"Who is to blame for Haggard's fall from grace? His fat, lazy wife"

[Wetzelbill]

Yup, blame the woman, that's good Christian believin' fer ya. -WB

Who's to blame for Pastor Haggard's fall from grace? His fat, lazy wife
David Goldstein

Colorado Springs' New Life Church just announced that it has fired Pastor Ted Haggard for his "sexually immoral conduct." The much publicized meth and gay hooker scandal has elicited a little bit of soul searching and a lot hemming and hawing from Haggard's fellow Evangelical leaders, but perhaps the most ridiculous response came yesterday from Pastor Mark Driscoll of Seattle's Mars Hills mega-church-wannabe.

Writing in his personal blog, Driscoll offers his fellow pastors "some practical suggestions" on how to avoid the type of temptation that consumed Pastor Haggard. And near the top of his list?

"Most pastors I know do not have satisfying, free, sexual conversations and liberties with their wives. At the risk of being even more widely despised than I currently am, I will lean over the plate and take one for the team on this. It is not uncommon to meet pastors' wives who really let themselves go; they sometimes feel that because their husband is a pastor, he is therefore trapped into fidelity, which gives them cause for laziness. A wife who lets herself go and is not sexually available to her husband in the ways that the Song of Songs is so frank about is not responsible for her husband's sin, but she may not be helping him either."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-goldstein/whos-to-blame-for-pastor_b_33279.html

[applegrove]

1. Already been posted. Un-believable. These people need to read

the New Testament..you know the part where you don't scapegoat someone for somebody elses issues.

[havocmom]

2. If the pastor was unfaithful to his wife WITH A MAN, probably not much about her

any way.

If the pastor would consider that gays should be allowed to marry, HE might be wed to the partner he really wants and can be faithful to.

[knowbody0]

3. wise words, pastor.

a woman who has manufactured five children in her body should always look sweet 16 or it's ok to cheat on her.

Mamas, don't let your babies grow up to be pastors' wives!

[Ken Burch]

4. Let me get this straight...Haggard bought a rent boy because his WIFE WAS FAT?

:wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf::wtf:

[ContraBass Black]

5. Aside form all of the piles of "WTF" that ought to go with this article,

Haggart's wife is pretty.

[Wetzelbill]

12. yeah I know

she's an attractive woman. How low is it for some guy to say that about a woman or a situation he doesn't even know anything about? Oh so he's another fundie pastor, so that gives him the right to denigrate the guy's wife? A disgraceful line of thinking for sure.

[MADem]

6. His wife is better looking than he is!!!

She looks a bit humiliated in this shot, but she's quite attractive.



And the idea that an ugly or slovenly WIFE would make someone "turn gay" is silly. The heterosexual cheater would get busy with some lady on the office staff or in the choir...isn't that how it usually works?

Personally, I think this asshat Driscoll either HAS SOMETHING TO HIDE or is engaging in some serious WISHFUL THINKING!

As every pastor knows, we are always at risk from the sin in us and the sinful temptations around us. Pastoring in one of America’s least churched cities to a large number of single, young people has been an eye-opening experience for me. I started the church ten years ago when I was twenty-five years of age. Thankfully, I was married to a beautiful woman. I met my lovely wife Grace when we were seventeen, married her at twenty-one, and by God’s grace have been faithful to her in every way since the day we met. I have, however, seen some very overt opportunities for sin. On one occasion I actually had a young woman put a note into my shirt pocket while I was serving communion with my wife, asking me to have dinner, a massage, and sex with her. On another occasion a young woman emailed me a photo of herself topless and wanted to know if I liked her body. Thankfully, that email was intercepted by an assistant and never got to me....No church should tolerate sexual sin among its leaders. Christians cannot be guilty of playing plank-speck with non-Christians on matters of pornography and homosexuality and be guilty of going soft on sin in their own leadership. As Paul says, nothing can be done out of partiality or favoritism.

Pastors should have their office at the church and their study at home. There is no reason a pastor should be sitting alone at the church at odd hours (e.g., early morning and late evening) to study when anyone can drop in for any reason and have access to him. Instead, a pastor should come into the office for scheduled meetings and work from home on tasks such as emails, planning, studying, sermon preparation, etc. I spend the vast majority of my time working from home. Some years ago when I did not, I found that lonely people, some of them hurting single moms wanting a strong man to speak into their life, would show up to hang out and catch time with me. It was shortly thereafter that I brought my books home and purchased a laptop and cell phone so that I was not tied to the church office.


Pastors have the right to protect their own home. This means that if someone keeps dropping by unannounced and is unwelcome, or a flirtatious woman shows up to a Bible study at the pastor’s home, the pastor and his family have the right to request that they never return. The pastor’s home simply cannot be viewed as yet another piece of church property that is accessible to anyone who desires it. Rather, the pastor’s home must be a safe place for the pastor and his family without the wrong people rudely calling and dropping by.

Churches should consider returning to heterosexual male assistants who are like Timothy and Titus to serve alongside pastors. Too often the pastor’s assistant is a woman who, if not sexually involved, becomes too emotionally involved with the pastor as a sort of emotional and practical second wife. I have been blessed with a trustworthy heterosexual male assistant who can travel with me, meet with me, etc., without the fear of any temptations or even false allegations since we have beautiful wives and eight children between us. .... http://theresurgence.com/md_blog_2006-11-03_evangelical_leader_quits

I DEFINITELY think this guy is "protesting a bit TOO much!!!"

[Totally Committed]

33. ...

She's a good-looking woman. Her only fault is she's not a man.

TC

[Thickasabrick]

7. His wife looks pretty good in the video with her sitting in the car

when a reporter was asking him about meth and sex in front of her and the 3 kids in the back seat.

[MADem]

8. Well, of COURSE it's all HER fault!!! She should have grown a penis and learned to cook meth!!

She was a dreadful wife for not seeing to her husband's 'needs' you see!!!


(Do I need to haul out this :sarcasm: thing?? :rofl: )

[AIJ Alom]

24. LOL. That was good ! n/t

[NoAmericanTaliban]

9. Always quick to blame someone else for their problems

& most christian right has little repect for women. It is a male dominated cult - no wonder so many of them are closet homos.

[zulchzulu]

10. ...and the reason he killed his dog was because it was barking too much...

...and the reason he made his son perform ___ on him was because the kid had bad grades.... and the reason he stole from the church till was because money is the root of all evil....and the reason he....

[sandnsea]

11. "Some Practical Suggestions"

http://theresurgence.com/md_blog_2006-11-03_evangelical_leader_quits

You have to read it to believe it. These pastors basically have to wall themselves off from the wiley females lest their penises unsuspectingly leap from their pants.

What the hell do they think the REST of the men on the planet do? You know. the ones who work with women every single solitary day!!!

Unbelievable.

[LizW]

13. Figures.

These people believe that all evil in the world originated from women. It makes perfect sense to them. It justifies their hatred of women and lets them off the hook for anything they themselves do. It's always the woman's fault.

[HuffleClaw]

14. "free, sexual conversations and liberties with their wives."

wow, if ever there was proof that they view women as chattel, that was it. brrrrrrrrr.

[Neshanic]

15. WOW! Just freaking wow. Pastor Mark may need a good divorce lawyer.

The level of hideousness of this guy is spectatcular. Maybe someone should look into his sex life off the books. It seems that there is a pattern, the louder and more pompous they are, the more suspect they are.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

25. you are too kind. Shame on you.

I can't even get myself to type how I truly think of this putrid POS.

[Jamastiene]

16. Oh yeah, blame the woman.

That guy needs to do some evolving.

[StoryTeller]

17. This is becoming all-too-common reasoning...

...in many evangelical churches--and not just the extreme fundy ones, either. It's the reason we left the church I grew up in. My husband and I were involved in helping with a group for young married couples at the church, and the man who led the group and taught us on Sundays believed that husbands were supposed to be responsible for everything--even their wife's spiritual growth. And women were told by the pastor on Sunday mornings that it was wrong to tell their husbands no on sex--unless they were physically ill. He said if we were too tired for sex, to grab a can of soda (or something with caffeine) and "come alive."

He gave some nod to the guys about being polite about initiating sex. But we even had a conference for the women on how we should loosen up about sex and how to make it more enjoyable for our husbands. And the big point about that was what to do if your husband didn't want to have sex with you. Nothing was ever said about what many of my friends deal with--what to do if your husband is so insensitive to your needs that you find sex unfulfilling and painful.

We were also told that it was our Christian duty as married couples to have children, and if we chose not to that we were outside God's will.

And this is NOT a "fundamentalist" church, in the sense of some of the ultra conservative Baptist churches, etc. The pastors are friends with lots of the pastors at New Life, and would fit that slightly more moderate profile. This sort of mysogyny is rampant in evangelical churches today.

And it hurts like HELL. Once we changed to a church that actually treated me like a valuable human being, I spent several months crying all the way home after a Sunday service because it was so refreshing and healing to be treated like I mattered--as me, not as an extension of my husband.

This sort of thing makes me so angry. It's so NOT how Jesus acted. And I feel so badly for all the women who are brainwashed into thinking that this is the way it MUST be if they want to please God. Women like Mrs. Haggard. Please, everyone, don't judge her. Pity her. Have compassion on her. Whatever she put up with, whatever she knew and didn't say, whatever she suspected or didn't suspect--she was and still is trapped in a no-win situation because she's been taught that this is the way that she must behave in order to be a godly woman. And goodness knows what will happen to her now, what will happen to her sense of who she is, what will happen to her faith.

I escaped this mindset without such a personal betrayal of trust. My husband was all in favor of rejecting the teaching at our old church. He hated it. So we grew stronger in our relationship. But Mrs. Haggard--I don't know what will happen to her. I don't know how, or if, she will escape.

It's a horrible, shameful aspect of the evangelical culture. There are those of us actively trying to bring about change. And that change is happening. But it's slow, and there are a LOT of casualties along the way.

[AspenRose]

19. They definitely take that approach with "FamilyLife" Marriage

Seminars.

I've been to one and felt terribly insignificant and like a failure afterwards.

[Wetzelbill]

21. yes fantastic reply

I am extremely bothered by the idea that women are somehow inferior to men. It's ingrained in our society, so much so that we barely notice it. These people are serious about women being little more than slaves to their husbands. Sure they dress it up under "family values" and all of that BS, but how you described the situation regarding sex is a great example. A woman is not supposed to question her husband. He want sex then she has no right to say no. WTF is that? These people also believe that a man cannot rape his spouse. For them forcing a wife to have sex is just something she should have done anyway. It is bizarre. Wow, I am so happy I was taught to respect my mother and female relatives. Without them I would be nothing and have nothing. If I ever was to think of women as second-class citizens like these people do I would get the snot slapped out of me, haha. I am glad your husband felt the same way that you do. I hope Mrs. Haggard is able to move on and put this all past her with as little pain as possible.

[Thickasabrick]

28. What a wonderful inspiring post. I am so happy you found a

church that values you for "you". I haven't been to church since the war and I saw so many follow Bush as if God would have wanted all the bombs and massacres. It just turned me off to organized religion altogether. I might try a few more - you've given me inspiration!

[WinkyDink]

18. Five bucks says Pastor Mark is gay.

[thereismore]

27. I raise you 20. If I were his wife I'd be scaired stiff. nt

[Neshanic]

31. Odds are he is. The loudest are the biggest suspects.

[Richard Steele]

20. QUOTE: "I will lean over the plate and take one for the team on this."

Sounds like THIS guy may have some "fat lazy wife" issues
of his own, knowhutImean?

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

[and-justice-for-all]

22. Haggard is to blame for Haggard.

I am sick of people blaming everybody else for their stupidty and hypocrisy, be a fucking man and fess up.

If he wasnt a bigot asshole he would not have this problem, just be who you are and stop wearing that religious masquarde bullshit.

[AIJ Alom]

23. Yes, if only she had not been lazy and pleasured him with a strap-on

then poor Haggard would not have had to take Meth to release his sexual energy with a "massaging" male escort. Face it the man was a closeted homosexual. There is nothing wrong with being gay. I mean if the guy were straight, wouldn't he be admitting to an extra-marital affair with a congregant or secretary for that matter ? The hypocrisy of leading a church and attacking the very essence of whom he is, is truly troubling.

The wife had absolutely nothing to do with. Women had nothing to do with it. Otherwise he would have been perfectly content with a wife or mistress with a strap-on.

[arewenotdemo]

26. Excuse me if I don't feel for the poor, neglected wife in this case.

I find it hard to believe she didn't at the very least suspect what the good Pastor was up to.

And you can rest assured she was probably more than willing to accept the lifestyle perks.

[Thickasabrick]

29. I'm sure she felt if she prayed enough about it and made herself

"available" at every waking moment then things would be ok. I can't find fault with her other than being a complete moron - which you
can't really blame people for.

[NightOwwl]

30. I''ll bet this poor woman didn't have a clue.

It probably isn't in her mindset to even consider that her husband might be banging some dude on the side.

I feel sorry for her and her children. They are the ones who will suffer the most.

[blondeatlast]

32. Just look at her face in the photo above. Asked about the allegations

in front of her children.

That lowlife Haggart is more concerned about saving his own face than about his wife and children.

Yeah, the party of "family values," all right. :sarcasm:

It's hard for even me to believe, but my heart is going out to her right now. What a horrible position to find yourself in--through absolutely no fault of her own.