3000 killed on 9/11...17,000+ die EACH YEAR due to drunk drivers-

[dysfunctional press]

who are the REAL terrorists we should be using our national resources to defend our society from?

[L0oniX]

1. covered that one already

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2177382

[babylonsister]

2. Wow. That's a rethug talking point. nt

[dysfunctional press]

4. how so?

i thought they were all about the islamo-fascists that want to kill our moms.

[wtmusic]

6. It uses the same weak logic

Republicans use to scoff at numbers of US war dead.

17,000 dead from drunk drivers. 40,000 dead from careless drivers. BAN CARELESSNESS!!! :crazy:

[dysfunctional press]

10. i haven't heard that one before....

i was addressing the monumental amounts of money being looted in the name of "homeland security", when we actually face MUCH more 'danger' from our own stupid selves, than from ANY outside islamo-criminals- (my personal opinion is that 9/11 was a crime, NOT an act of war).

[wtmusic]

12. no doubt

there are thousands of better ways to spend the money.

Example: Republican coworker whining about the National Endowment for the Arts and why he has to pay taxes for it (while the money wasted by his President's folly in the Middle East dwarfs it by comparison).

Honestly, these people...

[lvx35]

14. That's a really good point. I wish I head it more often.

I mean, drunk driving is trivial compared to a lot of things too. Smoking, heart diseased caused by the junk in our diets, etc. The thing is that we aren't implementing anything that looks remotely authoritarian to solve those problems, so why should be shredding the constituion over this smaller thing. If they can keep the nukes and biological weapons in the box, terrorism really should be a much smaller police issue.

[babylonsister]

8. The argument has been, if 'this many' people have died in Iraq,

more have died from drunken driving in the US. The comparison doesn't make sense, but there you have it. And I've read that more than once.

[dysfunctional press]

18. i'm not even talking about iraq.

i'm talking about the expense, in money, resources, and rights- being looted in the name of protecting us from a percieved threat from without- when a much LARGER threat from within is hardly considered.

[Erika]

21. Yeah W and Cheney should have been locked up

Look at the damage they've done with their alcohol impaired abilities to our troops and the Iraqis.

[babylonsister]

22. OK, whatever. You're bringing up the shadow of 9/11. I confused

it, considering that's all I've heard for so many years.
Sis out, carry on.

[rinsd]

43. Its similar to comparing murder rates in Det to Iraq

[aquart]

3. I completely agree.

But that's because Sean Leaf Tadeshi Oyama was killed at the age of 27 months on the way to Disney World by a drunk driver who refused to let a friend drive his car.

And my thanks forever to the Florida police on the scene who took care of his mother.

[Erika]

5. Wasn't W a drunk driver? Yes he was

We should have slammed his terrorist ass in jail for 20 years along with Cheney who had two dui's.

It would have saved our troops and the innocent Iraqis.

[Justice Is Comin]

7. And what about heart disease.

You don't see him out flapping his jaws with a bunch of military flags behind him trying to scare people much with that.

And that kills over 200,000 a year!!

How many 9-11s is that.

I guess it must just be certain kinds of scaring he's interested in.

[Erika]

9. Or breast cancer n/t

[ItNerd4life]

42. Please don't ban breasts.

:bounce:

[dysfunctional press]

15. i was actually trying to compare deaths/danger caused by the actions...

of others...not too many people out there inflicting heart disease on unsuspecting masses. (and NO- the kid at the drive-up nor the ceo of the fast-food burger places can be blamed for people who gorge themselves on the stuff- even though they've been told time and again about the dangers)

[Erika]

17. All this shit has nothing to do with our troops in Iraq. Zilch.

The comparisions of numbers of deaths due to disease and drunken driving vs a war action defies logic.

[dysfunctional press]

20. and my post has NOTHING to do with iraq or troop deaths...

iraq has nothing to do with what i'm referring to... the "homeland security" folly.

[Erika]

24. But didn't W and Cheny as DUI offenders

play a role somewhere?

[dysfunctional press]

25. how so...?

i don't recall either of them ever causing a dui fatality.
(not that it excuses the behavior- the only difference between dui and dui-death is dumb luck.

[Erika]

27. It is the poor decision making and self-indulgence

that is the concern when adults decide to imbibe and drive. Don't you agree? Both of these adults showed poor decision making....you just think that maybe that's why our country is now so messed up? You think?

[dysfunctional press]

38. i don't think that bush's or cheney's drinking habits have anything to do...

with the state our nation is in- it's the citizenry that has showed a lack of judgement- both those that voted for this regime, and those that didn't vote against them by abstaining from voting altogether. greed and the children of the ME generation have made us what we are today.

bush and cheney just epitomize it.

[HardRocker05]

45. why don't we have troops on the highways stopping drunk drivers? is it OK to

die at the hands of a drunk american, but not a sober foreign terrorist?

[HardRocker05]

46. What logic? it's OK to die at the hands of an drunk american but not a foreign terrorist?

foreign terrorist? i'm sorry if you find turban-wearing, funny-talking, dark-skinned terrorists so much more scary than driving on your city streets at 1am on a Friday night; the REALITY is that you are much more likely to die in the latter situation than in a terrorist attack. but you want the rest of us to have our national resources squandered to protect you against your personal bogey-man, while leaving us all more vulnerable to REAL THREATS right here in america? i'm pretty sure that's not logical.

[Justice Is Comin]

32. I was just making reference to the number of casualties

caused by a phenomenon we should be doing more to control and find a cure for heart disease. Their whole scare show is based on the number of people that died in the towers. This shows how phony they are.

And as for nobody "inflicting" the heart disease, I would say the cigarette companies were, and still are actively dealing heart disease death. Although a cigarette doesn't magically appear and jump in someone's mouth, they haven't stop making them either. No drunk driver can kill someone in a car without the car.

So our examples may be two kinds of apples, but not apples and oranges :pals: We're just hitting that mass murderer in the White House from all sides.

[stellanoir]

11. Well your point is well taken.

But on a deeper level what is wrong with a society and culture that is so dissociated, isolated, and spiritually bereft, that sanctions sadism (aka torture,) and so many sensitives feel they have to numb themselves to the point of an extreme lack of motor skills, just to cope? Granted those are hardly singular causes.

Please don't think I'm justifying that sort of behavior. I just wish there was a bit more humanity and willingness to help those in pain who would go so far as to inconsciously endanger the lives of others as well as their own.

As I see it in so many ways, we have a spiritual problem which requires spiritually humane solutions. Silly me.

Flame away if you wish. I've lost two dear cousins to drunk drivers over the years. So flaming simply won't bring them back.

Peace.

[Erika]

13. We elected a Pres and VPres

Who were guilty of drunk driving but these same people are commanding troops with disastrous results?

[dysfunctional press]

16. i tend not to be much of a spiritual person in any way.

being raised in parochial schools drained it out of me...besides, i have enough to handle just with reality.

[stellanoir]

28. I'm wishing for your reality to be infused and enhanced with true love

and kindness that is most likely quite distant from your most unfortunate parochial school experience.

Chin up and don't forget to smell the flowers Ferdinand. :)

[MazeRat7]

19. In 2003, there were 30,136 gun deaths... so pick your cause.

But don't try to frame it like you did. It's not very honest IMHO.

MZr7

[dysfunctional press]

23. how is it "dis-honest"???

i'm hearing all the time about "homeland security" spending- all triggered by one morning of a few guys with box-cutters committing mass-murder...but meanwhile, REAL things for us to fear get absolutely no attention.

[Erika]

26. Well, why did the public not look at W and Cheney as DUI

offenders? Where was MADD and the religious right when they elected two alcohol offenders to office? After all, that's the premise in which you started the thread.

[dysfunctional press]

36. they didn't kill anyone, as i recall...

i started the thread discussing dui deaths...
but even so- it goes to show that the public doesn't see dui as that 'big' a deal- just a hassle and expense for the person caught(everyone knows someone- i'm one of the few males in my age group among the people i know, who has never had one.)
but- they're just one terra-ist attack away from wanting to put anyone with an arab look/feel into concentration camps.

we're killing many more of ourselves than the terra-ists could ever hope to accomplish- short of nuclear weapons- which they may indeed have...depending on whether or not poppy * procurred them some.

[davekriss]

29. 18,000 per year die in U.S. due to lack of health insurance

Why hasn't Bush shocked and awed the insurance companies? Or waterboarded Congress into passing universal healthcare? Why do we have to be the only first-world capitalist nation that doesn't insure all it's people have access to the medical care they need?

[Erika]

31. W could care less if Americans die nor could his right wing

supporters. They sincerely reject the needy in every way. They close their eyes. W has created a caste system for the first time in this country where the needy is the "unclean" while Buchanan, Robertson, Falwell hop on their private jets to their multiple homes with tax cuts by W and a kiss.

[dysfunctional press]

37. that number is just a projection...

dui deaths are cold hard facts.

[davekriss]

39. I was compounding the outrage

Let me "project" further, the lack of health insurance in this nation costs upwards of $130 billion per year in pre-mature deaths and lost productivity. Terrorist attacks, well, the risks are akin to winning a perverse, demonic lottery, i.e. they are very slight. Though steps need to be taken to suppress and contain them, there are far more pressing social problems to be solved. Which exponentially compounds the tragic waste of resources now in Iraq under Bush and Republican rubberstamp mis-leadership.

The modern state is all about socializing costs while funneling the majority of benefits to the politically favored few. Look at the stock performance of the military, oil, and pharma sectors compared to the rest of industry. Recall that the Condalezza Rice used to sail for Exxon (it was only recently renamed), that the Bush family is synomonous with Big Oil, that GHWB consults for Carlyle, that Rumsfeld's last private job was for a pharma firm (Searle?) and Cheney's last job was for Halliburton. War! What a way to make billions for one's self and friends!!

I think "terrorism", though a very small risk to the American people, is not the cause of Bush Wars, just the rallying card around which they manufacture consent for war within the American public.

[davekriss]

41. Forgot to say, above

That war, globalism, and neo-liberal imperialism is profitable to the few, Bushboi's self-proclaimed elite "base". Therefore deaths from drunk driving? Deaths from lack of health insurance? Jobs fly overseas? Doesn't matter as these do not impact the bottom lines of Bushboi Base Profit & Loss statements.

[Warren DeMontague]

30. I lost my best friend at age 26 to a drunk driver.

We've all done stupid shit in our lives, but please- if you're going to drink, don't drive.

Get a ride, take a cab, whatever it takes.. just don't get behind the wheel. Thanks.

[Keepontruking]

33. Excuse me

We have a drunk running the country, so what is the difference
both are armed and dangerous.
Circus Girl

[Bluebear]

34. Okie dokie. nt

[951-Riverside]

35. HOW MANY DIE DUE TO GANG VIOLENCE?

So far 318 people have been murdered in Los Angeles this year

Source: http://lacountymurders.com/

[spanone]

40. SIX THOUSAND TEENAGERS EACH YEAR.

[HardRocker05]

44. yep, there are way bigger threats to americans than terrorism, but dems

keep allowing repukes to define the issues and they refuse to take them head on and and call the lie to their fear-mongering.

[Bandit]

47. 400,000 die every year from tobacco related causes.

But it is so very damn important that all these cigerette smokers get to pollute the public air with their poisons.... I could give one whit whether they smoke at home or not but in public come on.....There is absolutely no defense for it. They all say well so and so does it too. So fucking what? I don't care if cars do pollute. We know it and supposedly are trying to make it better. What are smokers trying to make better with their emissions? How do two wrongs possibly make a right?