Which will happen first in the U.S.: A black president or a female president?

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[readmoreoften]

1. A 1/79th "black" male with blonde hair and blue eyes. /nt

[Catherine Vincent]

5. You're right. I didn't think of that one.

He'd have to be bi-racial (B&W) but look caucasian.

[wtmusic]

2. Good question

I'm afraid the stereotype of women being weak will take a long time STILL to overcome.

[originalpckelly]

3. Demographically speaking 1 in 12 Presidents ought to be black...

1 in 2 ought to be women.

I don't think that is the case, is it?

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

10. Pretty Bad Statistical Math There, With All Due Respect.

It would come down to the ratio of race/gender within those that actually enter politics and try to win to begin with. Those numbers would be much different than simple demographic numbers, and it would be completely inaccurate to use demographic breakdowns for this exercise.

[originalpckelly]

48. No, not for that reason, but I was wrong on the black ratio.

reflect the demographics of people in America?

I didn't actually divide it right. If there are more than 10 percent the number of Presidents ratio should go down.

Womens figure was right, but 3 in every 25 Presidents should be black.

Now, I said demographically speaking. I am pissed that there haven't been women Presidents or black Presidents, or for that matter gay (about 10%, 1 in 10 Presidents should be gay) or otherwise Presidents.

This country is fucked up. Why the hell can't we just do the right thing?

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

67. Like I Said, Demographics Have Nothing To Do With It.

You can spit out the ratios as much as you want, but they are irrelevant for this exercise as I stated. The general demographic ratios have little or nothing to do with who is elected. What does matter, is who runs, since if ya don't run, you're pretty much not going to get elected.

So like I said, the ratios of how many female or black candidates ran weighted against what gender/race won and how frequently, would be the accurate way to go about it. This is the wrong application for demographic numbers.

[Temporary1]

4. Well won't we find out in 2008

If you catch my drift : p

[in_cog_ni_to]

6. Maybe. Obama's waiting to see how the TN. election turns out

and he's also been shown how race WILL BE A FACTOR if he runs. Barak and his wife are also concerned about assassination and I can say that I don't blame them.:(

[StellaBlue]

7. Republican, white female.

NT

[begin_within]

11. You mean this....

Katherine Harris

or



Elizabeth Dole

or



Ann Coulter?

[BlooInBloo]

8. I'll be shocked if there's EVER a black President in this country.

I welcome a future in which I'm shocked.


EDIT: My answer was based on the assumption - which you didn't actually state - that this hypothetical black President was ELECTED - and didn't inherit the office from being VP, Speaker, or something like that. A black President-by-inheritance is easier for me to imagine.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

13. I Wouldn't Be.

Though this is probably a far fetched and silly comparison, I will say that everyone I know who watches and loves 24, also loved and admired the character President Palmer. Any fan of the show that I know would say they wished we had a president like that and how much they loved his character.

If one on tv was that readily accepted, maybe in real life one could be as well. I do recognize that it is a bit more complicated than that though.

[SammyWinstonJack]

9. neither.

[Swamp Rat]

12. I'd vote for Rep. Barbara Lee in a heartbeat

:)

http://lee.house.gov/

[El Supremo]

14. An Hispanic president

They outnumber blacks now.

Or maybe a black hispanic female president. Who knows?

[begin_within]

16. Yes, and how about this guy:

[Warren DeMontague]

15. Both well before we get an atheist in the White House.

That's for damn sure.

[hfojvt]

18. or a member of the working class

unless Andrew Jackson counts, and what a disaster that was.

We probably have already had an atheist, but they could not admit that on the campaign trail. Did Nixon, for example, really believe in god?

[Warren DeMontague]

19. Sure. All the terrible ones were probably atheists.

You know, because we're all morally deficient. :eyes:

[hfojvt]

22. I wouldn't say that about Sagan, Russell, or Asimov

but then there was Nixon's close association with Billy Graham
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/inaug/history/stories/nixon69.htm

[Warren DeMontague]

38. I guess the thing that bothers me is the assumption that if he's an asshole

he must not be a "true" believer. And we're constantly hearing on DU how Atheism is "another religion" - stop and think, for a minute.. what other religion could you slur like that and get away with it?

"Nixon was so ****, he must have secretly been a ****".

I'm glad you could find 3 examples of atheists who you don't consider morally deficient. But please stop trying to pawn off every Christian (or member of other faith) who acts like a shithead onto us.

[hfojvt]

43. Just because they are not Christians

doesn't mean they are atheists. Since, IMO, Christianity commands a person to not be an a$$hole. (John 15: 12 - "My command is this. Love each other as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this, that one lay down his life for his friends." James 1:27 "Religion that God our Father accepts as pure and faultless is this: to look after orphans and widows in their distress and to keep oneself from being polluted by the world.")

If their actions show that they are more than 18 kiloparsecs from Jesus' teachings, then it is only logical to conclude that they are not Christians. That does not imply that they are atheists though. They might be practicing Satanists or Jainists or Zoroastrians for all I know, but it is quite clear that they are not Christians.

[Warren DeMontague]

44. I don't think post #18 was implying anything other than atheism.

But, whatever.

[hfojvt]

45. you are correct, it wasn't

but I thought you made a general case, about every a$$hole who claims to be Christian, such as Bush and Cheney. Plus I would say it is more like every atheist has a metaphysical philosophy which is just as unproven and unprovable as any religious metaphysical philosophy. Calling atheism a religion is a shorthand way of saying that, but I would not mean to imply that all metaphysical philosophies under the umbrella of atheism are the same.

[Warren DeMontague]

60. "proof" doesn't have anything to do with "likelihood"

If you postulate an invisible, odorless, colorless, hidden being who by definition requires faith to believe in, "proof" is damn well impossible. Not to mention the high hurdles in proving a negative. So, yes, atheism is "unproven" just as disbelief in the literal truth of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, the tooth fairy, and the Wizard of Oz are equally unproven.

[hfojvt]

63. equally unproven?

Then there is a God. From the foreward: "Having this in mind, the story of "The Wonderful Wizard of Oz" was written solely to please children of today. It aspires to being a modernized fairy tale, in which the wonderment and joy are retained and the heartaches and nightmare are left out. L. Frank Baum Chicago, April, 1900"

The author admits it to be a children's fairy tale, which is pretty solid proof of the non-existence of a real Wizard of Oz. Ah, if only deutero-Isaiah and Mark, et. al. had been so honest then we wouldn't have all these problems today.

But as Kung writes: "Belief in God is superrational ... but not irrational: there is a reflection on the reality of God emerging from human experience and calling for man's free decision. Belief in God can be justified in the face of a rational critique. It has a basis in the experience of uncertain reality itself, which raises the first and last questions about the condition of its possibility."

note to the OP - sorry for the thread-jacking, but we are keeping your thread kicked, no? I would say a woman President will happen first. For all the sexism of western culture, many western countries have been ruled, at least temporarily by queens. However, they are less likely to be voluntarily ruled by somebody without royal (that is, white) blood. For myself, I have voted both for Geraldine Ferraro and Jesse Jackson.

[Warren DeMontague]

65. Yep. Equally unproven.

You can't disprove the existence of the Wizard of Oz any more effectively than you can disprove the existence of God.

Period.

[Homer Wells]

58. I'm sure several, or more, were either atheists or agnostics

It would be political suicide to ADMIT it, but many, many people have no problem
being less than honest with their constituents.

As Robert Heinlein said "When everyone else around is rubbing blue goo in his/her navel, you also rub blue goo in your navel, looking very solemn while doing so"

(This is a very rough recall of the actual quote, but it pretty well sums up the actions of politicians)

:evilgrin:

[SammyWinstonJack]

20. I'd vote for an atheist President in a heartbeat! Male or Female!

[entanglement]

17. I think we'll have a white female President first

Proof: The Louisiana gubernatorial elections, where the electorate preferred a white woman to a man of color.

[Phredicles]

21. Why not both? Maxine Waters in '08!

[JackBeck]

23. My vote's for a gay, female, Muslim President.

Just to watch a few heads explode.

[AnnieBW]

24. We've Had Many More Female Senators and Governors

We've only had one black governor (Doug Wilder - until Deval Patrick gets in!) and four black Senators in the history of the US. We've got a growing number of female governors and Senators.

But no, I don't think it'll be Hillary Clinton. She's too polarizing a figure.

[raysr]

25. No President will

happen first!

[Nicole]

26. A black republican male

before a female of any color or party.

He will have to be someone like JC Watts before the repukes will nominate him.

[mikelewis]

27. This is Amurika... Won't happen... until Jesus Christ returns...

...as a black woman.

[Jcrowley]

28. Corporatist's

of all stripes, genders and sexual preferences are welcome. Interviews to be held on The Hudson.

[Cascadian]

29. Does it make any difference?

I want my President to be smarter than me, more noble than me, and have the Kahonies to go up against the Neocons and to undo the damage done by this Monkey and his handlers in D.C. I don't care what race, religion, sex, or sexual orientation they are. I just want them to be progressive and bring pride and dignity back to America.


John

[Kerrytravelers]

30. Here's my vote

[Ignacio Upton]

31. It depends on the invidual candidate

Obama could possibly win, but someone like Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton can't. In the case of a woman, she might be a conservative-oriented type, rather than someone who leans more to the left. Sadly, I think that the first woman President will be a Republican, but I think that the first black President will be a Democrat because I don't see the Republicans nominating a black candidate.

[Kerrytravelers]

32. rethugs nominate women only to seem "friendly" to women.

They have no intention of letting them win.

[Ignacio Upton]

35. Not necessarily

I could see someone like Kay Bailey Hutchison being nominated in the near future. While that candidate may not do as well in the polls, if she can get the Republican base excited just enough, she may have a chance.

[Kerrytravelers]

36. Since rethugs don't respect women as equals, the spin machine

would most likely take care of her actually having a chance at winning. Or, she's win and it would be detrimental to women as she enacted every anti-woman act imaginable to pay back those who put her into office.

A rethuglian woman is bad for all women.

[Yupster]

52. I could see Kay Bailey Hutchison

being the first woman president very easily.

I see her as a natural match as VP for McCain. Should McCain win and die in office, she would be the first female president.

I could also see Hillary beating McCain in 2008 and being the first woman president.

African-American presidents I have a tougher time seeing right now. Colin Powell had a real chance of winning but chose not to run. I don't think Obama would have a chance in the primaries since he's only been in office a few years. I think either Gore or Kerry would beat him assuming Hillary chooses not to run.

[Lilith Velkor]

51. Au contraire

They'd let a Margaret Thatcher type win.

[Pachamama]

33. If it was Oprah Winfrey running, it would be the 1st black female...

Heck, every Republican Woman loves her....

Oprah/Obama '08 - has a good ring to it, doesn't it???

:kick:

[Kerrytravelers]

37. rethug women especially love her after o'lielly's appearance.

Apparently, she let him just run nuts.

[LostinVA]

49. I watched the show -- and that's not an accurate statement

[Kerrytravelers]

62. Was o'liely put in his place and shamed?

I could barely stomache watching it as much as I did. He seemed to be running wild on the segments I saw while flipping.

[lumberjack_jeff]

34. None of the bloodlines that are permitted to be president are black

... but they do have females.

I say "female".

[burrowowl]

39. Angela Davis for President!

[951-Riverside]

40. How I see it

White female president, hispanic president, mixed race president, native american president and then black female president followed by a black male president. ;)

[Matariki]

41. I thought we already had a black president???

my mistake.

[Kerrytravelers]

42. !

:rofl:

[Catherine Vincent]

61. You betcha! And his wife will be the first woman President!

:)

[robcon]

46. It'll be Hillary Clinton...

and it will be in 2008.

[FreeStateDemocrat]

47. Obama is a long shot at winning in 2008 but Hillary has no shot at winning.

[LostinVA]

50. I believe HRC has a much better chance than Obama n/t

[Yupster]

53. I'm with you LostinVa

I don't see why people think Hillary can't win.

I can see her beating any Republican nominee I can think of, and 2008 might be a very un-Republican year.

[schmuls]

54. I want a Jewish twice divorced President and a black man for VP:

Obama Barrack. Or vice versa, doesn't *really* matter as long as they are of the same mind. Wonder how it would affect middle eastern foreign relations to have a Jewish American president?

[schmuls]

55. I forgot to say that Jewish guy is Russell Feingold, from Wisconsin!!!

YAY!

[Pachamama]

64. Israel would love it and meanwhile the rest of the ME might prefer Feingold, one of the few

in the Senate to openly question the Bush policies in the Middle East. I'm sure that they realize that a Neo-con and Oilmen are far more threatening to their interests than to their issues with judaism and Israel.

I agree with you though...I think either Feingold/Obama or Obama/Feingold would be fantastic for this country....

:kick:

[La Lioness Priyanka]

56. i think a woman/black president will only win on the republican ticket

largely because the sexists/racists are already on their side so this person will probably have to come from them

[sweetheart]

57. how many years

before women and minorities have equal rights economically in our economic world?

If a president be a symbol, cool, whatever it takes to drag a racist society
out of its slaving past.

[DireStrike]

59. I heard a joke once...

A woman is meditating one day when suddenly god appears to her. He congratulates her on the accomplishment and offers to answer any questions she may have. The woman asks, "when will the US have a female president?"

God consults his vast knowledge and replies, "Not in your lifetime... but it shall come to pass."

Later a gay man achieved the same feat of transcendence, and he also was approached by God with the offer to clear up anything he wanted to know. The man asks, "when will the US have a gay president?"

God again thought for an imperceptible fraction of a second and replied, "Not in your lifetime... but it shall come to pass."

Finally a black man is peacefully praying when he, too, feels his mind open up to the universe. God appears to him with the same offer. He says, "when will the US have a black president?"

God just bursts out laughing and says, "Not in my lifetime!"


I didn't really get it when I first heard it, but the more I think about it, the more it makes sense. Racism is probably the hardest of the three prejudices here to overcome, especially since so many people never see black people, except in a football game or as criminals on the news. The black person is easiest to identify as "the other" due to the apparent physical differences, which people conflate with the culture, which of course is displayed as extremely negative.

[MODemocrat]

66. Hillary Clinton

That's my hope.