Obama and Timmy.

[cornermouse]

My take on it is that Obama has delicately hinted the Bush may not be entirely sane via the statement about Bush's personality change and "messianic" gaze.

Add: He also stated he may run for President in 08 after all.

[Demit]

1. What a colossal ego he must have, to think he is ready to become President

How bout he gets a little experience under his belt first?

[Democrat 4 Ever]

3. Hells, bells - I think I am qualified to be president with absolutely

zero political experience. Ya gotta admit since Chucklenuts the bar is set pretty low. Why knock an up and coming person in the Democratic party?

Obama can consider running for president all he wants - isn't that the American dream - that any child can grow up to be president? I don't fault him, let him run, put forth his ideas, plans, etc. We separate the wheat from the chaff in the primaries. We can choose to vote for him or not. Why on earth you would want to limit a single candidate at this point in the game is just shooting ourselves in the foot...again.

[Demit]

10. You're qualified to run for president? Why? Tell me how, if you're serious

I think I explained why I'm "knocking" Obama. He's brand new on the scene. He hasn't done anything that shows he's ready. I think he's letting all this recent rock-star attention go to his head.

He certainly can consider running for president all he wants. And I can express an opinion on how it's way premature at this time.

[Temporary1]

55. Anyone but Hillary in '08

He's liked by people on both sides and is much more liberal than her.

[madokie]

4. thats ok if he wants it will keep the wolves away from the real candidates

for a while and it will give him some never to be outdone experience about running for the Presidency. Having lost once doesn't make for a failure. methinks

[jefferson_dem]

7. First off, anyone who thinks they are fit enough to run for pres has a

colossal ego -- megalomaniacal tendencies are a given.

Second, much of the Obama charm is that he is a "fresh face" and does not have (as much of) the taint of a Washington-politico.

I, for one, would love to see Obama run!

[Toots]

16. I think it is more a matter of him being told that instead of him just say

He has many fans in spite of his so-called lack of experience. I say the only experience one needs is a good intellect, common sense and the respect and admiration of the majority.

[wellstone dem]

17. He has about as much as John Edwards did when he

ran.

[valerief]

21. Are you talking about Bush or Obama? nt

[jzola]

22. They said the same thing

about John Kennedy. His greatest contribution was his ablity to inspire us. That maybe what Obama also has to offer.

[Demit]

30. I think a president's importance is more than beingan inspirational symbol

I think Obama is smart, and (glory be!) articulate, and I think he could one day make a wonderful president. But let's see him be an inspiration in the job he has now, in the Senate. I've seen him be cautious and noncommittal and striving to be uncontroversial. I want to see him take a stand on something, then see how he takes the heat that comes from it. I want to see, in the next four years of his term, whether he does more than dance around on issues. I want to watch him in action before handing over the keys to the most important job in the world.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

23. Experience? In the senate?

Show me one example in the past fifty years where experience in the senate has won the presidency.

[Kahuna]

24. Did you say that about John Edwards?

nt

[Demit]

25. Yes. n/t

[stella]

39. Look at Bush

he is a dumbass and no experience but he managed to be elected twice.

[k_jerome]

44. Sure, lord knows we need more of a humble common man...

with experience, perhaps as governor of a large southern state.

[EST]

2. I have been adamantly against even considering Obama as

a presidential candidate for '08.
That thinking is changing a bit.
I have come to wonder what purpose would be served by keeping him in the senate for another eight years. He is older than Clinton or John Kennedy were.

Senators don't seem to be able to get elected. Would additional time in the senate fundamentally change his outlook in a way that would aid him as president?

I don't know, for sure, but I am not so against the prospect as before.

[mucifer]

5. I would rather vote for Feingold, but the reality is Obama is more

popular and has more republican appeal. I don't think that his decision to run is an indication of his ego as much as it is an indication of who the high powered dems think can win and the pressure they are putting on him.

He just did a great ad for Tammy Duckworth here in IL. There was a sleazy lie filled comercial against her that Obama clearly pointed out how it was a lie and that the Chicago Trib agreed with him. Tammy's district is strong repub and they voted Obama and hopefully will vote for her.

[cornermouse]

8. I think he's been getting persuasion from somewhere as well.

There are others who I would much prefer to see as the candidate. I think Obama is not as liberal as I would like and I do think he is too young, but he does project a personality of someone who is willing to listen to others and deliberate his way to a decision. In comparison to Bush, that has to be seen as a positive indicator.

Given what appears to be his personality, I was really struck by his use of the word "messianic" when talking about Bush and the way he publicly and delicately tapdanced around the possibility that Bush is not sane.

[rodeodance]

6. i am not ready to think of him at this time (omaba).

[cornermouse]

9. There are others who I would prefer too.

I guess eventually, we'll all find out who its going to be.

[alcibiades_mystery]

32. It's OBAMA, not omaba

Just sayin'...

[electron_blue]

11. I'm ready to see him run for Pres.

Hells bells, let's have someone from outside the system for a change.

[hiaasenrocks]

12. I think some people have talked him into believing he's something he's not

Where does Obama get the idea that he's anywhere near ready to run for President? I think it's obvious from his previous comments (that he won't run) that someone or some group has convinced him that he's ready. And he's not.

One serious problem he has is something that turned many people off of John Kerry. Many of his answers are long-winded, meandering, disjointed lectures on, well, just about anything other than what the question was about. He did this on MTP this morning, and also on Larry King the other night. Someone needs to tell politicians like this that using more words doesn't necessarily make you seem more intelligent.

Anyway, the guy is kidding himself if he thinks he has a chance at winning the WH.

If any Obama supporters are reading this, can you give us some reasons why he deserves our support in such a campaign? What has he done? What leadership has he provided on major issues of the day? What kind of experience can he point to that gives us a reason to trust him with the most serious job in the world?

[acmavm]

14. Don't worry, my dog Jack is 'thinking' about running in 2008 as well.

Unfortunately he's as likely to win as either Barak Obama or Hillary Clinton.

Too bad, it would have been nice to have a 'connection' to the WH.

[davsand]

43. Obama is a hell of a lot more qualified than our current (p)Resident.

Simply by virtue of the fact that he CAN form coherent sentences and speak cogently. There are a lot of other things I admire about that man that lead me to think he'd be an excellent President, but it is only MY opinion based on personal interaction.

I realize that maybe I'm paying a bit more attention to him than some on here because he's my Senator and because I worked my butt off for him in his Senate Primary, but did you see him on Oprah this last week? A while back Oprah made a statement (in public) that Obama should be supported for President.

Have you looked at the current edition of Time magazine? That reporter was clearly not a "lap dog" for Obama, however, the article had a nice discussion of Obama and how he IS--in public and in private. They also had an excerpt from Obama's new book that discusses some aspects of Obama that are not (and will not be) part of any campaign, but certainly are part of his character.

He's getting press attention right now and THAT is why the subject of a Presidential run is coming up. I do not think this is anything he's floating, I think it is just part of the usual media frenzy. You saw it with Hillary a while back and you'll see it again with a different candidate later on.

Do I think Oprah by her lonesome should be picking the Dem nominee? Nope, not at all. I DO think, however, that it sure would be a lot easier to run WITH her support given how many living rooms she's in every day.

Do I think that the cover of Time magazine is a "king maker?" Nope. But it sure can't hurt if you've been seen on there, and it sure isn't gonna hurt any if people have read an excerpt from your book talking about something like religion and how it impacts in your life personally.

Like EVERY other voter in this country you are gonna have to make your mind up about who you support in any given Primary--including the one for the Presidency. If, and when, Obama decides he's running then I'm sure he'll do some campaign work. Until then it is just the media asking questions and people speculating.

Regards.


Laura

[hiaasenrocks]

53. Using * as a measuring stick doesn't prove much.

Again, the questions from my previous post stand.

Personally, I couldn't care less who or what Oprah supports. But, just for the sake of discussion, does she say why Obama should be supported?

[davsand]

61. I'll grant you, our current "leader" is not a shining example.

Nor is he even functional. I agree, that was not a blazing endorsement of Obama, was it...

Oprah feels that Obama represents a new attitude that is willing to work to get the job done. He listens to people, and he's got a respect for the intelligence of the American people (which I DO feel may be a bit optimistic but I am also pretty jaded.)

Oprah also seems to really just LIKE the man. They connect. While that may not be saying much because Oprah is a talk show host--she "connects" with a lot of people--in the case of Obama HE connects with people too.

Here's a Newsmax article about Oprah and Obama, there's a lot more out there on it--there was stuff on DU about it before he was EVER on her show...

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2006/10/19/134102.shtml?s=ic

Here's a short blog from the Chicago Trib about Oprah when she was originally endorsing Obama on the Larry King show:

http://newsblogs.chicagotribune.com/news_theswamp/2006/09/oprah_endorses_.html

As for my own personal observation of the Obama phenom, let me tell you about when I saw Obama speak for the first time at our local Dem dinner. I was sitting at a table full of Labor leaders that really DO run the gamut of political attitudes. (It really IS a myth that all Labor folks are Dems--you DO know that--right?)

I had a Libertarian biker on one side of me and an AFSCME retiree on the other side that is probably one of the most chronically morose people I have ever known. (This was NOT exactly a group of people that are immediately pre-disposed toward a progressive minority Illinois Senator from Chicago area...)

As Obama spoke (remember this was very early Primary) he spoke about things like Universal Health Care, access to educational opportunity and the dream of equality that our nation offered when it was formed. Those "Not-So-Left" leaning people on either side of me were both sitting there nodding and even cheering at points.

They were willing to march up to the gates of hell for that man by the end of that speech, and you could SEE how excited they were by him. I am an old political hack and I have seen more than a few stump speeches by some pretty amazing politicians over the years. I have NEVER seen anything like Obama. NEVER.

I've seen him at fundraisers, I've seen him in mob scenes and I have talked to him privately. He's the same in every setting. He's listening to you, he's interacting with YOU and he's right there with you. There is no artifice and there is no BS. He just IS.

Obama was in the Illinois Senate when it was GOP controlled. He got some pretty progressive legislation passed at a time when just getting any of it out of committee was a HUGE thing.

Obama was a Civil Rights lawyer in Chicago as well as having been a community organizer on the South Side. That might not carry a lot of freight for some folks, but I'm telling you, that man has earned his stripes and he's been there / done that a whole lot more than most people EVER will.

Yeah, I admire hell out of him, and, No, I do not expect you to support him based on my say-so. What Laura thinks, what Oprah thinks and what the reporters think really doesn't mean dick to anybody when they go to the polls. What matters is what THEY think, and I am hoping that if he EVER does run people will at least give him a chance.

Regards.


Laura

[OKNancy]

13. I thought Obama was impressive

and anyone commenting should watch Meet the Press before offering opinions about his appearance.
The political roundtable after Obama was interesting too. Especially when one of the reporters said that in the opinion of a Clinton aide that Hillary will not run, but Obama will. All four members of the panel were positive the Dems will take the House.

[jefferson_dem]

15. I agree. Obama is as effective articulating "our" positions as anyone.

I really cannot understand the dismissive attitudes toward him that i routinely see here.

[OKNancy]

18. because some people don't deal with real politik

If DUers think that Russ Feingold ( god love him ) has a snowball's chance of getting nominated much less elected, then they don't have a pulse on what is going on out in the real world.
As Obama said... most people in the US are moderates and want practical approaches to our problems. He said problems may need government intervention, but also sometime the market or private sector works best.

Just because I'm a liberal Democrat doesn't mean I'm going to put my head in the sand and not see what's going on all around me.

[Kahuna]

26. I don't get it either. John Edwards = ready. Obama = NOT!!!!

What the hell!!! Obama actually has more political experience than Edwards did. Sounds like a double standard to me. And I wonder why.

[Demit]

35. You are making an unsupported assumption, that people thought Edwards

had enough experience. You shouldn't jump to the conclusion you seem to be wanting to jump to.

[jefferson_dem]

38. Respectfully, Edwards was not criticized in 2004 for lack of experience

to the degree that Obama is being criticized now. No question about it.

[Demit]

41. How on earth do you come up with a quantitative assertion like that?

[Kahuna]

45. I'll explain. For two years leading up to 2004, we ran DU polls at

least weekly. THAT'S how we know. Edwards was barely registering in the DU polls before IOWA. Got it now?

[Kahuna]

42. And Obama really has more experience than Edwards because

Obama was a state prepresentative before running national. As opposed to Edwards who had no political experience at all before running for the senate.

[Kahuna]

40. I'm not jumping to anything. As far as the DU discussion about Edwards

goes I'm well aware of how that played out, and that's all I'm referring to. Before Iowa, most DU'ers did not support Edwards feeling that he was too inexperienced and unwilling to withdraw his support for his Iraq vote. After Iowa a lot of DU'er did what a lot of primary voters did. They put aside their concerns and hopped on the Edwards bandwagon. Many are still on the Edwards bandwagon to this day (compared to pre-Iowa), and yet Edwards still is just as lacking in experience as he was in 2004. And many of these same post Iowa Edwards supporters are saying that Obama is too young and is lacking in experience. That is a double standard.

[Demit]

46. Well then, you'd have to wait for Iowa before declaring a double standard,

wouldn't you? If Obama wins Iowa, and "a lot of DUers" DON'T hop on his bandwagon, then your claim of a double standard is supportable. Until then, it makes no sense.

[Kahuna]

47. Just stop! Just admit that you are the one who drew baseless

assumptions because you were not part of the DU community leading up to 2004. Everybody who was a part of the community knows full well what went on and it can be substantiated because of the frequent DU polls that tracked the mindset of DUers as the campaigns progress. This is not conjecture. This is fact.

[Demit]

49. Explain your reasoning again? About how DUers considered Edwards not

experienced enough before Iowa, and that was okay, but considering Obama not experienced—and it's before Iowa right now—is not okay? Explain to me exactly where the double standard is. I think I'll be able to grasp that without having been on DU in early 2004.

[Rosemary2205]

56. Obviously someone thought Edwards was worthy of being a player

he was chosen to be Veep afterall........

[elocs]

19. If Hillary ran and won 2 terms

she would be done in 10 years whereas if she stayed in the Senate she could be there for 20 years and be a very powerful Senator.

[redstateblues]

20. Maybe I'm not listening closely enough, but he doesn't really say anything

It's mostly platitudes. He really backed away from any strong stands. He would get chewed up in a presidential campaign.

[Kahuna]

27. You weren't listening closely enough. I thought he was very cogent

in his responses. I thought he was very impressive and a pleasure to listen to.

[alcibiades_mystery]

33. So what did he say?

:rofl:

They weren't platitudes? They were impressive and a pleasure? LOL.

[Kahuna]

36. Ha ha! Guess you miss the part about how he finessed his response

to the pull out of Iraq. If you were listening, you don't need to ask me what he said. You'd know. Guess you missed the part about how he said bush's messianic approach to governing has been bad for the country. You also missed the part about how he finessed the answer to what budget cuts he'd make. He responded to how he would not necessarily cut programs but that he would use technology to save money and run them more effectively. So, the point is you were not predisposed to really pay attention to what he was saying or how he was saying it. Your mind was made up and already closed.

[alcibiades_mystery]

50. So much for finesse

I listened to what he was saying. From the last response, it wasn't clear that YOU listened. :rofl:

If somebody accuses your man of spouting platitudes, you must respond with sustance, not with "I really liked him" nonsense. So, at the very least, i forced you to present some substance. How substantial your litany actually is, I'll leave to others to decide...

[Skidmore]

31. I heard some common sense, not platitudes.

I think this is a young man with promise and he hasn't gotten to this point in life without having some resolve and ability to take on tough situations.

[hiaasenrocks]

54. Exactly. He *talks* a lot, but doesn't say much.

I don't think he's this great communicator that people say he is. But it really all comes down to the substantive work he has done. So I keep asking for people to list those things, but I never get an answer.

[nevergiveup]

28. Run Obama Run!

I was talking to a young Mexican American guy yesterday, telling him about how important his vote was this mid-term election. The kid is a college grad, super bright, but not much interested in politics. In the conversation I mentioned something about Obama and his eyes brightened and he responded "I love Obama and if he runs next time I will work for him and most of my friends will too". I am becoming convinced that Obama would probably be our best candidate but am not convinced he will actually run.
On a side note: this young man's parent's usually vote Republican.

[Kahuna]

29. Obama exudes intelligence and confidence. Nobody will

be able to used the old tired refrain, 'he's not comfortable in his own skin.' The more I see of him the more confidence I have that he alone can deliver us the WH.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

34. He'll Get My Vote

He's my second choice...John Edwards is my first... I'll vote for any candidate I think can beat the GOPU.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

37. I Thought Most People Would Be Upset For His Praise Of Reagan.

IMHO, he was right to say Reagan lifted the national mood and accomplished quite a lot. Compared to Bu$h he looks like Abraham Lincoln.

[cornermouse]

51. Reagan did lift the mood

and I guess you could say he accomplished quite a lot. But when it comes right down to it, lifting a mood is not enough. You have to make it possible for people to lift themselves out of their circumstances as well. Reagan didn't do that. The things that he accomplished were mostly negative to the lower economic class in that it made life much harder for them. I know because I was in the class at that time and watched it happening all around me. A lot of people suffered from what Reagan did.

Bush II should go down in history books as the worst mistake the American people ever made.

[gauguin57]

48. People also run for president when they're angling for VICE president

Lots of people run for prexy every four years ... are weeded out by convention time, and are put on the ticket as vice president. this would sound like Obama's path for '08 ... it's hard to become president as a sitting senator (none since JFK)

[Perky]

58. Obama is not VP material

Too smuch gravitas, too much polish.....too much charisma.

He does not help the ticket electorally (in part because he can not run with an emphaise on being an African-American) and in part because Ilinois is already solid blue.


The bigger problem is that he outshines just about every other candidate on gravitas, polish and charisma...and Presidential candidate ARE VERY CONCERNED about that.

[mtnester]

52. I like Barak Obama, and so does my husband, BUT

the exact same thing that happened while he was being interviewed by Russert this morning will happen over and over and over again. They will show the clip of him saying he will absolutely finish his 6 year term, and then they will show his flip flop from today.

People are simple, and this will be pounded up his and the Dems asses if he makes it through an 08 primary, he will have broken what was damn near a promise in most folk's minds, and the Repubs will focus with singular tunnel vision on making sure their sheep and fence sitting sheep get that message.

Obama could not really defend it either. I think 2012 is the year of Obama.

[Rosemary2205]

57. I disagree

If a dem is elected in 08 then Obama would have to stew in the Senate until 2016. IMHO that is actually TOO LONG in the senate. IMHO the chance of a "longtime" senator getting elected to pres is pretty small.

Now if the R's can get elected for pres in 08 then Obama can come back in 2012 but planning wise, one has to assume a Dem win in 08.

IMHO his time is now or never -- partly because America seems to be trending toward fresh faces.

[Perky]

59. Illinois will love him regardless.

That is a non issue in every other state in my opinion.

[Orangepeel]

60. He'll have 11 years in government. plus, he knows the constitution

7 years at the state level, 4 at the federal level. He's brilliant (was president of the Harvard Law review) and cares about people.

Why isn't he qualified? The president doesn't rule alone -- contrary to what our current "decider in chief" might profess. Why does he/she need to have been working in Washington for 20 years? there will be plenty of people on staff who have been working in Washington for 20 years, so it isn't like he/she won't have access to knowledge about what's been done in the past.

The president needs 1) to be able to get elected; 2) to care; and 3) to be able to work with people at home and abroad; and 4) to be very smart. Kennedy had these attributes, regardless of age. Clinton did too. Does Obama? I'm willing to give him a chance to show me.

________________
OBAMA, Barack, a Senator from Illinois; born in Honolulu, Hawaii, August 4, 1961; obtained early education in Jakarta, Indonesia, and Hawaii; continued education at Occidental College, Los Angeles, Calif., and Columbia University, New York City; studied law at Harvard University, where he became the first African American president of the Harvard Law Review, and received J.D. in 1992; lecturer on constitutional law, University of Chicago; member, Illinois State senate 1997-2004; elected as a Democrat to the U.S. Senate in 2004 for term beginning January 3, 2005.

http://bioguide.congress.gov/scripts/biodisplay.pl?index=O000167