89. Are you series?!!! n/t

[SammyWinstonJack]

93. !

:spray:

[Ninja Jordan]

18. 1) Lincoln, 2) FDR, 3) Jefferson

As tempting as it is to put FDR no. 1 (because he is THE Democrat of all time), Lincoln is the reason the United States is, well, the United States.

[Nevernose]

20. Truman. After that, FDR.

Truman was a guy who won through by force of chracter alone. "The buck stops here." This was a guy who made the hardest political decisions imaginable -- from dropping the atomic bomb on Japan, to integrating the armed forces, to firing General MacArthur.

Go out an read "Letters to Bess." Or at least watch "Mr. Smith Goes to Washington," which was very loosely based on Harry S. Truman.

The guy had morals and ethics, and stood up for them, regardless of political consequences. That's why he defeated Dewey, and that's why he's an American Hero.

After that, I'll go with FDR, who established the good parts of America, and whose memory preserves them.

[ieoeja]

98. For the record on MacArthur.

Truman had no choice. 24 hours before the second Chinese offensive US Marine Gen. Smith, commanding 1st Division, sent formal notification to the Commandant of the Marine Corps that he had withdrawn the US Marines in Korea from under MacArthur's command. Within the next forty-eight all non-US commanders -- except for the commander from Turkey who died along with his entire command -- would inform their countries' governments they were doing the same.

Outside of his remaining occupation forces in Japan (most were in Korea with the Marines), Mac lost his entire command BEFORE Truman fired him. On top of that MacArthur lied to the SAC commander when he ordered him to use use atomic weapons on the Chinese in Korea.

Truman's courage vis-a-vis MacArthur was in taking responsiblity on himself and firing Mac for "political reasons". He could have easily gone the "it was Clinton's fault" route. Of course, it WAS Truman's fault. The Joint Chiefs of Staff had tried 12 times to fire MacArthur before the second Chinese offensive, but Truman denied them.

[hogwyld]

22. here are my rankings

1. George Washington. Voluntarily gave up power when he could have been king.
2. FDR Needs no explanation
3. JFK Oh, what a wonderful presidency cut short.
4. Theodore Roosevelt The first socially liberal president. Broke up the monopolies, and worked towards workers rights, and environmental protections.
5. Abraham Lincoln Brought together a nation in opposition to slavery.
6. Dwight D. Eisenhower Unmatched prosperity, and he actually despised the M.I. complex.
7. Thomas Jefferson Continued in the building of the nation that G.W. started
8. John Adams and the other original colonists.
Anyone bold and brave enough to sign their name on the Declaration telling the original King George off, kissing substantial wealth away, and possible physical harm in the pursuit of liberty deserves great respect no matter what party they belong. Feel free to ridicule my list.

[TygrBright]

23. Washington. He defined the Presidency...

...by his dignity, integrity, and commitment to a whole new form of government. He had the choice to make it a lifetime office and refused. His "Farewell Address" is one of the great documents of this Republic.

His vision of the Presidency lasted 204 years, pretty damn' good by any standards.

nostalgically,
Bright

[Rowdyboy]

24. Easy question....Thomas Jefferson.....

as a student of American history, I can't imagine any other serious answer.

He bought the fucking western half of the country people! What more do you ask?

[Zomby Woof]

30. Have you studied his second term?

It damn near undid the accomplishments of his first term, let alone nearly unravel the country and the economy completely. It was the most disastrous second term of any president in history, excluding possibly Reagan and obviously the current pretender.

Jefferson didn't even rate himself highly - there was a reason he left his presidency off his tombstone. The Embargo Act of 1807 to name one.

[Rowdyboy]

41. He was a classy, modest man in an age when modesty was admired.....

No one is perfect, but the question was "Who is the president you most admire?". In my case, Thomas Jefferson is clearly my answer.

However, I tend to trust your opinion (after 4+ freaking years on DU) so I'll ask you the obvious question....What was so disastrous about his second term?

Its late tonight, I'm a lot messed up, and my mind is VERY foggy right now, but I just can't imagine what TJ did in his seconds term to deserve your strong disrespect.

I am, however, always willing to learn.....

[Zomby Woof]

47. To clarify my intentions...

I have long admired Jefferson, and have studied him with intense fascination for years. It is impossible to study him, favorably or otherwise, with detachment or indifference. He is much too important a figure to dismiss lightly, and you are entitled to a better explanation of my post.

I share his own view that he had considerably greater accomplishments - namely his authoring of the Statute of Religious Freedom in Virginia (planting the seeds of the First Amendment), his authoring of the Declaration of Independence, and his numerous scientific and horticultural studies and inventions. He took considerable pride in founding the University of Virginia. As governor of Virginia, he enacted many laws favorable to the yeoman farmers he often romantically (Jefferson was perhaps the most romantic of all the founders) promoted, and adverse to the very aristocracy from which he sprang (namely laws concerning land grants to heirs, and establishing public schools, etc.). But for the second term...

The Embargo Act of 1807 sought to punish Britain for their strict trade policies against the U.S., as well as their impressment of American sailors on the high seas. France, once Jefferson's natural ally, also engaged in prohibitive trade practices. The embargo stopped all American exports to ports abroad, and did not allow any foreign ships to take American cargo at our ports. It didn't stop importation, but few ships were sent from abroad, because they would have returned home empty. It ended up punishing American merchants and farmers instead. Britain did ease up on impressments, but that was mainly because starving American sailors jumped ship and joined the British navy anyway, rendering most impressment moot. Northeastern ports engaged in smuggling across the Canadian border, as the one unintended benefit was a growth of the textile industry. Nevertheless, it brought America great economic isolation and ruin, and Jefferson paid heavily for it. Ultimately, it failed to prevent the War of 1812, a result of lingering failures of the Act.

Now, if I were to rate his presidency based on his first term alone, I would be inclined to rate him as among the top 4 or 5 presidents. As for his second term - the Embargo Act, the fallout from the Burr conspiracy, and sowing the seeds of a pending useless war mitigates his legacy a great deal.

If you have not done so, I highly recommend reading Henry Adams' History of the United States During the Administrations of Thomas Jefferson 1801-1809. The depth of research, the breadth of content, as well as the intimate writing style of Adams, is unsurpassed in Jeffersonian scholarship. Jefferson was certainly more than the sum of his presidency, no matter the highs of his first term, or the lows of the second. Never would I disrespect him outright, as was never my intention.

[Rowdyboy]

52. I haven't read the book you suggest but I'm certainly willing to do so...

As a history major, I really appreciate your serious response to my question. I hate to admit it, but I really need to study this period (1804-1808) a little more closely if I want to comment intelligently.

My support of Jefferson extends well beyond his presidency. He is, perhaps, the one person I most respect in American history. We all have our prejudices, and he's one of mine.

[Zomby Woof]

60. I got my degree in history too

So I enjoy sharing insights with others of the same background.

Have you ever visited Monticello? I have been there 4 times over the past 26 years. Like a gem, you see a different facet every time you hold up it up to the light - just like the man himself.

The Adams book is a must-read. Every contemporary account of Jefferson footnotes it somewhere. Outside of Jefferson's own writings, it's Ground Zero for Jeffersonian scholarship. You won't regret it. :-)

[immoderate]

27. In my lifetime, it's JFK.

He made you want to be a better person.

Otherwise, George Washington. He made this country. Jefferson helped.

--IMM

[Arkham House]

28. JFK, for one simple reason--

--he singlehandedly saved the world from nuclear annihilation during the Cuban Missile Crisis. Any other President--any one, especially Nixon had he been elected in '60--would have bowed to the pressure from the Pentagon and attacked Cuba, thereby triggering World War III. Had that happened, there would have been no "history", and no more America...

[nevergiveup]

29. Lincoln,

FDR, Washington, and Eisenhower.

[Synnical]

31. I'm torn FDR or Jefferson?

In my lifetime - get this, it would be Carter for his support of the Constitution, but Nixon didn't suck all that much, and had the grace to support his conservative nature. And he did start the EPA.

[zulchzulu]

32. Jefferson was a friggin' stud

FDR...Lincoln...JFK...

...but Jefferson really laid out a lot of what America is and should be.

On edit: Every great President certainly has something that we can find unsuccessful, disastrous or not something to be fully proud of. I'm thinking about the overall imprint that the "best President" had with America.

[Quixote1818]

59. True, but did he do those things as president?

I think Jefferson was a master at designing how our government would work and how it's laws would be drawn out, however as a president I think he was good but not the greatest. He and Madison were the two most important founding fathers.

[zulchzulu]

80. Like all good presidents, Jefferson was a complicated leader

Lincoln could be considered a heathen for getting rid of habeas corpus during his time, FDR could be considered a heathen for allowing Pearl Harbor to happen, JFK for his womanizing and sending advisors to Viet Nam...

It's all good...

[Skittles]

37. in my lifetime, Bill Clinton

absolutely

[MrSlayer]

38. F.D. Motherfuckin R.

We need another.

[alittlelark]

49. The pic in your post could well be the next FDR

I would fight for him in 2008... to the death.

[hijinx87]

40. lincoln

the great emancipator, and without him the VA/MD boarder would be
an international boundary. and his second inaugural was quite
possibly the greatest speech ever written in the english language.

and then washington. it fell to him to decide, just for example, what
"advise and consent of the senate" meant when nominating supreme
court judges. nothing was defined, everything was up in the air,
and he was supremely conscious of the fact that every decision he
made relative to actual operation of the new country was likely
to become precedent.

[patrick t. cakes]

42. JFK.....

after bay of pigs, saw the light.
and "they" killed him for it.

[Zomby Woof]

43. In defense of Abraham Lincoln

Quite simply, above all other accomplishments, he preserved the union. But that alone would be insufficient to deem him the greatest of presidents, if preserving the union meant restoring the pre-war status quo.

He engineered the course of the Civil War so that it became defined not just as a struggle to preserve the union, but to free human beings from bondage. He was quite simply the most brilliant politician to hold the office. His cabinet was comprised of rivals with many divergent gifts and abilities which he was able to steer for maximum effect. His speechwriting was simply the most substantial, relevant, poetic, and graceful of every president. He was a product of his time, yes, with clay feet (his outlook on the future of black Americans was bleak, as evidenced by his lip service given to the then common idea of deporting them to colonies and so forth), but nevertheless a figure of formidable virtue. It's impossible to conceive of any list of the two or three greatest presidents without him, unless you're an unreconstructed Confederate apologist, or willfully ignorant of our history.

[Bucky]

51. His original freedmen policies weren't farsighted, but by the war's end...

Lincoln's policy was clearly aligned with what Frederick Douglass was suggesting--treat all blacks like they have basic human rights, including the right not to be deported. The abortive attempt to establish a freedmen's colony in Central America along with the dismal performance of Liberia convinced Lincoln that wholesale deportations was not the answer. In the end, his policy was to let born Americans stay in America and to establish some agencies thru Congress to ensure their political rights in the South (but nothing in the pro-Union states).

Lincoln unquestionably had the biggest and most complicated set of challenges ever set before an American president before or since.

[Zomby Woof]

55. That's why I said "lip service"

Because I think time would have proved Douglass right, had Lincoln lived out his term. Lincoln was uncanny in how he let his true intentions evolve, so when the time and tide were right, he could reveal them just when they would have their most profound impact. Still, being of an often melancholy disposition, he feared for the future problems which would beset black Americans as newly integrated free people. I do not think that even when he entertained the deportation idea early on, it was without good intentions, despite the naivete it displayed or harm it may have entailed. Still, by expressing these views, he was probably setting everything up for his later revisions as circumstances would allow. Douglass admittedly underestimated, and even scorned Lincoln in his first few years in office. But like many others by war's end, he too had come to see Lincoln's gift for timing and genius for statesmanship.

[Odin2005]

45. 1. FDR

2. Lincoln
3. Washington
4. Teddy Roosevelt
5. Thomas Jefferson

[morgan2]

50. teddy roosevelt?

the founder of american imperialism? really?

[hogwyld]

53. Don't forget some of Teddy's accomplishments

He was probably the first truly liberal president we've had.
He musted up the monopolies to level the playing field for all.
Supported the labor movement in it's birth pangs, and the laws regarding child labor.
Started the National Parks and the conservation movement.

He was very progressive for his time.

[Bucky]

46. Van Buren. Without a doubt Van Buren. Cleveland & Arthur tie for 2nd best

And Taft--hooboy, was he one humdinger of a president!

[NoSheep]

48. Huey Long! Oh. I thought you said NEVER had.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huey_Long

[SammyWinstonJack]

94. In that case, RFK.

[AutumnMist]

54. I Agree With That

Lincoln was a self made man who really felt things deeply. He was not, like many of the men and women in politics today, a wealthy man who had family and friends with money to launch him into politics. He studied law on his own. He was raised by a father who could only sign his name and had a 3rd grade education. Lincolns father considered his sons interest in books frivolous and unnecessary. His step mother encouraged him to read and write after he was done with his daily chores. He would walk for miles just to borrow a book from a neighbor. Imagine that kind of dedication. That kind of need to lift ones self above the back breaking perils of poverty and then become President. It wouldn't happen today. Absolutely not.

[Ediacara]

57. Tie, Lincoln and FDR

If forced to choose one, I choose FDR.

[CarbonDate]

58. William Jennings Bryan

Kidding. FDR.

[BlueStateModerate]

61. Absolutely not FDR

I love how people always forget about those pesky Japanese internment camps.

I'll go with Washington or Jefferson.

[WI_DEM]

74. Gee, but what about those pesky slaves that they owned?

[Vidar]

65. FDR, hands down.

[madokie]

66. Bill the Big Dog Clinton hands down

more in tune with me as any during my 58 years

[Raine]

67. FDR

then Lincoln. :thumbsup:

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

68. Lincoln. Then FDR.

[LWolf]

69. Washington. n/t

[WoodrowFan]

70. Lincoln, FDR, Washington (NT)

[bmbmd]

72. The greatest American president

had by-God better be the next one.

[Polesitter]

73. Clearly Lincoln, followed closely by William Henry Harrison

Of course Harrison had the extreme decency to die on April 4th, 1841, after taking office on March 4th, 1841.

[WI_DEM]

75. Lincoln and FDR

[Botany]

76. The Big CHET

Chester Allen Arthur



Before entering national politics, Arthur had been Collector of Customs for the Port of New York.
He was appointed by Ulysses S. Grant but was fired by Rutherford B. Hayes under false suspicion
of bribery and corruption. A political protégé of Roscoe Conkling, his notable achievements in office
as President included civil service reform and the passage of the Pendleton Civil Service Reform Act.
The passage of this legislation earned Arthur the moniker "The Father of Civil Service."

[genie_weenie]

77. Why does everyone think Lincoln was so great?

Seriously, under him the constitution become the Roach Motel because he determined that once you enter the US you can't get out.

Generals picked by Lincoln decided the best way to win the war was to terrorize the families of the rebels by laying waste to the south.

1 million (out of 30) Americans died under his reign.

He waited several years to emancipate the slaves in the south, he stated he would have kept slavery if it meant keeping the union earlier. He was only against the rise of Slave power and not an abolishionist.

He established a precedent of suspension of Habeas Corpus...
http://teachingamericanhistory.org/library/index.asp?document=425

[skipos]

79. Because he was handed a horrible, horrible situation

and able to solve it. How many young countries break out in civil was ONCE and then never again?

I don't know if he was the best, but he was the absolute opposite of Bush. He surrounded himself with people who disagreed with him on many things and challenged his thinking. He was able to unite the country after 1 million died in a civil war. Bush surrounds himself with yes men and as for uniting the country... we have all seen his approval ratings from 9-11 until now.

[Jed Dilligan]

82. Never say never. nt

[FormerDem06]

83. Unfortunately, we would consider him in the same breath as Bush today

If he were in office now because of the war tactics his generals used in the South. Rape, pillaging, burning of whole towns to the ground in Sherman's case, internment camps where POWs were left without food or water for days on end.

It's amazing what you can get away with outsinde of the 24/7 media coverage.


=======================================================
"The rebels in a body have passed from among us, and the counties are comparatively quiet. The amount of damage done the people is in proportion of ten to one, and the misfortune is that those who came as our defenders and to drive out thieves, robbers, and bushwhackers damaged the people ten times as much in this way as did these rebels, from whom we had no right to expect better things. The officers, I hear, said they could not restrain the men;...Garrison and his myrmidons have been let loose among us, and it may be that they have done the chief work;... An inquiry by an honest military court into these things will develop the enormity of crimes of the most startling character. Robbery, murder, arson, and rapes will figure largely in the catalogue." From Major A.A.King, Richmond (Mo), 25 july 1864 to general Rosecrans OR SI vol XLI part 2 p387

========================================================

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Hon. E. M. STANTON.Secretary of War:
The crimes of spying, murder, arson, rape, and others, as well as desertion, are increasing, and the power to check them by inflicting the penalty of death is a nullity, for the delays necessary to get them a regular trial by general court-martial, and then holding them until the matter is reviewed and approved by the President, such a time elapses that the troops are relieved and the culprit escapes. This ought to be remedied.
W. S. ROSECRANS, Major-General, Commanding
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The Daily Richmond Enquirer july 7, 1864 report this raid too . Members of Draper's 36th USCT were accused of raping a Mrs G. wife of a confederate officer, eleven times. In addition, twenty five or thirty other females (decorum forbade mentionning their names) were also violated by these "demons". (In Ervin L. Jordan jr "Black Confederates and Afro yankees in CW Virginia")

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There is a site out there if I can find it with hundreds of these accounts of Union on Confederate civilian crime.

[Superman Returns]

81. ...

"Generals picked by Lincoln decided the best way to win the war was to terrorize the families of the rebels by laying waste to the south."

And your point?

[genie_weenie]

90. Ummm, because it's bad?

And evil. This is not to say it wasn't successful but, destroying railways, farms, and cities and causing families to starve does win wars but it's not a good thing to do. Of course, what do I know, Wars are meant to be won...

[Individualist]

84. FDR

[maxsolomon]

85. Thomas Jefferson

the only truly deep thinker to hold the office. the man designed this government. he wrote the declaration of independence. he edited his own bible to eliminate the dogma & reveal the core of jesus' teachings:

[terrya]

88. Abraham Lincoln

Sadly, we will never see another man or woman with Lincoln's sterling qualities and basic decency in White House again.

[Clinton Crusader]

91. Tough call...in my life, JFK or Clinton

IMHO, it's one of the two for many MANY reasons I won't bore everyone to death with.

:kick:

[never_get_over_it]

101. And pretty sure

Clinton has stated he was inspired to get into politics by JFK....

[berni_mccoy]

92. JFK

Saved us from nuclear war
Pushed the Nuclear Test Ban Treaty
Created the peace corp, inspiring international peace through good works and sending aid and giving Americans a way to serve their country other than being a soldier used for war
Supported civil liberties in a time when it was very difficult politically to do so
Led us into space and took us to the moon

And all this in less than one term.

[Johnny Appleseed]

95. I like Lincoln

[deaniac21]

96. Jimmy Carter.

[noonwitch]

97. FDR

JFK wasn't president long enough to really accomplish all of his goals. Clinton was a great president, but was hampered by a GOP congress on a witch hunt.

FDR established social security, created a lasting alliance that won WWII and stopped Hitler and Tojo from taking over most of the world, he got us out of the great depression, and god knows what other accomplishments that can be credited to he and his administration.

[joeygirl]

99. I'd have to pick Washington

he had a "dream team" administration to help him govern. He also could have stayed in power until he died, but he didn't. He knew how to be a leader.

Jefferson I like because he believed in limited government and wrote the Declaration of Independence.

Lincoln, because he helped destroyed the Whigs because they didn't want to do anything about slavery. He also held the nation together during a terrible time in our history.

[mvd]

103. FDR

I believe in his principles. A form of capitalism isn't all that bad when the government is there to help its citizens when in need. I'd say I believe in more limited capitalism than he did, but his heart was in the right place.

[Cameron27]

104. Abe Lincoln first and

then G. Washington, because he remained a slave owner even when he knew it to be immoral; but he did establish the presidency as an honorable office & willingly gave up his power at the end of his term, at a time when he was so admired that he could have perverted the whole concept if he chose.

Third FDR...great great man

[Carla in Ca]

105. F.D.R.

n/t

[DemocratSinceBirth]

106. Washington, Jefferson,Lincoln,Roosevelt, Kennedy...

Mad props to Bill Clinton but I don't think he's in the Pantheon.

[Synnical]

107. Grant! - 'Cause he gave me the Wild Wild West

And the Secret Service and

James West, Artemus Gordon, and Dr. Miguelito Loveless

Also known as Robert Conrad in tight pants, Ross Martin, and Michael Dunn.





Just kiddin'. :) But, I know there are some Dunn fans here, so thought I'd post this just for shits and giggles. Probably the wrong forum. Oh, well, my bad.

[Cleita]

108. Hugo Chavez. But he's not our's is he?

Sorry.

[MassLiberal]

109. Lincoln

and FDR

[Imagevision]

110. JFK Then Clinton > Clinton is so bloddy strong!