The majority of people in any century and any country are sheeple.

[raccoon]

IMHO.

Look at present day US (I know, we’d rather NOT) and Nazi Germany.

Most people will go along with whatever their government is doing. Why?

--Many believe if the government says it, it must be true/right, or else they believe the government is THE AUTHORITY and it’s wrong (unpatriotic) to disagree with authority.

--As long as something doesn’t affect them directly, they don’t think it’s important.
(It’s not their son/daughter in Iraq; it’s not them in the concentration camps.)

--Peer pressure; people around them cheer on the war, and they don’t want to be perceived as “different.”

--A relentless propaganda machine has convinced them that what their government is doing is right and necessary.

Anyone else?

[cantstandbush]

1. BINGO!!!! nough said!! n/t

[MrBenchley]

2. Always nice to see open contempt for Americans....

This kind of anti-American rheotric does a lot more damage to the Democratic party than anything the DLC does or doesn't do. And as long as I can remember, it's been endemic with the far left, which is why their views are toxic to voters.

[raccoon]

3. Always nice to see sarcasm--that's so easy to do, isn't it?

and somebody who doesn't read

I said,
"The majority of people in any century and any country "

[MrBenchley]

4. Hey, be sure and wonder aloud why

"the sheeple" don't seem to care much for the shit you're shoveling.

[DrunkenMaster]

22. Unfortunately, Mr. Benchley

The ruling elite disagrees with you completely, and I think their gains in public relations, marketing and propaganda prove them terribly, disgustingly correct. Beginning with Edward Bernays, the father of marketing who had a direct impact on J. Goebbels, the elite has believed that the masses are too stupid and ineffective to contribute to democracy and that the job of propganda is to "manufacture consent".

It has worked amazingly well, too. Although I would give a body part to be able to agree with you, my faith in the general intelligence and insight displayed by humanity is currently at an all time low, and I don't see any way out of this mess in the future.

I hope you are right -- I pray for it. I just don't believe it.

[MrBenchley]

24. Boy Howdy! There's a pair of aces to draw to....

"Edward Bernays, the father of marketing who had a direct impact on J. Goebbels"

Nuff said.

"my faith in the general intelligence and insight displayed by humanity is currently at an all time low, and I don't see any way out of this mess in the future."
Then pipe down and get out of the way. Because spouting off on a Democratic message board about how stupid and useless your feloow citizens is doesn't do a fucking thing except damage the Democratic party.

[DrunkenMaster]

32. not enough said, unfortunately

Dont misunderstand me: I don't condone or approve of Goebbel's direct adaptation of Bernays' ideas (JG even quotes him directly in his famous Nuremberg speech on the state function of propaganda) but the fact remains that this concept has been the dominant one in modern politics.

I think the Democratic party has done a fine job damaging its own reputation recently. I'm sorry if I have offended you -- I have tremendous respect for your work, as I mentioned in another thread -- but I think people seeking to oppose Bush and those who think like him need to acknowledge the power these anti-democratic ideas have had in the 20th and 21st century.

[MrBenchley]

35. Again, I don't think the way to counter

the sort of thing you're talking about is to join those forces in being contemptuous of your fellow citizens. And I don't think anything the party proper does damages the party nearly as much as this sort of wet-fingered condescension spoken aloud does.

To put it more plainly, there's nothing more dangerous to the con man than the chump who's been wised up...but a third party can't wise the chump up by CALLING him a chump to his face. Chimpy and the GOP have been treating Americans like chumps for years; the counter is not to treat them like chumps ourselves but to point out the con and build solidarity.

[meganmonkey]

26. I think I may faint

I actually agree with MrBenchley on this one!

:o

[Viva_La_Revolution]

5. Sorry. Truth wins out. the OP is correct...

Right now I'm reading "a nation of sheep" by Lederer, written in 1960.

and as stated, this applies to all countries, and all times.

We do ourselves a huge disservice by keeping quiet because someone will think ill of us.

[MrBenchley]

6. Empty contempt from an empty ideology....

"We do ourselves a huge disservice by keeping quiet because someone will think ill of us."
You do an even bigger one to yourself by openly expressing this sort of silliness out loud. "Yes, everyone is an ignorant sheeple but me."

[Viva_La_Revolution]

10. Well. Isn't it nice we live in a country where you can have your own

opinion. AND YELL IT AS LOUD AS YOU WANT. And ya know what? Until they repeal the first article of the bill of rights, I will continue to do so.

I'll be true to myself.. while you just hang on to that anti-free speech 'tude, ok? Good luck with that.

Oh, by the way... I never said this - "Yes, everyone is an ignorant sheeple but me." Just like you twisted what the OP said originally. You've been watching too much O'Lielly and learning bad habits.

[MrBenchley]

11. Doesn't seem so nice for you, having to endure them "sheeple" and all....

"I never said this - "Yes, everyone is an ignorant sheeple but me." "
Sure you did...you just couched it in pompous rhetoric.

"you twisted what the OP said originally"
I didn't twist a goddamn thing.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

13. lol

if you say so.

[MrBenchley]

14. YOU are the one that said so....

[Viva_La_Revolution]

15. sorry, I should have been more clear..

I was referring to this comment

"I didn't twist a goddamn thing."

[400Years]

19. ignore benchley he's a screaming fascist

[Viva_La_Revolution]

20. LOL! Very grumpy, anyway! nt

[MrBenchley]

38. Says the guy who throws out anti-gay slurs....

[400Years]

42. awe, look at the little crybaby whine like a simpering little coward

[wuushew]

21. why are you ashamed of leftist thought?

our ideology and one must assume yours preaches economic justice, education, environmental responsibility and heath care for the largest number of people in this country. The farther one moves to the right on these issues the less likely one is address these in a serious manner.

I suppose the pragmatist in you might by speaking the the psychological necessity of toning down rhetoric in order to win elections but instead I sense deep underlying contempt and disgust for what I feel are noble and well founded political aspirations of those on this board.


:dem:

[MrBenchley]

33. Because it's full fo crap like "sheeple"

"our ideology and one must assume yours preaches economic justice, education, environmental responsibility and heath care for the largest number of people in this country"
Mine does. The far left on the other hand, seems to wobble between slurring Democrats and spouting silly and anti-American rubbish.

"I sense deep underlying contempt and disgust for what I feel are noble and well founded political aspirations"
Funny, in the past few days alone, I've seen this "sheeple" rubbish, a thread claiming Bin Laden was harmless, and at least two claiming Clinton should have been impeached for crimes against Iraq. That's some "nobility" all right.

[wuushew]

36. Do you disagree with the lack of civility or the premise?

I don't know many non-political junkies who peruse the depths of DU for recreational reading, but certainly no politician in America uses the language you so take anger with in this thread.

If so many topics on DU irritate you I suggest you avoid them.

[MrBenchley]

37. With both....

And I find it endemic of the sort of coentempt for America that the far left has.

"no politician in America uses the language you so take anger with in this thread."
On the other hand, pieces of shit like Malkin and Hannity do peruse this site so they can attack the Democratic party to their audiences...and this sort of far left gibberish plays right into their hands.

[DrunkenMaster]

34. and what is funny about it

is that the Left has been warning people for ages about the dangers of public sheephood, while the Right exploits it effectively and convinces people that the Left is unAmerican for pointing it out.

What a nifty trick.

[MrBenchley]

39. And you've put your finger on something very important

The right is always inclusive--it assumes EVERYONE feels as they do.

The left is almost never so, and this is an excellent example of the fault: "Everyone is a sheeple but ME"

[MissMarple]

40. I understand your point. It is hard to make decisions based on propaganda.

And the far left, whatever that encompasses, needs to get a grip. Babies must be cherished, not thrown out with the bathwater. We have goals to meet, and they are not the chosen by being informed by fuzzy thinking or ideological certitude.

Well, kinda sorta. ;) There is that Constitution thing.

[Selatius]

7. I disagree with calling them sheeple. They're simply ill-informed

Peer pressure is a human weakness, but it's something most if not all of us have fallen to at some point in our lives. Anyone still remember what it was like in high school? Also, people are afraid that if they voice a "wrong opinion," they will be showered with attacks, especially of the negative kind. Few want that kind of trouble. Also, the information necessary to make an informed decision usually rests with somebody else to deliver. I'm generally talking about television, radio, newspapers, and the internet. If people are making decisions detrimental to their own survival, then one should question from where they are getting their information.

No judgments are needed here to see that.

[nomaco-10]

8. Yes, sheeplism is alive and well all over the world, but......

I think the biggest problem other than apathy, is the single issue voter mind set. Whether it be the god hates abortion and gays or the nobody's taking my gun away crowd. They are single minded, self serving hate mongers and they are truly ruining this country.
We are no longer being governed in this country, we are now being "managed" by fear.

[Vidar]

9. Self-involved might be a better description.

[raccoon]

12. Good point. nt

[Sydnie]

16. Add to the mix that many don't trust themselves to make the

"right" choice when something is really important, feeling that others must understand the situation much more clearly than they do, so they give over their power to someone else. It's not that they believe the others are right, it's that they don't know how to trust themselves to understand and respond appropriately.

That is why mob rule and posses were so easy to form, historically.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

17. Herd mentality easily morphs into mob mentality. good point. nt

[Batgirl]

18. Baaaa, baaaa!

This sheep analogy is one I've mulled over from time to time. Life is full of problems and responsibilities and I think most people just want to go about the business of dealing with their own personal concerns. Government and political shenanigans seem very far removed and most people reserve their attention for items they deem to have more immediate relevance to their lives. They have a general feeling of resignation that politicians are somewhat crooked and government a bureaucratic mess, along with a vague hope that our elected officials don't manage to fuck things up too much.

At least, that pretty much describes my outlook during most of my adult life prior to Nov. 2000. I'm guessing it describes a lot of people.

It's possible this widespread human condition might actually be an advantage to our survival as a species. Even though it's infuriating to us in our present political situation/crisis, because we think if more people woke up there would be enough of us to run Shrubco out of town on a rail. And that's probably true, but I think the biggest obstacle to this kind of widespread awakening is the sad, sickened quality of our corporate media, which most people still depend on. It could be that's a more significant factor in shaping public opinion, as opposed to some innate apathy.

It seems possible that, during ordinary times at least, having a large segment of people who tend to shrug things off and avoid controversy is a human trait that ensures a certain degree of peacefulness or social stability. A tendency that's far less beneficial during times like the present, when evil authoritarians have hornswoggled their way into complete political power.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

23. "All politics is local." - Tip O'Neil

The prevailing attitude of most Americans is "If it doesn't affect me or my family, who cares." Nothing new about it. The Romans kept the populace obedient with "bread and circuses" and threats of the "barbarians". Substitute Walmart and and the Superbowl and "terrorists" and we have the same thing.

[meganmonkey]

25. And the rest are apparently condescending

and will never help solve problems unless they get over the fact that they are no better than anyone else.

See, once you write all these people off as 'sheeple', you expect nothing of them. And until you do, you will never reach them. Maybe you could learn a little something from these so-called 'sheeple'.

[rinsd]

27. Outstanding post....

...You're too stupid to know what's good for you has NEVER won an election.

[meganmonkey]

30. Thank you

I think some people in this forum just need to get out more, and talk to people. I don't know if this mentality comes from some sort of education-based elitism, or something else, a self-righteousness, but they really need to broaden their horizons. They might be pleasantly surprised at what they find :shrug:

[pitohui]

28. because most people are concerned w. survival

most people have to worry abt feeding, housing, sheltering, and educating their family, if any time is left over from that, then maybe they can worry abt politics

it is a sad reality that there are only 24 hrs in the day

[maxsolomon]

29. Misanthropy is Legal

and nothing encapsulates the situation as concisely as "Sheeple".

Facts:
1. Humans are the most vicious & successful of the great apes.
2. In the nature of our beings are xenophobia, inertia, & self-interest.
3. The Neocons who run our government (not *, but the PNAC signators) & give it a philosophical foundation, agree with the OP's assertion & have turned it to their advantage. They think Americans are dumber than any liberal poster on DU. Leo Strauss is an unabashed elitist.

[Ron Green]

31. Maybe they're not Sheeple, but they're not smart enough in sufficient

numbers for the message of democracy, which is, "We must all go beyond our immediate selfish and tribal needs to embrace and nurture a common wealth."

The fear-based tribal mind is universal, but the love-based social mind is and always has been more scarce. I don't see how this will ever change.

[d_b]

41. Ding ding ding